Kurt Eichenwald: "Now It's Happened to You"

[kpete]

The conservatives celebrating the killings of Kyle Rittenhouse.

Congrats. You now see how peaceful Muslims can be radicalized into Islamists online who celebrate and cheer when their "enemies" are killed - and potentially to terrorists.

...except now it's happened to you.

Link to tweet

?s=20

[regnaD kciN]

1. Not much of a point for Eichenwald to make...

...righties will just reply "Radical Muslims support killing in the cause of evil. We support killing in the cause of fighting evil. It makes all the difference in the world!"

The fact is, most people are just fine when violence is used to further their side's goals, appalled when it's used in support of the "other side." It's not unlike those who decry the Axis' atrocities during WWII, but will insist that our nuking Japanese cities filled with noncombatants is "completely different."

[plimsoll]

2. Axis atrocities during WWII are independent of our actions.

We can decry them, but we should be willing to look at our own behavior. Curtis LeMay was honest enough to acknowledge that he and Bomber Harris would both have been guilty of warcrimes in an entirely independent war crimes courts.

On the other hand, I'm always puzzled by the reaction to Hiroshima and Nagasaki as being somehow so much worse than Hamburg, Dresden or Tokyo. Dead is dead, and if I'm not mistaken the casualty counts were higher in all three of the other cases. The weapon of mass destruction argument seems to fall apart if you can use conventional weapons to achieve the same effect.

[dhol82]

3. War sucks no matter which side you are on.

[lunatica]

4. That's why I'm an anti war progressive pacifist.

[Marcuse]

6. By knife or neutron dead is dead, but the body count is exponential.

[electric_blue68]

7. Don't forget about lingering radiation, gene mutations...

... that's the difference besides the very high immediate dearh count.

[plimsoll]

8. This isn't to minimize the impact of the atomic bombs.

Simply to point out that while horrendous, they were horrors of similar magnitude to those meted out by conventional weapons (incendiaries) deliberately used to cause firestorms. We remember the horrors of Hiroshima and Nagasaki but ignore Hamburg, Dresden and Tokyo.

Hiroshima: 90,000 to 146,000 over 4 months.
Nagasaki: 39,000 to 80,000 over 4 months.
Hamburg: 42,600 killed 37,000 injured.
Dresden: 25,000 to 35,000 by most estimates, but some as high as 250,000.
Tokyo: 80,00 to 100,000+ killed.

We can make a much better case for racism being a driving factor for Tokyo, Hiroshima and Nagasaki, but the death tolls from these particular atomic bombs were not an order of magnitude greater. They foreshadowed worse to come certainly, but in themselves are not out of line with what we were willing and able to do with conventional weapons.

It's our willingness to find the use of the atomic bombs so shocking that bothers me. As if the deaths in the 3 firebombed cities were so much more humane. And I'm sure those burn victims had untreatable lingering effects as well.

[ProfessorGAC]

11. Good Points, Except...

...the racism part regarding the nukes in Japan.
I have no hesitation in believing that had the bombs been ready in February instead of July, the US would have used them in Berlin & Munich.
The Manhattan Project was initiated to beat Germany to that weapon. I strongly believe we would have used them in the European Theater had they been available.

[bobbieinok]

5. An important insight!! Have shared with family and friends

[oasis]

9. Bingo. nt

[gulliver]

10. Every Republican with a troubled teenage gun enthusiast has to be worried.

Thanks to Trump and his Republican stooges.