If the House Impeaches Donald Trump and the Senate doesn't convict, what will you do?

[brooklynite]

Trump will still be President

Republicans will be riled up by the impeachment and likely to vote in larger numbers.

There will likely be no significant increase in the number of people who think he’s guilty.

What then?

[Girard442]

1. As I see it, doing nothing is not an option.

It would be like stepping over some poor soul bleeding out on the sidewalk saying to yourself, "He's gonna die anyway." Ya gotta try, man.

[uponit7771]

76. Exposing Donald Trump and impeachment is all we got we got to hit it as hard as we can with it

[NNadir]

2. I was a young man when Nixon went down.

As a result, I really question the basis of your claim, "There will likely be no significant increase in the number of people who think he’s guilty."

This is not what happened in 1974. The opposite is true. People became convinced, including many Republican members of the House, that Nixon was guilty.

There will also be a Senate trial and the Senators who vote against impeachment of a man who is clearly and openly a criminal will stand, if not in elections, then certainly in the docket of history.

[Baltimike]

4. This ain't 1972/3 and the conservative press changed the ball game. nt

[NNadir]

7. Really? People can no longer think for themselves?

I was unaware of that.

You think the live hearings will not be around in all kinds of public venues?

I've certainly been around since 1974, and I have in fact, seen the rise of the Pravda for the neo-nazis - maybe better put Das Sturmer for Republican racists - Fox News, but I actually don't believe that people have all become stupid.

Cowardice and fear will not win. Clean and open air will.

[brooklynite]

14. No, I don't

The cable channels will cover the hearings, but they'll have a far smaller audience than the 1970s when there were only 3 networks and one was always showing the hearings.

[Baltimike]

28. That's your strawman, not mine...

I never said people couldn't think for themselves....I said this ain't 1972/3 and people are too busy to be that engaged.

[NNadir]

31. Whenever I hear that silly word "straw man"I immediately recognize the conversation as useless.

You said that there's some kind of all powerful media that should make us quiver, and therefore history, specifically the history of a truly likewise criminal President, Nixon was irrelevant.

I am aware of what you claimed. A vague rote platitude about so called "straw men" convinces me of nothing. I find that term awfully abused to the point of silliness.

You implied that Fox News is all powerful, that it controls the outcome, and all of the wiggling in the world will not make it different.

We are cowards if we don't confront this criminality when we have the power to do so.

[bdamomma]

47. We better use

that power before it is taken away from us. Anyone who is not a supporter of his is going to be ridiculed and cast aside because he is pitting Americans against Americans. Vile POS he is.

[Firestorm49]

59. It's not so much that people can't think for themselves as it is political ignorance.

Most people just don’t know or don’t care about what’s going on.

[NNadir]

69. You're referring to people who don't vote.

Those kinds of people simply will not matter one way or the other in the fate of our country.

[treestar]

22. Not nearly as big a spin machine as now

No media 24/7. Spinning away and excusing everything

[Trumpocalypse]

43. The impeachment hearings didn't change people's minds about Nixon

it was the Senate hearings in 73 that did.

[onenote]

62. It was the smoking gun tape in August 1974 that finally did Nixon in

While Nixon's approval rating dropped below 40 percent during the Senate hearings in 1973, even after the July 1973 revelation that there were White House tapes in and the Saturday Night Massacre in October 1973, support for impeachment was only around 33 percent (even though Nixon's approval rating was below 30 percent).

It was not until July 1974, a year after the revelation that there were tapes, that the House Judiciary Committee passed three articles of impeachment and none of the three received a majority of Republican votes. At that point, polling still showed less than 50 percent support for impeachment. It was only after the smoking gun tape was released in early August that the bottom completely fell out and support for impeachment topped 50 percent.

[Trumpocalypse]

66. That was the final nail in the coffin

[onenote]

73. The coffin was far from closed until that happened.

Prior to the US v Nixon case and the release of the smoking gun case, Nixon had reason to believe that even if the House, which had a 243 -192 Democratic majority passed articles of impeachment, he might survive in the Senate given that a majority of the country still didn't favor impeachment. Indeed, it wasn't until AFTER the Supreme Court ruled against Nixon on July 24 that the House Judiciary committee passed the first of the articles of impeachment (on July 27). But for the SCOTUS ruling (and the fact it was unanimous) and the disclosure of the smoking gun case, it is far from clear that Nixon would have been forced from office (even though his popularity prior to those events was lower than Trump's is now).

