So, I binge watched the 1st 2 seasons of The Handmaids Tale

[Funtatlaguy]

They didn’t see it happening at first EITHER.
They saw their rights being taken away.
But, they waited too long to stop it.
Terrifying show.
Terrifying times we live in now too.

There is no way to be CIVIL with the uncivil.
There is no way to give good to the EVIL and expect them to change.
There is no way to defeat greedy powerful entitled narcissistic people with no empathy by trying to reason with them. Because you can’t reason with the UNREASONABLE.

IF WE CANT BEAT THEM AT THE BALLOT BOX, WE MUST FIND ANOTHER WAY.
Hopefully, that doesn’t mean violence or full scale civil war.
But, damned if I will allow the women of my country to become PROPERTY.
Damned if I will allow my country to become a corporate Christian Taliban.
Will you?

[dewsgirl]

1. Most terrifying line in the whole series, I have always remembered "When they slaughtered Congress,

we didn't wake up." (I hope that is correct, it's been awhile.)

[Funtatlaguy]

3. There are so many terrifying lines.

Don’t watch it if you are easily depressed.
There is a rape scene that I had to fast forward through. Couldn’t handle it.

[dewsgirl]

5. Rape scence S2 E10 "the Last Ceremony".

[marble falls]

2. If we don't get the vote out in November, we'll deserve what we've let happen to us...

An individual vote is the only sort of equality we have to those who openly proclaim their desire to get rid of us, they technically get only one vote each, too. We out number them.

We need to be as committed to change as much as they commit against change.

[volstork]

12. "We need to be as committed to change as much as they commit against change."

Exactly this!

Well said, marble falls!

[onlyadream]

4. June mentions the frog being in water that gradually gets warmer

and warmer until it’s boiling and the frog is dead. That’s a good number of Americans, barely paying attention, voting on emotion, if voting at all, not realizing what’s really happening, until it’s too late.

Also, Serena Joy has zero empathy for anyone or anything. It’s all about her and her desire to have a baby. Sick.

[Funtatlaguy]

7. Aunt Lydia reminds me of Rudy Giuliani

Enabling asshole

[Alwaysna]

21. Aunt Lydia is in a bad spot.

She doesn't have many options. Too old to be handmaid. She's not married . They don't have any use for her except the colonies where the toxic sludge is or her current position . I've never seen any elderly people on the show.

[TexasBushwhacker]

37. That actress, Ann Dowd, won an Emmy

She plays a baddy in the film Compliance too.

[mantis49]

42. She also had a big role in HBO's The Leftovers

n/t

[Nitram]

17. You are right, only. I have friends who think the left and the media are just exaggerating the

danger Trump poses to the country.

[peggysue2]

6. The Handmaid's Tale is more relevant now than . . .

when Atwood first published. I think Atwood was picking up on religious extremism--the rise of the Christian Right, for instance--and went into the 'what if' mode from that start line. I read the book when it came out never thinking the storyline would become terrifyingly real.

If you're up-to-date with the episodes, The Last Ceremony when June--after being savagely raped by The Commander--is reunited with Hannah then you know those scenes absolutely nail the parent/child separation trauma. The episode couldn't be more timely or heartbreaking.

And yes, you're right, the fictional characters never saw the complete horror coming. Double yes, evil cannot be appeased or reasoned with and true ideologues ultimately end up like Serena--hollow and endlessly vindictive. All for the Cause, the True Faith for which they've surrendered everything. Even their souls.

[NewJeffCT]

8. Yes, when the book originally came out

in the mid 1980s, I immediately thought of Reagan and the rise of the Religious Right.

I have not watched season 2, as I watched season 1 using a free month of Hulu last year.

[forgotmylogin]

10. Atwood and Orwell were both prescient with their cautionary tales.

I'm glad The Handmaid's Tale is getting attention.

[localroger]

32. Atwood once made the point

...that by design, everything that happens in the book is something that some human society actually did and thought was a good idea at some time in the past. There is really no speculation except for those things happening again here. Its power is that it is actually hyper-realistic.

[gulliver]

9. It's not reality.

Nor is The Stepford Wives. It doesn't mean they can't be enjoyed and learned from. They aren't gonna happen though. It's actually very counterproductive to suggest they might, imo.

[ProfessorPlum]

15. what a ridiculous post

there are powerful people who would very much like to make many features of this fictional society real. They are against abortion, birth control, women controlling their own bodies, and for obedience to authority and the rule of the elite.

To that extent, Gilead already exists in a very real way within many Americans.

[Nitram]

18. Gulliver, I believe you are mistaken. The "It can't happen here" belief is the biggest weakness

our democracy has. Sure, it might not look exactly like the novel, but in principle the same thing could happen if, for example, rising oceans lead to economic breakdown and the splintering of the nation into smaller fiefdoms.

