War Children

[H2O Man]

“The Iraqi regime . . . possesses and produces chemical and biological weapons. It is seeking nuclear weapons. We know that the regime has produced thousands of tons of chemical agents, including mustard gas, sarin nerve gas, VX nerve gas.” – George W. Bush; 10-7-2002


I think that every rational American knows that the Bush-Cheney military invasion of Iraq was horribly wrong. Although the “official” start of the war was in March of 2003, evidence documents that members of the Bush administration were making plans to invade Iraq even before events on 9/11, and became solidified after that date.

The purposeful lies were coordinated efforts at “perception management,” as the administration hired “experts” in that field to help them sell the war to the American public. This included purposeful lies, most famously about “yellow cake.” We were told by Condi Rice (on CNN) and others that “we don't want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud.” The connections between “journalists” and intelligence were exposed by the New York Times' Judith Miller.

Those of us who were on the Democratic Underground remember that everyone here knew the administration was full of shit, that the WMD “threat” was bullshit, and that the invasion and military occupation of Iraq was a disaster. We understood, to quote Edgar Allan Poe, the “sequence of cause and effect, between the disaster and the atrocity.”

The closest that anyone associated with the Bush-Cheney administration came to telling the truth was when unconvicted war criminal Henry Kissinger – the advising George W. Bush, said, “They [American forces] are there as an expression of the American national interest to prevent the Iranian combination of imperialism and fundamentalist ideology from dominating a region on which the energy supplies of the industrial democracies depend.”

A bumper-sticker at the time summed it up with the question, “How did all of our oil end up under their sand?” This stood in stark contrast to the infamous “Mission Accomplished” banner on the USS Abraham Lincoln that hung behind Bush on his May 1, 2003 “victory” speech.

Between that asinine speech and 2019, American military members and “contractors” continued to kill and be killed in Iraq. Nothing says “victory” like sixteen years of violence. Yet, perhaps because the US role in Iraq is covered far less frequently in the media, far too few people discuss what the heck we are doing there today. What, pray tell, is the game plan? Because it sure as hell hasn't brought peace and stability to Iraq or the larger Middle East.

On Sunday, I began to watch media reports on the Trump administration's bombing of five sites in Iraq and Syria. Without exception, every report stated that the bombs were dropped upon “Iranian-backed” forces. Day after day, every media report continued to apply that “Iranian-backed” label. I note that this is distinct from the description of the 9/11 attackers, who were Saudi-backed.

I do understand why our military would want to strike those targets, in the context of their being deployed in the land of this on-going military disaster. I also appreciate that Trump and his merry crew will seek to exploit anything and every thing that might distract from impeachment. And that has to be viewed in the context of thousands of Iraqi citizens demonstrating and eventually attacking the US embassy. Film shows that this included a military group – perhaps not those the administration currently favors, but one that the Iraqi security forces were comfortable with. Indeed, the Iraqi government's leadership was and is strongly opposed to the strikes on targets in their country.

In a conversation yesterday with a good friend here on DU, I said that these events had brought me back to a speech that Malcolm X gave in Rochester, NY, of February 16, 1965 (five days before his assassination). I remember it in the context of something the late Dick Gregory said in the 1980s, that America would not understand the Islamic world, because it had failed to understand Malcolm X. Below are some interesting quotes from Malcolm's speech:

“The press is used to make the victim look like the criminal and make the criminal look like the victim… . This is imagery. And just as this imagery is practiced at the local level, you can understand it better by an international example. The best recent example at the international level to bear witness to what I’m saying is what happened in the Congo. Look at what happened. We had a situation where a plane was dropping bombs on African villages. An African village has no defense against the bombs. And an African village is not sufficient threat that it has to be bombed! But planes were dropping bombs on African villages. When these bombs strike, they don’t distinguish between enemy and friend. They don’t distinguish between male and female. When these bombs are dropped on African villages in the Congo, they are dropped on Black women, Black children, Black babies. These human beings were blown to bits. I heard no outcry, no voice of compassion for these thousands of Black people who were slaughtered by planes

“Why was there no outcry? Why was there no concern? Because, again, the press very skillfully made the victims look like they were the criminals, and the criminals look like they were the victims.

