Cartoon: Dear (Some Of) My Fellow Lefties...

[WhiskeyGrinder]

http://amptoons.com/blog/?p=24834

[lunatica]

1. The purity police

Wagging that finger in everyone’s face.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

2. Can you elaborate?

Your response reads like you think a cartoon pointing out hurtful things that leftists say is "the purity police," but I want to be sure.

[lunatica]

4. It's clear as a bell what I mean

[WhiskeyGrinder]

5. Is that helpful to people within the party/movement?

[LanternWaste]

46. I see no evidence indicating it either helps or hurt the party/movement

If there is objective evidence supporting that claim, it would be incumbent to present it as such, or accept that simple allegations do nothing substantive other than allow the opportunity to advertise a self-serving self-righteousness.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

47. My question was about people within the party/movement.

Oppressed or marginalized people have a lot of experience dealing with hurtful rhetoric from people who would otherwise call themselves allies of those populations, and it takes a toll.

[Tipperary]

69. Not a bit surprised at your response.

Exactly what I would expect.

[Ms. Toad]

3. Thank you. n/t

[tblue37]

6. Thanks! K&R for visibility. nt

[Ms. Toad]

7. Only 4 recs in half an hour.

Says pretty much all I need to know about how welcoming DU is recently to those of us who are "other," for a variety of reasons.

Not that I didn't feel it already.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

8. There are some who will never give up hurtful rhetoric, because they feel that a scorched-earth

Last edited Thu Mar 28, 2019, 10:40 AM - Edit history (1)

approach to insulting the other side is worth the friendly fire. I am sorry you feel its effects.

[Maru Kitteh]

9. There was another thread calling Betsy DeVos "Bitchy DeVos"

I just don't think misogynist name-calling is a good look. What's wrong with just calling her an asshole and attacking her actions?

[LiberalArkie]

10. Calling people names remind me of the the folks over at FR.

[Blue_Tires]

11. Yes, I remember having almost all these discussions on DU back in the day...

1. I don't know why calling out Trump's obesity is off limits, though... Especially after he has repeatedly lied about the status of his physical/mental health.

2. Like it was on DU, when comments like these are made they are *teaching opportunities*... "Shut up and get the hell off my side!" doesn't help in the slightest and is counter-productive. Ironically many of the people depicted here are young and if they're anything like me they reach the maturity point when they discover these comments don't help further the cause...

3. I'm personally guilty of all of these at one time or another (Except for the "Who would want to impregnate anti-abortion women" one and as a black man I will forever call Clarence Thomas a self-hating "House Negro" because there's no other term for it).

4. So is it the sentiment itself that Deutsch has an issue with, or just the wording?? Because there *IS* a long and documented history of Xtian famblee values conservatives getting caught in homosexual trysts, Trump *IS* a classless bloated spray-on orange tan poorly dressed bad toupee wearing piece of shit despot and he's openly proud of that fact, and while not always penile-related, there *IS* a long and documented history of certain gunners trying to compensate for some fear or paranoia or inadequacy and the gun gives them the "courage" to escalate a situation/conflict they would have otherwise fled were they not armed (and they'd still flee or quickly defuse the situation if they discover the OTHER guy is armed), and finally while "inbred hillbillies" and other silly ancient stereotypes die hard, there *IS* a documented history of willful cognitive dissonance and an air of old-fashioned proud ignorance in the deepest red areas of Middle America. Do they honestly believe there is some covert war and genocidal campaign against all white folks? That on Trump's first day in office he was going to personally arrest Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama and throw them bodily into federal prison? That Trump could make Mexico pay for a wall? That he would even try to stop job outsourcing? That every major mass shooting is a hoax created with Hollywood CGI and bloodpak squibs all so Democrats can declare martial law and grab everyone's guns? That Hillary Clinton is a proponent of spreading Sharia Law in the U.S.? That Climate Change is some hustle created by Beijing just so Red China can keep their trade advantage? That a billionaire candidate from Manhattan who's never worked an honest day in his life and who literally shits on a gold toilet is in touch with the pain of the so-called "working man"? (I'm not making any of these up, people!) That Trump would somehow stand up against big banks and Wall Street? That Trump hiring all these unqualified incompetents and giving his brat kids jobs with near-unlimited authority is somehow a best practice? That there is some grand conspiracy to turn their kids into homosexuals while outlawing Christianity? That Jade Helm was ever a thing? That Trump isn't using the office of the Presidency to personally enrich himself? That undocumented migrants from Central America are the cause of all out national problems? That the media is "the enemy of the people"? How many more you want? For the love of Christ, PLEASE tell me how I'm supposed to respond to people who say this other than with outright mocking and ridicule... It is impossible to use rational thought to refute an irrational argument; to even attempt it only serves to legitimize and mainstream insanity and very specific people have been exploiting this to permanently poison the well of fact, truth and coherent thought. Now imagine millions of people spread out around the Midwest parroting this tripe -- What is the proper way to react??

