To those now critical of Hillary's remarks about women who voted for Trump:

[Atticus]

Telling an inconvenient truth about someone is not slanderous or cruel, it is telling the truth. And, to the extent that it may occasionally be "politically naive or unwise", so be it. The alternative is some form of lie and those who condemn embarrassing candor should understand that they are endorsing the "alternative facts" we supposedly deplore.

No one likes being told they don't have a mind of their own, but it is not wrong to say that about them if it is true. I'm sure klansmen don't like being called ignorant racists either, but if the shoe fits---.

[Ninga]

1. Valid assertion. Thank you.

[poboy2]

2. I'm not a woman, and this post is not about that but about 'deplorable'.

In an article posted in another thread, a line went: 'Comments in 2016 that some of Trump’s supporters fit in a “basket of deplorables,” a line the Republican then used against her repeatedly during the final stretch of the campaign."

Do these POS not prove her correct every day? Look at how they behave. Look what they cheer on.

She was being 'presidential'. These 'deplorables' are real pieces of shit. Honestly.

[NCTraveler]

6. They were violent, chanted lock her up,

And condoned everything from sexual assault to raping the environment. God help us if Clinton calls them deplorable.

[Cha]

49. I know, right! God help us..

[Squinch]

3. I think the criticism from our side is coming from people who believe it will turn

off potential voters. If it is someone who won't vote for future Democrats because of something Hillary said, they weren't going to vote for future Democrats anyhow.

And maybe there are some out there who are uninvolved because they so seldom see political figures telling the unvarnished truth who will look again at the Democratic party because one just did.

[McCamy Taylor]

31. Maybe. Or maybe it is coming from THEIR side trying to turn off our voters.

Divide and conquer is the GOP's favorite game.

[EffieBlack]

33. What potential voters will it turn off?

If at this point, a voter is still so shaky that they could be tempted to vote for Trump again because of something Hillary Clinton said, they aren't likely to vote Democratic and we need to stop wasting our time on them and focus on people who are likely to cast an intelligent vote.

What is is with this ass-kissing of Trump voters. Politicians on both sides - and their supporters and even people right here on DU - go around speaking their truth and, in so doing, risk offending all kinds of people. But for some reason, the very thought of maybe possibly offending voters who voted for an ignorant racist and STILL aren't sure whether they're going to vote for him again has you shaking in your boots.

It's ridiculous. And while people are wringing their hands worrying about offending these deplorables, they seem not to care in the least that this solicitude toward people who represent such a serious threat to people of color deeply offends me and people like me.

[NCTraveler]

4. There is a reason it makes people uncomfortable.

The scope of the conversation has increased over the last couple of years. Her comments seem to be the truth, is a topic that impacts us all, and is within the scope of today’s conversations.

[BeyondGeography]

5. There is ZERO upside for Democrats with what she said

Sens. Brown and McCaskill, actual elected Dems who are facing difficult elections in November, are on the record as rejecting her remarks. Does that mean anything to you?

[JI7]

7. It will turn off people who cheered on the mexicans are criminals, rapists comments

[BeyondGeography]

10. And some Conor Lamb voters, too

Wake up.

[JI7]

13. Yes, some Lamb voters cheered on the mexicans are criminals and rapists attacks

[NCTraveler]

14. They tried to tie him to Pelosi.

It didn’t work.

[BeyondGeography]

15. Because he wants her out as Leader when we win the House

Smart politician.

[NCTraveler]

16. And he would have yelled from the rooftops that he agreed with Clinton.

Nice fallacy.

[JI7]

19. Yes. He is a politician. He knows he needs the votes of those cheering on mexicans are criminals and

Rapists to win.

[BeyondGeography]

21. Seems you are in a bit of a rut. 8.4 million voters switched from Obama in 2012 to Trump

Are they all evil?

[JI7]

24. They can be. If they voted trump that reveals a lot about them

And obama lost the conor lamb district.

[Atticus]

26. I'm sure this is just an oversight on your part, but this thread is about WOMEN

who voted for Trump no matter who they voted for in the past (despite "grab 'em by the pussy!) and no one but you has mentioned "evil". "Brainwashed" and "mindless", though not actually stated, may have been implied, but not "evil".

Your welcome.

[EffieBlack]

34. Yes - the ones who still support Trump - or are even considering voting for him again - are evil

Leave them right where they are. I don't want them anywhere near me or my party.