“They refer to the villages as “rebel held,” you know. As if to say, because they are rebel-held villages, you can destroy the population, and it’s okay. They also refer to the merchants of death as “American-trained, anti-Castro Cuban pilots.” This made it okay. Because these pilots, these mercenaries—you know what a mercenary is, he’s not a patriot. A mercenary is not someone who goes to war out of patriotism for his country. A mercenary is a hired killer. A person who kills, who draws blood for money, anybody’s blood. You kill a human being as easily as you kill a cat or a dog or a chicken.

"So these mercenaries, dropping bombs on African villages, caring nothing as to whether or not there are innocent, defenseless women and children and babies being destroyed by their bombs. But because they’re called “mercenaries,” given a glorified name, it doesn’t excite you. Because they are r
eferred to as “American-trained” pilots, because they are American-trained, that makes them okay. “Anti-Castro Cubans,” that makes them okay. Castro’s a monster, so anybody who’s against Castro is all right with us, and anything they can do from there, that’s all right with us…. They put your mind right in a bag and take it wherever they want, as well”

I apologize for this being even longer than my usual tirades. I'm hoping that the Democratic Party will fully address this issue and those related this year as our candidates campaign for offices – including for the White House, the Senate, and the House of Representatives.

H2O Man

[onecaliberal]

1. K&R

Thank you. We can all use the history lessons.

[H2O Man]

2. Thanks!

[secondwind]

3. Thank you for posting this.

[H2O Man]

6. Thank you!

I'm glad that you liked it.

[malaise]

4. K & R for truth

“Why was there no outcry? Why was there no concern? Because, again, the press very skillfully made the victims look like they were the criminals, and the criminals look like they were the victims.

THIS

[H2O Man]

8. Thank you!

Malcolm X told the Truth. And he had a wonderful talent for telling it.

[onecaliberal]

44. Which is precisely why Americans didn't "understand" Malcom X when he refused to be silent

about it all.

[Kid Berwyn]

5. "Money trumps peace." -- George W Bush, Feb. 14, 2007

Thank you for the great essay, H2O Man! The Mighty Wurlitzer cranks out the enemies on cue. History to you, unknown news to most everyone else.

[H2O Man]

12. Thanks!

A person might speculate that the US role continues to create havoc in Iraq. We clearly are not welcomed guests.

Too many people seem to have forgotten how Cheney supported Ahmed Chalabi -- a man that the CIA was wary of. As it turned out, Chalabi worked with Iranian intelligence. Shocking, huh?

I found Trump's threats against Iran yesterday were troubling. We all should.

[Haggis for Breakfast]

65. That anyone of intelligence in American government listened to Ahmed Chalabi,

a man who had been in exile for decades, as THE voice of expertise and reason on Middle Eastern affairs, doomed the US to failure from the beginning. He had his own agenda. That Cheney used him to craft US policy was madness. But then, Cheney had his own agenda.

Excellent post, H20 man. Excellent.

[H2O Man]

66. Thanks!

I find today's events there troubling. Talking with sane people here helps.

[lunatica]

7. DU never ceases to astound me when it comes to being current and savvy

about the truth behind our governments actions. Perhaps we are truly unique in that way. It’s not just that we have some outstanding writers who are incredibly intelligent and who excel in their political analyses, like you, and many others here. It’s that we also have the right audience and readers to understand the analyses who are also educated and savvy about world politics.

Again and again through the years I’ve experienced so called “breaking news” which has been covered here weeks and months before. Covered in the unique way we do it here on DU which is truly a gathering place for ideas and true debate. My definition of true debate is when both sides of the rhetorical argument come away changed for the better. This is something missing in the America of today and in our government. There is only conflict, fighting and lines drawn in the sand because of the extreme emotional takeover of the normal discourse BY EXTREMISTS ON THE RIGHT. I will not even pretend both sides are doing this, because, in truth it is one side only in pursuit of whatever it is they want to replace Democracy with.

