Who is to say "Q" is not GRU?

[My Pet Orangutan]

my Hail Mary for the day

[bullimiami]

1. gru is involved in the coup attempt. you can take that to the bank.

[lagomorph777]

2. I have always assumed it's a Putin front.

[NoRoadUntravelled]

13. Same here. nt

[Pachamama]

3. My money is on it being GRU

[Wounded Bear]

4. The idea has been floated...

I'm sure Russia was involved somehow. This has GRU fingerprints all over it. They've been practicing for decades in Eastern Europe and other places. Now they're here.

[sboatcar]

7. This is the kind of thing that GRU really excels at too

They know that a lot of americans are evangelical christians, who are already led to 'follow the plan' even if they don't understand it. They're also of the belief that they have special secret knowledge and that god talks to them in cryptic signs.

So Q just took all that and combined it with the same old tropes of blood libel and jazzed it up a little for the modern age and added democrats into the mix instead of just the usual jews, put a 'secret plan' in place, all that.


This is a brilliantly evil plan, and to me only the Russians could come up with something like that. Its their bread and butter. This has just been more wildly successful than any of their previous attempts. Also, I don't think they care whether their guy wins or loses, as long as they can sow chaos, they've accomplished their mission.

The whole thing may have intentionally been done so sloppily that it was destined to fail to sow even more chaos.

[My Pet Orangutan]

11. Stupidity is plausible deniability -

the best bluff in IC.

[Pantagruel]

8. Posted here earlier/same general theory

orangecrush (10,471 posts)


"We are witnessing a masterpiece of Russian tradecraft.

It would make a chess Grandmaster weep for the level of strategy unfolding.

Aleksandr Dugin wrote the book on it.

"The Foundations of Geopolitics: The Geopolitical Future of Russia is a geopolitical book by Aleksandr Dugin. It has had some influence within the Russian military, police, and foreign policy elites[1] and has been used as a textbook in the Academy of the General Staff of the Russian military.[1][2] Its publication in 1997 was well received in Russia. Powerful Russian political figures subsequently took an interest in Dugin,[3] a Russian eurasianist, fascist[4] and nationalist[5] who has developed a close relationship with Russia's Academy of the General Staff.[6]"
....

"The United Kingdom, merely described as an "extraterritorial floating base of the U.S.", should be cut off from Europe.[9"

.....

"The book emphasizes that Russia must spread anti-Americanism everywhere: "the main 'scapegoat' will be precisely the U.S."

"In the United States:

Russia should use its special services within the borders of the United States to fuel instability and separatism, for instance, provoke "Afro-American racists". Russia should "introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity, encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the U.S. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics".[9]
The Eurasian Project could be expanded to South and Central America.[9]"


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics



THIS BOOK WAS PUBLISHED IN 1997.


The longer it takes us to pull our heads out of the sand, to develop anti psy-war methods against the conspiracists spreading their disinformation, to overcome the hesitance to take tough counter measures, the worse it is going to get.

We didn't get to this point by accident, it was by design.

[Pantagruel]

12. Putin has executed very effectively

In 2017, news.com.au said that the book "reads like a to-do list for Putin's behaviour on the world stage".[12]

[sagesnow]

5. GRU led by

General Mike Flynn is my guess.

[Trailrider1951]

22. Yep, Flynn is in this up to his eyeballs

https://www.factcheck.org/2017/12/michael-flynns-russia-timeline/

[wishstar]

6. Internet sleuths have found suspicious links to Flynn and Stone

who coordinated with others to amplify the conspiracy to help radicalize Trump's base for 2020 election.

[Wounded Bear]

9. All roads lead to Moscow...

the whole Trump organization has a Russian mob feel to it.

[Mike 03]

24. Fascinating. I was aware of the Flynn hypothesis but hadn't

considered Roger Stone.

[Kid Berwyn]

10. GRU knows how to appeal to many Americans' most basic instinct.

QAnon is a Nazi Cult, Rebranded

by Gregory Stanton
JustSecurity.org, September 9, 2020

Excerpt...