[NNadir]

71. He resigned during the impeachment hearings.

The Senate hearings started the wheels rolling, and we can hope for John Dean like relevations in other hearings such as the Mueller hearings, but the impeachment hearings forced action.

[Baltimike]

3. this...all day long. I know some are suffering from battle fatigue, but we get ONE

Last edited Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:20 PM - Edit history (1)

chance at this

[redstateblues]

5. Trump takes a victory lap

[Thunderbeast]

6. The evidence will be overwhelming

and every Republican Senator will be on the record. They may energize their base, but independents will see their partisan votes, in the face of indisputable facts, in sharp relief.

Let them run on that.

[elleng]

23. Yes.

Thanks

[Trumpocalypse]

44. If most people accepted indisputable facts

Trump would never been elected.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

8. Be proud of House Democrats for doing *their* job - the job they regained majority to do.

[in2herbs]

9. There's a lot of assumptions in this post meaning that your theory is as plausible as a

theory that the truth that comes out in the hearing will change the minds of enough people to vote him out of office. I'm supporting impeachment and picking up the pieces to restore democracy. I liked Tim Wise's twitter feed today -- emphasize that the occupant of the WH is a racist during the campaign.

[brooklynite]

16. So, you want to lose?

Voters in aggregate DON'T CARE about this: they didn't care in 2018 when they elected us to deal with health care, education costs, jobs, etc. And that's not an opinion, that's what dozens of candidates and elected officials told me.

[standingtall]

38. It is an often repeated talking point that voters dont care about this

and it is not true and even if it were then it is the job of Democrats to make voters care about it. May not have been the most important issue to voters in 2018, but it was a contributing factor and I don't care what some exit poll says. Democrats were not elected in 2018 to deal with healthcare. They ran against the sewer in republicans on the healthcare issue. They were elected as check and balance on Trump and republicans on healthcare and many other issues including the Mueller investigation.They weren't going to be able to advance any legislation on it. The only they can do is stop republicans from passing bad legislation. If we don't impeach Trump by 2024 repukes will have the presidency,senate and congress and they will come for healthcare again and we wont be able to stop them next time, because pissing on our base is never a winning strategy.

[RDANGELO]

10. The DOJ wont indict him. The only thing left is to work to get him voted out of office.

[TreasonousBastard]

11. Move.

[emmaverybo]

12. You mean WHEN not IF the senate does not convict. NT

[trev]

20. This.

[kacekwl]

61. Best idea I've heard

in a while.

[onenote]

63. Even if the public doesn't support it?

Do you think that's a viable path to victory for Democrats in 2020?

[Fiendish Thingy]

15. You present no evidence that Republican voters will increase their turnout if Trump is impeached

But not removed, and you present no evidence that supports your suggestion that there would be no increase in the number of people who think he's guilty- no evidence, just fear based defeatism.

If Trump is impeached, I will applaud our brave congressional warriors who took a risk to do the right thing and defend the Constitution.

If the hearings are managed and timed right, the evidence and testimony could not only weaken Trump's chances of re-election (historical evidence says it would damage the party in power in the WH), but also boost the Dems chances of taking the senate. GOP senators would be on the spot to vote for removal or face the wrath of the voters, who, if the hearings are managed properly, should be sufficiently informed and outraged over Trump's crimes.

[Golden Raisin]

17. I'll say to myself that even though we may have not

succeeded in sufficient votes for a conviction, History will look back on us and say we did the right thing while Trump/Barr/McConnell and all the goddamn, complicit Republicans in Congress burned down our Democracy.

[KentuckyWoman]

18. Probably die of shock

If the House impeaches I'll be happy yes, but so shocked they did I might need 911.

I keep telling myself the strategy is to ride out the clock and air all the dirty laundry close to the end of his term. That self lie grows thinner daily though, and we are still a year and half out.

[lame54]

19. Your outcomes are pure guesses

[elleng]

25. Worse than 'guesses.'

[treestar]

21. Blame the democrats

At least, there would be a few such posts here !

