CNN's Angela Rye: Washington, Jefferson Statues "Need To Come Down"

[Polybius]

CNN's Angela Rye called for statues of George Washington and Thomas Jefferson to come down Thursday on the network.

"American history is not all glorious... George Washington was a slave owner. We need to call slave owners out for what they are. Whether we think they were protecting American freedom or not, he wasn't protecting my freedoms," the network contributor said.

"To me, I don't care if it's a George Washington statue or Thomas Jefferson, they all need to come down," Rye concluded.

Rye's remarks came after Daily Beast editor John Avlon argued Washingon spent his life trying to unite the nation.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2017/08/18/cnns_angela_rye_washington_jefferson_statues_need_to_come_down.html?jwsource=cl

Video in link. Thoughts on this? I can't say I agree.

[JonLP24]

1. I'm not going to lose any sleep if they do

I don't disagree but I won't say anything more on the topic.

[dem4decades]

2. Washington? Let's not go crazy. I liked the idea of winning the next election.

[empedocles]

5. ,

[Grins]

32. And this won't help!

The Reich will pick this up like “emails” and “uranium 21” and run with it like they are on fire giving them a diversion they desperately need from the horror they inflicted on the nation for 4-years.

This is a gift to Republicans and we need to STOP GIVING GIFTS LIKE THIS TO THEM!!!

[Maeve]

3. First let's take down the ones to folk who fought against the union

And those who went to war to keep slaves.
Then we can talk about flawed founding fathers, ok?

[Hekate]

23. What you said

[moose65]

4. I disagree with her

Yes, Washington and Jefferson owned slaves. Also, most white people in the 1770’s were racist. That’s a fact of history. However, Washington and Jefferson were important in the history of this country, flaws and all.

Are we now going to establish the Statue Purity Police? I hope not!

Full disclosure: I am a white Southern man who is 100% behind removing Confederate monuments from courthouses and capital buildings and the public square.

[empedocles]

6. Also the conderates had some treason involved

[exboyfil]

13. Well to be accurate Washington and Jefferson were also traitors

Washington especially since he turned on his own military commission (kind of like Lee and most of the other southern generals for example).

[empedocles]

16. We could make some distinctions

[DFW]

49. So let England take down all statues of Washington and Jefferson n/t

[CountAllVotes]

8. +1

n/t

[Raine]

10. I agree with you.. nt

[Amishman]

60. This, leave them alone.

If we judge every historical figure with modern ethics, we'll have to tear down everything more than a generation old.

[qazplm135]

7. eh, I'm Black but yeah no

Are we going to rename Washington DC now?

[empedocles]

19. When Dems get on a roll, historically, the 'shoot self in foot' folk pop up

[Blue_true]

37. Angela Rye is a sound member of that club.

I have ever considered her to have sound logic, too emotional.

I am Black and some of my Black female ancestors were used for sex by White men leading up to my maternal grandmom. In those times, I realize that stuff happened. Personally, I have closed the book on my White ancestry, it simply has no meaning to me, I have lived the existence of a Black person. Even with that sordid history, there is no way that I would back removing statues of Washington or Jefferson or any other Founder that owned slaves, I believe that such an attempt in modern times is pure lunacy, we have more important battles to fight.

[empedocles]

42. FDR, LBJ, MLK - all had 'more important battles to fight'

Each had a lot of 'foot shooters' to contend with, who garnered considerable publicity - for various purposes.

[Blue_true]

57. I am not good at understanding cryptic posts. Do you mind spelling out your point? nt

[npk]

9. Washington is literally "The father of our country"

He may not have been perfect, but there will never be any support to remove his statues. Hell the capital of our country is named after him. Seriously Rye needs to reevaluate her position. She sounds ignorant.

[exboyfil]

12. Fox News bait to the cultist mob

up in arms.

[Yeehah]

28. Yep. Fox "News" will make it sound like it's part of the Democratic platform

and rile up the gullible imbeciles.

[PatSeg]

27. Next we can go after FDR

because of the Japanese internment camps.

The point of removing confederate statues or flags was because they committed treason against the United States in order to preserve slavery. All our leaders have been flawed, but their flaws do not necessarily diminish their accomplishments. The confederate leaders, however, betrayed their country. We don't see any statues of Benedict Arnold and if you go to Germany, you won't see any of Hilter.