[BlueStater]

41. This is what I always say about Trump supporters.

Maybe not all of them are racists, but racism wasn't a deal breaker for any of them.

[BeyondGeography]

42. Nor was voting for a black man

Lots of voters are up for grabs. Our hurt feelings shouldn’t consign them to the dung heap.

[BlueStater]

43. I guess a lot of us, myself included, are having trouble letting this go.

They voted for a vile, disgusting excuse for a human being. An ignorant, childish, hate-filled, racist, bigoted bully who sexually assaults women and rips people off. It's not the same as voting for John McCain or Mitt Romney. I'm having a hard time overlooking that and acting like it's no big deal. A big part of me feels like these people should be made to feel a certain degree of shame for voting for such an obviously unqualified, revolting person.

[EffieBlack]

47. Dismissing this as "hurt feelings" is beyond insulting

[Jakes Progress]

65. They didn't vote for him

because they appreciated his positions. They are dolts who voted for the celeb, for the hot thing. They will do that again and again. Policy and news commentators have no influence over them.

It has nothing to do with hurt feelings. I has to do with spending time and energy trying to catch water with a sieve.

[Jakes Progress]

64. No. Some are just stupid.

They voted for the cool, black guy because he was hot and hip.

They voted for the flashy, orange guy because he had a tv show.

They have no idea what Hillary said. They do not watch news. They only see parts of headlines. They are simply too stupid to try to corral. Anyone who still thinks they had a good reason to vote for trump or who thinks Hillary is a monster, is too easily led by fox and russia to have their vote courted.

[Cha]

50. For you, NCTraveler..

Link to tweet

Conor was for Obamacare.. go figure..

Link to tweet

Obamacare was a defining issue in the Dems winning PA-18 election

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10360337

[Atticus]

9. Not a damn thing. nt

[NCTraveler]

11. That they are on the record.

Not much more. This is one of the weakest attacks I’ve seen on her.

[arthritisR_US]

8. TY, this woman salutes you! 👍👏

[Atticus]

12. Thanks. nt

[calimary]

55. So does this woman!

Sorry, but Hillary was right. Again.

[arthritisR_US]

59. Yes she was! 👍🏼👏🏼

[hlthe2b]

17. She can say anything she damned pleases and nothing she said was untrue.

That doesn't mean her comments will not be used by the RW for political gain. As true as her comments are, as you say, "no one likes being told they don't have a mind of their own." A very few of those so offended, MIGHT have been "reachable".... But, instead, they will become more defensive. That is the problem and that is the truth of the matter.

That said, HRC has earned the right (more than almost any other) to do/say whatever the F...k she wishes. That doesn't mean her doing so is helpful to future elections. I'm just not of a mind that she needs to care.

[happy feet]

28. This!

[kacekwl]

29. After all the bullshit that has been said about her

(Much of it by those same women) why should she give a damn what she says about them or anyone else for that matter.

[calimary]

56. THIS. She's more than paid her dues. She's earned the right to say whatever she wants.

She doesn't lie, either. What she said was true.

[mcar]

18. K&R

[ismnotwasm]

20. Yeah and since when is kissing ass and keeping quiet

A campaign strategy? This seems to be the implication in the criticism of Hillary’s remarks.

Which reminds me of that whole chasing after White Trump voters dumbassery.

[bettyellen]

23. Exactly- spineless dishonest behavior is only encouraged when its Hillary?

No fucking thanks!

[fleabiscuit]

36. Bingo, spot on.

[NRaleighLiberal]

22. Truth. What a concept. If it bothers those who have no self-awareness - well, they should get some

[VOX]

25. I'm with you.

Thank you, Atticus.

[UTUSN]

27. They don't want her to say whatever? - fine, I'll plagiarize it under my name.

[McCamy Taylor]

30. Everyone who voted for Trump was an idiot. Period. Even the rich.

Only Russians benefit and they can not vote in U.S. elections.

To say that women deserve a special dispensation from being held accountable for their idiocy in the polling place is stupid--and divisive.

[EffieBlack]

32. Awesome OP. Thanks!

[Egnever]

35. My problem with what she said had nothing to do with women.

Nor do i think was most folks. That is a side show. The part I had a problem with was this.

"I won the places that are optimistic, diverse, dynamic, moving forward,"

Which basically calls a large part of the country backwards.