[paleotn]

23. Umm, actually, yes it can....

I've been exposed to the religious right my entire life and trust me, there are many in that movement who wouldn't at all be upset with a theocratic dictatorship in the US. In fact they would rejoice. People like Franklin Graham, James Dobson and many other are all about enforcing their world view on the rest of us, by legislation and the power of the state if necessary. In fact, I once heard Dobson espousing the virtues of a "godly" dictatorship, whatever the fuck that is, over the evils of democracy. He actually said those things on his radio show. Their motivation is to turn the US into some puritanical hell hole by any means necessary. And I mean any means. There's no real love for Trump in the hierarchy of the religious right. They're not stupid like their followers. They know who and what he is. He's merely a useful idiot for furthering their agenda.

As for their stupid followers, many times I've heard would be normal and supposedly decent people state with heartfelt conviction that gays and atheists should be locked up simply for being gay or atheist. That we should bring back the Old Testament punishments to "clean up our wretched society". They would see Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and all other Christians who don't believe exactly as they do, be forced to espouse the "one true religion" or suffer the consequences. To them, it's simply what we have to do to "remake our society in god's image." It's really not all that far from that to stringing up their former neighbors in front of a wall in order to clean our society of what they consider the unrepentant ungodly.

[Generic Other]

24. The story is allegorical

It is already happening. Christian right controls women's fertility (or does a damn good job trying): they wish to outlaw abortion and contraceptives even, curtail women's right to make decisions about their own bodies, force women to carry pregnancies to term,and pretty much only value them for their childbearing abilities. They even jail them for miscarrying. They believe in the subjugation of women to patriarchal control not excluding violence against them, even rape. They glorify stay-at-home privileged wives and seek to limit the majority of working women to menial jobs (Aunt Marthas), and even would like to determine what it is appropriate for women to wear. They want the government to be a theocracy, they defend Old Testament justice, they rule as an elite in a police state as part of the apparatus of control. They stifle dissent and disseminate propaganda 24/7.

Most of that sounds like where I live.

[LiberalLovinLug]

28. I understand where you are coming from, that it's not reality

It was written as speculative fiction, and spiced up with costumes. It was suspending reality in its plot lines to further the goal of creating a riveting book to read. Like how Canada could be such a haven. I'd think that if it got that extreme, Canada would probably be either falling in line with Gilead or borders would be closed and patrolled. I also don't think such an evil regime would be bothered to or creative enough, to design various coloured outfits for the various women's groups. And I think they exagerated the turnover time to implement such a well orchestrated ingrained social structure so quickly. Based on the visual age of the main characters before and after the full implementation.

But...


The tenants of the show, the suggestion that if given the chance, that there is an element in the US that would welcome something similar, is correct. Also the fact that it has happened to some degree already in history less than 100 years ago. And thirdly, many more violent and racist incidents have already happened, with Trumpsters emboldened by their fascist leader. Laws are also being slowly changed towards the eventuality of a coup. With looser gun carry and acquisition laws to facilitate any violent uprising. I am frightened as to what could happen if Trump is indicted. Attacks on funding for Planned Parenthood. Voter suppression. Demonization of the 'other'. Whole networks dedicated to Christian-right propaganda. And now the Sinclair Group poised to take over 76% of the local news shows Americans watch. It is exactly like a pot of frogs in slowly heating water. Just because the temperature is a nice comfortable luke warm right now does not mean someone hasn't turned on the burner.

[localroger]

33. There are no androids in The Handmaid's Tale

It is not speculative fiction. As I said in post #32, which ironically sits right above yours right now, Atwood has said that everything that happens in the book is something that has actually happened in some human society in the past, that actual people thought was a good idea. The only speculation is those things happening again here. And given the whackadoodle makeup of a large part of our population, that speculation isn't very fringe.

[AmandaRuth]

11. the only thing they left out

was the race stuff. In the book, AA's were sent to the "badlands", the Dakotas (I think that was it)-

other than that, spot on...... so many similarities to what is happening right before our eyes.

[LiberalLovinLug]

31. Yes, that is another suspension of reality that is a little unbelievable

My theory for not including that in the series is that it complicates the plotline to be tackling both women's suppression and AA suppression. Or more simpler, racism or sexism? Both are powerful topics and they wanted to instead focus on how such a fascist society would affect women, as was Atwood's focus. That the show only had so much time and having too many issues to address at once would muddle the plot lines further.

But I agree that it is very unlikely that such a government would be a mixed-race society. To the point of giving black men the same rights as white men. Or even the fact that some of the handmaids are black. Do they only go to black commanders? Or are they suggesting that that kind of dictatorship would be fine with mixed racial babies? They try and excuse this by having a threat of massive infertlie infliction on most women to the point that race is not an issue. But I think if they went to that much trouble already, and given the already disturbingly loud white supremacist faction already within the county, it would be definitely be a more apartheid system.