[elleng]

24. There will likely be no significant increase in the number of people who think he's guilty is absurd

[kentuck]

26. I suppose it might depend on how long the impeachment proceeding were to go on?

And how much more shit is uncovered?

Or if it happens the next day?

It is better to try and fail than to not try at all, in my opinion. Because if nothing is proven, we know he is unfit to be president.

And just my opinion, but I think it would destroy the Democratic Party if they did not impeach and then lost the next election to Trump. That is a much bigger danger than attempting to impeach and convict and failing in the Senate.

[YOHABLO]

27. You are making assumptions that can't be verified. By the way, his base is already riled up.

The people we're after are those who sat out the past election because they disliked Hillary, and Independent voters. Also there are many, what I would call x-Republicans, or never Trumpers, who may have seen the light. A lot can happen.

[StarfishSaver]

29. One thing will surely happen

A whole lot of progressives will jump all over the Democrats for not doing a good enough job, second-guessing every move they made, insisting that if they'd done a better job, if they'd introduced this piece of evidence, if they'd called that witness if they'd only made a different argument or used a more effective tactic, the Senate would have convicted him.

[Poiuyt]

30. If he's impeached, he'll always be scarred by that

History will see that something was so off that Congress felt the need to impeach him. Historians and scholars will teach young students about the evils of Trumpism and fascism.

[Crunchy Frog]

32. I will be very pleased about the impeachment.

I never expected the Senate to convict in the first place, so that would be immaterial to me.

I would hope that the Democratic leadership would have worked out the most effective spin to put on the situation.

I don't agree with the premises in the body of your post, so no reaction there.

[ProudLib72]

33. Then it will obvious to everyone that the GOP are enablers

of the single worst president in history. We can go on to denounce him as a racist, misogynist, rapist who cheated to win the election, and that will stick.

[FoxNewsSucks]

34. Why the hell would you think there would be no

"significant increase in the number of people who think he's guilty"?

Do you think the media would give it zero coverage? Obviously the MAGAts won't be affected, they're too brainwashed and stupid, but you really think no regular people who generally don't follow politics would be unaffected by seeing the facts laid out? And then seeing Senate republicons let him off the hook despite his guilt?

[onenote]

64. Why do you think that "regular" people who haven't paid attention would start paying attention?

It will be a repeat of the Mueller report spin cycle. Highly legalistic arguments claiming (a) Nothing happened; (b) if something happened, Trump wasn't aware of it; (c) if Trump was aware of it, he didn't cause it to happen and isn't responsible; (d) if something happened and Trump played a cognizable role in it, it still wasn't illegal because intent, elements of the crime, blah blah blah.

And people who haven't already made up their minds will just continue to tune it all out.

[standingtall]

35. Don't impeach Trump and

Trump will still be president.
Republicans will be riled up because Trump was investigated and Democrats didn't have the courage to impeach him.
There may be significant lower turnout in 2020, because of the failure Democrats to impeach Trump. Even if Trump loses. Democrats will not have enough momentum to take back the Senate without impeaching Trump. Republicans will take back the house in 2022 and whoever the Democratic is will lose in 2024 due to not being able to pass any legislation and in 2024 repukes will come for everything they failed to take between 2016 to 2018. What then?

[madville]

36. He is in office until at least January 2021

The Senate will not convict him. In the end it's Nancy's decision if the House at least makes the effort.

[Meowmee]

37. If the house doesn't start impeachment inquiries etc.

And dump is still in office, maybe even legitimately elected, I don’t consider he was actually elected this time, what then? What is the plan.

[sueh]

39. I think that even if he Senate doesn't convict, swing voters and independent voters

will re-think voting for trump after they learn about his crimes from the impeachment hearings.

[onenote]

45. You give people too much credit

If there is a trial in the Senate, Trump's attorney will present an aggressive , highly legalistic defense and he'll be acquitted. The fact that evidence of his guilt is presented won't ultimately matter. The legal arguments will soon cause the average person to lose interest and the ultimate headline: Trump acquitted will be the takeaway for those who hadn't already made up their minds before the trial started.

[MFM008]

40. It will be part of the historical

Record and it will gall the hell out of him.
He will rant and rage and hopefully that
Aneurysm will get him.

[onenote]

46. He will absolutely bask in the fact that he was acquitted. He'll be proud not ashamed.

That's the very nature of his personality disorder.

