General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsLet me tell you why this Ukrainian thing is a game changer
just in our ordinary lives. A new difference in our relationships with family members and co-workers and acquaintances who went MAGA and who spewed propaganda lies force fed to them by Fox and Limbaugh and Laura Ingraham and Evangelicals and Republicans.
No matter what argument they have, and no matter what fallacious opinions they spew to shut down any arguments we make to attempt to show them the truth they can no longer override us with lies.
All we have to say is that Trump is a traitor to our country. That he is willing to use our military, to put their lives on the line and endanger our country and its citizens just to be powerful at any cost.
We can put all our other immense list aside to use because their favorite thing about him is that he owns the liberals and he hurts illegals and that he says it like it is. They get a great deal of pleasure out of his sadistic behavior. Our outrage is their pleasure.
But the reality is if all we say is hes a traitor to our country, to our military and to them too, that will be all thats needed. No matter what they say they can not claim its OK for him to hump the flag, because thats no longer a metaphor for love of country. Its a metaphor for raping it.
CrispyQ
(36,221 posts)His trumper friends all piled on, high-fiving & rubbing it in to the "snowflakes." Finally someone posted, "Not for long," along with a pic of an avalanche. I'll have to revisit & see if it turned into a food fight.
Wounded Bear
(58,436 posts)lunatica
(53,410 posts)They can go on and on all they want. He only needs to repeat that sentence. Or variations of it, such as he sold your loyalty to Ukraine for personal gain, or if theyre in the military or have family in the military tell them he sold our military out when he chose to be a traitor.
I do like your friends response though!
leftieNanner
(14,997 posts)"It's a metaphor for raping it."
Trump in a nutshell.
yonder
(9,631 posts)TwilightZone
(25,342 posts)Some of these people believe the guy was sent here literally by God himself to save the country. They aren't going to believe that their savior is a traitor. Besides, they justify everything he says and does because of the end result. He's packing the courts, he's making the "right" people miserable, etc.
You're expecting rational debate to get through to completely irrational people. If rational was going to get through to these people, it would have done so long, long ago. This is unlikely to change anything for most of them, particularly the ones who are only getting parts of the story spoon-fed to them by right-wing media.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Just say Hes a traitor and nothing else. No matter what crazed thing they say just respond with that. Period. Its the fundamental truth. Its a fact.
There will be a hell of a lot more that comes to light that will simply add to that fact.
TwilightZone
(25,342 posts)His entire presidency has been under the shadow of Putin. Anyone who has paid attention knows that the guy's loyalties aren't to the United States, starting with the fact that everyone around him has links to Russia.
My point is that calling him a traitor isn't likely going to change the minds of the ~85% of Republicans who are diehards. That fact has basically been public knowledge as long as we've known about all of the Russian connections, and they don't care. They think it's all one big conspiracy, and this is unlikely to change that.
They're more likely to dig in and double down on the denial and the deep state.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)We will transfer the frustration to them.
Its always been their game, and trying to reason with them has been extremely painful for us because all theyve done is jeer and mock us.
We can turn the tables on them.
Psychological victories are as important as any other kind of victory.