[jimfields33]

29. Robert Byrd is always mentioned by the righties.

I can see all his names changed in West Virginia eventually if we go down the road of changing every name of a person who has a negative part of history.

[PatSeg]

51. At this rate,

all our streets, military bases, towns, cities, public buildings, and schools will be named A, B, C, D, E, or 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. No matter who's name you use, someone somewhere will be offended.

[jimfields33]

54. No exaggeration at all. It does seem to be going that direction.

[Sgent]

45. Its not even the treason that gets me

its the fact that the statues were created as form of propaganda in the same vein as "Rise of a Nation" and "The Lost Cause" to keep black Americans from acquiring full citizenship and equality. To serve of a permanent reminder to both blacks and whites of slavery and the Civil War.

There very well maybe statues of prominent colonists that supported England and fled to Canada / the UK during the Revolutionary war, and I would want to keep them.

[PatSeg]

50. Yes

Until recently, most people including myself didn't know that the statues and the Confederate flag came decades after the Civil War ended, as a way to intimidate and control black Americans. There are some who tend to take "freedom of speech" too far.

Confederate leaders and their flag belong in history books, not in our schools, town squares, public parks, or government buildings.

[exboyfil]

11. The big thing about the Confederate hero statues is that they

fought for the institution of slavery in open rebellion of the Union. Most were also placed there to reinforce the lost noble cause narrative and to serve as a constant reminder to African Americans of who is in charge.

I am perfectly cool with a statue of Lee in St. Louis that celebrates his accomplishments as an engineer in making the Mississippi River navigable.

[Beartracks]

17. That's true, some were not without their actual contributions.

Their Confederate history should not be ignored, but celebrating or honoring them specifically for their role as traitors is what shouldn't be done.

=========

[Beartracks]

14. Disagree. Confederate statues should be coming down not because they "weren't perfect"...

... but because they were traitors.

On the other hand, Washington, Jefferson, and others established this nation on the principles that we still expand and perfect today. Nobody's perfect, but they established a new nation that could grow and strive to achieve its ideals of equality for all --which is precisely something the Confederates fought to prevent.

==========

[cwydro]

15. Oh boy.

Smh.

[roamer65]

18. Let Dump steal the election and some of the former United States will have new founders.

[GulfCoast66]

20. Oh brother.

Hope none of our leaders take up this shit.

I like the idea of winning elections.

And as a reminder, we want confed statues down not because they weren’t perfect, but because the commuted sedition and fought against the United States. And most of the statues were placed to help reinforce Jim Crow.

[melm00se]

21. Foolishness and playing to the extreme wings

Let's look at Jefferson.

While he gets slammed for stating "All men are created equal..." but not including ALL people. He, specifically, called out slavery in the Declaration but was overridden at the Continental Congress and that wordage was struck.

He owned slaves so it sounds like a dyed in the wool slave owning bastard. Sounds simple, right?

But wait a minute...

- Didn't he lead the charge for slave importation into Virginia in 1778.
- Didn't he propose federal legislation banning slavery in the New Territories of the North and South after 1800 (it did not pass by 1 vote).
- Didn't he propose and sign the Act Prohibiting Importation of Slaves just after timeline expired for laws about slavery that was embedded in Article I, Section 9, Clause 1 US Constitution.

[Goodheart]

22. No, Angela. Just no.

[Lock him up.]

24. Well, I guess the next step would be...

American Indians tribes (Native nations) should request blowing up Mount Rushmore on CNN.

Lock him up in a padded cell in a bunker.

[The Magistrate]

25. Bloody-Minded Stupidity, Sir

Past self-defeating all the way to self-destructive.

