Our fight is larger than beating Trump. Much much larger.

[Yavin4]

What the past two years have shown us time and time again is that the Republican party has become the party of preserving wealthy, White male privilege and power by any means necessary including, but not limited to, denying hearings on a SCOTUS nominee, colluding with a hostile foreign power, tearing babies away from their mothers at our borders, enabling White supremacists, and now pushing a man accused of attempted rape onto the SCOTUS without examining all of the evidence. They have shown us who they are and what they represent. And no, defeating Trump is not going to change them or their mission. They'll another one. They have a very deep bench to pull from.

What we have to do is defeat their ideology. We have to clearly define and present an alternative vision for America. Simply saying, "we're not them" is not going to be good enough. Democrats have to give the American people a sustainable view of what we want America to be. Once such a vision is defined, the party and any potential candidates will fall into line.

Labor and social movements of the 20th century didn't wait for a political party or a politician. They defined a vision and drew in the American people to support it. Soon, the Democratic party and its politicians came to adopt that vision and enacted legislation to support it.

The only way to truly defeat the Republicans and Trump is by building a strong, progressive vision of our future.

[empedocles]

1. A progressive vision, . . . and rooting out deep corruption, . . .

. . . and enacting structural reforms to limit 'corruption colonization' of healthy institutions.

[LiberalLovinLug]

9. Unfortunately corporatists in the party are at war with the progressives.

I'm not sure if they are just too tied to their long time corporate donors and don't want to turn the tap off, or they don't like relinquishing their power status, or if they are truly afraid that to rock the boat will be a bad thing for the party. Either way there has been clearly an attempt to quash the progressive wing. And to their own detriment. The American public, at this time, is open to radical, populist, anti-establishment ideas. Many I's would have voted for Sanders if he had won the primary. There is a clear shift towards the left in the rank and file D's as well, with self declared 'socialist" candidates being voted in. Issues like gay marriage, pot legalization, which used to be condemned by most all Democrats in office is now championed.

The old establishment wing of the party must be more open to not just social progressiveness, but economic progressiveness as well. Either they are too beholden themselves to money interests, or they are afraid, like chicken little, of the sky falling, of people running and screaming away from democratic socialism, when IMO, the time could not be riper to push for this kind of change. Not only in the country, but in the Democratic party.

But we have to glue together now until November for sure. And I think they are doing a good job at keeping it on the back burner overall. I think though that just under the surface there is simmering a revolt, a renewal, a new vision of the party that will assure more youth voters, more I's coming over, which leadership will nip at their own, and their party's, peril.

[empedocles]

13. Please don't adopt trump's label of 'corporate democrat'.

Given current campaign finance law, corporate contributions are necessary. Absolutely, it is necessary to clean out Citizen's United. Agree we have to 'glue' together in November, more than dem 'purists' have allowed in the past. In a center right country, pragmatism is a necessity - and as some here are finally beginning to realize, Manchin may be important - perhaps crucial! So obvious, yet . . .

[calimary]

16. That's one of the MAIN things in messaging!

Last edited Sun Oct 7, 2018, 07:01 PM - Edit history (1)

DON’T use the opposition’s words and buzz phrases. You only help them sink in and take root. And when that happens, whatever it is then has a name. At that point, that’s how it’s known and that’s the lens through which it’s viewed and understood. We all then work with or work against how THEY see it. From THEIR perspective and what THEY think and what THEIR take on the issues.

Like - NEVER using the word “regulations”. It’s PROTECTIONS.

Like - NEVER use the term “Obamacare.” It’s “The Affordable Care Act.”

NEVER use trump’s phraseology or sloganeering. You only reinforce it.

[LiberalLovinLug]

22. I agree!

So mad every time I heard and still hear, Democrats interviewed and even they themselves use the term "Obamacare". I've even heard Obama himself use in more than once! Republicans invented the term in order to discredit it, make it all about Obama. And so when it failed, or they made it fail, that failure would have a clear name, Obamacare. Implying all sorts of things like Obama and big government will "care" for you instead of letting you find your own way. Using the term "Affordable care" whenever they could, should have been the edict of the party.