QAnon true believers think Donald Trump will rescue America from this Satanic cabal. At the time of “The Storm,” supporters of the cabal will be rounded up and executed.

The QAnon conspiracy theory has now spread to neo-Nazis in Germany, where over 200,000 German QAnon accounts infest the internet. A faction known as “Reichsbürger,” or citizens of the Reich, orchestrated a brief storming of Parliament on Aug. 29.

Many people are perplexed at how any rational person could fall for such an irrational conspiracy theory. But modern social science shows that people in groups don’t always think rationally. They respond to fear and terror. They blame their misfortunes on scapegoats. They support narcissistic demagogues they hope will rescue them.

In the 1930’s, millions of Europeans were unemployed. Violent battles between Nazis and Communists raged in city streets. Democratic governments were powerless. Fascist dictators ruled Spain and Italy. Hitler took power in Germany and conquered Western Europe. Stalin’s Communists conquered the East. The Hitler-Stalin Pact sealed totalitarian rule over most of Europe. It took World War II and the deaths of millions to defeat the Nazis’ genocidal tyranny, and another fifty years to free the gulags of the Soviet Union.

Today the American people suffer from a Plague. Millions of Americans have lost their jobs. Angry mobs roam American cities and battle militarized police and heavily armed militias. The American government seems to be paralyzed. Dictators rule Russia and China. Islamic fascists rule Saudi Arabia and the old Ottoman and Persian empires. The American President appeases Russia, scapegoats China for the pandemic, and looks the other way as Vladimir Putin and Mohammed bin Salman murder their opponents.

Continues...

https://www.justsecurity.org/72339/qanon-is-a-nazi-cult-rebranded/

[mzmolly]

14. Interesting

read. Thank you for sharing.

[Kid Berwyn]

16. Putin and Co use racism, bigotry, all our worst instincts to divide us.

If knowledge is power, QAnon is one example of the power of disinformation.

Sad so many appear to have lost their critical faculties.

Most importantly: You are welcome, mzmolly!

[mzmolly]

17. Indeed.

I'm perplexed at what we can do, legislatively to address these issues. The misinformation is deliberate and there was an obvious endgame - election interference and beyond.

I agree. Sad and frightening times we live in.

Thanks again Kid Berwyn.

[My Pet Orangutan]

19. Stupidity is the ultimate cover story,

although Palin is another story altogether

[IronLionZion]

15. Qanon is openly boosted by Russian accounts online

that was established months ago
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-qanon-russia/russian-backed-organizations-amplifying-qanon-conspiracy-theories-researchers-say-idUSKBN25K13T

As far as public info, intel analysts/researchers have stated they don't believe Q originated with Russians. Russians just amplify it openly on social media and through RT and other media to take advantage of the situation. Many analysts suspect that Jim Watkins of 8Kun is Q, and that he made it up himself without any actual secret intel officers involved at all.

on a related note, people have posted about the diversity of the capitol raid. The Qanon conspiracy is surprisingly diverse including all types of people: minorities, women, young, old, otherwise liberal activists, generally paranoid people, anti-government types, etc.

[mzmolly]

18. I think Watkins "Q" is on the Putin/Trump payroll.

Either way, we have to find out and address it somehow.

[Initech]

20. I think it's time to cut Russia off from the rest of the internet.

Really they've been doing more harm than good.

[Celerity]

34. And how exactly would you do this?

Besides being basically impossible, the mere attempt would be seen as an overt, officially announced (unlike Russian's cloak and dagger attacks on the US, which they lie about and officially deny) act of war.

[Mike 03]

26. A nugget from Anne Applebaum's book Twilight of Democracy

She points out that oftentimes Russia doesn't originate disinformation, memes or scams, but it is masterful at choosing which ones to amplify, for example: George Soros conspiracy theories, Hillary's "health issues", and almost certainly Q and Hunter Biden.

They apparently did this in Brazil to help get Bolsonaro elected, and have done it in Europe wherever far right organizations and parties are gaining steam.