[Ms. Toad]

12. As to #1 - off limits.

Call him out for lying (about weight - as well as everything else he's lying about.)

When you call him out for obesity itself, especially when (as many do here) you express disgust at his obesity - the message you send is not that Trump is a liar. The message you send is that obesity is disgusting - and you send it to everyone on DU who is obese.

As to #2 - I've probably addressed gay sex comments about Trump, or references to mAnn Coulter on DU more than 100 times - and been slammed for it most of the time. How many times am I expected to say, "Excuse my, you're stepping on my foot. Can you please get off," "Excuse me - you've stepped on it again . . " Especially when the response is, "anything goes," in the war on Trump - or "No I'm not. Just because I am expressing disgust at Trump's obesity doesn't mean I think obesity is disgusting on you."

#3 - as a white woman, it is not my place to correct how you refer to Clarence Thomas.

#4 - using a class of people as an insult is unacceptable. Using a class of people as an insult isn't effective unless there is a perception that being in that class is a bad thing. When you use the class as an insult you are calling on the negative associations with that class AND you are inherently endorsing those negative associations.

[Blue_Tires]

14. As for #4, what's the appropriate epithet then?

Rubes, yokels, just flat-out ignorant, what?? It's not like they've earned the right to have their "arguments" taken seriously...

And as for #2, I've been here a very long time and I haven't seen "Ann the Man" used since the Bush years so I thought it was long dead already....

[WhiskeyGrinder]

17. The point of the cartoon is that using *actual* *bigoted* slurs that could be used against people

with certain immutable traits, regardless of party or moral standing, should be reexamined.

[Ms. Toad]

19. Most recent mAnn Coulter comment I found in a quick search.

January 25, 2019

I'll see smoke out of Mann Coulter ears ...

on Real Time with Bill Maher tonight.

I hope Bill calls out all her bull $hit.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=2252628

I'd avoid name calling altogether. Occasionally I say something that I don't recognize is insulting, then either realize my foot-in-mouth disease by the uncomfortable silence (Within the last decade I used the phrase "cotton picking hands" and am embarrassed to say I never consciously thought about whose hands were picking the cotton until using that phrase shocked a friend into silence) or because someone pointed it out to me (e.g. gypped, spaz).

Ignorant is a good descriptive word, because - by and large - they are ignorant of other's experiences, the real facts, etc.

[cwydro]

67. +1000.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

13. I'm not sure what you're saying in your post...

1. I don't know why calling out Trump's obesity is off limits, though... Especially after he has repeatedly lied about the status of his physical/mental health.

The rhetoric I've seen on DU, when referencing his weight, has combined a fact with a moral judgment (he's disgusting because he's fat, etc.). That kind of rhetoric contributes to an atmosphere of associating weight with moral standing, which hurts everyone.