It really does make a difference which crowd you hang out with. And it really is possible to be better when you gather together with likeminded people. To be vindicated in our deepest beliefs and expanded in our righteousness.

Thank you H2O for being such an outstanding teacher and human being!

[Pepsidog]

13. So true. Incredible thoughts and analysis presented every day by DU writers

[H2O Man]

15. Thanks, lunatica!

I haven't seen as much discussion on the US role in Iraq in recent years as I think is needed. So, although I was not sure if this essay would sink or get responses, I figured that I'd post it. What is happening now certainly poses a threat of expanding war. With Trump pretending to be Commander in Chief, that is extremely dangerous.

I like to think of myself as a member of the DU Team. Maybe a bit outside the box in my thinking at times, but still able to contribute a few interesting ideas.

[lunatica]

18. Well I hope you feel vindicated in your ideas

by the reception they get on DU. I also hope you don’t feel it’s just en echo chamber and that you get as much out of it as you put into it.

I think that overall DU is pretty unique, at least for me. I like political analysis but now that the people in my family who I could discourse with have passed on my only recourse has been DU. As an employee in UC Berkeley I was able to converse with Professors and students about all kinds of interesting subjects, though I also had DU since just after 9/11, but now I only have DU. It is an extremely important part of my life as it nourishes that part of my psyche.

[H2O Man]

64. With tonight's news,

it is truly upsetting to know that I am correct regarding the situation in the Middle East, especially Iran.

[stopdiggin]

9. you're saying then, that the targets were NOT Iranian backed?

Or that it makes no difference if they were or weren't?
Or is this a "bigger picture" cautionary tale on the dangers of confluence in state and media messaging?

[H2O Man]

17. Interesting questions! Here is what

I am saying, in addition to what I said in the OP. I recognize that different people will interpret what I say within the context of their own thinking and beliefs. That's a good thing. The only potential risk would come with "you're saying then," rather than recognizing that what I am actually saying is exactly what I say -- nothing more, nothing less.

The nation we call "Iraq" was formed shortly after WW1 by the British. It was not recognized as a "country" by those who had inhabited the general region. There were 11 different ethnic groups contained within the territory identified by England as a "new" country. A rational person might ask if Iraq was created for the benefit of its population, or maybe -- just maybe -- for England's advantage in obtaining its one natural resource sought by the industrial world. England's role in administering the new country may provide a hint.

During the Reagan-Bush era, the Iraqi leader Saddam went from being a good buddy we provided all types of weapons to, especially during its war with Iran (who we also sold weapons to), to an enemy. Bush the Elder invaded Iraq; sanctions resulted in the deaths of countless children; and eventually George W sent our military in. For the miltary does what the president orders, even when that president purposely lies in connecting Iraq to 9/11.

As I noted in response #12, Dick Cheney based the majority of his planning upon the information he got from Ahmed Chalabi. By 2004, it was documented that Chalabi was working with Iranian intelligence. This was hardly a surprise to anyone on this forum. Due to religious affiliation, it was obvious that Iran would benefit from the US invasion of Iraq. Indeed, it could not be otherwise.

Shortly after Bush declared victory in Iraq, a friend of my sons was killed in Iraq. The improvised explosive devise used resulted in one of this kid's hands being the largest body-part that was returned to the US for his widow to bury. I think of him whenever I think of Iraq.

I'm not a fan or Iran. Yet it is obvious to me that President Obama -- along with John Kerry -- demonstrated the correct way for our government to deal with Iran. I'll add that I fail to see how the Saudi "royalty" -- as if any human being is "royal" -- is in any way superior to the leaders of Iran. Thus, I advocate for the US re-assessing its entire Middle East policy.

And I will confirm that your third question is accurate -- any reporting of events coming from the Trump administration should be questioned, perhaps doubted.

[stopdiggin]

19. thanks. you write with some knowledge and conviction

and I appreciate you're grasp of historical context. You didn't exactly answer my basic question(s) .. but then, you're under no obligation to. I think I'm going with the "it doesn't matter whether they were or weren't" option as a guess.

