A lot of what passes for "conventional wisdom" among the older

[Atticus]

Democratic establishment amounts to "there is a certain way things are to be done, the way they have 'always' been done, and variations will not be encouraged, supported or financed".

Doesn't that sound awfully CONSERVATIVE?

I'm 69 and a liberal. I am for doing things HOWEVER they need to be done to win and begin the long process of repairing our democracy and our world reputation.

Am I "out of step" or are they?

[Different Drummer]

1. Sounds like they're the ones out of step. n/t

[RandySF]

2. Context?

[Atticus]

4. Pelosi, Schumer, many in the DNC. Primaries are SUPPOSED to be where WE choose

candidates.

[RandySF]

5. Ok, has anyone stopped you from voting?

[Atticus]

6. And here I thought you were a serious poster. nt

[RandySF]

7. I'm trying to get some more information here.

It sounds like you have a specific grievance and I'm searching for details.

[Cha]

24. He is.. you don't need to get personal and say

he's not.

[Demsrule86]

23. Sure, but this is not a normal year and not one dime should be spent on Primarying sitting Democrats

in my view...but in going after GOP held house and senate seats...we could put all that money in the Senate and improve our chances of winning a majority...that would stop the Trump's court packing cold...that is way more important than choosing another Democrat to fill a Democratic seat...which doesn't change the status quo and help us get a majority. That is how I and others look at it. The house is on fire. This is not a normal year. We are fighting for our lives. Put the money and time where it counts.

[Mopar151]

3. Is this the bunch that muzzled Kerry?

And keeps pooh-poohing election fraud?

[Hoyt]

8. Me too. Although letting Sanders run as a Democrat didn't work so well.

I’m still for changing things up when it makes some sense. That’s the hard part, telling when it makes some sense.

[Kentonio]

12. It worked extremely well

It motivated large numbers of voters to start caring again and to come out and vote. Without Sanders we’d have lost even harder.

[Hoyt]

13. Maybe, but it contributed to Clinton losing too.

[Kentonio]

14. Not really

We gained a lot of new voters, and energized grassroots workers. Despite the rhetoric some people engage in here, he didn’t fight a dirty or even particularly rough campaign against her. In a non-incumbent year, any candidate would have to expect a primary fight.

[Hoyt]

15. Yes, really. Primary weakened Clinton, and trump used some of Sanders ideas to beat Clinton.

And he’s still using some of them, TPP, European trade, tariffs, immigration, promising to artificially reduce world trade, for example.

[Kentonio]

16. Why would Clinton not have faced a primary battle?

She wasn’t an incumbent President. Last I checked we usually make our candidates win the nomination, not just hand it to them.

As for Trump using Sanders ideas, come on now. The GOP have been smearing Hillary for decades, they sure as hell didn’t need some light ammunition from a Vermont progressive.

[Hoyt]

17. Sometimes it's just the smart thing to do to ensure victory, as in this case.

Obviously, Sanders didn’t do anything illegal. But Democrats should have told him No since he was not a Democrat, has run against Democrats, and was critical of Democrats, even promising things he couldn’t deliver to make Democrats look bad. It hurt us just enough, to put trump in office. More than enough Sanders supporters were fine with that, in November.

[Kentonio]

19. No sorry

That’s just you channeling your own feelings about him onto the result. He didn’t run third party because he didn’t want to hurt the party. That was exactly the right decision.

[Hoyt]

35. Maybe you are "channeling." I like most of Sanders' ideas, just not his honesty about chances to

achieve it. I was adamantly opposed to his world trade views that everyone would get a big pay raise here if we just traded among ourselves and treated foreign workers like scabs (I admit, probably someone of a simplification, but not a lot).

[Kentonio]

39. I don't agree with that vision either

Although I don’t think he actually intended it in anything like those stark terms. Unlike Trump and his authoritarian approach however, I think Bernie would have run a much more reasonable administration and respected the power of congress a lot more, meaning any wild ideas on trade would have been heavily moderated anyway.

[mythology]

21. Somehow Obama won in spite of a primary

Clinton didn't lose because of the primary. She lost because she had that stupid email server. The polling data shows she was ahead by enough she almost certainly would have won until the second Comey announcement. If she didn't have the email server, there's no announcement to make.