2. Like it was on DU, when comments like these are made they are *teaching opportunities*... "Shut up and get the hell off my side!" doesn't help in the slightest and is counter-productive. Ironically many of the people depicted here are young and if they're anything like me they reach the maturity point when they discover these comments don't help further the cause...

I'm okay with strong language to make a point to people who are on my side -- and if the strong language OR the concepts are enough to drive them away, I'm not sure I want them on my side.

3. I'm personally guilty of all of these at one time or another (Except for the "Who would want to impregnate anti-abortion women" one and as a black man I will forever call Clarence Thomas a self-hating "House Negro" because there's no other term for it).

As I understand it, the issue with the "Uncle Tom" comment was the fact that it was a white person saying it. There are certainly terms that it's more acceptable for some people to say than others.

4. So is it the sentiment itself that Deutsch has an issue with, or just the wording?? Because there *IS* a long and documented history of Xtian famblee values conservatives getting caught in homosexual trysts, Trump *IS* a classless bloated spray-on orange tan poorly dressed bad toupee wearing piece of shit despot and he's openly proud of that fact, and while not always penile-related, there *IS* a long and documented history of certain gunners trying to compensate for some fear or paranoia or inadequacy and the gun gives them the "courage" to escalate a situation/conflict they would have otherwise fled were they not armed (and they'd still flee or quickly defuse the situation if they discover the OTHER guy is armed), and finally while "inbred hillbillies" and other silly ancient stereotypes die hard, there *IS* a documented history of willful cognitive dissonance and an air of old-fashioned proud ignorance in the deepest red areas of Middle America. Do they honestly believe there is some covert war and genocidal campaign against all white folks? That on Trump's first day in office he was going to personally arrest Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama and throw them bodily into federal prison? That Trump could make Mexico pay for a wall? That he would even try to stop job outsourcing? That every major mass shooting is a hoax created with Hollywood CGI and bloodpak squibs all so Democrats can declare martial law and grab everyone's guns? That Hillary Clinton is a proponent of spreading Sharia Law in the U.S.? That Climate Change is some hustle created by Beijing just so Red China can keep their trade advantage? That a billionaire candidate from Manhattan who's never worked an honest day in his life and who literally shits on a gold toilet is in touch with the pain of the so-called "working man"? (I'm not making any of these up, people!) That Trump would somehow stand up against big banks and Wall Street? That Trump hiring all these unqualified incompetents and giving his brat kids jobs with near-unlimited authority is somehow a best practice? That there is some grand conspiracy to turn their kids into homosexuals while outlawing Christianity? That Jade Helm was ever a thing? That Trump isn't using the office of the Presidency to personally enrich himself? That undocumented migrants from Central America are the cause of all out national problems? That the media is "the enemy of the people"? How many more you want? For the love of Christ, PLEASE tell me how I'm supposed to respond to people who say this other than with outright mocking and ridicule... It is impossible to use rational thought to refute an irrational argument; to even attempt it only serves to legitimize and mainstream insanity and very specific people have been exploiting this to permanently poison the well of fact, truth and coherent thought. Now imagine millions of people spread out around the Midwest parroting this tripe -- What is the proper way to react??

You say rational thought doesn't refute an irrational argument. Are you saying that rhetoric that hurts your friends and allies does? Are you saying you can't talk about irrational arguments without hurting friends and allies? Are you saying you can't possibly avoid language that hurts people you want on your side?

[Blue_Tires]

15. So how do I respond?

The original question still stands.

How do I fight red state anti-intellectualism and racism without hurting these 'friends and allies'? And why would friends and allies think I'd be including them in my attacks against far right conservatives??

[WhiskeyGrinder]

16. I see.

How do I fight red state anti-intellectualism and racism without hurting these 'friends and allies'?

