I just left my doctor's office.

[redstatebluegirl]

She and I have become friends over the years. She is VERY conservative, but so are most of the people I interact with in Oklahoma. We have disagreed about politics but nothing like today.She requires masks be worn at all times but when I said it was nuts for Trump to politicize wearing a mask she said people on both sides refuse to wear masks because they are "uncomfortable". Really???? She told me the mask issue is not politicized by anyone except the media and the crazy left wing. I tried my best to argue with her to no avail. She told me Trump would get reelected don't listen to the polls. I won't change doctors because she is my pain management specialist and has kept me on my feet. I will never talk politics with her again though.

How can highly educated people be this dense! She told me "the pandemic isn't Trump's fault" "he was doing a great job on the economy lowering our taxes and everything before the pandemic". She sees nothing wrong with his stance on race either. She told me "you watch more tv than you should, walk away from MSNBC and you might get it". Ok....

Thankfully I only see her about every 3 months or so. I have always liked her, but wow.

I'm sorry I had to vent. I should have included, she insists on masks, people have to wait in their cars and go in one at a time. It is the safest office I have been in here in Oklahoma.

[Vinca]

1. I think if I'd been the patient instead of you I would have either stroked out or slugged her.

Guess I'm lucky my next appointment will be by telephone.

[vapor2]

2. You really really should consider

changing doctors. That would be my last visit had I heard the words from her mouth. Ignorance, stupidity and no common sense.

[redstatebluegirl]

3. The problem is finding one here that is good, and is a Democrat is almost impossible.

[Ms. Toad]

81. The other perspective

is that exposure to people who are different has tremendous power to change hearts and minds. It's not work for everyone - but I do it when I can.

Our doctor is also very conservative. He once chatted with me (favorably) about Sarah Palin while performing my annual gyn exam. We talk politics nearly every time I visit him. On our first visit there, his politics were apparent (I had just been offered a job in a law firm in which they required a biblical approach to employee disputes; he mentioned one of the partners was a member of his church). I told him we were a lesbian couple with a child looking for a family doctor - and I wanted to make sure he would not let his biases interfere with his medical judgment. It never has - in ~ 2 decades of providing care for our family.

I figure exposure to a stable lesbian couple, raising a child, that he can chat with about politics without rancor is good for what ails him. (We do have two-side conversations that he is not dismissing out of hand, and he asks sincere questions of us that I'm pretty sure he doesn't ask acquaintances.) I don't think I've changed his mind about politics - generally - but I'm pretty sure we've broadened his views on same-gender families.

[lpbk2713]

4. What a contradiction she is.

Someone so educated is so willfully ignorant.

[COLGATE4]

5. My daughter's a doctor. She tells me tales of horror of the

political views of most of her colleagues. To say they are to the right of Atilla the Hun would be patently unfair - - to Atilla. This pain doc sounds to be true mainstream for much of the medical profession.

[redstatebluegirl]

7. Many of them are doing well and they don't want anyone to take their money.

[COLGATE4]

9. I don't think money is driving it. During her residency she served as a

Navy doctor. Her colleagues there (certainly not making the big bucks)were even farther to the right than those in civilian practice.

[Journeyman]

6. Was she wearing a mask during your conversation? If not, she places your health in jeopardy . . .

and unless she has specialized knowledge for making intubation tubes less painful, you should probably start looking for an alternate pain management specialist,

[redstatebluegirl]

8. That is the weird thing. Her office requires masks and gloves.

You have to wait in the car to be called, only one patient at a time.

[TexasProgresive]

10. I feel your pain, no, not your physical pain.

Some suggested getting a new doc. In OK that might mean getting one with the same or worse views with no guarantee of good treatment.

[redstatebluegirl]

14. Yea I can put up with her, she has taken good care of me.

We just need to stay away from politics.

[madaboutharry]

11. No doctor is irreplaceable.

I would not go to a doctor who demonstrated that they have drunk the Kool-Aid, are participating in willful ignorance, and have rejected science. I would not be able to respect a person who uttered such nonsense.

[redstatebluegirl]

12. I don't think she rejected science in terms of the masks.

She insists on them. What she was arguing is that the media have made wearing them political, not the right wing and trumper.