[Initech]

21. Well he is an evil genius, perfect for the Trump party!

[whttevrr]

30. This is what I thought of...

[SKKY]

23. I don't think Q is GRU, but they are certainly working towards the same goal...

...Russia doesn't know how to deal with a democratic country. They would feel much more comfortable if we were at Autocracy, and their goals are to convert the US to an Autocracy. I suspect.

[Mike 03]

28. I lean towards this too.

There is some evidence it originated with the proprietors of 8Chan.

Identity of "Q"

There has been much speculation about Q's motives and identity. A range of theories credit Q's posts to either a military intelligence officer, a Trump administration insider, an alternate reality game created by the puzzle organization Cicada 3301, or Trump himself.[22][69] The Italian leftist Wu Ming foundation has speculated that QAnon is inspired by the Luther Blissett persona, which leftists and anarchists used to organize pranks, media stunts, and hoaxes in the 1990s. "Blissett" published a novel titled Q in 1999.[114]

Since the Q tripcode was uniquely verified by 8chan's server and not reproducible on other imageboards, and Q did not have another means of communication, Q was not able to post when the website went down after the 2019 El Paso shooting.[115] This apparent conflict of interest, combined with statements by 8chan's founder Fredrick Brennan, the use of a "Q" collar pin by 8chan owner Jim Watkins, and Watkins's financial interest in a QAnon super PAC that advertises on 8chan, have led numerous journalists and conspiracy theory researchers to believe that Watkins[116] or his son, 8chan's former administrator Ron Watkins, work with Q, know Q's identity, or are Q.[37][74][117][118][119] Both Watkinses deny knowing Q's identity.[37][120]

A livestream archive appeared to show 4Chan moderator Coleman Rogers logging in to the 8chan Q account during a Patriot's Soapbox livestream. The feed quickly cut out. Another livestream archive shows Rogers analysing a supposed Q post, before his co-host notes that the post is not verified. Rogers said Q must have forgotten to sign in before posting.[27]

An algorithm-based stylometric approach by Swiss company OrphAnalytics provided evidence that two people likely wrote Q's posts during different periods.[24][25]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QAnon#Identity_of_%22Q%22

[BGBD]

36. This is correct

Q probably started with another user, but the Watkins immediately recognized the potential to profit from it and overtook the tripcode "Q" was posting under and have been using it ever since.

You can read messages known to be from them, particularly Ron Watkins, and they sound exactly like the types of messages posted under "Q".

[Hortensis]

25. Experts now believe Russia's been involved since the beginning.

Or very near to. Also, apparently anyone can act as "Q," adding their own elements to the conspiracy to serve their own agenda, so it's not just coming from the one or two we hear discussed.

[BlueIdaho]

27. One thing is for sure

It’s not a “grassroots” organization. It could easily be a GRU operation. It could also involve the unusual GOP traitorist suspects. I can imagine a joint GRU/GOP operation. It reminds me of the Tea Party on acid.

[FakeNoose]

29. How does Rebekkah Mercer figure into all of this?

She's putting up a lot of dough for Parler and other alt-right organizations. Also Cambridge Analytica, Breitbart, Steve Bannon, the hits go on and on. They don't call her the "First Lady of Alt-Right" for nothing.

I believe the Mercer Family Foundation needs to be investigated.

[Klaralven]

31. "Q" is an Alternate Reality LARP - As American as apple pie

It's a straightforward extension of the American online gaming traditions and technology.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternate_reality_game

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_action_role-playing_game

[My Pet Orangutan]

32. Apple Pie Is Not All That American

the first recorded recipe for apple pie was written in 1381 in England

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/why-apple-pie-linked-america-180963157/

[Celerity]

35. Beat me to it.

[Sogo]

33. How about this guy?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-51236915

The American founder of US-based militant neo-Nazi group The Base is directing the organisation from Russia, a BBC investigation has found.

Rinaldo Nazzaro, 46, who uses the aliases "Norman Spear" and "Roman Wolf", left New York for St Petersburg less than two years ago.

The Base is a major counter terrorism focus for the FBI.

Seven alleged members were charged this month with various offences, including conspiracy to commit murder.

****