We're all taking it for granted that Trump will lose in 2020

[Cyrano]

But what if he wins?

It's an unimaginable nightmare to most of us. Can it happen? How the hell did he "win" in 2016?

After four years of the grossest pig in history inhabiting the White House, It's inconceivable that the presidency can once again be stolen. I, for one, believe that the Democratic turnout will be huge enough to beat all the Republican/Russian grifters.

But that doesn't mean I'm right. Bush II, and the Supreme Court, stole the 2000 election right in full sight. What makes anyone believe something similar to this can't happen again. After all, we're playing by the rules. They're not.

So what happens if another election is stolen and Trump is free to do his crazy act for four more years? I, for one, will not accept another stolen election. And my guess is that most of the country won't accept it either.

Sooo, what's the answer. The answer is a question. Is the present Constitution preventing justice?

It's not up to me to answer this question. It must be answered by a vast majority of Americans.

Having said this, I believe we are going to crush Trump and the Republican Party in 2020.

But the question lingers. What if they steal it?

[sarcasmo]

1. If the Democratic infighting continues, Trump won't need election fraud.

[DontBooVote]

5. But Uncle Joe must be properly punished and ostrasized! We'll worry about tRump and the Constitution

some other time!

Maybe!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

104. Not properly punished... properly vetted. We need the candidate with the best chance of defeating

the Pussy-Grabber-in-Chief. I believe Bernie is that candidate... not that there are no other Democrats who could do the same. Elizabeth comes to mind.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Demsrule86]

113. Punished...there is no there there Sen. sanders will also be ' vetted who will stick up

For him in a primary after what was done to Biden?

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

123. What did Bernie do to Biden?! Please cite actual facts, not wild speculation...

can't wait to hear this!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Demsrule86]

124. You know me better than that. Other than the link between Flores and Biden, I don't see anything to

discuss...My point is that the take down of our candidates won't be limited to Biden...Sanders and others will face the same thing. and who will speak for them? This is divide and conquer crap. And we will lose in 20. I know you think that Sanders is so wonderful he can win with one hand tied behind his back. But this will be a tough election for anyone to win. Trump is going for another electoral college win. And after Sanders is vetted to the point of destruction...and it will all be new because this didn't happen last time and painted as a dangerous socialist( and no they will never understand what a socialist is)...we lose 2020.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

125. So, in other words, you have nothing. That's fine, so long as that's clear... we don't want to give

people the wrong impression.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Demsrule86]

126. Not out to prove anyting...truth will out or it won't.

[padah513]

129. He won't even show his tax returns

Just like trump

[Demsrule86]

130. I wonder what that is all about.

Surely it can't be as damaging as not showing them. His supporters are rock solid ...they would accept anything.

[Firestorm49]

52. We'll need to be solidly united behind whomever our candidate turns out to be.

[Demsrule86]

64. We won't decide the election. Moderate voters from MI,WI and PA WILL DECIDE.

It is my opinion that only Biden can win.

[Kanoko]

101. Bernie won MI, WI in Democratic Primary.

No reason to believe he wouldn't defeat Trump in both those states.
Trump barely squeaked out victories in those two states.

[Demsrule86]

114. He won West Virginia too. But he won't win a general in any of the states mentioned,

He may not even win states like Virginia...if he is the candidate we also lose Nevada and Arizona which we could win with a more moderate candidate. A primary is not like a general.

[Kanoko]

117. Bernie receives strong support from independents. That's why

just about every poll showed Bernie beating Trump in 2016 by a wide margin (10 points), and early polls are showing Bernie ahead of Trump. Besides, after 4 years of Trump, I think most Democrats will have no problem beating Trump. Voters took a chance with Trump. "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice..."

Trump has been a big disappointment to many, except his base.

[Demsrule86]

119. Polls that are national are meaningless and those taken during

A primary even less so . Look at the Electoral college map and examine the 2018 takeover of the house. He has high negatives and isn't vetted also.

[bigbrother05]

78. We need to be sure "whomever" is solid first

We don't want "any Dem", we what the best Dem available.

Maybe that's Joe or Kamala or Cory, but they should be battle tested, not anointed.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

105. That's fo sho!!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Demsrule86]

115. I will do so but a candidate must be able to win a general.

[crazytown]

68. Trump Reagan Approval

[Polybius]

97. Wow, that's scary

We must unite in 2020.

[Sherman A1]

100. And what do you believe to be such infighting?

I have yet to see such?

[sfwriter]

103. It's called a primary...

Where candidates put on their big boy pants and prove themselves capable of not pissing themselves. It doesn’t weaken anybody. It airs the dirty laundry. It clears the way for a fierce campaign.

Try not to be so pessimistic.