[DonaldsRump]

36. Yes, sure. It was the media that politicized the shutdown, masks etc

As evidenced by this picture, where the "Fake News" hired a bunch of actors to storm the Ohio Statehouse protesting for their "constitutional rights". Indeed, they were such fine actors that rage and hatred in their faces almost looks realistic. I'm sure your doc would agree...

?

Fully appreciating what you're saying about finding another good doctor, I would still be actively looking to change. I wouldn't trust this person's judgement, political or otherwise.

[mnhtnbb]

43. The answer to that is to ask who is not wearing a mask? The media? No, Trump is the one

demanding that masks not be worn in his presence and refusing to wear one.

Ask her to find a Democrat who isn't wearing a mask.

You can give her any number of names of Republican idiots who refuse to wear masks or refuse to allow cities, counties to mandate mask wearing.

You should have told her she was full of shit and that if she wasn't so good at managing your pain, you'd be looking for another doc.

[lagomorph777]

13. If your doctor is this cavalier about your health, you need to run far away.

She is dangerous. Was she masked during your visit? If not, you really should have left immediately.

[redstatebluegirl]

17. I edited my post to show that she requires masks, this was about why people don't.

[lagomorph777]

19. I'd still be afraid to put my life in such a crazy person's hands.

I've fired doctors for this kind of crap.

[redstatebluegirl]

22. The problem is finding another one down here who is any different.

She is a good doctor, I've seen her for 15 years.

[demigoddess]

15. she's a doctor but denies science??!! My condolences!!

I would go elsewhere, but it is your choice.

[bobbieinok]

41. So she goes where? OK likely out--○so there's TX, KS, ARK, MO 'nearby'.

If you don't live in a DEEP RED state, you can't understand the reality of life here

And even before the virus struck, it was simply not easy to find a job in a better place and pick up and leave

[redstatebluegirl]

53. Thanks for this bobbieinok.

When we were looking for jobs in higher ed it was right after 9/11. A lot of schools were pulling offers off the table until things settled down. My husband has a good job he likes here, the university community is insulated. Most of our friends are academics so we can keep away from the craziness. It is when you need doctors, dentists or other services it becomes difficult. Mainly because they assume everyone here agrees with them so they don't feel they have to not say what they think.

[bobbieinok]

59. You at OU? Beautiful campus. One brother graduated there in 63, other OKState 65

The new part of the univ library is pleasant. Easy for visitor to use

[redstatebluegirl]

71. Yes.

We love the campus and the community.

[appalachiablue]

77. It's also an issue with lawyers, insurance agents, advisers

and others who we entrust with our welfare, a huge responsibility which can profoundly impact our lives.

Since the pandemic began, I'm surprised at the number of posters commenting that their doctors are conservative and even further right, how many of them, and also nurses are on the right. Remarks about how they are Fox news watchers, that dentists and others in the medical field (a while back) make light of, or dismiss wearing masks and more.

I never realized this or even thought about it, if it's the case. But given the conditions in the country now, I'll try to assess a service person or professional's political bent when it's a factor and before investing in them. The influence of the enlightenment and western liberal democracy has been severely diminished in the last several decades, here and in other authoritarian controlled nations. The change is visible and troubling.

The fixed notion that many democrats and people on the left hold that anyone who is educated can't be a far right, Fox and Trump supporter is concerning, and that it's mostly the stereotypical ignorant, vulgar white red neck racists with guns and nasty suburbanites that fall into this category.

I'm becoming more aware of the fact that plenty of medical professionals, business people, lawyers, teachers, government workers and more are far right or have moved there especially since major changes starting with Reagan's 'Counter Revolution' in the 1980s. Adherence to very traditional and right wing churches and religions that have grown in membership the last few decades is also part of the picture.

It can't be said enough how the majority of Americans, including professionals and many people with busy lives don't follow political news and issues to the extent that members of DU and other discussion forums do. This brings up the chronic problem of the state of the US news media that has moved so far right and become so dominant and influential that it's fueling a lot of the conflict and problems we're facing in the last 20-30 years.

The media is critical, esp. to a democracy and there are ample resources in LA, NY and in between to support more honest news coverage. If U.S. news isn't reformed soon and strengthened to present more truthful reporting by measures like reinstating the Fairness Doctrine which Reagan cancelled in 1987 and more issues after deregulation under Clinton, then I don't know what will become of this country and democracy.

PS Given your views and the circumstances in your area and state, I understand your decision to remain with your doctor.