[Cha]

27. trump was Rigged in because of the Russians..

And, their Enablers. that's conveniently forgotten by some. But, not by the Majority.

[Bettie]

33. I'd add in voter suppression

and at least some outright cheating in terms of vote counting as well.

All that compounded by 25 or 30 years of continuous negative press about Clinton.

Many voters literally can not recall a time when she wasn't being investigated for something.

She wasn't guilty of anything, but it still stuck in many people's subconscious that she wasn't to be trusted.

Marketing works and this was negative marketing over the course of many, many years, a constant hum at the back of people's minds.

And she still won. He is not legitimate in any way.

[Cha]

26. You are absolutely

correct!

And, we can't forget the Fucking Russians.

[Cha]

25. Of course it did.

[rickford66]

9. Democrats should run center left.

That's where the majority of the country is. Moving to the right may gain a few votes but loses the enthusiasm and votes from the left.

[JNelson6563]

10. That's exactly right.

Center left. Not far left. Not center. Center left.

[SoCalDem]

20. The "center" anything is a myth these days

We are in a left-right cycle .. The center is where it's blurry and wobbly. Republicans were never really moderate. Back when people pretended to be a moderate R, they were still eager to cut taxes/starve the beast/cut benefits.

Once the religious nutcases joined in, they only got meaner. They have been mostly racist since the Dixiecrats bailed.

Dem have been "moderate"ly pummeled since the 60's, and I don't see it ending anytime soon.

Every time we are in a position to govern, we are too busy cleaning up the horrific messes left by a republican, and our leadership only wants to forgive & forget, and play nice..

[JNelson6563]

40. Yeah, ok, no, I'm sure

NY CD 1 and MI CD 1 are very much alike and one could win either district with the exact same far left platform.

(Yeah, I squeezed 10 pounds of sarcasm into that sentence)

[Squinch]

11. Isn't there a big tizzy going in right now about the

somewhat farther left candidate who unseated a somewhat less far left candidate in the primaries?

So, who is being prevented from doing what, now?

[JI7]

18. they want Pelosi gone

what's funny is those complaining are usually white males . and if that district had more white men there was less chance cortez would have won.

the reason she won was because of the democratic base which also supports people like pelosi. minority voters.

instead of white men talking to other white men and getting them to vote for better candidates and policies they will keep going after the woman.

[Squinch]

22. And as I keep pointing out, five miles away from Ocasio-Cortez, Engel won his primary in

a landslide. He's old guard Democratic. So all these blanket statements about how we all have to cater to this or that group are moronic.

[Cha]

28. "Engel won his primary in a landslide. He's old guard Democratic"

Can't say it enough.. Thank You, Squinch!

[murielm99]

32. I went to a meeting of one of the local grassroots organizations

a few weeks ago. One of the men who spends too much time on the Internet asserted that, "Nancy Pelosi has to go!"

A middle-aged woman spoke up, very politely. She said that, believe it or not, she had been a right wing republican until a few years ago. She informed the man, politely, that that was the number one topic among the republicans. They were always trying to find a way to get rid of Nancy Pelosi. The conversation turned away from that sentiment immediately.

[OnDoutside]

29. You can be strident with your centrism !!!! Every one assumes that to

be a centrist you should meekly say "Oh well", when get shafted by the right. No, you can be just as vociferous in defending common decency.

[Cary]

31. Strident?

Being strident is a good thing? Really?

[OnDoutside]

36. Yes, yes it is.

[Cary]

37. I suggest that's a poor choice of words

Resolute. Assertive. ...

I'm sure there are others unless you really want to say that being obnoxious is an end in and of itself. I do suspect that is the end that a Nina Turner or Susan Sarandon aspires to, unfortunately. And if you tell me that is your goal then I would have to believe you.

[Cary]

30. Badmouthing Democrsts!

Finding pretexts to bash each others or, better yet, taking up fascist lies and smears...! Yep that's the ticket!

[betsuni]

34. Conventional wisdom: if someone tells you a plate is hot and not to touch it, don't touch it.

Trying to make Teh Democratic Establishment into CONSERVATIVES:

[NCTraveler]

38. "They" are not a monolithic group as you outline.

"Doesn't that sound awfully CONSERVATIVE?"

No.

No one is better in the bedroom than a twenty-two year old male. Just ask him.