We say their prophet was a criminal. We mock their garb.

[cthulu2016]

We say their prophet was a criminal.
We mock their garb.
We speculate that they are trying to take over our government.
We belittle their dietary laws.
We express deep outrage over their private religious practices that really harm no one.
We give awards to plays that mock them.
We have popular TV shows highlighting the most aberrational of them, for entertainment.


So of course American values are antithetical to them.

Of course they seek to destroy everything we care about.


They are the conservative Mormons.


[font color=green]To avoid some inevitable misunderstandings, the items on the list refer to: First, Joseph Smith was criminal. No real controversy in saying that. Second, Magic Underwear. The third and fourth speak for themselves. The religious practice is the secret baptisms which, if not exposed, obviously hurt no one. And of Course Book of Mormon: The Musical, Big Love and Sister Wives.[/font color]

[valerief]

1. Harm no one? Guess you're not a Mormon wife. nt

[cthulu2016]

2. That reference was to the baptisms

which if nobody knew about them would, of course, harm no one

[NutmegYankee]

17. Not everyone would agree with that.

I know several people who believe it would condemn their ancestors to hell. Sure, those people are dead, but they strongly believe their souls are harmed by the baptisms into a false and evil faith.

I myself just believe that the stand-in is getting an ornate bath and nothing more.

[randome]

3. I mock them all. All religious 'orders' that imply we are less than they...

...if we don't belong to the same club. Their funny hats and beards and scarves. They are all ridiculous to put that much focus into physical attire and appearances.

I mock them all.

But I wouldn't make a movie about it. I'll just post about it on DU, instead.

[cthulu2016]

4. Is is not nice to harm people, but some of the stuff

about how we must respect all religions is deranged.

No, I do not respect all points of view. That is why I am posting on a message board that bans certain points of view.

Duh.

Why should anyone respect a silly religion (all of them) unless we are going to respect the idea of returning to the gold standard.

The gold standard is stupid, but it's at least as worthy of respect as the average supernatural belief.

And the hypocrisy is blistering. People who think the world is 5,000 years old are figures of fun... but only as long as they are Americans.

[cali]

5. If all we did was mock them, that would be one thing.

We invade them. We bomb them. We overthrow their democratically elected leaders. We install and prop up strong men.

A bit more than merely mocking them.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. That's The Real Problem And Not The Film

The film was the straw that broke the proverbial camel's back.

[cthulu2016]

8. Yes, and the point.

Which I think you are in general agreement with, but just clarifying.

This focus on righteous hurt feelings over our terrible free society is getting damn close the the Chimp's "they hate us for our freedoms"

If they hate us for our media products then they are welcome to get the fuck over themselves.

If the tension is from more substantial things that are any of their business, like what bombs land where in their territories, our how natural resources in those territories are used, or who props up which dictator, then that is a whole different thing.

[cali]

12. except it's not a whole different thing. it's all entangled

[cthulu2016]

13. Entangled in their minds? Sure.

(hypothetical) violent objection to our having a free society would not, however, be morally entangled with violent objection to being bombed.

As a psychiatric syndrome? As human nature? As how simplistic minded people sometimes think and react? As how a person with grievances can self-righteously boot-strap those grievances into a sense of universal moral entitlement? Sure.

But the two are, morally, poles apart.

I shoot an armed man breaking into my house. One thing.

I shoot the same man because he allows his daughter to dress like a slut, and my daughter rides the same bus as his daughter, so he is a corrupter of my daughter and a threat to my values. A whole different thing.

But I could give an awesome speech about how the two offenses are equivalent, and since we are allowed to kill in self-defense then why can't I shoot people in the defense of my family.

I really cannot believe we are talking about this.

The thing about the indefensible is that it cannot plausibly be defended.

[chill_wind]

6. It probably helps

that we haven't developed a policy of sending drones into Utah and Idaho on a daily basis.

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/09/yemen-drone-war/

(link edit)

[Igel]

10. You're right.

The drones came first, after all.

Awlaki uttered his incitements only after he was killed.

We sent drones into Pakistan long before there were militants there.

A fine supporter of the concept of a later effect producing a prior cause.

One that is especially apropos in Libya, where we mercilessly drone-bombed mosques, schools, and madaris.

[chill_wind]

16. Yes, I am.

Ongoing drone strikes that errantly kill civilian women and children, regardless of where in the continuum of our foreign policy we decided on it, would seem to complicate our diplomatic relations with said populations rather a lot.

[Nye Bevan]

9. And if they rioted and murdered people in response

many DUers would be solemnly condemning the Magic Underwear jokes and urging that the show "The Book of Mormon" be closed.

But since the Mormons don't do that stuff, it's all in good fun.

[cthulu2016]

11. And that is why the concept of "fighting words" is so foolish

and is a relic.

You cannot sensibly gain additional rights/protections by being an irresponsible hot-head.

[joeybee12]

14. And we're bombing and killing them...

Oh wait, that one doesn't apply.

[Drahthaardogs]

15. I lived in a Mormon community as a non-Mormon

The way they treated non-Mormons was not nice. They are a closed society. If you keep sending message that you do not want to belong, people will make sure that you do not.