Bigotry of any kind is not solved by insulting someone with bigoted tropes. Using bigoted tropes back against someone legitimizes bigoted rhetoric. It's possible to tell people they're acting ignorantly and against their own interests without saying the r-word, it's possible to talk about Ann Coulter having objectionable without implying that she's trans or using a gender-based slur, and it's possible to talk about how Trump is a reprehensible person without implying that at least part of that quality comes from his weight.

And why would friends and allies think I'd be including them in my attacks against far right conservatives??

Because when you slurs to describe qualities about people that they can't change, and you use those terms as an insult against your enemies, you imply that the quality itself is a bad thing.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

18. I'll add here that using slurs against Republicans in an effort to highlight their hypocrisy is

tired. They don't give a shit about their hypocrisy. Their voters don't care about their hypocrisy. Most people don't, when it comes to the things that divide us. So the posters that show Trump and Putin kissing, for example, have pretty much zero effect on Republicans, and normalizes the concept that men kissing should be something embarrassing or gross.

[scrutineer]

20. This is exactly the kind of stupid shit thinking that got Al Franken out of the senate.

Last edited Thu Mar 28, 2019, 02:53 AM - Edit history (2)

This is exactly the kind of stupid shit thinking that got Al Franken out of the senate.

Laura Ingraham couldn't have said it better:

"Shut up and get the hell off my side!"

"Shut up and Sing"

"Shut up and dribble."

Nine panels in that cartoon, all stupid, but the ninth one is the stupidest of all. Think about what you're saying - do you really want me and so many others to get the hell off your side? And if I do join the other side do you really think that I’ll shut up?

Think about what you're saying.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

22. "Think about what you're saying."

Funny, since that’s exactly the message of the cartoon!

[scrutineer]

32. No

The message of the cartoon is "Shut up and get the hell off my side!"

[WhiskeyGrinder]

34. Well, it's more of an if-then.

If you don't think about how what you're saying can hurt your friends and people working with you, then you should probably rethink whether you're on their side or not.

[scrutineer]

38. "Shut up and get the hell off my side!"

That's the next MAGA hat.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

39. I have to say it's fascinating to me, what people are taking away from this cartoon.

I'll tell you, though -- as a woman, I don't want a man who jokes about prison rape or makes comments about how a woman's looks determine her political worth working with me in a party, on a campaign, or anywhere around me. Any of these comments, really -- but I'm trying to illustrate my perspective.

[scrutineer]

41. The message the cartoon conveys is intolerance.

Thinking like this is what Republicans masturbate to while waiting for Fox prime time.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

42. I am fine being intolerant of people who use bigoted language.

[Ms. Toad]

49. The simple solution, then, is to stop using classes of people as an insult.

If you're not insulting me by using who I am to bludgeon trump, I won't feel the need to ask you to stop stomping all over me.

[cwydro]

68. Wow.

You really don’t get it. Smh.

[Devil Child]

21. "Shut up and get the hell off my side" is a foolish way to go through life n/t

[WhiskeyGrinder]

23. For marginalized people, it can be a matter of survival.

[Devil Child]

54. I was on board with the spirit of the toon till that last panel

I get the anger and frustration but left with skepticism towards the "get out" mentality. Save the fight for the republicans and for our allies use dialogue and education.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

55. Interestingly, the cartoonist in a blog post about the cartoon addresses the vehemence in the last

panel:

I don’t mean the final panel, of course. The “personality” of my comic strips is often harsher than I am in person; political cartoons work best when they’re not wishy-washy. I don’t want everyone who’s ever said one of these things to get off my side. (I’ve said some of these things, in my life. Maybe you have too.) All of us mess up sometimes. And we can all – like my friend who used “fat” as an insult – take the opportunity to do better. That’s what I want.

There's certainly a lot of pushback in this thread; I wonder how much of it is pushing back on the last panel, and how much of it is pushing back on the request for consideration of the language we use, and how much of it is discounting the entire cartoon because of the last panel.

