Queen Elisabeth expressed her opinion despite her duty of reserve :)

[syringis]

[Grassy Knoll]

1. Long Live The Queen...

[Gothmog]

45. Well done: Royal family 'snub' Trump as Queen left to meet the US president alone Daily Mail Onlin

Link to tweet

[msongs]

2. is that melania in the nurse ratched uniform? nt

[Rstrstx]

14. Now that you mention it, she does remind me of someone

[marble falls]

3. Not so big on using that word as an insult here.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

4. Ditto!

[pazzyanne]

5. Make that three.

And on top of that, it is very disrespectful to a woman who is all about decorum. I hate memes that are dishonest about the people whose pictures they usurp.

[mr_lebowski]

8. Are you 3 unfamiliar with how the term is bandied about in the UK, and how it means something

entirely different from what it means in the US?

Just askin' ...

[Petrushka]

10. This isn't the UK. (eom)

[mr_lebowski]

11. It's actually nowhere ... it's the internet :)

[Petrushka]

13. You're right, of course! Sometimes this absent-minded ol' biddy forgets where she is! :-P

[HipChick]

20. Where is This?

[Petrushka]

55. Last time I looked, this was there---now this is here---who knows where this might be tomorrow.

This gets around. At least, this is the rumour going around.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

15. I'm familiar with it being a misogynistic term.

It's disgusting to see its use with approval here.

[pazzyanne]

27. Strongly agree, 50 Shades of Blue!

[Denzil_DC]

19. If you ever visit the UK, I'd advise being very careful of the contexts in which you use that word.

It's not "bandied about" casually except in very specific circles, and its meaning and consequences of use are not dissimilar to those in the US. Otherwise this joke pic wouldn't have any impact.

Just sayin' ...

[marble falls]

23. This isn't GB......

did you know that?

Just askin'.

If women were trying to reclaim that word, that would be something else.

In the US its used by misogynists to shame women by reducing them to a part. The same way racists reduce People of Color to just their color.

That's as real as the way its used in GB. And more damaging to those being called that here.

[mr_lebowski]

25. This is the internet ... thus 'here' in this context ... is not actually a place ;)

I'm just saying it doesn't have the misogynistic association when used by the folks there, as it does in the US.

In the US, it'd be weird to here a man called one, yeah? Well, men get called that regularly in the UK, put it like that. It's much more synonymous with '@ssh*le' ...

Not saying I love the word by any stretch, just ... I view it differently when used by UK'ers.

[marble falls]

28. Please. If you want to find out where here is, download some child porn that's legal ...

somewhere else.

And I don't judge GB by our standards but it gives me serious pause when people show it here and defend it by saying but its what those folks do there. There is an issue of newsworthiness that gives it SOME leeway and the fact that people like syringis give us an invaluable window on how her part of Europe (at least I hope its Europe and not just a borderless internet) that I for look forward to and pay attention to. I was in my small way trying to give her a little DU view of that same word.

I submit that she and I were counter-partnering.

[mr_lebowski]

37. I'm just saying, DU is not necessarily 'the US' ... people use it from all over the world

Last edited Sun Jul 15, 2018, 11:16 AM - Edit history (1)

We're probably MOSTLY from the US here, but I find it odd to refer to DU as though it has a specific geographic location.

It IS 'what folks do there', and given I know (or, rather 'believe' I should probably say) they don't MEAN it the way we use the word in the US, then I'm not nearly as offended by it.

Kinda like I'm not offended when black people offhandedly and in a friendly sort of way ... refer to each other using the N-Word, but I am when a non-Black person uses it in derogatory way towards blacks. See how it matters 'who's saying it' in that instance? This one works the same for me.

Obviously, you're perfectly free to find it horribly offensive, if you fancy, but I'm not going to be doing so, myself. That's all.

Course, I'm also male, so I suppose in a sense I 'have that luxury', if you will.

G'day

[marble falls]

46. I didn't say "horribly offensive" I did mean totally dismissive of women. I think ...

we all know where we are and we for a good part know who we're typing at particularly on DU which is made up hugely by a US membership.

[Demit]

32. When people want to call someone an asshole, they call him an asshole.

It's a genderless insult, because it's something everyone has. So no, not synonymous at all.

[mr_lebowski]

38. So what you're telling me is ...

Is when a dude in the UK calls another dude a c-word, they 'mean it' they mean the c-word in the same way as I'm about to illustrate:

Me and another dude here in the US are hanging out, and I'm getting on his nerves, constantly whinging about stuff, and he turns around and goes 'dude, stop being a b**ch' ... which would be obviously derogatory and offensive towards women ...

Are you telling me that the c-word in the UK is used the same way as my hypothetical buddy ... used the b-word? Like, an English dude might well use the c-word, where my buddy used the b-word, meaning it the exact same way, to refer to something they consider female-like behaviour?

Because that is not my understanding of the 'meaning of the word' when used in the UK.