I think in part, some hubris from Democrats was at play. They assumed that they would get the last laugh. That instead of failing, the ACA would only grow and be proven to eventually save money. Especially after Hillary got elected and it had another eight years to establish and improve. They figured that by then the GOP would be cringing whenever their own term Obamacare was spoken. It would come back to bite them as it increased in popularity.


another Republican term I wish they'd not use is "entitlements". It implies some arrogant demand for tax paid services from undeserving people that nonetheless feel entitled to them. Rather use "earned benefits" or something.

But the term "corporate Democrats" was around long long before Trump ever had notions to run for office. It is he that is borrowing it. And laughably so. He only used it as a way to fool and sway Sanders supporters towards him. Read my other post to empedocles for why a certain breed of Democrats got that name in the first place.

Its still a problem. I like this Naomi Klein article on it written just after the election:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/nov/09/rise-of-the-davos-class-sealed-americas-fate

[calimary]

24. "Earned benefits" is GREAT!

Because that’s what they ARE.

[homegirl]

23. George Lakoff

should be required reading. Peace.

[calimary]

25. Abso-freakin'-lutely!

[Scubamatt]

26. PLEASE

go teach a class to some of our leaders in DC! You are so right, but our leadership seems not to understand these important points of how to frame an argument.

[calimary]

28. Welcome to DU, Scubamatt! Thanks!

I'm a BIG disciple of George Lakoff. He's a professor of cognitive linguistics at UC Berkeley, and he's an expert on MESSAGING.

You can google him and find his MOST thought-provoking book "Don't Think of an Elephant." (And note: what did you just do? You probably thought of an elephant!)

Here's a recent one of many good essays he's written. It's called "How You Help Trump":

https://medium.com/@GeorgeLakoff/how-you-help-trump-9d0139b9d4c9

I call it Perception Management. Your message is sent not only in WHAT you say but HOW you say it. HOW you say it. How clever and clear it is. How short 'n' sweet it is. The shorter and catchier it is, the more memorable it is. Especially if you repeat it a lot. As nauseating as it is, listen to even just a few minutes of a trump speech, or interview. Notice how many times he repeats stuff. "NO collusion! NO collusion! There's been NO collusion!" Note how many times he makes the same point again and again and again. Biggest inaugural crowd ever! Best economy ever! More jobs created than ever in our history. The mob that was so "unfair" to Brett Kavanaugh! Every repeat is one more hammer strike, BANG. BANG. BANG. Driving that message into the listener's brain.

[LiberalLovinLug]

18. I don't take any definition Trump makes about anybody, least of all Democrats

Especially when he is of a party that is exclusively now a 1% party. Its a laugh that he even uses that term for Democrats.

But it doesn't negate the fact that Democrats have moved to the right to fill the space left from the Republicans crawling into their extreme right wing cave.

Even as the population was gaining more liberal views if you asked them on specific issues. Obama won his primary partly because he was seen as more left, more progressive than Hillary who was linked with Bill's 'third way' corporate catering strategy. Even though, in the end, he followed the third way doctrine almost to a tee once elected.

And the trend has been losing seats, big and small, across the country in direct proportion to the shift to the right. The whole, 'why vote Republican-lite when you can vote Republican" came into play. We have to give them more compelling reasons to vote Democratic. Reasons that separate ourselves in a concise way, other than we are not them. Or even a promise that we won't dismantle SS medicare etc...We can't sustainably keep running on fixing Republican mistakes. We need our own big ideas, that may sound radical. Trump knew this, hence The Wall. We could have Medicare For All.

So I think it is imperative, but only AFTER the November elections, whether we win the House or not, the establishment wing of the party must start to listen and adapt and take advantage of the public's woke moment. Yes they will have to accept corporate money for awhile longer, but actively work to change laws when they can around campaign finance. If you give the public the same old pablum, maybe slightly warmed, it won't do much. Because Republicans will always cheat, always invent fake scandals, always play dirty. Its not a matter of both parties laying their cards on the table and the public deciding, which is what we have always counted on in the past. The GOP knows they have nothing for the 99%, so they spend their time muddying the waters, lowering the debate.