That may or may not be true depending on how you look at it but I don't see how it is helpful to any democrat running for election in those states in any way.

It ties in perfectly with the idea Democrats look down on the states in the "heartland"

[fleabiscuit]

38. Another read is that HRC insinuated that they are stuck on old ideas and ideology. nt

[radius777]

45. Dem party gets most of its votes from metro areas

across the country, including those that are in red states and in fly-over country.

She is exactly right, just look at any 'electoral map by county' and it's clear what she was talking about.

The key to Dem success isn't in kissing deplorable ass, it's in standing up for our diverse base and giving them a reason to show up at the polls... about fighting voting suppression and gerrymandering, etc.

[apcalc]

37. She has been right about everything so far. Truth hurts.

[videohead5]

39. I've seen those Trump voters

With their racist post online using the N word and calling Michelle Obama an ugly monkey.they are a disgrace.

[progressoid]

40. Here's DU if Bernie had said it...

?resize=1440%2C440&ssl=1

[lunamagica]

44. Hillary is honest, and it is the truth. I will never believe in a million years that anyone

who was offended by her remarks is "reachable". Those people feed on hatred, and they are a lost cause.

[calimary]

57. THIS.

[Awsi Dooger]

46. I didn't like the deplorables comment in the midst of a campaign

Hillary had no margin for error. I don't think she understood that at all. During the debates she seemed giddy when she described Trump's "imploding" campaign. If she understood the Shy Tory aspect perhaps she would have avoided that deplorables phrase.

I wish she had walked the gallery ropes at golf tournaments, as I did earlier that year. White America was on full loudmouth display. It might have been the jolt of reality Hillary needed.

Hillary's recent comment is more generic than it sounds. Marriage generally favors Republicans. One study after another indicates that, although the reasoning can vary. This is one link I saved that cites and summarizes many studies:

http://www.inquiriesjournal.com/articles/127/the-effect-of-marriage-on-political-identification

[EffieBlack]

48. I'm quite sure Hillary was well aware of what her margin of error was during the campaign

Saying that you don't "think she understood at all" is extraordinarily patronizing. Hillary understood what the deal was at least as well as you or I or just about anyone did - whether or not she walked the gallery ropes at gold tournaments.

[oasis]

51. Madeleine Albright's "controversial" comment during the campaign was

right on, as is, Hillary's recent statement. Those who are outraged whenever a political figure issues them a wake up call, need to grow thicker skin.

[lapucelle]

52. Amie Parnes is trying to sell a few more copies of her book

before it's removed from the $1 remainder table and shipped back to the publisher for pennies on the dollar. Here's what one of the four unnamed Democratic party "insiders" (who apparently represent Democrats in general in Amie's narrow world) told Parnes about Clinton:

“'She’s annoying me. She’s annoying everyone, as far as I can tell,' said one 2016 Clinton surrogate. 'Who lets her say these things?'”

Poor Amie. She's always written drivel, but to be reduced to writing this particular breathless brand of gossipy drivel is frankly humiliating. Here's a more accurate headline for your story, dear:

"Four Unnamed Dems Are Angry Over Hillary Clinton’s Latest Comments; One of Them Thinks Women Should Seek Permission Before They Speak"

[Gothmog]

53. Hillary Clinton was right: The parts of America that support Trump are stuck in the past

https://www.salon.com/2018/03/15/hillary-clinton-was-right-the-parts-of-america-that-support-trump-are-stuck-in-the-past/

[dalton99a]

54. A must read.

[Jakes Progress]

66. Just read this link. It is very good. It is the truth.

[Gothmog]

67. I also enjoyed this article

[Gothmog]

58. Some fact checking

Link to tweet

[Atticus]

60. Thank you. Hope many will read this. Might be worth an OP if you have the time. nt

[Gothmog]

61. You have my permission (not that you need it) to start a thread on this

Have fun

[Baconator]

62. True or not...

The end result is that Democrats lose and Republicans gain by it.

Don't you think that should work its way into the equation somewhere?

[Atticus]

63. Your exaggeration of the "end result" makes it difficult to respond.

Will SOME Democrats lose? Of course. Will ALL Democrats? Of course not.

If we adopt the attitude of discarding the truth whenever telling it MIGHT cost us a win, we will no longer deserve to win. In the long run, I'm convinced that a reputation for telling it straight even when it hurts will win more elections for our party.