If I'm actually wrong about that, then I apologize, and withdraw my 'defense'.

[Denzil_DC]

36. "it doesn't have the misogynistic association when used by the folks there"

This is just plain wrong.

But go ahead, visit and try out your theory.

[mr_lebowski]

40. I have visited though it was quite some time ago & also lived in HK when it was a BCC ...

Our family were members of the Royal Hong Kong Yacht Club while we were there.

My folks own Four Morgan cars (handmade in Malvern, England) they've collected since the early 70's, one of which they keep in England because they go there so friggin' often and do 'Morgan Club' events with all their British Morgan-loving friends, touring the countryside. They've probably been in the UK or France an average of 2 months each year since they retired about 7 years ago. They're there NOW, in fact.

And I have, in fact, heard my own very liberal mother say, literally EXACTLY ... what is on that sign.

So ... tell you what, next time I talk to mom, I'll try to get some further clarity.

If I'm wrong, I'll definitely come back and apologize for my abject wrongness. Fair enough?

[Denzil_DC]

41. I really don't need an apology!

But this thread isn't the first time on my thirty or so years on the Internet when I've read similar claims from Americans that "cunt" isn't a big deal in the UK. When I was in school, far too long ago, it was the worst insult you could call someone, an invite to a punch-up, and that's still true in most everyday contexts nowadays.

It's widely referred to as "the C-bomb", and its shocking impact is used deliberately for effect by some comedians, for instance.

In the context of Trump's visit, let's consider Janey Godley, a notoriously "earthy" Glasgow comedian.

She uses the "c-word" and others liberally in her act for effect. She achieved a degree of fame/notoriety during Trump's Turnberry visit in 2016 on the day after the Brexit vote:

I got out of the bus and stood proudly with my sign “TRUMP IS A CUNT” the cops saw my sign and harassed me into folding it up.

“haha now nobody will see your stupid poster” the cop said.

It went viral, the world saw it so fuck him.

https://janeygodley.com/2016/06/28/welcomed-trump-scotland/

Now here she is during Trump's latest visit:









If the word isn't considered offensive, then why would she play on the idea of self-censorship during this visit?

The photoshop in the OP is a play on Godley's earlier placard and the fuss it provoked - in fact the placard the Queen's "holding" is a clip of Godley's sign.

That's the joke!

[mr_lebowski]

48. My friend, I never said it wasn't 'offensive' or not a terrible insult :)

Just that it didn't have the same misogynist connotation as it has in the US ... i.e. it's not synonymous with 'the most evil possible WOMAN' ... which is how we interpret it in the US.

Like I say, if I'm wrong on that, I apologize, and submit that I wouldn't have 'defended' its use by UK'ers ... as I did.

[Denzil_DC]

49. Then did my computer malfunction and misdisplay your posting above,

"the term is bandied about in the UK, and ... means something entirely different from what it means in the US"?

I've pointed out to you and others that it's not "bandied about" in the UK with anything like the freedom some Americans claim.

Did I misread you then doubling down to somebody else with the news that you're "not nearly as offended by it" because you erroneously assume we in the UK drop it into everyday conversation ad lib?

Did my monitor glitch and mislead me that you then diverted to: "Me and another dude here in the US are hanging out, and I'm getting on his nerves, constantly whinging about stuff, and he turns around and goes 'dude, stop being a b**ch' ... which would be obviously derogatory and offensive towards women ...

Are you telling me that the c-word in the UK is used the same way as my hypothetical buddy ... used the b-word? Like, an English dude might well use the c-word, where my buddy used the b-word, meaning it the exact same way, to refer to something they consider female-like behaviour?"

See, the women (and not a few of the men) I generally hang out with IRL (and not least the woman I'm married to) would take a very dim view of its use on precisely those grounds. I haven't joined in the chorus of disapproval from others in these comments, but I could just as well be reading a UK board, as the objections would be identical (as would some of the defences). Where your definition of "'the most evil possible WOMAN" comes from, I've no idea, and it seems like a red herring which I won't try to follow down the rabbithole where it will no doubt be chasing its tail.

The objections usually centre on the fact that one meaning of the word is a female bodily part, and the unwelcome negative associations with someone - like Trump, in some people's eyes - worthy of being called a "cunt". No bodily part really deserves that, but certainly not such a tender one.

We're two nations divided by a language, but in this respect, we're not that dissimilar.

I thumped my monitor to be sure, to see you then addressing me, saying that your mother used the very phrase on the placard. Did she mean it as a compliment to Trump? Or was she choosing a very strong term to express the vehemence of her disapproval? Or is she in the habit of "bandying it about", which is where you got the idea?

I've also tried to fill you in on some cultural background to the slogan placard and its history and origin, and how it fits with the photoshop in the OP. Its offensiveness and incongruity is pretty much all there is of the joke.

The fact that all the UK DUers - rather than those with more tenous links to the country - that I've seen pipe up on this have taken the same tack as me might tell you something.