[Vinca]

24. Oh, great. Back to holding hands, singing kumbayah and losing elections?

[WhiskeyGrinder]

25. Rhetoric that hurts marginalized people wins elections?

I mean, it worked for Trump...

[Vinca]

27. All I mean is if we sit back, smile and be polite as we're flogged from the right, we appear

to be a party of pathetic weenies. I wouldn't vote for us for heaven's sake. So far our candidates, by and large, have done a pretty good job of it and AOC is Queen of the Congress if you ask me. I doubt when I opine about the "orange idiot" I'm offending a large swath of the population that is orange. I try to stay away from fat or old cracks, despite feeling entitled to use them since I'm both fat and old. Stupid, dumb, fool, etc., are fair game when it comes to a party that thinks God delivered Trump.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

28. But this cartoon doesn't talk about rhetoric from the right.

It highlights how rhetoric on the left hurts people on the left. And it's not about harsh descriptors, it's about weaponizing traits we and our friends and allies share.

[Vinca]

44. Then I think it's baloney.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

45. What is, the cartoon?

The cartoon that synthesizes the experiences people *in this very thread* say they face within the party/movement?

[Ms. Toad]

48. So you think my pain is baloney

When I can't read through a thread on DU without encountering my "friends" on DU expressing disgust at who I am? That's what posts that use who I am to express disgust with Trump do. They put me in the same disgusting class with Trump, sending me a clear message that not only do you find Trump disgusting, you find me disgusting as well.

[Vinca]

50. You obviously are taking comments way too seriously. Lighten up.

If people make a fat joke or an old person crack I don't get my panties in a knot. If you're an orange person and I've offended you, I sincerely apologize.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

51. "If people make a fat joke or an old person crack I don't get my panties in a knot."

That's fine, but other people do. What do you lose by listening to them and taking their perspective into consideration?

[Vinca]

56. You realize our democracy is threatened at the moment, don't you?

In the semi-large picture, this is probably one of the dumbest threads I've had the misfortune to comment on. I should have known better. The thing we Democrats do best, after all, is fighting amongst ourselves. Oops . . . I bet that was offensive, wasn't it?

[WhiskeyGrinder]

60. It is indeed, which means we can't afford to drive people away.

I'm not sure why considering other people's perspectives and experiences is getting such a push-back here, or why some are so adamant to cling to insults based on immutable traits, as if we can't save our democracy, win elections or build coalitions without them.

[Ms. Toad]

52. Thanks for dismissing the feelings of a member of a group repeatedly used

as an insult.

Would you be as dismissive if a black member of DU complained that it was painful to encounter "N****R being used on DU as an insult?

[Vinca]

57. I would be surprised if that word was ever posted on DU. In any case, whatever you're talking about

must not have been terribly offensive if the moderators let it stay. I think we have bigger things to worry about and this is definitely the last time I post on a thread with Democrats fighting amongst themselves. No wonder Trump is in the White House.

[Ms. Toad]

59. DU does not have moderators

And voting on the rights and feelings of minorities rarely results in blacks getting the vote, LGBT individuals being allowed to marry, etc.

Since that is the system we have here regarding offensive posts, it is hardly surprising that the majority thinks it's just fine, while the members of the classes being used as insults are feeling unsafe. And, frankly, most of us have given up speaking up about the pain these kinds of posts cause us because we are riduculed when we do.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

62. It's not uncommon for people in the majority to dismiss the concerns of the minority as

"divisive." I encourage you to consider how your post can come across as cruel to Democrats who regularly experience hurtful rhetoric from fellow Democrats.

[EndGOPPropaganda]

26. I will proudly say gun owners have small penises.

Don’t tell me what to do, cartoonist.

Gun owners ARE compensating for small penises.

Clarence Thomas IS a feeble-minded mediocre hack that got to the court because of conservative affirmative action- where billionaires promote attorneys with conservative views. (No need to say anything about race.)

The Republican base IS filled with the uneducated and foolish.