[Demsrule86]

116. And the 2016 primary was devestating. So maybe a divisive primary should be avoided,

Winning 2020 is the most important thing.

[sfwriter]

133. I guess we disagree about what caused that animosity toward her.

But I don't think she lost a single vote over any issue that was brought up ONLY in the primary. Let's face it, the manufactured crisis of "her emails," a multiple decades long smear campaign, basic sexism, Comey's interference, and Russian divisiveness had a bigger effect. None of those were primary related.

[A HERETIC I AM]

2. I'm not taking anything for granted.

This country was stupid enough to allow him to become president once.

Who is to say it won't happen again?

Shit, he put Betsy DeVos in as Education Secretary, thus ensuring that at least one generation of voters will be dumb as fuck.

[SlogginThroughIt]

94. Meh if we get him out then Betsy's impact will be muted

To be sure she has do e a metric shit ton (two assloads) of damage but much of that can be reversed.

[Oneironaut]

3. Trump actually has an advantage going into the election.

If we don’t have a good candidate and have good voting attendance, he’s going to win.

Anyone who is taking Trump’s loss for granted is incorrect, imo. He’s going to be an even tougher candidate to beat than 2016.

We can win, and I believe we will, but’s it’s going to be close.

[FakeNoose]

13. Yes the incumbent does normally have an advantage but ...

... George Bush I lost to Bill Clinton in 1992. Clinton was a young, smart, tough cookie who energized us Dems and the independents to come out and vote. People became fed up with Bush for a number of reasons - remember "Read my lips - No new taxes"? Bush even had a successful Gulf War but it wasn't enough to get him re-elected.

I'll let someone else talk about how Jimmy Carter lost his re-election bid. That one still breaks my heart to this day.

My point is that the right candidate who's smart and gutsy can make a big difference, even going against an incumbent president. We can do this!

[customerserviceguy]

58. I attribute the Bush loss in 1992

to the third party candidacy of Ross Perot. A vote for Perot was a way of saying "None of the above, I hate all politicians," and in a way, a vote for Trump was like that, too. Trump was not elected to create, he was sent to destroy. Pete Buttigieg seems to know that the people who 'accidentally' elected Trump (who expected him to win the EC?) and stresses the importance of giving those people something to vote for, and not just to vote against.

[FakeNoose]

61. Yes that was a big part of it

There are a lot of haters and negative voters in the US. If they can't vote against something, they just won't bother to vote at all. We need to change that behavior - at least in our party we need to change it.

[INdemo]

108. Over Reaching Over Reaching..that will be the Republican talking point

The Corporate mafia has that being repeated over and over now. Even by our favourite MSNBC

I think the turn our will break all records but we must remember the Russians will interfere.

We need paper ballots and do away with the machines, if that could happen Democrats win everything
Keep the House, win back the Senate an Whitehouse

[Aristus]

4. The 2018 Mid-terms gave me hope. But I'm not taking anything for granted.

Anyone who tries to prevent me from voting Democratic in 2020 will have to be square with God first. God may have mercy on him/her, but I sure as Hell won't...

[trev]

6. Bush was elected twice. nt

[brooklynite]

10. If Gore hadn't run such a bad campaign, Florida and the SC would have been meaningless...

[Gothmog]

14. Nader is the main reason why Gore was cheated

I will never forgive nader Rove funded Nader in 2000 and 2004 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-zuesse/ralph-nader-was-indispens_b_4235065.html

Furthermore, Karl Rove and the Republican Party knew this, and so they nurtured and crucially assisted Nader’s campaigns, both in 2000 and in 2004. On 27 October 2000, the AP’s Laura Meckler headlined “GOP Group To Air Pro-Nader TV Ads.” She opened: “Hoping to boost Ralph Nader in states where he is threatening to hurt Al Gore, a Republican group is launching TV ads featuring Nader attacking the vice president [Mr. Gore]. ... ‘Al Gore is suffering from election year delusion if he thinks his record on the environment is anything to be proud of,’ Nader says [in the commercial]. An announcer interjects: ‘What’s Al Gore’s real record?’ Nader says: ‘Eight years of principles betrayed and promises broken.’” Meckler’s report continued: “A spokeswoman for the Green Party nominee said that his campaign had no control over what other organizations do with Nader’s speeches.” Bush’s people - the group sponsoring this particular ad happened to be the Republican Leadership Council - knew exactly what they were doing, even though the liberal suckers who voted so carelessly for Ralph Nader obviously did not. Anyone who drives a car the way those liberal fools voted, faces charges of criminal negligence, at the very least. But this time, the entire nation crashed as a result; not merely a single car.....