[volstork]

13. I read the book in college

when it first came out in the mid-80s, and it scared the crap out of me. Never dreamed I would come so close to living it.

Atwood indicated in an interview around the time of the premier of the series that everything she included in the book had already happened somewhere on earth at some time in history. There is nothing new under the sun. There will always be those of us who want to move humanity forward, and those who hold stake in maintaining the status quo or even in reversing beneficial change. It is our duty to ourselves and to those after us to fight on and continue progress for all of our sisters and brothers.

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

14. I was prepared to lay down my life...

when I was in the Army, never stopped being prepared.
It would be an honorable death.

[Nitram]

16. I read the Handmaid's Tale, but it doesn't go into the process that led to the premise of the book.

Does the series provide the backstory to the patriarchal society that is already fully-formed in the book? BTW, I highly recommend "The Power," a novel that recounts how the tables are turned when women get the power to inflict a painful or deadly electric shock at will.

[Funtatlaguy]

20. Slowly, it does.

I’m hoping Season Three will give more of the back story.

[paleotn]

25. In bits and pieces....

a bit at a time, which is highly irritating to me. The only down side of the series in my opinion. Other than that, it's extremely well done and Atwood has been more involved than other authors. I know, it's about June and her story, but dammit! I want to know what happened to our nuclear arsenal. I want to know if the Brits and our other NATO allies are quietly building up troops in Canada in preparation for an invasion in support of forces still loyal to the legitimate US government. That's been eluded to in the series. Wouldn't it be ironic if American democracy is reestablished and a bloody, repressive regime is overthrown with the help of German troops.

[localroger]

34. That's true to the book, though

Atwood also dumped us straight into Gilead and only slowly revealed how it got that way.

[Generic Other]

26. I believe it was a nuclear war that triggered the crackdown on freedom

Atwood wrote it in 1985. I have always called it a feminist horror story although it is so much more. I love that it was published the year after 1984. Seem like wonderful irony, no? Like the morning after pill in dystopian form. This novel has always been on my list of 10 greatest of the 20th century.

Notice how she got it right that a 9/11 type event could trigger bizarro responses by the government to re-establish order?

As for your question, what about this scenario: the religious right are opportunists. They fill vacuums of reason with fear and superstition. The book you recommend sounds intriguing, but I tend to mistrust ones where a society filled with women given power are just going to be as dickish as the men they seized control from. We have good men and women and bad. That's more in keeping with Atwood's view. She is quite good at revealing the glimmers of humanity found even within the evil people in her stories.

[Nitram]

29. Generic, I remember thinking in 1984 that Reagan's election was the

embodiment of Orwell's prophecy. I suspect Reagan and the right wing media the sprang up during his term, led directly to Trump.

[Generic Other]

35. Now that you mention it

that makes sense. Atwood was probably thinking so too

[barbtries]

19. i read the book last year

and i even subscribed to Hulu almost entirely for the show. it's been on my watchlist for months. i got through about 1 minute of the first episode and said nope.

i'm not ready. i see it too clearly i guess. i often balk at watching shows that i know will illustrate the maddening abuse of power and lack of humanity and respect for the rule of law on the right.

scary as shit. to answer your question, at 62 it's easier than most for me to say this, but i will resist to the death if necessary.

[TexasBushwhacker]

38. Check out 11.22.63

It's about a man who travels back in time to prevent JFK's assassination. It's based on a Stephen King story.

[Texin]

22. In a fight for one's life, there's ALWAYS a little blood shed in the process.

Every revolutionary-type movement throughout history has witnessed confrontations with blood shed in the streets or by persons being persecuted for who or what group they come from, who they worship, who they love, what they aspire to be and for each and every person to be allowed to have the right to their own happiness, self-realization and dignity.

[virgogal]

27. It's from a novel,just like "1984" and "Gone With the Wind"

A figment of the author's imagination.

Relax.

[Nitram]

30. It is a failure of the imagination to miss the truth in novels like 1984.

It is absurd to rank 1984 in the same category as Gone with the Wind. But I suppose your post was intended to be provocative rather than meaningful. The "pigment" of an author's imagination often speaks to a greater truth than the predictions of political theorists and TV pundits.

[virgogal]

39. I try VERY hard to never be meaningful----but so be it.

[Nitram]

41. May I say that you have succeeded in that.

Thanks for the warning.

[virgogal]

43. Thank you.

[EffieBlack]

36. Serena reminds me of the blond female conservative commentators who enable the worst of the movement

and don’t for one second think that the policies they’re promoting will ever negatively impact them.

Serena surely thought that when the revolution came, she’d continue being an influence and a voice, only to find herself just a few rungs up from being a handmaid, with a blue uniform stead of a red one, getting whipped for being too uppity.

I often wonder what these pundits think will happen to them if the conservative movement actually gets its way. The damage won’t be just to “others.”