[Leghorn21]

16. Hey, girl, so sorry this shocking conversation took place, wtf??!

But a pain doctor who can keep you "on your feet" is NOT easy to replace, so yeah - next time, y'all can talk about the *weather*, eh??

[redstatebluegirl]

18. Yea, I'm staying put. I have been seeing her for 15 years since I developed a spinal problem.

She has kept me from having a second surgery so I'll just keep it to the weather.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

20. I'll add another voice to "You really need to find another doctor."

[SharonClark]

21. My nephew's widow is an MD in Missouri and is

one of the most ignorant and unaware people I’ve ever met. At my nephew”s funeral his dad told her he would never forgive her for turning his son into a Republican.

[lunatica]

23. I feel your disappointment!

It’s very hard when you like and respect someone. But you’re right to keep her because evidently she’s a good doctor you can rely on. It’s sad to find out people you like are aligning themselves with someone as evil as Trump. I bet she doesn’t pay much attention to what is happening.

Hang in there! You have DU to keep you sane!

[redstatebluegirl]

29. This is where I come for sanity for sure! Thanks!

[stopbush]

24. I'm glad she's under the delusion that tRump will be reelected.

I look forward to reading about your interactions with her post-election.

[redstatebluegirl]

26. Her feeling is people won't tell a pollster they are voting for Trump but will vote for him in the

privacy of a voting booth.

[SunSeeker]

69. The doctor is projecting. Like all Trumpers, she is a racist, but she likes to keep that "private."

Some try to hide it more than others.

[blueinredohio]

25. If my doctor didn't believe the science I would be finding a new doctor.

Last week a doctor who did a dexa scan talked to me about the results then she said "you're lucky you take Plaquenil they're doing a study and it looks promising." It's already been proven it doesn't help. I thought to myself that's the last time I come here.

[GeorgeGist]

27. Find a new Dr ...

She's too dumb to trust.

[Eliot Rosewater]

28. They have been told their racism and homophobia is OK so they will ignore everything else.

Traitor has told your doctor she can be a RACIST and a HOMOPHOBE etc...so she loves that, nothing else makes sense.

[samnsara]

30. my late mother was born in Oklahoma and i went back with her a few times to visit relatives..

...its beautiful. But she would be HORRIFIED about her home state right now....Im sorry you are stuck with a trump humper as a health care provider. Sounds like shes doing one thing and saying another. Stay safe...

[redstatebluegirl]

32. It has gotten really frightening since Trump was elected.

All of the racists and homophobes came out from under their rocks. Plus the anti science crowd is thick down here.

[bobbieinok]

46. OK wasn't a liberal enclave in 40s, 50s. But we had Sen Fred Harris, others. It wasn't like now

But the switch in late 70s, early 80s in GOP, Evangelicals all across the country pulled the state very rightward

Saw it happen in IA too

[Cha]

31. Some can be really educated in some areas and soak

in fox screws as "truth". Your Dr sounds like one who's fed shite and kept in the dark by fox "news".

Sorry, redstatebluegirl Good to vent.. that's what we do here.

[redstatebluegirl]

34. Thanks Cha.

[Cha]

35. I just edited my previous post and changed "smart" to "educated"..

I saw it upthread. "Educated" is a much better word for how these people are in some areas.. like Ben Carson.

Best of Luck! I know you're stuck with her.. thankfully you only have to see her every 3 months.

Hopefully Biden will WIN!

[uponit7771]

61. +1

[uponit7771]

60. +1, this is text book science of how can one be educated but spout shit and its because they have

... a single source of respected information and few other perspectives.

It takes an emotional shock to get them out of listening to those sources at an individual level.

I bet if a loved one of hers were suffering lung damage from CV19 she'd change her mind about how "Political" wearing a mask was.

[Cha]

64. It's like the Twilight Zone from Hell.. the brainwashing

fox and ilk has permeated America with.

Rod Serling would be sickened.

[MLAA]

33. Sounds like my ex dentist

I fired his unrepentant ass a year ago.

[Cha]

38. lol.. Congratulations! It sounds like the OP doesn't

have much of choice in Oklahoma where she is.

[MLAA]

45. Agreed, I live in a largish city so I had choices.

[LuckyLib]

63. I don't buy "no other choice". I would want my doctor to actually read about what's going on

in the country, particular in this time of pandemic. Medicine is her field. I'd also like to think that he/she is up on current medical research, indicative of reading because it's your professional duty to do so. Spouting RW talking points that are clearly from Faux News doesn't indicate someone very well informed. There are informed and progressive doctors out there.