On July 9th, the San Francisco Chronicle headlined “GOP Doners Funding Nader: Bush Supporters Give Independent’s Bid a Financial Lift,” and reported that the Nader campaign “has received a recent windfall of contributions from deep-pocketed Republicans with a history of big contributions to the party,” according to “an analysis of federal records.” Perhaps these contributors were Ambassador Egan’s other friends. Mr. Egan’s wife was now listed among the Nader contributors. Another listed was “Nijad Fares, a Houston businessman, who donated $200,000 to the Bush inaugural committee and who donated $2,000 each to the Nader effort and the Bush campaign this year.” Furthermore, Ari Berman reported 7 October 2004 at the Nation, under “Swift Boat Veterans for Nader,” that some major right-wing funders of a Republican smear campaign against Senator John Kerry’s Vietnam service contributed also $13,500 to the Nader campaign, and that “the Republican Party of Michigan gathered ninety percent of Nader’s signatures in their state” (90%!) to place Nader on the ballot so Bush could win that swing state’s 17 electoral votes. Clearly, the word had gone out to Bush’s big contributors: Help Ralphie boy! In fact, on 15 September 2005, John DiStaso of the Manchester Union-Leader, reported that, “A year ago, as the Presidential general election campaign raged in battleground state New Hampshire, consumer advocate Ralph Nader found his way onto the ballot, with the help of veteran Republican strategist David Carney and the Carney-owned Norway Hill Associates consulting firm.”

It was obvious, based upon the 2000 election results, that a dollar contributed to Nader in the 2004 contest would probably be a more effective way to achieve a Bush win against Kerry in the U.S. Presidential election than were perhaps even ten dollars contributed to Bush. This was a way of peeling crucial votes off from Bush’s real opponent - votes that otherwise would have gone to the Democrat. That’s why the smartest Republican money in the 2004 Presidential election was actually going to Nader, even more so than to Bush himself: these indirect Bush contributions provided by far the biggest bang for the right-wing buck.

[jrthin]

33. Exactly right. Historically, the party that is primaried generally loses.

That is why when BS announced his intention to primary Hillary, I turned to my husband and said that this is not going to turn out well for us (meaning the dems.). BS wanted to primary Obama, and had he found a candidate to do so, we would have had a President Romney.

[Gothmog]

34. There are a large number of real democrats who will not support sanders for that reason

These real democrats have long memories and will not forgive or forget

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

53. What's your definition of a "real Democrat" vs. a fake one in the context of your post?

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[oldsoftie]

87. Maybe someone who has been registered as one for quite some time.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

92. Oh okay, so you're sayin' my nephew, who just registered to vote as a Democrat, is not

a real Democrat. He's gonna be SO bummed to hear that though!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[NewJeffCT]

37. Trump survived a primary with 14 or 15 other Republicans in it

while I would have preferred that Sanders drop out after he was essentially eliminated on the first Super Tuesday, it wasn't like Trump didn't have to go through the primary process as well.

[jrthin]

51. Not to revisit 2016 but some would say Hillary was basically shadow primaried until election day.

[jg10003]

67. Every non-incumbent goes through a primary.

The Clinton-Sanders primary was more civil and issue oriented then most. Sanders campaigned hard and ethusiatically for Clinton and most of his supporters voted for her.

[murielm99]

88. There was nothing civil about it.

Sanders and his supporters tore Hillary down at every opportunity. Issue oriented? BS claimed ideas that were in our platform before he became a candidate. He did not campaign hard for her. He was lackluster and half-hearted.

It infuriates me when the BS supporters rewrite history.

Where are Bernie's taxes? Hidden in the attic of one of his three homes? And why are his supporters doing their best to discredit Biden, who is looking more Presidential by the hour?

[LiberalLovinLug]

86. Is it Nader's fault that the GOP helped him get more votes?

For their own devious purposes? I'll never understand the hatred for Ralph Nader. Can I understand the bitter frustration in having that third party candidate running? Yes. But Ralph was a good man. Who dedicated his life, before politics, to defending the consumer. Standing up for the little guy.

Many here act like he deliberately conspired with Republicans to make sure Democrats lost.

I have been puzzled by this, even the seething hatred of Jill Stein and the whole Green Party. I imagine that if that recount she initiated had gone Hillary's way, we'd all have a different opinion of her.

I think this puzzling inability to separate the person, their platform and values, from how much they threaten the Democratic party, might be explained in that America is one of the more rare democracies in that it only has a two party system. Kind of a very very limited version of democracy. You have no experience with a multi-party concept of democracy.

In Canada, we have 4 parties that are active and recognized. Yes the Greens are fledglings, but are rising. They compete with my traditional party the New Democratic Party. A left of center, democratic socialist party. Do we like them taking votes away from our party? No. But we also respect their platform, and we are not upset to see them rise in popularity........because they are a thousand times better than the Conservatives. That even if they can split the vote in some ridings to allow a Con to get in, we still respect them as a party and what their goals are. That eventually progressivism will be advanced, and that Cons will either disappear or be forced to adopt more green policies themselves the next time round.

