Anti Muslim video sparks protests in Egypt-American Killed at Consulate/video linked to Terry Jones:

[trailmonkee]

Last edited Tue Sep 11, 2012, 08:13 PM - Edit history (2)

an anti-muslim video has touched off attacks on US embassy's in Egypt and Libya... here are the related stories - there were thousands of protesters reported in Cairo, I don't have a good feeling about this one:

American Killed In Libya Prophet Protest: http://news.sky.com/story/983922/american-killed-in-libya-prophet-protest

Egyptian protesters scale US Embassy wall in Cairo: http://www.wrex.com/story/19514168/egyptian-protesters-scale-us-embassy-wall-in-cairo

Libyans Set Fire to U.S. Consulate, Protesters Breach U.S. Embassy in Egypt in Anger Over Film: http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2012/09/11/anti_islamic_movie_protesters_set_fire_to_consulate_in_libya_breach_u_s_embassy_in_cairo.html

--------------------------------- update:

Cairo U.S. Embassy Protested Over Anti-Islam Film Linked to Terry Jones http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/11/cairo-u-s-embassy-protested-over-anti-islam-film-linked-to-terry-jones.html

[Nye Bevan]

1. Remember when the Christians went on a murderous rampage over "Piss Christ"?

Me neither.

[LadyHawkAZ]

23. Remember when American Atheists went on a murderous rampage

against the Secular Humanists? Me neither.

[Nye Bevan]

24. I respect atheists.

I'm confident that if I made a movie that ridiculed Richard Dawkins, the atheists would not issue a fatwa on me.

[boppers]

36. No, they'd probably try to get a nice hilarious debate set up.

Atheists love a spirited argument, it keeps the mind going....

At most, the grand-high-wizard of their not-church might issue an edict to be polite to you, and make sure you got to the debate well rested, and on time.

Or else.

[Mr Dixon]

53. Agreed

[Voice for Peace]

27. Christians have gone on plenty of murderous rampages.

[Nye Bevan]

29. They've been comparatively civilized of late (nt)

[boppers]

37. Yeah, it's been a whole couple of weeks since the last christian group killed others for their god.

Uhm, yeah.....

Hint: The US media often omits the religious motives of Christian terrorists and wars, much like Saudi media does for Islam.

See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism

[ProgressiveProfessor]

35. Have a recent event you cite?

[boppers]

38. See #37. eom

[Voice for Peace]

50. what pops to mind immediately is Dr. Tiller

and the "pro-life" Christians with guns.

[graham4anything]

52. YUP!!!

+1

[ProgressiveProfessor]

60. Not analogous

The attack was done by a large group of muslims apparently offended that some one published something they consider offensive attacking others whom had no link to the offending item.

Tiller was a lone gunman who killed a doctor who was doing things he considered murder. Tiller acted alone and his target was well documented.

While one can loosely argue they are both based on religion, they are dramatically different in nature.


Note this ignores the recent evidence that the at least one of the demonstrations was preplanned for the anniversary of 9/11.

[Voice for Peace]

61. Dr. Tiller

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Tiller


Pro-life group Operation Rescue kept a daily vigil outside Tiller's clinic for many years: first the national group, then later a branch that moved from California to Kansas specifically to focus on Tiller. On August 19, 1993, outside of the Wichita clinic, Tiller was shot in both arms by Shelley Shannon, who received an 11-year prison sentence for the crime of attempted murder.[5][6][7] On May 31, 2009, Tiller was shot through the eye and killed, by anti-abortion activist Scott Roeder, as Tiller served as an usher during the Sunday morning service at his church in Wichita.[8][9][10] Roeder was convicted of murder on January 29, 2010.


I know it's not precisely analogous. Scott Roeder wasn't exactly a lone gunman, though.
How about the Iraq war? For many it was a Christian war. Interesting to see this again yesterday on DU:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021329690

[Dkc05]

2. becaise of Israel

We make enemies in the Middle East. We need to be neutral going forward

[DavidDvorkin]

6. This has nothing to do with Israel.

[Dkc05]

8. who produced the film?

[cherokeeprogressive]

11. Did Israel?

[Dkc05]

12. film maker or producer

Read it on a google site

[cherokeeprogressive]

13. But you don't have a link... am I right?

The protests were sparked by outrage over a video being promoted by an extreme anti-Muslim Egyptian Christian campaigner in the US, which the demonstrators say insults the Prophet Mohammed.

I didn't read this on a "google site" and the emphasis is mine.