[Petrushka]

9. I agree . . . and this makes four! (n/t)

[Tipperary]

17. Five.

[stonecutter357]

30. +1000

[Kali]

52. I usually don't care for it (or alert on it!) here either, but in the context of that idiot, and

Brit humor and custom, I LOL'd.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

6. Not a progressive insult. . . . nt

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

7. What's IQ45 pointing at?

"Look at my blimp! It's the biggest blimp of me in the world!"

[smirkymonkey]

12. LOL!

[HipChick]

16. Hi syringis ..love it..

[syringis]

18. Hi HipChick

I'm glad your are not offended as British.

[HipChick]

21. Not only am I am not offended, but actually surprized

at the lack of knowledge displayed here...I am far more offended by the use of the word Cow...

those would be fighting words...

[cwydro]

24. What lack of knowledge?

How to spell surprised?

We all have been told how the word is supposedly “bandied about” in the UK, which it isn’t.

My entire family lives in the UK. Never heard it used.

Besides the fact, how does that make it right here? Rappers use the n word all the time - does that mean I can?

Ugly OP on many levels. Trashing.

[HipChick]

26. My entire family lives in the UK....

I really doubt that, since it's been used since the Middle Ages for a stupid person...Do they have limited educations, as I definitely remembering studying Chaucer and Shakespeare for A levels and it was liberally sprinkled all over..

https://www.theguardian.com/media/mind-your-language/2016/jul/11/in-praise-of-the-c-word

https://www.quora.com/Why-is-cunt-considered-very-offensive-in-the-US-but-not-in-Australia

[Denzil_DC]

31. I was born in and live in the UK.

I'm always amused, and not a little astounded, by Americans who claim the use of the word "cunt" isn't offensive over here.

Yes, in parts of Glasgow and other major cities, it's used very informally as a jocular term of endearment or a synonym for "guy" by some people who know each other well, but the idea that its use is widely accepted as inoffensive is absolutely absurd and plain wrong.

Lecturing Americans on DU as if they were ignorant about the sociocultural connotations of the term is ridiculous.

Shakespeare never uses it, by the way. He alludes to it through wordplay to appeal to the more knowing among the audience, such as "country matters." This suggests that it wasn't a word used in polite company even in those days. Chaucer uses "queynte" or "queint", which is also considered wordplay (see here). (He also uses the colorful phrase "let flee a fart", which excited titters when we read Canterbury Tales at school. I don't think that proves anything. Hell, the word "titter" itself made us titter.) The word was considered "vulgar" even in Chaucer's day, hence its use, or homonyms of it, for comic effect in his bawdier tales.

But why should I care? Anyone who visits the UK is free to follow the advice some are giving here and use it as much as they wish. I won't be there to see the fallout.

[Tipperary]

42. Thank you. I frequently visit the UK and have friends there as well.

I have heard it from two of my less-educated Irish friends (in jest). Never from anyone else. Certainly not “bandied about.”

[Denzil_DC]

43. No problem.

Yeah, you'll hear it, but for most of us, it's not an everyday occurrence.

I didn't want to get into terms like "less-educated" as in some ways it's a class issue, and that cuts across education, but then in trendier middle-class circles some people may use it for whatever reason, perhaps to seem "edgy" or "hip".

But it's not a word to use lightly in most company. At best, in a humorous or incongruous context, it might provoke laughter; in the middling ground maybe some gasps, rolled eyes or an uncomfortable silence; at worst, social shunning or a fistfight.

[stonecutter357]

33. I just googled that word and all i got was a lots and lots of vaginas .

[RandiFan1290]

22. Love it!

and the whiners make it even more delicious!

[nini]

35. Agreed

The constant whining over words makes me crazy. God knows Trump deserves every insult known to man thrown at him.

[stonecutter357]

29. what a disgusting OP ! trashing .

[nini]

34. Sometimes an insult fits

Fine use of that word IMHO.

[benld74]

39. She going to dip into the crown's

Best reserves
Right
After
They
Leave

[Gothmog]

44. Prince Charles and Prince William were unwilling to meet Trump,

Link to tweet

[syringis]

47. Alex Jones was wrong. It's not about a 2nd Civil War

While opening the thread, I had no idea I would almost start a second Independence War a quarter millennium after the first...

Before to post, I checked the word in an English dictionary. It is offensive, no one will dispute that, but it has no misogynistic significance when it refers to an obnoxious behavior, and it is exactly in this spirit I posted the meme.

[oberliner]

50. This should be deleted

No need for that language.

[Kali]

51. !

[WhiteTara]

53. OT but did you see the back of Melanie's dress?

you can see the outline of her butt cheeks. I'm am so humiliated that they represent our country to the world. I keep thinking of when they turned around to leave, the Queen could see that they were showing their ass. Ugg

[HipChick]

54. Butt Cheeks representing the US?

classic...

[Buns_of_Fire]

56. The Presidential Seal will need a little rework, but for the time being, it makes sense. nt