[bobbieinok]

37. All my family here in OK are GOPers. Very glad my parents died before Fox infection!

My adult son and my ex live in IA---both strong dems

My ex is just stunned when I tell him what's 'truth' in the RW/Evangelical bubble here

A week or so ago when I was telling him about Jim Bakker's ministry and its massive amount of land near Branson, he was flabbergasted. He still thought of him as being permanently mired in the scandals of years ago

[SharonClark]

52. Glad your son and ex are in Iowa.

We need all the Dems we can get.

[safeinOhio]

39. Just for fun.

When you get your bill, write on it Mexico will pay for it.

[Beringia]

40. A lot of these stories remind me of a Seinfeld episode

Elaine thinks she has found Prince Charming, a furniture mover. But her friends tell her to find out about his views on abortion and sure enough he wants to overturn roe vs wade

[spanone]

42. some 'smart' people are very stupid

[guillaumeb]

44. Her taxes were lowered.

Another greedy GOP voter.

[redstatebluegirl]

47. I think it is this and the courts.

She is an evangelical Christian too, she finally quit talking about "killing babies" when I told her I would look for another doctor if she kept it up. I told her I was a Unitarian and she rolled her eyes, but kept from preaching to me. I honestly think she hates paying taxes too.

[guillaumeb]

51. Agreed. For most GOP voters, it is about the money.

The well off GOP voters do not want to pay taxes, and the poor GOP voters think they will get rich someday.

[mnhtnbb]

54. Exactly.

That's all she cares about--$$ in her pocket.

My brother is a physician, although no longer practicing. He was an OB Gyn oncologist. An academic at the University of Iowa. Then he left and went to work for Big Pharma and finally retired from Pfizer a couple of years ago.

I tried to appeal to him in 2004 to vote for Kerry instead of Bush, based on his identity and grounding in science. No go. One of his sons told me that all he cares about is how much he pays in taxes and that he will always vote Republican because of it.

He's greedy. That's all there is to it. He's behaved that way with me, too, over the years and when our parents were downsizing and giving away things from the house. I got a phone call from my father that my brother and his wife had flown out to California from Iowa and were packing and taking EVERYTHING and that if I wanted anything, I should get on a plane, pronto, and come out there. My brother and his wife had cooked this trip up with my mother and none of them had said one word to me. Not a word. Some years later I asked my brother for two items--a vase that belonged to my father's mother and a pencil portrait of my dad--from all the stuff they took out of my parents' house and do you think he would let go of them? Nope.

I no longer speak to my brother. He and his wife are both Trumpers and thank goodness they now live in California and I live in North Carolina so I don't have any reason to ever have to see them.

[mvd]

48. It's too bad you can't change

Did you ask her what news she watches? That would be a good comeback.

I would tell her that I don’t want to be upset at the office and to please not talk politics. Fortunately my primary doctor doesn’t like Trump. She used to be an old style Republican, but I wonder if she changed parties over Trump.

[redstatebluegirl]

50. She claims she doesn't watch tv at all.

[mvd]

55. Hmm, I wonder

Either she watches FAUX or she has friends/family keeping her up to date with the latest Dump nonsense.

[PCIntern]

49. Keep your doc

As a practitioner myself I get both sides of this issue. There are people whom I see who have horrendous politics but they get my full attention and care and to be truthful, I’m extra careful to do the right thing. I especially wish to have a good outcome with them for many reasons.

[redstatebluegirl]

56. I plan to, I didn't expect what I thought was an innocent statement about people not wearing masks

would end up where it went. She is a Cornell educated doctor, she is brilliant in terms of what she does. I need that as I age into this spine of mine.

[PCIntern]

58. It happens....

Some people whom I treat are often very disappointed that I’m a pragmatic leftist, rather than a radical.

[essme]

57. Hit her with taxes

Next time you see her, be sure to ask how her deductions are. If she is young enough to have school loans, the deduction for those have been reduced. Mortgage deductions are going to hit the housing market hard this year--

When you talk to Trumpsters, you always have to keep it centered on money. Everything. The economy, taxes, student loans and mortgages.

Always bring up the taxes for huge companies-- and mention that their employees are taking out food stamps....and call the food stamps, snap benefits, etc. "OUR tax dollars." Act outraged.

