Attorneys representing Kyle Rittenhouse say he was wrongfully charged after 'acting in self-defense'

[sl8]

From https://www.tmj4.com/news/local-news/attorneys-representing-kyle-rittenhouse-say-he-was-wrongfully-charged-after-acting-in-self-defense
(video at link)

Attorneys representing Kyle Rittenhouse say he was wrongfully charged after 'acting in self-defense'

By: Jackson Danbeck , Ben JordanPosted at 6:16 PM, Aug 28, 2020 and last updated 11:45 PM, Aug 28, 2020

KENOSHA — Attorneys representing Kyle Rittenhouse, the teen charged with homicide in the shooting deaths of two protesters and the injuring of a third in Kenosha, says the 17-year-old has been wrongfully charged after "acting in self-defense."

[...]

Bainbridge argues that when Rittenhouse finished his shift as a lifeguard in Kenosha last Tuesday, he decided he wanted to help clean up damage in Kenosha left amid unrest over the police shooting of Jacob Blake.

He and a friend went to a local high school to remove graffiti, according to Bainbridge. Later that day, they received information about a call for help from a local business owner, whose downtown Kenosha auto dealership was largely destroyed, Bainbridge says. The business owner said he needed help defending his business.

So Rittenhouse and his friend armed themselves with rifles and headed to the business. Bainbridge added that the weapons were in Wisconsin and never crossed state lines.

It was a gun Rittenhouse legally couldn’t carry in Wisconsin due to his age.

]...]

[StarfishSaver]

1. Funny how white men with guns are so often terrified that unarmed people will hurt them

that they end up shooting and killing them "in self-defense."

These guys seem to be too fragile, even with their big guns, to function in normal society.

Maybe they should just stay at home in their mothers' basements where they'll be safe from harm.

[5X]

2. I'll bet they will get away with this.

They will eventually get the charges dropped to the illegal weapon.

[Generic Other]

3. He was wildly discharging his gun

He shot randomly. That's what I saw.

[Amishman]

8. I disagree

He fired seven shots (there are other gunshots on the videos that aren't his).

Four were at his first victim at extremely close range. The first victim had been chasing him and had tried throwing something at him. Not random.

There is a gap of the second pursuit

The fifth shot was at the man who was leaping to disarm him. He missed.

The sixth was at the skateboarder who was also attempting to disarm him. He fatally shot this victim in the chest.

The seventh shot was at a man who as also attempting to stop him. He took off a significant part of the man's arm.

There will be a ton of debate on if these were self defense, or if his presence there even allows a self defense argument - but the shots were not random.

We are headed towards a Martin / Zimmerman esque mess over who is the aggressor, who is allowed to use lethal force, and when. This is going to be extremely ugly and muddled.

[Yavin4]

13. Using your logic, a mass shooter at a school is just defending himself from being subdued.

Right? Why can't a kid walk into a school with an automatic weapon and when people try to take it away from him, oh, I was just defending myself.

[GusBob]

15. Yep

See my post below

Exactly whose self defense are we talking about?

And who was the aggressor?

[Amishman]

16. Not quite

The second incident being self defense or not seems to hinge on if the first is self defense.

In the school shooter scenario they is zero chance their first attack is considered self defense.

It's a going to be a ugly mess, the outcome of which I can't begin to guess. The laws do not align with how many if us are viewing the situation.

[Yavin4]

21. "In the school shooter scenario they is zero chance their first attack is considered self defense."

How so? Go to the :27 time mark of the Kenosha shooter below. The people in the crowd have no idea that he's an "honest" citizen or a mass shooter. How would anyone know? They instruct people to try and subdue a mass shooter.

[Amishman]

24. Again, I agree with you in part

You do have a good point that those in the crowd during the second attempt to flee won't know what happened.

However, attempting to chase and subdue an armed individual is not a good choice if action. Heroic yes, but still not a good idea. It also isn't what experts recommend.

The official advice for an active shooter situation for the general public is 'Run Hide Fight'. Run away, hide, fight as a last resort. https://www.ready.gov/active-shooter

However that is just gov recommendations and not law. The law isn't straight forward at all in this situation, which is why I keep saying we need to expect an ugly legal fight and the outcome is impossible to predict.

The school shooter scenario also isn't a good comparison due to the background. A school day is a straight forward setting with no complications. This had plenty of complications. They were all there in violation of curfew. Possible / probable open carry violation by the little bastard (I still can't find the exact WI statute governing open carry to study). Vandalism and arson being attempted at car dealership prior to first shooting. Verbal exchanges before the chases started. Plus a big critical time gap before the chases.

[Celerity]

14. Very good synopsis. My wife said he would get a slap on the wrist within

minutes of her first studying the videos and hearing the timeline. I tend to agree.

[Hoyt]

34. I think it will come down to the first shooting. Did the police wannabe, armed Prick just shoot him

for the heck of it, or was he "attacked." Depending on that, the other shootings are either people trying to stop a murderer or the Prick shooting attackers.

The guy who was shot in the arm was armed --

?strip=all&quality=100&w=1200&h=800&crop=1


Whatever, we have to get armed people off the streets. Personally, I'd lock the little police wannabe, white wing militia Prick up just because he showed up at protest with a rifle, wears his cap backwards, and is clearly a POS. But the trial will be interesting.