[Vinca]

41. I know the Senate won't convict, but I don't want Democrats to go down in history as doing

nothing. It's bad enough the subpoena process is oozing like molasses and going nowhere. If they can get Mueller to admit he meant he would indict Trump if not for the DOJ memo, it's time to impeach. People voted for action in the midterms, not status quo. If Dems don't impeach, we might have a whole lot of voters saying to hell with it in 2020 and staying home.

[pecosbob]

42. I question the premise that impeachment would rile their base any more than the Rs current strategy

of hanging out red meat for them. They'll try to tie the candidate to the 'squad' in any way possible and try to craft the candidate into a surrogate for their favorite bad guy Hillary. I believe they'll have ninety five percent of their base at the polls this time around as a result of everything from Kavanaugh to all the recent red state anti-abortion rulings to their now openly racist rallies.

I believe the election will fall based upon turnout of non-voters. Trump and the GOP are their own worst enemies...this election is Dems' to lose. All we have do is avoid nominating Che Guevara and I have a hard time seeing anyone in our current field being demonized as effectively as was done to Hillary. They had twenty years of right wing radio and television to indoctrinate red America against her...it was even effective on many in our own party.

[Fullduplexxx]

48. Impeach but dont refer it o the senate

Ef

[onenote]

65. What would that accomplish?

Other than to make the story about how the Democrats are afraid to put Trump on trial and/or give him due process.

[Fullduplexxx]

70. They can ask why wont the republicans remove a lawless

Potus impeached by the house? Why are the republicans protecting him . Stop worrying what the cons are gonna say the constitution is pretty clear on what to do with a potus like this besides theyre gonna say something no matter what is done

[onenote]

72. That's not much of an argument if we don't even let a trial take place.

And I'm not at all worried about what the cons will say. It's what the folks we need to convince will think.

[Fullduplexxx]

74. I disagree i think it is .

[scarytomcat]

49. I still think it is better to leave him in office

the more he talks the worse chance the rethugs have
but hearings up to the election are very good
we need the truth out

[Everyman Jackal]

50. If and when impeachment comes is not the important thing right now.

Articles of Impeachment is what is important. The House controls Articles of Impeachment. The Democrats will pick who they will interrogate. The Democrats will control what documents are seen. The Democrats will decide how long they will investigate under Articles of Impeachment. Without Articles of Impeachment Trump and the Republicans will say that Trump is innocent of any wrongdoing. If the Democrats say he is guilty of crimes the Republicans will ask why wasn't there any impeachment proceedings. Besides if the Democrats don't bring Articles of Impeachment how are the voters going to react. Without Articles of Impeachment Pelosi and other House Democrats will have other Democrats running against them and the Democrats will probably lose the House. Then Trump will own the government. 2021 will bring the United States closer to a fascist government than we ever thought possible.

[StarfishSaver]

51. Articles of impeachment come toward the end of the process

The investigation isn't conducted under Articles of Impeachment. Articles come as a result of the investigation. They are drafted and voted on by the committee after the impeachment inquiry/investigation and then voted on by the full House. The president is immediately impeached upon a majority vote approving the Articles.

Perhaps you're thinking of the vote by the House to authorize the opening of an impeachment inquiry?

[lark]

52. I think this is a flawed premise.

If impeachment hearings are held and the information on drumpfs' criminality and treason are more widely shared, why would some people not change their minds? They only know the drumpf/barr lies, not the truth. I think a lot of people will be positively informed of the real danger and threats Mueller uncovered and will be struck how Barr took the real investigations off the table for his party's gain and to the detriment of American law. Yes, the 30 some percent of criminal haters and greedy rich will still support him, but it will definitely hurt him on the margins. Have the hearing but don't refer it to the Senate, stop and issue a condemnation of the thief. Use all the information in 2020 ads and get rid of him that way with a newly enlightened populace.

[Gothmog]

53. I will hope that this stunt does not help trump win reelection

trump will use this to claim vindication

[Trumpocalypse]

54. I say the House should

continue to investigate the way the Senate Watergate committee did in 73. That is the best way to sway public opinion.

[blueinredohio]

55. What can we do besides call our senator and protest?

[Thomas Hurt]

56. We should be focusing on winning the election, impeachment hearings are only useful...

in how they affect the election. The end results are besides the point.