On the rest of it, he’s right. No need to attack people using the words gay, fat, ugly, and no need to make jokes about prison.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

29. "No need to say anything about race."

Which is...exactly what the cartoon is getting at. But this female gun owner rolls her eyes at your small-penis obsession.

[Tipperary]

65. No shit.

I am a woman. I learned to shoot at an early age. People who have to talk about penises all the time really make me wonder lol.

[EndGOPPropaganda]

66. It's a man thing

I hear what you’re saying.

But let me say, as a man who has spent time in sports locker rooms and drinking at bars with other guys — there is almost nothing that is more effective for the gun-lover crowd to tell them that they’re weak and cowardly and insecure in their manhood. They think guns make them real men, and when you point out that they’re just compensating, it burns them to the core.

So I think the penis thing is kind of dumb too. But with the loser-white-man crowd, it’s EFFECTIVE.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

70. Effective for what, though?

What's your goal in using that rhetoric? Just getting their goat?

[Ms. Toad]

71. And how do you think a person on DU with a small penis feels

when Trump is ridiculed basedon his penis size.

I'm not a man (and don't have a penis - since the two are not necessarily synonymous), but women have subconsciously internalized all of the beauty standards- even when intellectually we beleive they are bunk. But what that means id that when a woman (conservative or not) is ridiculed because she doesn't meet those standards, what we hear is that to the extent we have the same charactristic, you believe we deserve to be ridiculed as well.

I can't imagine (even DU) men with small penises are that different when the ridicule is directed at penis size.

[EndGOPPropaganda]

73. No it's not like that

First, no man really knows whether other men have smaller or larger penises. So that makes it very different than fat shaming (which is bad) etc etc.

It’s a way of saying “you’re compensating because you’re insecure.”

And thus it’s effective.

[Ms. Toad]

74. locker rooms, bathrooms with urinals w/o walls

There's a fair amount of visibility as to men's genitals.

And even if they aren't seeing other men in the places where men's genitals are on display, given how much sex magazines seem to play in the developental lives of young men - you're seriously telling me that someone who has a smaller than average penis hasn't checked it out to confirm his suspicions?

And - even if is effective against Trump, et al., it comes at the cost of sending a loud and clear message that you belive something is wrong with having a smaller penis. It wouldn't be insulting to the people you are trying to insult if it was not generally associated with negative stereotyping.

[EndGOPPropaganda]

78. OK, just say they are insecure and need a gun to feel strong

[Ms. Toad]

79. Much better -

Makes the same point without implying small genitals are a bad thing.

[Codeine]

72. Effective?

How do? Effective at passing them off, I suppose. At actually making them think about the validity of firearm ownership? Nah.

[HughBeaumont]

30. *

1. Yes, anti-Trans jokes are unnecessary low-hanging fruit and there's plenty about Ann Coulter to make fun of that we don't have to go there.

2. Clarence Thomas is simply an asshole. That's really all that needs to be said about him.

3. I too have never understood the "speculation" tropes. Maybe anti-gay conservatives are just hateful assholes and nothing beyond that.

4. Easy. No body shaming. Plenty to make fun of about Trump that his weight, hair or family doesn't need to factor in.

5. . . . . is this a thing? I'm just asking because I've never really experienced this much in comments sections.

6. Now here's where I'm like "geez, pick your battles". Men, especially violent angry white guys, aren't an oppressed class and they made Trump president.

7. I mean, we don't have to use regional insults or "retard" . . . but I'm not exactly calling people who vote for the modern Republican Mensa candidates either. Because if they support Trump and all that he's about and claim NOT to be stupid, then maybe some less-than-flattering descriptives need to be tossed their way?

8. Prison rape jokes are never funny.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

31. I would say the issue highlighted in No. 6 is not white men or gun owners,

but using penis size (or even having a penis) as a weapon.

With No. 7, the issue is indeed the slur.