[H2O Man]

49. I recognize that

I am not qualified in any way to speak about military matters in the context of your first two questions. Thus, it would be foolish of me to claim I have an opinion on that, since an opinion requires knowledge and insight. A bias, on the other and, requires only an emotion, which is exactly why our court system only allows expert witnesses to provide opinions. I know that there are a number of qualified forum members here who could provide opinions on those questions.

All I know is what military intelligence reports to the public. That is based upon the evidence they have gathered -- which may or may not be accurate, as the "yellow cake" and Chalabi episodes showed -- andthe quality of interpretation of that evidence. Hence, my ill-informed bias would be that Iran has provided assistance to many of those fighting against the US since Bush invaded Iraq.

Now, as I've mentioned elsewhere on this thread, a kid who was friends with my sons (who I knew casually from high school sports) joined the military after 9/11. He was sincere about protecting our country from those who attacked us. But he was sent to Iraq, a nation that didn't attack the US. He was sent there based upon purposeful lies.

The IED that killed him is the type of device that we've been told -- and I have no problem believing -- was either made in Iran, or made based upon the model that Iranians taught to the Iraqis fighting to expel from their country. He left a wife and baby. The biggest part of this kid's body returned to his widow to bury was a hand. I was horrified. Who was responsible? Iran? The Iraqi who planted the IED? Or the administration that sent him to Iraq?

Again, the role of Iran in Iraq isn't something I have an opinion on. Maybe a bias. I have been involved in numerous court cases over the decades, on a Super Fund Site, Native American burial protection and repatriation, and primarily on family systems/ violence cases. And I often talk about all types of "systems" here on DU, not because I mistake myself as an authority, but rather, because systems fascinate me.

There are patterns of family systems, for example, that translate to systems including schools, work places, communities, states, and nations. Some of those patterns shed light on domestic issues. Our current "family system" is the most barren in human history (single parent families), and can be easily tied to the economic reality of the day, right down to the work place. That is distinct from the family systems of other parts of the globe, including the Middle East. An understanding of this leads to my opinions of our role there, though not to the questions you asked. Thus, I wasn't seeking to avoid answering those two questions you asked -- I recognize they are valid -- but because I recognize they are not something I know much of anything about.

[PatrickforO]

10. Too many children dying.

All over the world, and even here. See my post of today:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212830156

[H2O Man]

25. Thank you!

And thanks for the link! I voted & responded.

[Martin Eden]

11. "everyone here knew the administration was full of shit"

If we knew, shouldn't our elected representatives in Congress have known as well? Isn't it their duty to be well informed in matters of government, and especially in matters of war and peace?

I was devastated in October 2002 when 81 Democrats in the House (39%) and 29 in the Senate (58%) voted to give GW Bush authority to invade Iraq. Here at DU we knew that once given the authority, Bush would invade. The administration of GW Bush & Dick Cheney would not act in good faith, having built their case on a foundation of lies and half truths.Their PNAC policy makers had been pushing for an aggressive war of regime change in Iraq since before 9/11.

I was especially devastated when John Kerry, who garnered national attention as a leader of Vietnam Vets against the war, voted for the IWR. We desperately needed strong Democratic leaders to stand up and speak truth to power against this disastrous war before it was launched, but far too many let us down. Were they really uninformed, or did they stick their fingers into the post-9/11 political winds and calculate an advantage to being "strong" on national security with midterm elections coming up? Were they fooled into thinking Bush would act in good faith? Were they on board with the neocon agenda?

John Kerry would have gained advantage as our Democratic nominee for president in 2004 if he had showed strong leadership and voted against the IWR instead of trying to explain how he was for a bill to fund the war before he was against it. I think he would have won the presidency, and much could have been different. Hillary's vote for the IWR was a disadvantage in 2016, whereas Obama's opposition helped in 2008.

What does all this mean for 2020?

Much depends on whether our Democratic leaders learned the necessary lessons. It will be easier to oppose Trump's warmongering proclivities than "popular wartime president" GW Bush, but they may still be wary of looking "weak" against Iran.