Finding, exposing and creating a narrative of Trump's corruption is the goal.

[Hotler]

57. Impeachment proceedings are more than removing the man from office.

I'm thinking impeachment investigations and hearings will expose to all of America and the world all of shit stains shittiness. The humiliation, shame , embarrassment he will suffer will be what brings him down. He will be ruined, no one will do any business with anymore and the bankers will call in the debt and the man will be broken.

[Gothmog]

58. The backlash from a failed attempt to impeach and remove trump could help re-elect trump

Link to tweet

[Blue_Tires]

60. I don't dare say it on a public forum

[LanternWaste]

67. The following day I'll most likely have lunch.

"What then?"

The following day I'll most likely have lunch. Possibly with a friend or two. Hopefully show good form and keep silent about lunch (both menu and persona dramatis).

That's what's then.








(vague response to an even vaguer premise)

[mtnsnake]

68. The Senate will NOT convict, but as long as that asshole is impeached...

At the very least, the simpletons in this country who still don't know the truth about the wrongdoings of Trump will finally be educated through the findings of the impeachment hearings, which will translate into a huge positive for Democrats in future elections.

Plus, Trump's enormous ego absolutely would not be able to tolerate the word "impeached" next to his name in the history books. Seeing "impeached president" next to his name would at least give me some satisfaction.

And, more importantly, there is a good chance that once Trump is under impeachment, he just might resign, rather than take even the slightest chance that he might be removed.

Bottom line, if Trump isn't impeached before 2020, then shame on the Party for not trying to do what is right.

[budkin]

75. If we go down, we go down fighting

We CANNOT let this stand.

[wasupaloopa]

77. Reading through the replies leads me to think the pro impeachment folks have faith

in people and ideas that trump’s presidency has destroyed. Things like rule of law, people will see the truth and act correctly, people who do not care will suddenly care, and that through impeachment we will set the world right again.

I don’t know what impeachment will bring about or what not impeaching will bring about and neither does anyone else. We do know that it is a crap shoot and will not remove trump.

My fear is that we could begin impeachment hearings and still have no factual witnesses. In that case we will look impotent in the world of trump. We will surely lose many voters and possibly the election. Trumpites are working toward that end and trump is expert in escaping responcibility for his actions.

[DFW]

79. What will I do? Who could possibly care what I'd do?

What I would do is say a big “DUH!!”

The hard core, including the Senate Republicans, will still vote for him even if he beheads immigrant toddlers at rallies on live TV. His supporters would yell “off with their heads!” and cheer every new decapitation. If you think that is an exaggeration, I say you are in for a disappointment if you ask people who attend them. That is no intentional hyperbole on my part.

The only possible favorable outcome to an impeachment not ending in conviction is the public shaming and lame defense Republicans will need to present publicly to justify their votes to acquit. That’s not the outcome we want, but Trump screaming “witch hunt!” on a nightly basis with only Hannity, Carlson and Lou Dobbs defending him (feebly) might be the worst to have happen a year before the election.

[scarytomcat]

80. Vote him out

Hearings will help even in if vote on impeachment is never taken

[Gothmog]

81. Impeachment will help trump win re-election

Link to tweet

[Gothmog]

82. Nancy Pelosi Doesn't Have The Votes To Impeach Trump

Link to tweet

Pelosi’s majority includes 31 members who represent districts Trump carried in 2016 and could face electoral danger. Impeachment might accomplish little more than energizing Trump 2020 voters.

Close Pelosi allies insist she couldn’t gain majority support for impeachment even if she tried, not to mention the two-thirds of a Republican-run Senate needed for conviction and removal from office. “There will never be 218 in the House,” a leadership aide told me.....

The votes aren’t there. The 31 Democrats who represent districts that Donald Trump won in 2016 can see that impeachment is not popular with voters in general. If these nearly three dozen Democrats want to win second terms and keep the House in Democratic hands, they feel the need to stay far away from impeachment.

Blaming Pelosi is both easy, and it displays a fundamental ignorance of the dynamics of this Democratic House majority.

Robert Mueller’s testimony was an important step, but unless public opinion changes and a whole bunch of House Democrats change their minds, impeachment won’t happen in the House before the 2020 election.