[Dkc05]

15. i will try and find it again

Saw it at office computer. Now on tablet. It might be in the morning. I will find it.

[muriel_volestrangler]

17. American Terry Jones, ex-pat Egyptian Copts, and Dutch

The Dutch film sparked today’s storming of the U.S. Embassy in Cairo. The film is being produced by U.S.-based Coptic Christian Egyptians with the support of fundamentalist Christian preacher Terry Jones, who in March 2011 burned a Quran at his tiny Florida church.

http://tucsoncitizen.com/usa-today-news/2012/09/11/mob-attacks-u-s-consulate-in-libya/

[Dkc05]

18. thanks for the link and clarification

[Comrade Grumpy]

47. The film was bankrolled by an Israeli-American

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/in-depth/middle-east-in-turmoil/film-that-sparked-cairo-bengazi-protests-the-work-of-an-american-israeli/story-fn7ycml4-1226472497757

[cthulu2016]

3. Does the OP suggest that the problem here is the cultural insensitivity of the film-makers?

I would say that a bigger problem might be the thousands of people who attack a building whenever they see something they don't like on Youtube.

[banned from Kos]

9. Amen - and I am an atheist/rationalist

The problem is the Teabagger Muslims.

[sabrina 1]

10. Well, I don't remember any American being killed in Libya until NATO decided to side with

Al Queda there to get rid of Qadaffi.

[renie408]

39. No shit.

Do you not think that Terry Jones shares any culpability at all? Knowing how many Muslims, rightly or wrongly, would react, do you think it was OK to post that video?

If I walk into a predominantly black neighborhood waving a confederate flag and start shouting about how much I hate niggers and yard apes, if I get the amoral shit beat out of me, don't you think I might have had it coming? Yeah, the people who beat me up might be wrong to use fists instead of words, but I think you could make the case that they were provoked.

Without excusing the actions of the people who actually did the killing and the rioting, I still find Jones' behavior reprehensible. I think he should be tried for inciting a riot.

[Whovian]

4. religion sucks.

It gives many a license to kill.

[Union Scribe]

46. You have found your home on the web.

lol

[Purveyor]

5. I'm trying to figure out who is benefiting from the release of this 'movie'. eom

[trailmonkee]

14. I am guessing evangelicals use it to educate themselves...

[trailmonkee]

16. Terry Jones... I just updated....

[derby378]

7. Waah, waah, waah

Last I heard, even the most fanatical Muslims never acknowledge Muhammad as being divine - so why do these jokers in Egypt treat him as though he were?

[muriel_volestrangler]

19. It may compare Mohammed to a goat, and a child molester

What exactly does the film say? It's still not clear, but it appears to compare Mohammed to a goat and Muslims, according to one translation, to "child-lovers." The New York Times' Liam Stack, offering some offhand translations of the scene shown above, called it a "doozy." The man in the scene says of his goat, "This is the first Muslim animal." He asks the goat if it likes girls; when it doesn't answer, he bursts into laughter and says, "He doesn't like girls," according to Stack. Other scenes in the above clip seem to portray Muslim Egyptian characters, who for some reason all have strong New York accents, as immoral and violent, particularly toward the Christians whom they pursue with near-genocidal fervor. A number of Islam's founding figures, including the prophet, are accused of homosexuality and child molestation.

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/09/the-movie-so-offensive-that-egyptians-just-stormed-the-us-embassy-over-it/262225/

You don't have to think something is divine to want respect for it. This does seem to have been designed to offend Muslims.

[CJCRANE]

20. Koran-burning pastor Terry Jones was involved.

He's a neocon psyop stooge if ever I saw one.

[cthulu2016]

21. Have you murdered anyone recently?

Probably not.

Have you, as a Democrat, encountered things designed to offend you?

Sure. There are probably ten such things cited on the first page of GD.

Is it natural for you to want your political views respected?

Sure. Who wouldn't?

Yet you have not killed anyone.

See. It is possible.

[CJCRANE]

22. Have you invaded

a country on a false prospectus?

Probably not you personally...but it's pretty easy to get people in general riled up and angry, not just muslims.

[Voice for Peace]

30. If our legal culture allowed for revenge and honor killings, there would be plenty more murders.

Many Christians are ok with killing abortion doctors, or even women seeking abortion.
Or killing Muslims or blacks, or killing the prez.

Others are civilized no matter what, both in USA and even in the craziest parts of the middle east.