Trump is angry, and perhaps desperate. I don't doubt for one second he would try to find advantage in taking us to war. I wish I had no doubts about Democratic leadership standing up against the folly of war with Iran, but the track record gives me pause.

[H2O Man]

26. Great points.

I think the Democrats should have known. Some clearly did. But those who were unsure had a duty to find out, before sending the military into a conflict.

I remember during the Plame Threads, having a fellow who was close to one Senator contact me about a couple of things I had posted on DU. Eventually, we spoke on the telephone. He wanted the contact information for whoever was my source, which was not possible. Had he supplied me with direct contact information for the Senator, I would have given it to the appropriate person, who could decide if they wanted to come forward.

The information he wanted to learn about was specific to VP Cheney. I thought that if a woodchuck like me could find it, that the Senate could. More, I knew this person was a sometimes journalist. That is a competitive sport.

[Martin Eden]

31. Diplomat Joe Wilson was a whistle blower who publicly to disputed the Yellow Cake lie

Bush/Cheney struck back by outing his wife Valerie Plame, an under cover CIA agent -- compromising national security and ruining her career.

Trump is even more vindictive. How much damage has he already done, and how much more will he do if not held to account?

[ChubbyStar]

39. An unchained malignant narcissist

Is a very crazy beast. The shit they will do is beyond comprehension. He will either break himself, or he will break the rest of us.

[Martin Eden]

40. We must break him

And break our country free of what he represents.

[ChubbyStar]

42. Thank you, tells me you're a fighter

Let's hope others feel as strongly!

[McKim]

69. Yes, If I Could See Through The Lies, Why didn't they?

Yes if I could see through the lies about the Iraq War, why couldn’t our democrats in congress?
Some did stand up, but they were few.

[BeckyDem]

14. Purposeful lies. Indeed.

K&R

We the people can salvage our humanity or not. What we do, how we galvanize, what we demand from our government and what we will sacrifice in order for it to function as a democracy is upon us as never before. I say this in the context of your OP and climate change, the clock really is ticking, no drama intended.

[H2O Man]

27. Outstanding!

Thank you so much, BeckyDem! I agree 100%, and love the manner in which you communicated this Truth.

My normal brother (relatively speaking, as I often note) works at a large university. He frequently has lunch with the climate scientists. They have told him that we don't have time, that we have to understand that it's already far too late to repair much of the coming damaging. That the opulently wealthy are well aware of this -- that most of them are quietly investing in compounds for their families and friends. And that even most republicans already know this, though publicly they pretend there is valid disagreement on climate change.

[BeckyDem]

50. Compounds for their families, I believe it. They think they'll insulate themselves for good.

We have so much to take on, omg.

[warmfeet]

16. K and R.

[H2O Man]

28. Thank you!

[Evolve Dammit]

20. Great post. Malcom X was spot on. Thanks for sharing. We're about to hear more "aluminum tubes and

mushroom clouds" 2020 equivalent mumbo jumbo to justify attacking Iran, which has been a wet dream of the GOP for decades. It's largely fabricated lies, distortion and bullshit. Hell, let's have Kissinger, Cheney, Rice and Powell have a curtain call. Whaddya say America? They're all wrapped in the flag and carrying a bible; Drumpf and Pence are just emulating.

[H2O Man]

30. Malcolm was a Prophet.

In my opinion, the greatest prophet in our nation's history. I was lucky that my friend Rubin was friends with Malcolm (and with Coretta and Martin Luther King, Jr.). We used to talk about Malcolm's message, its beauty and power.

In response to your name, Evolve Dammit, I'll add one of the Hurricane's quotes from a 1979 letter: "A person's consciousness cannot evolve unconsciously." It was part of a very long letter that Rubin wrote in what was called his "Buddha phase," where he spent his days in self-imposed solitary confinement, speaking only to his lawyer, myself, and another friend.

[Evolve Dammit]

67. Thanks very much for sharing that. You are fortunate to have been part of history and have

friends dedicated to social consciousness and action to that end.