The leader of the Green party, Elizabeth May was recently voted as the most trustworthy/respected of all the party leaders of Canada.....but it doesn't mean you'd not vote against her party if you were so inclined on voting day. Voting or not for someone, and respecting their values and platform are not mutually exclusive.

Just musing from this side of north of the border.

[Gothmog]

90. He took Rove's money and worked with Rove to help W win

I will never forgive Nader for this

[LiberalLovinLug]

91. Believe what you want to I guess

But there will come a time perhaps, in some distant future, when more will comprehend the difference between a candidate participating in democracy because they honestly think values they share with many others are not being represented, and an evil usurper conspiring with the enemy to make you lose.

[sacto95834]

111. i agree

if the candidate cannot persuade people to vote for them, who's fault is that? could it be the party nominated the wrong person?

Dems like to blame nader for gore's loss. let's face it, he ran an awful campaign. i voted for him, but i recognize that his campaign was weak. i give gore credit for never blaming anyone for his loss and there is plenty to be bitter about in florida. wish other nominees would follow suit.

[Demsrule86]

131. He shoul never have run...he knew a third party run is always a spoiler...and it was too important..

9-11, two wars, thousand dead in New Orleans, and economic meltdown...I have to say I will hate both Nader and Jill Stein until the day I die.

[lunatica]

16. Gore didn't run a bad campaign

You should get your history correct. Gore won just like Hillary did, by getting millions more of the popular vote. Jeb Bush, as governor of Florida pulled some real shenanigans which appeared to give the state to George Bush. Gore took it all the way to the Supreme where the they decided to stop the vote count and handed the Presidency to Bush.

[brooklynite]

20. But we don't elect Presidents based on popular vote

We elect based on Electoral College votes. Gore lost TEN States that Clinton won, INCLUDING his Home State. Any one of those States would have given how m 270 EV.

[Cyrano]

22. Umm, except for the stolen Supreme Court vote in Florida

Wake up.

Wake the fuck up.

I will assume you are a sentient being.

[brooklynite]

30. If only he hadn't needed Florida...

Last edited Tue Apr 2, 2019, 04:26 PM - Edit history (1)

If only he'd won Tennessee...
or Arkansas...
or Kentucky...
or Louisiana...
or West Virginia...
or Missouri...
or Arizona...
or New Hampshire...
or Ohio...

[lunatica]

47. Then we're very lucky Bush won!

Because that’s what you’re saying.

[brooklynite]

50. I'm saying that a better candidate who wasn't afraid of sticking with a popular President...

...wouldn't have lost because the Florida vote count would have been inconsequential.

[lunatica]

28. The vote count had to be certified by

That woman official in Florida. Katherine Harris, The Secretary of State of Florida. The vote counting was stopped by the Supreme Court and she handed it to the Bush family.

Jesus! It’s really irresponsible to repeat Republican talking points if you’re a Democrat. Gore did not run a poor campaign. And neither did Hillary, no matter how much the Right screams hat they did.

[kskiska]

73. The Palm Beach ballot alone

would have given Gore Florida. The poorly designed ballot caused people in a heavily Dem area to punch a hole for Pat Buchanan instead of for Gore.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

106. I'll NEVER forget that!! Biggest travesty in political history...

Think how our environment would have benefited if we had Gore as President for eight years!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[marylandblue]

31. He only got 500,000 more popular votes than Bush

And he made some strategic errors like distancing himself from Clinton, even picking the most anti-Clinton VP around.

[lunatica]

46. I suppose you think Bush didn't make any errors at all

He ran the perfect campaign right?

And so did Trump, right?

If Gore was so incompetent then we must be very lucky indeed that he didn’t win!

[marylandblue]

54. I think no such thing, and I don't know why anyone would think I did.

Campaigns are like wars. Both sides do some things well and both sides make mistakes. The winner is the one that does best overall. After the war is over, strategists study it to learn lessons for future wars.

There usually isn't just one thing that causes a victory or a loss. There are a lot of factors, some within the campaign's control, and some not. It's a good idea to look at past campaigns and learn from your own mistakes, as well as the other side's so as not to repeat them.

I have watched Democratic campaigns repeat mistakes and it affected the outcome. Let's not do that again.

[LanternWaste]

75. Unsupported premise

Again.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

107. Gore did better than most Democrats who've lost presidential elections.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[mitch96]

42. He was a "war" president. they always get bipartisan support..nt

[BlueStater]

7. I haven't seen anyone here take that for granted.

Just winning the first time defied all common sense and logic, so I'm definitely not assuming he couldn't win again.

[TreasonousBastard]

8. I take nothing for granted...

Every time I have, something bit me in the ass. And that's not just politics.

