General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI know there is no "proof" the Russians changed the election count, BUT....
if someone breaks into my home, I don't wait to see if they dropped by to deliver flowers.
Nictuku
(3,587 posts)Every time I have heard any government official or news broadcaster speak about this, they invariably say something like this:
"We have not seen any evidence of actual election counts tampering"
Here is the problem: If you don't 'look' for something, you won't 'see' anything.
I don't think anyone has actually even done any computer forensics to see if there was something nefarious.
mythology
(9,527 posts)Wisconsin partially hand recounted. Those counties didn't show a significant difference from the counties that machine recounted. Same for Pennsylvania were all the votes that were recounted were by hand.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/06/06/were-2016-vote-counts-in-michigan-and-wisconsin-hacked-we-double-checked/?utm_term=.5b9e029a4147
The national polls in 2016 were more accurate than in 2012.
sarah FAILIN
(2,857 posts)Without a paper trail, there is nothing and on the systems in question we were not allowed to look at them at all.
Thieves don't break into your house to hang out. They have a reason to be there even if you don't know what it was yet.
Tatiana
(14,167 posts)Like, maybe they didn't steal anything. But they sure as hell broke into your house to do SOMETHING. And it's logical to assume that someone breaking into your house wants to steal something.
After everything that the Republicans have done of late, I think it makes sense to actually theorize that something affecting vote totals happened and conduct a search for evidence operating from that theory.
The Michigan vote totals don't freaking make sense. The Democratic vote totals coming out of Detroit don't make sense. We don't need to examine samples. We need a top to bottom forensic examination of the software and all voting equipment used. And the fact that the Republicans are SO afraid of paper ballots and statewide recounts tells me that they are hiding SOMETHING.
We can use logic to determine what they might be hiding, can't we? Or shall we continue to think that Republicans won't stoop that low?
NY_20th
(1,028 posts)The States need to ask the FBI and the DOJ to do such an investigation, and most are reluctant to do so.
Varaddem
(431 posts)And I dont believe they broke into your house to clean it either
alwaysinasnit
(5,060 posts)Malcolm Nance interview by Stephanie Miller that was previously posted.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1017500669
csziggy
(34,131 posts)Remember the reports of people whose voter registration was changed from Democratic to Republican so they were blocked from voting in the primaries? Or those whose registrations did not show up at their local precincts? Or the thousands whose "motor voter" registrations were not processed or lost? Or the millions whose voter registration was contested because "John Jones" (or more likely an ethnic variation) was found in another state or had a past conviction?
Add all of that to the massive effort to suppress voting - not just the repressive Republican laws but the social media push to claim that "both parties are the same so why bother to vote." And the push to vote for third party candidates because Hillary Clinton was not "progressive enough" or that she was mean to BS.
The Russians did not have to change the vote tally - they just needed to make sure too many people were blocked, repressed, depressed, and convinced not to vote.
Oh - and how about the broken machines in Detroit that prevented an estimated 70,000 from casting their ballots? And the number of primarily Democratic and minority precincts across the country under supplied with working voting machines so that lines were excessively long so people could not stay long enough to vote?
The Republicans and their allies the Russians have been working up to this for years - and in 2016 they achieved their goal.
alwaysinasnit
(5,060 posts)they have trouble getting their votes counted, rather than tamper with vote tallies.
onecaliberal
(32,785 posts)Turbineguy
(37,295 posts)As it turned out. But they would have been able to.
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)This is the culmination of a 20 plus year plan. You they they'd leave the counting up to chance?
shanny
(6,709 posts)Dawson Leery
(19,348 posts)Since they had access, it is very possible.