[Grave Grumbler]

43. Just how many Christians are "ok" with murder?

Many Christians are ok with killing abortion doctors, or even women seeking abortion.  Or killing Muslims or blacks, or killing the prez.

Could you be more specific, please?  Just what percentage of Christians (I presume you're speaking of those in the United States) are ok with the murder of:

1)  Abortion doctors

2)  Women seeking abortions

3)  Muslims (for being Muslim)

4)  Blacks (for being black)

5)  The President of the United States

Again, please express your answer as a percentage of Christians in the United States as a whole, since "many" could mean anything from 10 to millions.

[CJCRANE]

44. Conversely

how many muslims are involved in these protests?

The local authorities have condemned the protests.

It's obvious this was stoked up by neocon operatives. It works everytime.

[pampango]

49. Great point! "how many muslims are involved in these protests?"

Probably close to 0.1% of the population of these countries. Undoubtedly the most fundamentalist 0.1% of those populations roughly the same percentage as Americans who back our fundamentalists like Terry Jones.

It will be interesting to see the reaction of the other 99.9% both here and there.

[Voice for Peace]

51. I can't give statistics and specifics even if I knew them I wouldn't be able to remember

but post #37 has an informative link on the subject.

[Nye Bevan]

25. OK, but when someone offends my religion, I don't go out and throw bombs around.

I'm sure that Jesus would not want people to be murdered because of "The Life of Brian" being offensive. And I'm pretty sure that Allah would not want people to be murdered because someone ridiculed Muhammed.

[muriel_volestrangler]

48. I am trying to explain there's more to religious figures than "divine" and "don't care"

I'm not saying the rioting is a correct, or justifiable, reaction; but derby378's post was "why do these jokers in Egypt treat him as though he were" divine? The attacks wouldn't be justified if the lampooned figure was divine, either. But it's a part of the more extreme religious devotion to venerate humans that are placed high in the religion - Mary (especially in Catholicism), Muhammed, Buddha - and these are pretty clear and sizeable insults.

As to what Jesus would want - who knows? Millions have been murdered by Christians over the centuries for either not being Christians, or not being the right kind of Christian. Many people thought they knew Jesus was fine with that, even if I couldn't see that from what I know of the gospels. And the same goes for Muslims and what they thought Allah felt.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

26. I find the film "2016" disrespectful

I didn't burn a building over it.

[HooptieWagon]

28. There is an easy solution.

Send Terry Jones et al over to Libya to explain to the muslims how the film doesn't offend them.

[Voice for Peace]

31. excellent, I second your suggestion.

[derby378]

32. I like the way you think

We've already got a Terry Jones over in the UK that I find much more palatable and educated in the history and culture of the Middle East.

[Zalatix]

45. Way to support freedom of speech.

Deal with murderous thugs by feeding them... awesome move.

NOT!!!

I don't care who Terry Jones is, that's just... a totally useless and non-Liberal move.

[HooptieWagon]

56. I see no reason to defend a cowardly zealotrous bigot.

Jones and Co deliberately intended to insult and inflame muslims, while hiding behind mamas skirts. Fuck that. If they want to insult muslims, let them do it face to face, and face the consequences. Why should the peaceful tolerant majority of Americans pay the price for bigoted shit-stirrers?

Would you defend a racist KKK movie?

[Zalatix]

57. I see no reason to defend murderous crazy people.

And if you can show where Muslims spent hundreds of years in slavery then you might have a point.

[AndySipowicz]

33. re

US consulate was also attacked in Libya.........that "Arab Spring" is really working out.

[CJCRANE]

34. The movie was produced by Terry Jones

a guy who specializes in propaganda designed to provoke an anti-American reaction.

It has nothing to do with the Arab Spring.

[trailmonkee]

42. Arab Winter?

[AndySipowicz]

58. Thought

is was produced by an Israeli.

[CJCRANE]

59. Yes, you're correct. It was only promoted by Terry Jones. nt

[AnnieBW]

40. Now THis Fucker Has Blood on His Hands!

But then again, it was just another "faceless bureaucrat". The wingnuts won't care about him at all.

[rollin74]

41. they don't like a video

so they burn buildings and kill people

absolute insanity

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

54. Oh, good. Guess who's coming to visit ...

Our dear friend Terry Jones will try to stir more shit next month.

http://www.thenewsherald.com/articles/2012/08/21/news/doc5033ee10727b4671604412.txt

[trailmonkee]

55. just read about Libyan ambassador.... shite!

I had a bad feeling about this one