And, even when you get the check, don't assume it won't bounce.

We've got a few assholes out there who claim to be on "our" side, but are better than us and are only here to teach us. Republicans have the same kinds of assholes, but they are much better at dealing with them.

The problem is that we have a message, but our message can't be compressed into a simple phrase. Or maybe we haven't tried hard enough...

We live to beat the shit out of our good people because they are not good enough, or maybe because they aren't good enough in the "proper" way. This won't stop, but we've got a year or so to figure how to stop make it hurting.

[SWBTATTReg]

9. I am not taking it for granted. I am going to canvess/etc./until every single vote and ...

voter we can get to the polls is accomplished. I want to make sure that every vote is counted, that literally 10s of millions of us are going to throw this bum out of office squarely and soundly, leaving no doubt as to what the vast majority of Americans think of rump, his cronies, his 1% buddies, his ignorant policies...all junk and a dismal failure (to add to the rest of his other failures).

[MineralMan]

11. We'd better not be doing that.

If we are, we could easily lose, especially if Democratic internal fighting means a weak candidate on the general election ballot. We'd better start thinking about that real soon now, or we risk everything.

I'm not seeing recognition of that, despite Trump's electoral win in 2016. If that isn't a shocking warning, I don't know what is.

[Gothmog]

12. There are economic studies and models that show that trump is likely to win

Most POTUS are re-elected unless there are economic issues. See https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211939024

Link to tweet

trump could easily win in 2020 if the historical trends listed in these studies hold up. I am hoping that trump is an outlier and that the above rules will not apply but this is not a given.

trump is planning on running on the basis of 45% support and using negative attacks to win

Link to tweet

And that’s why, as Axios reports, they are planning to hold on to the minority of voters who support the president while working overtime to launch a scorched-Earth campaign against the eventual Democratic nominee.

“The GOP]is going to make whoever the nominee is radioactive well before they get the nomination,” one former Trump campaign aide explained. “That’s Trump’s strategy. Stay at 45-46 percent [in the polls] and just make the other guy radioactive.”

Given Trump’s own unpopularity, the campaign reasons, the only way to get him back into the White House will be to convince swing voters that the Democratic nominee will pack the Supreme Court, end the Electoral College, and grant reparations to black Americans.

Throughout his first term, Trump has consistently posted lower approval ratings than any of his predecessors. FiveThirtyEight’s average of public opinion polls at the moment gives Trump an approval rating of just under 42 percent with a disapproval rating of 53 percent.

I do not think that it is a given that trump will lose in 2020. I am looking at a number of candidates in the Democratic primary field. I have donated to three so far. I am worried that trump could win and electability is my main criterion for a candidate.

[lunatica]

15. You entered the wrong year for Bush II Presidential Selection

I’m sure it’s a typo.

I have tried to think hard on what it would be like to live in a dictatorship if for some horrible reason it turns out that way.

The internet would be one of the early casualties which would effectvely cut off our primary source of information. The MSM would all be Fox News so in full awareness we would know nothing except what Trump or whoever, maybe Steve Miller, would want us to know.

Our quality of life would plummet as we would all work for minimum wage in the new corporate age of Fascism production. Most people would work in armament and munitions in service of the American Empire of aggression or a renewal of PNAC.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century


I can see this really happening.

Our only recourse to actual physical survival would be to shut up, especially us older people like me in my 70s, put our heads down and tow the line.

It would be easy for the government to destroy any pockets of resistance, because I really don’t see how any group of resistors could do anything other than localized activity.

[Cyrano]

21. Yep. Fixed the 2000 thing about Bush ii

Like you, I can't see anyway to stop what seems to be American fascism.

However, we both seem to be underestimating the current younger generation. IMO, they won't tolerate it. I don't know how they'll stop it. But many of them are currently in the service of our country: The FBI, The CIA, The NSA, The Military, etc. And many of them believe the oath they took to "... protect and defend the Unites States of America, against all enemies, [i]foreign and domestic.

Hopefully many of them believe that oath live by it.

[PSPS]

17. If trump's still around to run for re-election, our system is hopelessly broken beyond repair

[Historic NY]

18. Trust me its all being setup, were just helping it along.

[lunamagica]

19. That's my fear. I see post after post on how this or that candidate is so wonderful that

[bs/he will wipe the floor with trump.

They seem to forget about Russia intervention, about how it doesn't matter how great the Democratic platform is when the media will not broadcast it to the voters...Hillary would talk about the economy, jobs, education, health care, but the media ignored it.

Unless does issues are addressed and fixed, it doesn't matter who runs. They will steal it. They will get away with it for the FOURTH time in twenty years.

[inwiththenew]

23. I'm not and no one else should be either

That's how we got in this mess in the first place.