[PWPippinesq]

21. Thank you for this excellent posting and reminder of our fairly recent history.

How soon we forget. Thankfully, we still have a few true journalists, one of whom might run with this. This would seem to be in Rachel Maddow's wheelhouse.

[H2O Man]

33. Thanks, PWPippinesq!

I think that there are some outstanding journalists these days. Definitely superior than from Reagan through Bush-Cheney.

Years ago, a researcher/ part-time reporter from MSNBC used to read DU's Plame threads daily. But he has left, and I no longer have any contact with him. In the past, I had communications with a couple reporters from the NY Times, but nothing for a decade. It wasn't due to my thinking President Obama was perfect, but he was certainly the best president since Reagan. I believe he did attempt to disengage in Afghanistan, for example, but was informed that he didn't have the ability to do so.

[TrishaJ]

22. Great summary, H2O.

Thank you so much!

[H2O Man]

34. Thank you, Trisha !

Much appreciated.

[bucolic_frolic]

23. Very astute essay because most of those issues have been written out of American political discourse

MSM seems to think they've been decided already.

If memory serves me correctly, which is not guaranteed, I recall GWB shortly after taking office using the term "new war" as if trying to make it exciting. You just knew where we were headed. And he was Trump lite. 'I'm a leader. And a leader ... leads!'

[H2O Man]

35. Right.

I remember W saying, "I am a 'war president'," as if he was a rough, tough guy. I fear Trump may be heading for that territory. Neither one should ever have been president.

[democrank]

24. For this, I thank you from the bottom of my heart.

I am one who can not stomach the excuses made for the Iraq War support or any current statements that we just need to move along and stop talking about it. I just can’t keep my lips zipped when I hear these things.

Some memories are seared into my brain. That tiny child running alone after having been hit by napalm. That little boy (Ali?, Ari?) lying suffering and terrified with his arms blown off by the Bush/Cheney invasion. The young man with no hands left, the older soldier with half his head gone.

I’ll never forget what I saw and heard during years at different VA hospitals while we were dealing with fucking Agent Orange lung, liver, lymph nodes and brain Cancer. We couldn’t just forget it and move on.

Now it’s Trump’s turn. He has already blown up most everything in our country....without batting an eye, so I can’t imagine he’ll shed too many tears over dead children elsewhere. He invites war criminals to campaign with him, speaking of criminals becoming victims. Somewhere around 35-40 % cheer that heinous move.

Rah-Rah flag waving is easy. Watching your child lose half his head because of a bomb on “rebels” isn’t.

[H2O Man]

36. The Vietnam War

influenced the manner in which I evaluate what the government says to justify armed conflict. I remember one evening, my father talking about his supervisor's son being home on leave. My brother said that even if drafted, he would refuse to go to Vietnam. Dad became furious, and as a first generation American, spoke about relatives serving proudly in WW1, WW2, and Korea.

He must have brought it up to his supervisor the next day at work, because that evening, his supervisor and his son came to our house. The son told my father the terrible truth about the war. After that, my Dad was opposed to the war.

My wife and two sons lived in the first house I bought. It was located near a small hamlet of about 500. Seven young men had been killed in the war. One was my wife's cousin, who was raised in the house I owned. The day his brother found out, he killed himself. The father killed himself a year to the day later.

A number of friends served in Vietnam. They had a variety of experiences and beliefs about that war. I've respected all of them, and tried to learn from their opinions.

What I am not okay with are the presidents -- from Truman to Nixon -- that sent Americans to participate first in re-establishing French control, and then in a civil war.

[kentuck]

29. Recommend

"They put your mind right in a bag and take it wherever they want, as well”

The eternal struggle between truth and delusion.

[H2O Man]

37. Thank you!

Malcolm had a way with words. I enjoy watching his debates and speechs on youtube.

[spanone]

32. K&R...⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

[H2O Man]

38. Thank you!

[G_j]

41. K&R

right on the mark! And yes, I also remember, ..sadly.

[H2O Man]

43. Yep.

We had adventures here, didn't we? This OP/thread is like a blast from the past.