Right now, people are out in the street for a left cause. Those demonstrations enjoy mass support, something like three out of four people agree with the demonstrators and the object of policing the police. This is a genuine moment, a sea-change, which has the potential to change what side of the political spectrum a good many people feel aligned with. It may well carry over to other things, more beneficial social and economic policies, once many have gotten over the habit of knee-jerk rejection of leftist programs. The last thing we need is 'ultra' grandstanding of a sort guaranteed to remind people of just what they don't like about the left in national politics. Get a good crowd out tearing down a statue of George Washington, and you can just kiss the whole kit and kaboodle good-bye. It is beyond stupid, it is self-destructive to the point that any sound Leninist would consider people agitating for that to be traitors in fascist pay, and as matter of fact, such people are serving as a left auxiliary of the christo-fascist right, and without even the dignity of getting a money price for their services.

This apparent determination of some leftists to alienate mass support by indulgence in quirkiness and crankiness, and in giving deliberate offense to things the great bulk of the people hold dear, is a chief reason why we cannot have good things, like national health insurance, proper regulation of credit, labor unions with power in the workplace, and a whole host of other items, including decent police, that people on the left generally do want, and that most people would enjoy having, if only they could be enacted into law by a left government.

[flying rabbit]

30. Spot-on, Sir.

[Sgent]

46. Exactly what happened with Occupy Wall Street

it got co-opted by Leninists and everyone else peaced out.

[Owl]

52. Exactly. Well said Sir.

[oasis]

26. Jefferson and Washington stay. Focus on Andrew Jackson for continued

targeting. He's already been on the skids in the mind of the American public.

Sacred cows, Washington and Jefferson must stay.

[zak247]

31. I wouldn't do that

I doubt you’ll get support for Washington and Jefferson statues to be taken down.

There too conventionally accepted and not civil war era folks.


Ancient African civilizations had slaves like ancient Egypt. Black people look to for inspiration, so we should dismiss all reverence for them as well.

No, slavery is the rule rather than the exception culturally in most of our history as bad as that is.

And during revolutionary times was an era where it was accepted culturally as a norm in society, the civil war era was much different.

Grant had a slave even though he did free the slave, so should we take down all statues of Grant?

Washington freed his slaves in his will, BTW.


Robert E Lee and those confederates are different.

[SharonClark]

33. I've never heard of Angela Rye.

Is she always this extreme?

[RhodeIslandOne]

41. I don't know who she is either

But TV talking heads only have one interest. Ratings.

[Still Sensible]

34. Totally disagree that any founding fathers monuments should come down.

The statues that should be taken down--and removed to local museums if the local public wishes--are those of traitorous individuals that took up arms against the USA and violated their oath to uphold the constitution.

[dalton99a]

35. Well, that's fucking stupid.

[Blue_true]

36. Honestly, her logic is pretty hot-headed.

The belief that White men were pre-ordained to rule everything and that people of African descent was pretty commonplace during the days of Washington and Jefferson. I believe what should be done is history should be re-written to highlight both their monumental achievements and their monumental faults. They are not like confederate generals and leaders, that needs to be taken account in evaluating the status of their statues.

[coti]

38. It's not like they didn't know what was right, though- all men being created equal....

They even recognized that, as a truth, it was self-evident.

Yet they sure didn't act like that.

[Blue_true]

55. Unfortunately, during that period, Black people were fairly

universally considered less that civilized, hence less that human. American Indians were viewed the same way.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

47. .

The belief that White men were pre-ordained to rule everything and that people of African descent was pretty commonplace among white men of a certain class during the days of Washington and Jefferson.

FIFY.

[Blue_true]

56. My reading of history lead me to conclude that the view that Blacks were

inferior extended well past White men of priviledge. If that wasn't the case, there would have been little chance that slavery could have become an morally corrupt and just wrongheaded institution.

[Kaleva]

39. Did you just stumble upon this old article from 2017?

[zak247]

40. weren't heralded as slave owners but heroes in the creation of the American republic

Another reason it's not logical to get rid of honoring revolutionary war heroes is that they weren't heralded as slave owners but heroes in the creation of the American republic and the fight against English tyranny. Civil war Confederate generals aren't known for doing anything but fighting against the union and the freedom of black people. They don't deserve to be honored in any way. In-fact they were traitors.

[empedocles]

43. George Mason and the Bill of Rights

[rockfordfile]

44. No

[denbot]

48. Troll bait.

[jalan48]

53. Are we really trying to lose the next election?

[empedocles]

59. Some think their particular 'principle' is more important than vote insurance.