[DFW]

24. They WILL try to steal it. That's a given. But for whom?

I am less convinced that Trump will be their candidate. He is even easier to run against for Senate and House candidates than he is for our presidential nominee. The presidential nominee has to explain things most voters find bafling--the economy, foreign policy, taxes, global warming, etc. A local candidate can campaign on issues that have affected his/her immediate district/state. Flooding, lack of support from Washington for disaster relief, eliminating of state tax and charitable contribution deductions for local causes, etc.

Trump may get convinced that he has been brilliant, claim he has accomplished more in 4 years than most presidents have accomplished in 20 years (just wait--you don't think he's capable of a statement like that?), and say, "my work is done here." What will have really happened, of course, is that McTurtle, Pence and some unnamed guy with a slight Slavic accent will tell him he will be leaving the White House around January 2017, and whether it is vertically on January 20th or horizontally a few months prior to that is entirely up to him.

One way or the other, I give it at LEAST an even chance that Trump is NOT the Republican nominee next year, and that IF that is the case, he will claim it is because he was such a great president, he really did make America great again. Toruk Makto was no longer needed.

[rzemanfl]

56. I think it is entirely possible Putin will "help" the Democratic candidate in 2020.

He may think, "Why poison one well when I can poison them both?"

[doc03]

25. I heard that back in 2016, don't worry she got it. The

Blue Wall.

[democratisphere]

26. With drumpf NOTHING should ever be taken for granted.

This super teflon coated SOB should have gone long ago; yet he remains.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

27. I'm not. I think a lot of people, including me, made that assumption in 2016,

even the pollsters and analysts. We can't afford to assume anything this time.

[Cicada]

29. Predictit has odds of trump 31%, any Republican 40%

The betting public is smarter than I am

[bearsfootball516]

35. That's roughly what 538 had on election day 2016, if not just a touch worse

I think it had him at like, 33 percent on election day. So not good, but very, very far from impossible.

People talked like it was unfathomable that he would win back in 2016, but that wasn't true at all. If someone told you there was a 33 percent chance the sandwich you're about to eat would kill you, would you still eat it?

[Cicada]

38. The old Nate (Silver) and the new Nate (Cohen) at the NYT stat desk are awesome

[Perrenial Voter]

32. Republicans have been stealing elections in plain sight for a long time.

The do it with gerrymandering, voter suppression, voter purges, misinformation about polling places, etc. Are they also engaging in manipulation of vote counts? It would be surprising if they were not given their recent history.

[Socal31]

36. Anyone who actively discourages participation in the 2020 vote....

Either directly or through concern-trolling, is not a Democrat and should go somewhere else to post

[NewJeffCT]

39. I'm taking nothing for granted

Yes, Trump's poll numbers look bad in Michigan, PA, WI and Ohio - much worse than in October/November 2016 - but a lot can change over the next 18 months.

I fully expect he'll try some false flag event in late October 2020 to both ramp up the fear and to justify closing inner city polling locations for "safety" reasons. Just imagine a big terror attack and Trump and DHS claim another attack is coming in the cities of various swing states?

[sellitman]

40. Who will count the vote?

From what I see there are not any changes from the last Presidential selection.

I expect the same outcome.

I fucking hope I'm disappointed.

[Freethinker65]

41. We need to hold the House and retake the Senate.

If we are able to retake the Senate, Trump will have lost.

[lame54]

43. I don't know anybody who is

[sarisataka]

44. Anyone who takes any election

For granted is a fool. There were many in 2016. The warning signs were there but many chose to ignore any/everything that looked to spoil the victory party plans.

Hopefully there will be less in 2020 but I expect a few will "guarantee" a win and talk about how it's "in the bag".

[mitch96]

45. "Sooo, what's the answer.

Win by an overwhelming margin so political ratfucking does not come into play. Get out the vote. It seems that when the #'s are close the repukes play games. Large margins are hard to mess with.
When he looses lets hope the Presidential Secret Service detail escorts the rump out of office..
m

[Jarqui]

48. Too many past elections have been stolen by the GOP

I wouldn't take anything for granted.

A rattlesnake with it's head cut off can still bite.

[dustyscamp]

49. If Trump wins 2020 don't expect a Mueller report part 2

[Doreen]

55. I NEVER took it for granted.

I am still and have been scared shitless that he will cheat his way in again. Despite how much Democrats are jazzed up to vote for a well qualified candidate does not mean we will succeed. Since he cheated his way in last time he has more countries other than Russia to help him. Think of all those countries he made friends with while kicking our true allies to the curb.

Anyone who thinks it is not possible for him to get in again is a fool. Sorry, but that is my opinion.

[OrlandoDem2]

57. I'm not. I'm looking for the candidate who can win PA, WI, and MI.

I don’t see one in the current pack and that worries me. Now if Biden jumps in...,RUN JOE RUN!!!!!