Hope that helps

[captain queeg]

62. I find many doctors to be intellectually arrogant

More than once I had docs ignore what I tell them because they’ve already decided on the prognosis. To be fair I’m sure they get sick of people coming in after consulting “Dr Google” but they shouldn’t ignore what a patient is telling them. It’s the largest part of the diagnosis when you get right down to it. Tests are important but ought to be combined with the patients input. I’ve been on deaths door twice in my life while doctors cruised along their merry way ignoring what I was telling them.

[Grokenstein]

65. "the pandemic isn't Trump's fault"

Hillary didn't attack the consulate, but Republicans want her locked up/executed for her response (or at least what they opine her lack of response to have been). Sauce for the gander, doc.

[Mr.Bill]

66. I know a lot of people in the medical field because I volunteer at a hospital

and some are conservative and some are liberal. But something most of them have in common is being relatively uninformed. Relative to people like us, I mean. I'm retired and spend much of my day on the internet reading about politics and watching the news. Doctors and nurses by and large just lead very busy lives, work a lot of hours and don't have time to keep up with politics. Which is fine with me. I'd rather have my doctors reading medical journals and doing continuing education than going home at night and watching political news.

[Shermann]

67. She's right and wrong about both sides refusing to wear masks

More Democrats are masking up, but not all of course. Huffington Post did a survey in late May:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/face-masks-poll-partisan-culture-war_n_5ec584fcc5b642a7d150e103

In my personal experience, age is a better predictor of mask-wearing than political views. But there clearly is a correlation there as well.

[TygrBright]

68. Cognitive dissonance to the max... n/t

[NNadir]

70. Because of a change in insurance, for a while, I had a doctor who used to play Fox News in...

...the waiting room, and give these little lectures on his politics during my appointment.

He was a competent doctor, but since he seemed like an incompetent human being, I changed doctors.

I don't know my current doctor's politics, but I know his parents were immigrants, which makes me feel better about him.

[ecstatic]

72. trump is such an ignorant clown. I'm stunned that some people don't

see it that way. It's mind boggling.

[niyad]

73. I am so very sorry that you experienced this. It sucks that she is taking good care of you,

but is clearly a kool-ade drinker. Knowing that it might be incredibly difficult to find another doc, you might have to insist on no political talk. Wishing you all the best.

[LeftInTX]

74. My friend's husband is a doctor. She says most doctors are Republican

I also looked at the Texas Medical Association endorsements: Republicans

The TMA was the main sponsor of the Texas Republican Convention.

I think Obamacare is a big factor.

My rheumatologist posted a letter in his office before the 2012 election. It didn't say vote for Romney, but it went on about Obamacare....My dad's cardiologist sent him a letter, asking him to vote for Romney. (My dad was a pretty die hard Republican and his doctor probably knew)

[Buckeyeblue]

75. Doctors are good at science. They aren't necessarily intelligent

I've dealt with many a misdiagnosis by doctors with kids and family members. And we you point it out to them they get defensive. An intelligent person would be willing to admit they were wrong.

Doctors follow protocols. They don't do much outside of the box problem solving. That's for the tv doctors.

And many doctors run their offices very poorly. And their finances are typically a mess.

[MyMission]

76. What do you call a person who graduates at bottom of medical school class?

......A doctor!

Hope you see her in 4 months, and then talk about politics and the blue wave!

[MerryBlooms]

78. I saw my primary two weeks ago...

Before the C19 hit, he checked the hardware in my back and hernia incisions, etc... Since February, he hasn't physically examined me, just asked questions. Before the most recent visit, he was wearing N95 masks, last visit was homemade cloth. He said PPE is being rationed again, and the testing kits are low. He's on the Doc Board of Whatever for the huge med company in our area, he knows what's going on. He has a very grim outlook. He's on the same political wavelength as me, so we talk a little about politics... Again, he has a very grim outlook unless Biden wins. I am due for my annual spine x-rays in December, so unless there's a shift in my hardware, I don't expect a physical exam. I still have one incarcerated hernia that needs fixed (it's not huge like the others and is in an area that doesn't pose great risk), but my surgeon and primary don't want me near the hospital until absolutely necessary.

[Skittles]

79. I would not continue seeing that doctor

nope

[milestogo]

80. If my doctor criticized my tv viewing or my politics, I'd leave and never come back.

But hey, that's just me.