[Loge23]

2. The right has deceived the people into believing in them

Labor? Organized labor, long a Democratic stronghold, is almost a thing of the past now. Worse is the fact that many blue-collar workers actually vote with the Racist Party now.
Women? White women went with the pussy-grabber in 2018. Women are split into separate camps now with many agreeing with their dinosaur husbands and wearing their abusive situations as some sort of survival badge: "See? I survived so shut up and make the man his dinner!"
Working poor? Well most red states are full of them. The R's have somehow convinced these people with phony patriotic bluster and dangling carrots of fabulous prosperity (which they never bring).
Seniors? The most galling. Seniors who greatly depend on pensions, Social Security and Medicare have been duped with the same phony patriotism and myths about welfare queens.

The entire R platform is based on lies and flim-flam. Their policies support this: less for education, demonizing health care, and selling off the environmental protections to liars who con people into believing they will be better stewards than the government.
The Democrats greatest challenge is how to get people smart again.

[k-dub]

3. The Democrats greatest challenge is how to get people smart again.

There is your problem. Intelligent inquiry and study is now mocked. The Republicans have trashed education, higher education, for years and years, stating it's nothing but Liberal propaganda. So anyone coming out of college who touts a progressive vision is dismissed as a Liberal propagandist. Of course, if a Conservative flies out of an institution of higher learning those people (like Ben Shapiro) are celebrated as brilliant thinkers. This is done with the media as well. State its Liberal propaganda so that anything a progressive would "support" can be cast aside as propaganda, but the first thing disseminated a Conservative would agree with is now all of a sudden hard facts.

Intelligence is not needed. Who did the Nazis persecute? The arts. The intelligentsia. However, NOT ALL within higher education in Germany were rooted out, those who towed the fascist line were used as "intellectual props" for the Nazi empire, while the system itself had been attacked.

We are barreling down toward a fascist state.

[True Blue American]

11. Amen to your post.

[SergeStorms]

12. And CONservatives get their voters....

to vote against their own self-interests by cultivating their hate and fears. It's as simple as that. The rest takes care of itself.

[calimary]

17. Astounding, isn't it.

[kcr]

4. Looking like that blue wave is coming, huh? n/t

[Yavin4]

5. The blue wave, if it happens, is a reaction to the past two years.

To make sure that it sticks, it has to come with a vision for the future.

[True Blue American]

6. You have to understand those making the laws are

Last edited Fri Oct 5, 2018, 05:41 PM - Edit history (1)

Protecting their own? They are mmbers of the class they are protecting and are also owned by their lobbyists. They could care less about thse who vote for them.

[Yavin4]

8. That's been true since the founding of the Republic

Corporate interests were just as entrenched in the late 19th century.

[True Blue American]

10. Of course but not this bad

With all the money poured in that the Supreme Court approved.

It is even worse with Trump in.

We have had a few brave Presidents that broke the control, such as Teddy and Franklin Roosevelt, but they have been much too few.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

7. Yes, Kochs & Constitutional Convention. State votes important. All votes important.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211236025

USA is a progressive Democratic (capital D) country if it is allowed to be democratic (small d).

Make it so.

[lancelyons]

14. You are correct but it needs to start with a firm hand

We have to stop being nice. We have to start being firm.

Start fighting fire with fire. The GOP went there some years back and now they are reaping the rewards.

They are punishing Liberals on PURPOSE. We have to come ready to fight back.

[Stuart G]

15. k and r

[unitedwethrive]

19. Very true...now that they are allied with the Russians

who knows how far they will go?

[bucolic_frolic]

20. Republicans

are playing Machiavelli 3.0, we are fighting back with Civics 101. We don't twist language, phrases, ideology, psychology well enough. Our lies are examined and ridiculed, theirs are accepted without scrutiny. They have tagged a liberal media with scorn even if it barely exists, we can't solve Fox News. So don't tell me "vision" is going to get it done. We have significant obstacles.

[Beartracks]

21. In the meantime, repudiate Republicans at the ballot box Every. Chance. You. Get.

Vote Democrat. Period. Even if yours is a DINO.

If nothing else, voting for the person with a D by their name robs the Republican candidate of a vote.

And remember: In Congress, it's the number of D's that matter, not what shade of blue they are.

============

[machoneman]

27. yes, Yes, YES! The battle is MUCH bigger than stupid old Trump!

We must defeat republiscums at all levels, all the time and for decades to come!

Give then no rest, no quarter, no respect....as they deserve none!