[G_j]

45. It almost seems like another lifetime

I have always appreciated the interaction with passionate, informed, intelligent people who genuinely care.
When one looks back on that time, it was very clear to anyone who cared to pay attention the WMD claims were nonsense.

[H2O Man]

57. It was

so different that it seems like a lifetime ago. I surely did enjoy the friends that participated in those days.

[c-rational]

46. Thank you for this post and your resposes in this thread H2O man, and I completely agree with

your points. Regarding the speech by Malcom X, it made me think of a book I just finished reading - "The Fire Next Time," by James Baldwin. His writings should be required reading for all Americans.
I alos appreciated your historical review about how iraq was created - most Americans (people) do not question why its borders are such straight lines.

I will leave you with a sentence I noted in one of my journals from several years back - Always question why we do the things we do (as an individaul and as a nation).

Peace.

[H2O Man]

47. "The Fire Next Time"

is one of my favorite books! I have my books by Baldwin located next to the section of books by and about Malcolm in my library. And thanks to to internet, I can watch films of Baldwin debating various others. What a great mind that man had!

Malcolm's friend Rubin used to tell me that people are obligated to question any and all claims of fact, or they not only risk being a follower of the next Jim Jones ....but they have betrayed themselves and indeed all of humanity at the exact moment they opt to behave as sheep.

[H2O Man]

48. PS ......

I was in junior high school when I did a book report on "The Fire Next Time." The teacher ended up reading my report to the class. Many decades later, when I moved to my current home, I attended a neighborhood social event. I didn't recognize the very elderly lady who approached me at first. Then she said, "I've never forgotten your report on James Baldwin's book."

[The Mouth]

51. And there are still members of the Democratic Party

who voted for the damn war.


Everyone who didn't fight AGAINST it should have been on trial at the Hague.

[H2O Man]

58. There are.

In fairness, I think some of those who fell for the lies and/or wilted under pressure were not in positions that allowed them access to the information they needed to make a proper judgement. I'm not trying to make excuses for them. It was the party's leadership that I think was responsible for doing a much closer examination of what the administration claimed to be true.

On the other hand, Bush's rush to war before the UN inspections were complete -- and they had found nothing at that point -- might have served as a bright, flashing red light to anyone paying attention.

[McKim]

52. Thank You!!

This is an excellent analysis and history lesson. Remember that PNAC includes nearly every country in the Middle East. The insane and brutal plan was/is to destabilize these countries and then take them over. Iraq proved to be a very tough slog and so they had to put Iran on the back burner. Citizen pushback in the form of a vigorous Peace Movement also forced the Neocons to slow down their plan. Iran is their last prize. We must push back against this!

[H2O Man]

59. Right.

I appreciate it.

It would seem that the Democratic Party should take a more active role against the Saudi war in Yemen, too. Of course, one sees relatively little, if anything, about this situation in the mainstream media.

[Hekate]

53. Kick for a must-read later

[H2O Man]

60. Thanks!

[malthaussen]

54. "Distraction against impeachment," okay.

But I continue to be puzzled why Mr Trump and the GOP did not drum up support to move against Iran long ago. I was expecting it in 2017. If, indeed, as you say and I agree, it has been their "wet dream" for most of the century, they've been notably laggard in bringing it about. I have no explanation for this failure. We know quite well that excuses could be found or invented to create a casus belli. And the AUMF is still in force, providing the Administration with enough legal cover to make war on just about anybody under cover of "law." At this point, I am not sure the GOP have any consistent foreign policy at all, they're too focussed on raping the country domestically.

-- Mal

[H2O Man]

61. Poor John Bolton!

There is definitely more involved here than an attempted Trump distraction. Why are we still there? Who is pushing this agenda?

I appreciate that the military doesn't want to be a target in Iraq. That's a good thing. I don't want them to be attacked either, but as long as they are unwelcomed visitors, one can assume they will be.

Since being formed in 1968, the neoconservative movement has had a harsh attitude regarding the Middle East. It has never been a soley republican agenda, despite the glaring influence they had in the Bush-Cheney era. From Daniel Patrick Moynihan to Joe Lieberman, there have been non-republican neoconservatives. One assumes they see an opportunity.