[Paladin]

33. This is doing trump's work for him.

We don't stand a chance in 2020 unless we are angry. And if a few insults go beyond the good taste barrier, tough shit.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

35. Can you elaborate?

In this cartoon, I see being transsexual, race, sexual orientation, body size and traits, intelligence and prison rape being used as jokes or insults. Are you saying we need to be able to weaponize those traits and concepts to win elections? Does that mean we should add really heavy slurs based on immutable traits, such as the n-word or the f-word?

We definitely need to be angry. No doubt about that. But we can be angry without hurting ourselves.

[Paladin]

36. Democrats are not the primary source of such insults, and you know it.

Your little cartoon is an attempt to impose an uncalled-for guilt trip on DU participants. We can't afford to dawdle in such Goody-Two-Shoes games anymore, the stakes are too high. Direct your outrage where it belongs: trump and his hordes.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

37. I see those kind of comments on DU all the time.

Bigotry on the left is definitely a thing, and to tell marginalized or oppressed people that their objections are Goody-Two-Shoes games is a great way to show them you don't give a shit about their concerns. How does ignoring bigotry among our own ranks help us fight it in the larger world? We can learn and grow at the same time we try to win elections or grow our base. In fact, we must.

[Ms. Toad]

40. It's not goody two shoes. Posts like these are made frequently -

and are hurtful to those of us in one or more of these groups. By and large, when alerted on, they remain up. Since the Mueller report, I've alerted on a half-dozen homophobic posts and a couple of posts expressing disgust about Trump's weight. Not only were none of them hidden, I lost alerting privileges on probably half of them. The message that sends to me is that the vast majority of DU is willing to sacrifice the feelings of the DU LGBT community, or of people who are overweight, who see DU members expressing disgust at sex acts between same gender people andat people who are obese - in favor of hurling insults at someone who will never even see them.

DU has enough brain power that it can, and should, come up wtih creative insults that don't rely on the tired, easy insults that use classes of people as a bludgeon. It's not a very safe place around here for members of classes that are easy targets - every time some new Trump outrage rears its ugly head we know that it is open season on us. If you don't want to dawdle in "goody-two-shoes games," stop using me as an insult. It's that simple.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

43. Well said.

[Paladin]

53. I stand by my prior comments.

And as my time and efforts could be put to much more effective anti-trump actions, that will be my final entry on this thread.

[Ms. Toad]

58. As I said - this is exactly why DU is no longer a safe place

for members of many minority groups. Despite the TOS, members feel free to post bigoted, homophobic, sexist, etc. posts as long as the ostensible target is Trump, and juries are letting them stand.

It takes no more time and effort to avoid bludgeoning your fellow DU members than it does to avoid using racial epithets.

Your refusal to do so sends a very clear message to those of us who aren't your average white, cis, straight, able-bodied, normal BMI membes of DU.

[Tipperary]

80. Good post.

We have plenty of bigoted people here, sadly.

[Jakes Progress]

75. So using racial slurs and anti-LGBT tropes is okay with you.

Sounds like a well off, straight, white male.

Can you disagree with a black man without calling him the n-word? Taste has nothing to do with it. One day your ox will get gored and you will understand.

[KG]

61. !

[Tipperary]

63. Thank you for this. Some of the comments here make me sick.

Smh.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

64. You're welcome, and I'm sorry.

[treestar]

76. Most of those have gotten boring

The prison rape jokes are just repetitive at this point.

Being heavy myself, at least since middle age, I still don't mind people making fun of Orange Needy Amin for it, because of his behavior judging others on their looks. Making fun of his combover is OK with me. It's so ridiculous. It doesn't make fun of bald men; it makes fun of the vainest fake orange hair and tan lying corrupt ass on the planet. It's his vanity and fairness and pretending he isn't fake that is his flaw rather than his weight. Being so vain as to lie about obvious things like his now height and weight just deserves mockery.

[Fla_Democrat]

77. my, my, my.