General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHistory may view Trump's appeasement of North Korea as a diplomatic setback
tantamount to the French allowing the German army to reoccupy the Rhineland.
The French failure to enforce the demilitarization of the Rhineland led to the collapse of the system of alliances so carefully built up to deter a second world war. After this failure former French allies--Yugoslavia, Romania, Bulgaria--all began to scramble to reach an accommodation with Germany. Italy, which had opposed German ambitions in Austria, decided to abandon this position and instead began to seek a German alliance. Only Czechoslovakia continued as an ally--only to be sold out at Munich. Even Poland tried to make a deal with Hitler, until it became obvious any deal short of complete surrender was impossible.
Trump's wiliness to sell out South Korea and Japan will have ramifications far beyond North Asia. Right now military planners in both countries are busily examining their options--which include developing or acquiring nuclear weapons to provide their own deterrence against North Korea, Russia and China. And so, rather than seeing the end of nuclear weapons on the Korean peninsula, we may well see a nuclear arms race as Tokyo and Seoul abandon all faith in American promises of security.
Beyond that, other nations in the region, seeing an increasingly powerful and aggressive China, and an increasingly erratic and unreliable America, will draw their own conclusions. If the US is willing to sell out Japan and South Korea for the vague promise of eventual North Korean disarmament, what might Trump be willing to offer China and Russia in exchange for--what is again we've gained from all this?
And in Europe, reeling from Trump's accusations and blustering about trade, Germany and France are already acting as though the US alliance is irreparably damaged. Germans for generations have been understandably anxious about expanding their military beyond a purely defensive force. The German decision to send troops to Afghanistan in support of the US/British mission came only after much debate. But a German "defensive force" without a strong US/NATO guarantee will be a whole different animal. I think there is a distinct possibility that Germany too might now be weighing its nuclear options, as their own deterrent against a nuclear Russia.
I hate to be so pessimistic, but I can't help but see what Trump has done as a complete catastrophe for American influence around the world. Some might applaud this, considering the blunders and disasters visited upon Guatemala, Vietnam, Iraq. But we are now in a new world, one in which American guarantees aren't worth a Trump University diploma.
Can this damage be reversed by a future administration? I hope so, but I doubt it. Credibility is an easy commodity to lose, but difficult to regain. Never again will the United States have the credibility and influence it had under President Obama.
The American Century is over.
Sophia4
(3,515 posts)gratuitous
(82,849 posts)Tie performance of the agreed-upon actions to some concrete reward or penalty? Kind of like the JCPOA the United States and the other members of the UN Security Council concluded with Iran back in 2015.
thucythucy
(8,069 posts)The alternative to canceling a major part of our military alliance with South Korea and Japan would have been to continue the policy President Obama followed--a sanction regime, containment and deterrence. To trying to hammer out a multinational deal to restrain North Korea from further testing and development.
We could have done that without abandoning our alliance with the South Korean military.
You honestly believe North Korea under its current leadership will ever abandon their nukes? And risk "the Libyan option"?
The irony is Trump abandoned the Iran deal--a substantive and enforceable arrangement under which the US sacrificed nothing in terms of regional security--and has entered into this vague arrangement after stiffing two of our staunchest allies.
The only two alternatives that seem to exist for Trump are war and appeasement. He might have first tried actual and informed diplomacy first.
saidsimplesimon
(7,888 posts)In the scope of time, this is but a blip. We can and we will change course. It's just a matter of how much pain and suffering must be endured.
thucythucy
(8,069 posts)Not to push the analogy too far (because it breaks down for a variety of reasons) but the German reoccupation of the Rhineland was dismissed at the time---"after all, they're only taking a stroll in their back yard,"
Trump has reneged on a military agreement we had with the South Koreans that has lasted more than half a century. He did this without a word of warning to the South Koreans or the Japanese. He is compromising the preparedness of our military alliance in one of the most dangerous--if not THE most dangerous--region in the world. In return for nothing. No solid agreement. No verification regime. Nothing.
I think the ramifications of this idiotic PR stunt will be felt around the world, and will long outlast Trump's tenure in the White House.
soryang
(3,299 posts)If you are in the negotiating process and things are progressing appropriately, it isn't smart to fly B1" s and B52s into the region and simulate "decapitation" operations during war games. It's just common sense.
No one said a word about abandoning our military alliances with Japan and S.Korea. This is just unfounded exaggeration.
Comparing this to Munich is absurd. The US is conducting active military operations all over the world. Our military is massive and our operations in the Korean theater have been very intimidating.
The sanctions haven't been lifted.
We were on the brink of war a few months ago. And now the media is upset because it looks like things are going to be more peaceful in this region.
What catastrophe?
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)Citation needed.
soryang
(3,299 posts)in the region than they were just a few months ago.
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)Are the political prisoners in North Korea suddenly free, as just one example? Has Kim committed to free and open elections? Yeah, Trump isn't threatening Little Rocket Man with fire and fury, or calling him a maniac, but it's only Tuesday.
soryang
(3,299 posts)If millions die in a war in Northeast Asia how will you evaluate their civil rights?
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)No sense getting even more people killed in cruel ways on the off chance that he'll actually be as good as his word.
Wow. Ordinarily, I'd have to be doing some powerful hallucinogenics to see things like that.
soryang
(3,299 posts)It's amazing to me, that everyone is an expert now on the Koreas.
Response to soryang (Reply #6)
thucythucy This message was self-deleted by its author.