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Lawrence Tribe says it is treason: (Original Post) Kingofalldems Jul 2018 OP
I am not a lawyer or a constitutional scholar, but it sure looks like they waged a war shraby Jul 2018 #1
It won't be treason for the rich. Just the lesser knowns. nt chowder66 Jul 2018 #2
The people who worked with putin and his hackers duforsure Jul 2018 #3
Precisely. dalton99a Jul 2018 #4
I've come around. TomSlick Jul 2018 #5
Exactly. Kingofalldems Jul 2018 #6
Agree too Capperdan Jul 2018 #13
Russia's cyber attack was an act of war.... babylonsister Jul 2018 #7
Time to open another Congressional Benghazi hearing. NoMoreRepugs Jul 2018 #8
North Korea may provide a better case for "treason" Shoonra Jul 2018 #9
Until I read yesterday's indictment, I agreed with you. TomSlick Jul 2018 #16
In a sense Trump and his allies overthrew the government of the United States with Russian help. UCmeNdc Jul 2018 #10
Yes, if it is an act of war . kentuck Jul 2018 #11
I've often said this was an act of war. PatrickforO Jul 2018 #12
Death Penalty applies for treason in a time of war? Republicons LOVE the death penalty. . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2018 #14
Yep Hekate Jul 2018 #15
We've been saying this for close to two years malaise Jul 2018 #17
Prof. Tribe is right on this Gothmog Jul 2018 #18
The biggest obstacle to the treason charge is the meaning of "enemy." OliverQ Jul 2018 #19
How do you suppose they could ever have addressed cyber warfare in the constitution? There shraby Jul 2018 #20
Name someone charged with treason for pro-Soviet activities during the Cold War. onenote Jul 2018 #21
If a Deplorable, i.e. Republican had to choose between losing or getting help from Russia DemocratSinceBirth Jul 2018 #22

shraby

(21,946 posts)
1. I am not a lawyer or a constitutional scholar, but it sure looks like they waged a war
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 02:06 PM
Jul 2018

using military to me and I understand it's treason during war to collaborate with the enemy.

duforsure

(11,885 posts)
3. The people who worked with putin and his hackers
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 02:16 PM
Jul 2018

To help do this ARE guilty of treason, and those helping him in any way now are co-conspirators who will be just as guilty of acting on behalf of someone attacking our country and our Democracy. Trumps leaving a huge trail , and public statements that'll be great to use for his own prosecution , and conviction. They already know what he's done, and just a matter of when they want to pull the plug on him and many others.

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
5. I've come around.
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 02:28 PM
Jul 2018

I have resisted calling it treason. I've changed my mind.

Prof. Tribe is correct. The Russian military attacked the United States. The fact that is was a cyber-attack does not make it any less a military attack. Therefore, it was an act of war - one that is on-going.

Anyone who aided the Russian military in the attack are traitors. Anyone that continues to attempt to hide the fact of the attack are traitors. That would include many GOP Congressmen.

I will now call it what it is - treason.

babylonsister

(171,056 posts)
7. Russia's cyber attack was an act of war....
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 03:01 PM
Jul 2018

snip//

Russia’s cyber attack was an act of war. They significantly disrupted and damaged our Constitutional infrastructure in an attempt to undermine the foundation of U.S. democracy. They were of sufficient scope, duration and intensity to deem them armed attacks. Clearly, they meet the international criteria of an armed attack and an act of war against the United States.


more...

https://www.thedailybeast.com/its-not-a-liberal-fantasy-to-ask-if-trump-committed-treason

NoMoreRepugs

(9,408 posts)
8. Time to open another Congressional Benghazi hearing.
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 03:13 PM
Jul 2018

Deflect deflect deflect.

Or maybe an investigation into how President Obama masterminded all this?

Repukes will stop at nothing to maintain power. Going to take stronger measures than subpoenas and proof.

Shoonra

(520 posts)
9. North Korea may provide a better case for "treason"
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 03:22 PM
Jul 2018

Treason is the only crime defined by the US Constitution and the definition differs from uses of the accusation in previous British history. In US law it presupposes an active conflict with a hostile power.

It might be argued that there was no active conflict with the former Soviet Union, but the same cannot be said for North Korea. The Korean War never officially ended; there was an armistice but not cessation of hostilities. Technically and legally, as a UN member, the US is still actively engaged in a police action against North Korea. So Trump's unilateral concessions to North Korea might qualify under the Constitutional definition.

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
16. Until I read yesterday's indictment, I agreed with you.
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 04:33 PM
Jul 2018

The Russian military attacked the United States. No shots were fired but it was nevertheless a military attack - an act of war.

The paradigm has changed. Wars do not now necessarily include the expenditure of ordinance or the killing of soldiers. The United States recognized the change in 2009 with the establishment of US Cyber Command.

US citizens that participated in the attack are guilty of treason. US citizens that continue to abet the attack by down playing, diverting, and obfuscating are also guilty of treason.

One thing the right-wingers were correct about years ago. You cannot combat the danger until you name it. The name is treason.

UCmeNdc

(9,600 posts)
10. In a sense Trump and his allies overthrew the government of the United States with Russian help.
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 03:37 PM
Jul 2018

They did not allow the will of the people be the deciding factor.

PatrickforO

(14,570 posts)
12. I've often said this was an act of war.
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 03:44 PM
Jul 2018

I'm not thinking we should get into a shooting war with Russia, mind you, but we sure as hell need to clean up the treason, and put better firewalls in place to close down the hacking.

And that's no shit.

malaise

(268,910 posts)
17. We've been saying this for close to two years
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 04:35 PM
Jul 2018

It was as clearbas the blue skies outside my window. Now we have proof.

What matters most is who is going to lock up all these people.

 

OliverQ

(3,363 posts)
19. The biggest obstacle to the treason charge is the meaning of "enemy."
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 08:38 PM
Jul 2018

Aiding and abetting an enemy is a complex, often debated element of the Constitution. Generally enemy has been assumed to refer to a country we're in a declared war with. But treason charges have been brought against people during the Cold War where there was no official declaration of War.

Since the Constitution never addresses cyber warfare by foreign military, it's an open question. I think it absolutely should be treason. But I'm not sure we'll actually get that charge.

shraby

(21,946 posts)
20. How do you suppose they could ever have addressed cyber warfare in the constitution? There
Sun Jul 15, 2018, 01:23 PM
Jul 2018

wasn't even such a word until in the 1970s-1980s or so except in maybe comic books or movies.

onenote

(42,690 posts)
21. Name someone charged with treason for pro-Soviet activities during the Cold War.
Sun Jul 15, 2018, 03:05 PM
Jul 2018

Not even the Rosenbergs were charged with treason. Such charges are rarely brought and they won't be brought against Trump or any of his associates. Why? Because we are not in a state of war with Russia. They have not been designated an enemy under the Trading with the Enemies Act. We maintain diplomatic relations with Russia. Americans can travel with and engage in economic business with Russians. None of those things happen when countries are in a state of "war" with one another.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,710 posts)
22. If a Deplorable, i.e. Republican had to choose between losing or getting help from Russia
Sun Jul 15, 2018, 03:14 PM
Jul 2018

If a Deplorable, i.e. Republican had to choose between losing an election or getting help from Russia he or she would choose the latter. Everything else is commentary....

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