[Demsrule86]

65. Agreed Joe can do it.

[Irishxs]

59. Never say never.

[Poiuyt]

60. If Trump wins in 2020, I expect that the House will do a full court press and work to impeach him

They'll have nothing to lose. I think Nancy Pelosi will step down from the Speaker position so we might get someone who's willing to fight for it.

Assuming we still control the House.

[VOX]

62. Will there even be a free & fair election in 2020? I take NOTHING for granted with 45 & Co.

Trumpists are not “average” people. They believe themselves to be above the law (and they have been, so far). These cultists will do anything to keep their Neanderthal figurehead in office. Meanwhile, Democrats and progressives need to STOP the infighting if they’re genuinely interested in saving the country.

When the 2020 election finally rolls around, Democrats, progressives and independents must turn out in “Obama numbers” to overcome voter suppression, gerrymandering, and vote-tampering. Republicans will NOT be playing fair...do they ever?

[grannyokie]

80. YES

[elias7]

63. We're all taking for granted that Trump will be able to run in 2020

We need to be patient and see how this all plays out. Those protecting the country’s integrity have one shot against this villainy and it pays to do it right.

[edbermac]

66. I am not.

Never underestimate the stupidity of Republican voters.

[crazytown]

69. Trump Reagan Approval

[Joe941]

70. He wont win - not possible.

[Tipperary]

110. Many people said that last time...

I remember well.

[jpljr77]

71. What if? He's steamrolling toward re-election. 100%. His poll numbers are going UP.

And meanwhile, all Democrats care about is how intersectional his candidate will be.

[Texin]

72. The way things are stacking up in the Middle East right now, we'll be at war with Iran by then.

Shitler will be a War pResident* by that time. If we all aren't vaporized in a nuclear mushroom, the War pResident* will be pretty hard to beat. And if he's defeated, but in a very close race where votes need to be recounted, he'll have the Supreme Court - or hell, Barr - to stop the counting and just declare him monarch for life with his children and grandchildren his successors.

[grannyokie]

74. Life during war time

This is advice someone gave to us once when people on the same side were bickering back and forth on a blog page. It stuck in my brain.
Don't pick fights with your own soldiers. Don't go to battle thinking you're going to lose. Don't assume you will win easy.

These are just some random thoughts that go through my head.
It sure feels like we are at war. When I see that disgusting Sarah Huckabee say we are just a bunch of sore losers. Us Democrats. I don't think it's that at all. I think it's because we were robbed. I feel that way. In my wildest dreams I never thought that many Americans would go for Trump. I didn't think he could fool that many Americans. I just couldn't believe that many Americans were that stupid to think a reality tv star should be President. I was really down. I think it was more because I felt let down by my fellow Americans. My husband told me I always underestimate the stupid and overestimate kindness. Maybe it's true. I learned a lesson well. The best man/woman doesn't always win and never take anything for granted.

[Turbineguy]

76. Take this for granted:

Republicans will cheat.

[grannyokie]

77. Republicans do cheat

If they ran only on their policies few would vote for them. They're good at it. They've been doing it for years.

[BlueJac]

79. Certainly not me...

Trump and his cult are unpredictable and I can see lots of issues facing the Dems in 2020, if Trump even allows an election to take place. He will not go quietly!!!

[ScratchCat]

81. For those who are making comparisons

to other incumbents in the past: Its just not the same.

None of those former Presidents were elected by a bunch of people who claimed they hadn't voted in decades.

None were as universally hated as much as Trump.

You didn't have millions of previous voters quietly telling each other they know they made a huge mistake.

The message should be easy and simple: Do you want this lunatic to remain President? IF the millions who voted for Obama but sat out 2016 vote this time, its not even close.

[grannyokie]

82. This is not normal

Right!

[RANDYWILDMAN]

84. He is garbage

But so are his voters....

He cheated once, nothing he has done, makes me think he won't do it again.

We should win, but it's who counts the votes in the state he NEEDS to win.

He shouldn't win Ohio again... But the Caravan or all the jobs he is bringing back...
He shouldn't win Florida....we have heard that one before, the narrative this time will be how all the former felons voted for him.
We should win Michigan...but half of Detroit this time won't vote for president....
We should win Wisconsin...f-it I don't know what the hell is wrong with that state.

Ok so he has a chance, but that says more about our stupid media leading the stupid sheeple to the poles then anything of substance, because after 2 years if you can't figure out he is a lying piece of poop, we can't help you.

Beware, the Oranges of Trump.

[peggysue2]

85. I'm certainly not assuming a Trump loss in 2020

In fact, to go into an existential fight with that attitude? Suicidal.

Listen, there were many who said that 2018 would wind up a bust.