[beachbumbob]

4. lol, the kid had no legal right to even have the AR in his possenssion in Wisconsin OR Illinois

- there are weapons charges need to be filed
- need to have charges against his parents as well
- WTF is Gov Evers doing here? I would have all this turned over to State Police and STate AG office with charges against the Kenosha police chief and police dept coming, especially IF and coordination between police and the "militia" as in conspiracy to commit murder

[Baitball Blogger]

12. This is what happens when conservatives control the police

and criminal justice system. They can set the facts at the beginning, making it sound innocuous. While minorities get the full force of their ire and prejudices.

[beachbumbob]

25. Why "we" need to take back local elected offices and take responsibility to fixing the flaws

I tire of people whining about this and that and they themselves don;t vot,e don;t go to town council meetings, don't speak up

What happens, in the end is on all of us aand we have to quit blaming the "others"

[TruckFump]

5. What bullshit.

He came to the fight with a gun. The intent admitted by this atty IS TO PROTEST THE PERSONAL PROPERTY OF A THIRD PARTY!!!

[Buckeyeblue]

6. I think they are making a big mistake with this defense

It appeals to the moment. Not to the long term reality of the national situation. I would argue that he was manipulated by a lifetime of racist dogma and extreme far right conspiracy theories. Essentially he was brainwashed. Given his age. If he struggled in school it would even be better.

I think in a year to a year in a half such a defense would find sympathy.

[Amishman]

9. He is receiving massive legal assistance from right-wingers

That assistance would vanish if they took that strategy.

Plus that angle might be a better months from now at either sentencing or appeal, when this plan fails. More convincing that way, doing a 180 in political philosophy in only a few days and claiming you were brainwashed will not sound sincere.

[GusBob]

17. I wouldnt say brainwashed but not right in the head

He was scrubbing graffiti that day, he was ginned up by the cops and business owner and his fellow gun nuts there. Who knows what they were saying that night?

I think that was the moment he was caught up in

On top of a lifetime of shit

[Justice]

18. I agree. The atty though, will use him to

Advance the NRA’s narrative, not what is best for Kyle.

If what Kyle did is self defense, then we have no law or order. If private citizens can freely roam the streets and shoot at people, we are lawless. The victims reacted to guy with a gun - and tried to stop him - to protect people; if they are Found to be aggressors - that means we all must walk around with meek, subservient postures so as not to offend the guy with a gun.

Madness.

[Buckeyeblue]

31. Right. The self-defense logic doesn't hold.

If anything his victims were acting in self-defense.

[FarPoint]

7. I expect nothing less...

That is what a Defense Attorney does...

[GusBob]

10. Not a legal expert but I think it boils down to this

Is it self defense to disarm someone who is shooting at you or who has shot other people to death?

Aka: self defense of whom? The survivor will testify he was trying to stop the suspect

The suspect was also a criminal illegally armed

If the survivor testifies to such, it seems to me the only way to counter that testimony is to have the kid take the stand to claim he was in fear of his life

I dont think his lawyer wants that little shit on the stand

[Baitball Blogger]

11. I don't know if that's the true story. Sounds like they're

trying to white-wash facts that will show his culpability in other offenses. Where did Rittenhouse live? They say that it was in Antioch, Illinois, south of the border. Does he have another address for the AK-47?

How did he get to Wisconsin? Does he have his own car?

[GusBob]

19. His mommy drove him there!

No shit

Can you see it? On the way home

“How was the protest son?”
“I shot 3 people”
“thats nice dear”

[dware]

33. Can you provide the link of his mother driving him to WI?

There is a lot of speculation, but no confirmation that actually happened, so a link would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[empedocles]

29. Saw the latest defense attorney's on tv. Drama queens?

Something to some fox people, carlson, rallying behind the murderer. Ugly 'hero' synrome?

[yardwork]

20. If he was black he would have been shot dead at the scene by police.

This is fundamental. Don't forget it.

[Alacritous Crier]

26. Exactly!

That's what the protest was about to begin with.

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

22. The video of the guy with pistol in his hand

Will probably have a jury toss it out.

Sad but my thoughts.

[GusBob]

23. The third victim had the gun correct?

The medic dude who was shot in the arm?

Logic (which doesnt apply on the heat of the street)
would dictate that he would be the first guy shot and dead

He survived. I think his testimony will be key to the case. He could claim he was trying to stop the shooting and defend himself?

[Kaleva]

27. It needs to be determined if the pistol was legal or not.

[GusBob]

30. Yes but

The fact that he survived and is an eyewitness puts a twist to this case

His testimony will be key

[dware]

28. This isn't surprising,

they're his attorney's, of course they're going to say this, whether they believe it or not.

Kyle Rittenhouse is a POS, but he is entitled to, under our Constitution, an attorney to defend him in a court of law.

[Ilsa]

32. So much BS: The owner of the dealership should have called

the police if he was scared. I bet no call exists on their logs or 911 tapes.

This kid tried to play like he was an adult, deputized by his Facebook buddies. He killed two people, fathers of young children and disabled another person. He needs prison time for this. He went looking for confrontations.

You know if he was a 17 year black kid, if he had survived arrest, he would be tried as an adult and thrown into gen-pop.

[DetroitLegalBeagle]

35. An acquittal or dropped charges would not surprise me

Based on what is seen in the publicly available videos, the witness statement found in the criminal complaint, and Wisconsin law.