There are industries that benefit from limiting Iran's role on the international stage, though they most likely prefer sanctions and intimidation to war.

Thus, the synergism created by neoconservatives and Trumpites -- each with their own agenda -- is what creates the greatest ganger. Just my opinion.

[burrowowl]

55. To quote Smedley Butler

war is a racket.

[H2O Man]

62. True.

Absolutely true.

[FormerOstrich]

56. H2O Man I can't thank you enough,

nor properly express my respect and appreciation for you.

I remember very well the days leading up to the Iraq invasion. I still consider the day our senate voted to allow Bush his war as the darkest day I have ever experienced.

I find it very disturbing we don't see to have as many resources to research as we did then. With a few exceptions, such as yourself, we don't have the researchers either. I was underemployed then so I did a significant amount of research. I don't have the time now. Even if I did have the time I don't think I could provide the same level simply because so many sources are gone. Social Media and Google have taken over. Disturbing is really an understatement it scares the hell out of me.

Thank you so much. I am honored to (virtually) know you for all these many years.

[H2O Man]

63. Thank you!

Reading your post here, I found myself recalling something Rubin told me about the administrations of Rahway and Trenton State Prisons in 1974. He said that they allowed drugs in, because they prefered a large group of merry fools to a single unhappy wise man. In our country, Trump prefers an angry mob arguing with another angry mob, to people thinking rationally.

There are good journalists now, and some outstanding researchers employed by the media. As a group, I think that MSNBC's researchers for Rachel M are extraordinary. Her show isn't always the best -- it can take ten minutes to say what could be said in one minute on nights where there isn't breaking news. But that team has put together some of the best programs I've seen.

In terms of DU, I'd like to see more of the discussions that used to carry on longer, and which provided more in-depth information. We certainly have the exact people here to do that.

[JonLP24]

68. I remember all this very well

It has defined my life. Bush lying his way into Iraq is what turned me into a political person. I remember being called "coward" and "anti-american" on college basketball message boards the year Carmelo Anthony won a national championship because I opposed the Iraq war.

Unlike a lot of war hawks I ended up serving in Iraq. The reason is I was under pressure to find a job because I had a SO later wife and a recruiter came up to while I was holding resumes on my way to apply for work (I was also working day labor at the time) when he came up to me and asked me "what job trains for over 100 different career fields". I can't remember the exact quote but it was exactly what I needed to hear. I ended up taking an MOS I thought I could use in the civilian field.

I won't go into too many more details but I can't pass off an opportunity the horrible treatment of TCNs (Third Country Nationals).

Blood, Sweat & Tears: Asia's Poor Build U.S. Bases in Iraq

https://corpwatch.org/article/blood-sweat-tears-asias-poor-build-us-bases-iraq

A U.S. Fortress Rises in Baghdad: Asian Workers Trafficked to Build World's Largest Embassy

"All the workers had their passports taken away by First Kuwaiti," Mayberry claims, and while he knew the plane was bound for Baghdad, he's not so sure the others were aware of their destination. The Asian laborers began asking questions about why they were flying north and the jet wasn't flying east over the ocean, he says. "I think they thought they were going to work in Dubai."



One former First Kuwaiti supervisor acknowledges that the company holds passports of many workers in Iraq - a violation of US contracting.



"All of the passports are kept in the offices," said one company insider who requested anonymity in fear of financial and personal retribution. As for distributing Dubai boarding passes for Baghdad flights, "It's because of the travel bans," he explained.



Mayberry believes that migrant workers from the Philippines, India and Nepal are especially vulnerable to employers like First Kuwaiti because their countries have little or no diplomatic presence in Iraq.

https://corpwatch.org/article/us-fortress-rises-baghdad-asian-workers-trafficked-build-worlds-largest-embassy

Anyways long story short I deployed came back and had a rocky 10 years and now I am mostly fine living with a disability from that war.

[McKim]

70. I am Grateful for All These Posts!

This post and the subsequent comments are the best things I have seen here since 9/11. Let’s keep this up! This is deep and very very important!