They were wrong.

They were wrong because the Democratic Party fielded good, strong candidates who were aligned with their districts, because the GOTV was turbo-charged and because candidates kept on message.

For many, that was healthcare.

We duplicate that effort in 2020 we can win. Yes, there are all sorts of variables; there always are. But sending our eventual nominee weakened and bruised into the arena is a recipe for disaster. Opponents of the Democratic Party have already started the tear down. We cannot let that happen.

As stated in a post yesterday by another DU'er, we must control the narrative, snatch it back from those on the Left and the Right who would use it to favor their own candidate and bludgeon everyone else.

We can do this. But there is never a guarantee.

[oldsoftie]

89. I took it for granted LAST time, as did others. I doubt anyone is making the same mistake this time.

[Baltimike]

93. The Russians are still meddling...

and we haven't done much about it

[catbyte]

95. After 2016, I take NOTHING for granted.

[YOHABLO]

96. What Republican will challenge Trump? That is if he runs. It might be impossible for him to run.

[hurple]

98. As of right now...

I'm putting it at 2:1 that he will be re-elected.

[cstanleytech]

99. Even if he loses we need to focus on taking out the Repugnants support and do what

was done to take out the German American Bund which is to go after them via their taxes and make sure its not wrist slaps they get but rather years if not decades in prison.

[DFW]

102. In 2004, my European colleagues asked me my prediction for the presidential election

My prediction then was: Kerry wins, and Bush stays in office.

They asked, how does THAT work? Then I explained to them who Kenneth Blackwell was, and who Diebold and ESS were.

After the election, they asked, how could you possibly have known that? How indeed. After the elections of 2000 and the 2002 midterms, it became clear that we only would win major elections if there was close to a landslide majority in out favor, and even then, as shown in 2016, a huge majority is still no guarantee.

Will we crush Trump in the presidential election? Sure. He could still well end up staying in office.

What if they steal it?

My question is: What makes anyone think they won't try?

[FakeNoose]

109. +1000 This is the dark underbelly of American politics

The Babyboomers (and I'm one) have never addressed this situation, and now I'm afraid we've become part of the problem. Now it's up to the youngsters to take over and deal with it.

Nobody wants to play fair any more, nobody wants to play by the rules. Everybody wants to beat the system somehow. I truly believe that the Democratic Party would love to have fair elections by the rules but we don't dare trust the GOP - we know they are the cheaters. Some of us, maybe most of us, believe we have to cheat to beat them, otherwise we'll never, ever win. We've all been down this road before.

[W T F]

112. Republicans have been caught already rigging elections, and those are just the ones we know about...

Not to mention, that they are also getting help from the Kremlin

[allgood33]

118. If you are paying attention, Trump won't need help to win 2020.

His racism will carry him through UNLESS we come together behind one excellent candidate no matter what.

We need to focus on (1) jobs creation through a new green economy; (2) affordable and comprehensive healthcare by either fixing Obamacare, opening up a public option, or some kind of effective and cost-saving mix; (3) STEM-focused education programs beginning in early childhood and K-6 levels; (4) affordable housing by examining, exposing, and explaining what and who actually controls our current rental and housing economy and passing legislation to correct those markets; (5) facing and preparing for longevity and population density issues with attention to emerging climate and weather patterns.

[Miles Archer]

120. I'm not taking it for granted.

It's going to be a battle, and Trump is already setting the stage for the "rigged election" rhetoric.

This is the guy who said he'd support the results of the 2016 election "if he won."

I'm not taking anything for granted.

[Calculating]

122. Honestly I expect him to win if the economy and stock market keep doing well

That's just how I see this. Incumbents usually don't lose if things are going well. Now if something catastrophic were to happen like a recession or he gets us into an unpopular war things might change. In order for Trump to lose, the Dems need to either put up an exceptionally good candidate or things in this country need to get bad in a hurry.

[Hoyt]

127. Tend to agree, although I wish voters would look to future. Healthcare might change things though.

I guess it is so American to put one's pocketbook first.

[Demsrule86]

132. It might be good in some places but not where Trump needs to win. Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin and

Pennsylvania have all been hurt by Trump's policies...and in Ohio we lost a GM assembly plant. If we can win in PA, WI and MI...we can beat Trump. He has to have those states...Ohio would be icing on the cake. Now we won the governorships of all the states mentioned except Ohio...the crypt keeper as I call him won there. He was an ex-Senator so not surprising. But we need the right candidate. Biden could do it but if he doesn't get in because of the bullshit. I will vote for Tim Ryan...he has annoyed me from time to time, but we must win in 20, He can take the rustbelt and Trump loses...glad to see him jump in .

[Hekate]

128. I don't take any such thing for granted, which is why I refuse to knock any Dem candidate

We are in perilous times