Are You Prepared for the Death of a Loved One?

[MineralMan]

Have you made your own plans? If the answer to one or both questions is no, then you need to read this. I wrote it as a reply in another thread, but I decided to create a new thread for it:

Dealing With A Loved One's Death Is Complicated

After both my parents died recently on the same day, my very first task was arranging things with a funeral home and with the cemetery where my father said they had two gravesites. It was far more complex a job than I expected. The funeral home would not pick up their bodies until I had made arrangements with them and had paid for those arrangements. Fortunately, I was able to do so, and my sister's husband kicked in half of the costs.

Then there was the cemetery. They couldn't find the records that my parents owned the gravesites. After a frantic run through a box of their papers, I found the document that recorded the sale of the gravesites to them by someone else. I scanned it as a pdf file and emailed it to them. Then, there was another bill from the cemetery to pay for two burials.

Had it been up to me, I would have chosen cremation, but my father was adamant about being buried, so I honored his wishes.

All of this happened on the same day they died. Fortunately, I knew all of the information that was needed, like my parents' parents names, including maiden names, where they were born, their birthdates, their SS numbers and more. I had created a text file with that information a couple of years ago, just in case.

I also needed an obituary for the funeral home to send to the local newspapers. I wrote that the next day in about three hours, had my wife proofread it, and sent it to them, along with a scan of their wedding photo from 1943. Note: The obituary was long, because it had to be. The total cost for it to appear in two local papers was over $700. Newspapers charge advertising rates for obituaries.

None of the things I had to do immediately were things I wanted to be doing that day. I was in Minnesota and my parents were in California, so everything had to be done by phone and via email. It was a severe test of my patience and ability to keep myself together, frankly. But it all had to be done, and on the day they died.

So, if you can, plan those things in advance as much as possible, and make sure your next of kin folks have all the information readily at hand. That will save them time and stress at the moment they begin to grieve your death. Death is a complicated business for the survivors.

[padfun]

1. One thing I never expected was losing my daughter

That is something that you just cant plan for. I never expected for her to go before me.

Next Friday would have been her 32nd birthday. Happy Birthday Kristi and may you RIP.

[malaise]

40. How sad

No parent expects to bury a child

[Girard442]

2. My father had chronic health problems and had preplanned a lot just like you suggest.

If you want to leave a gift to your heirs, I can tell you from experience, that's a very good one.

[MineralMan]

4. Yes. It is one of the best gifts you can give your next of kin.

If you don't, their pain will be dramatically increased. And, when you do make preparations, make sure they know where those plans are and who to contact.

[Mossfern]

53. My mom did that for me

She gave me a manila envelope and told me that everything I needed "in case" was in it. She had prepaid for everything.
That's the best gift she ever gave me! Of course the casket she had picked out was no longer available and I had to chose a new one, but since we're Jewish, it was quite easy - no frills.

I plan to make it as easy for my children as I can.

[plimsoll]

30. And clean up your memorabilia.

I’m still going through photos and slides from parents, one set of grandparents and one great grandparent. It seems trivial, but in many respects it is the only lasting personal memory that will be preserved.

[FM123]

3. Thank you MM for your generosity in sharing this with us.

I can't help but think how grateful and proud your parents would have been of your efforts after their passing.

Sending you hugs

[MineralMan]

5. And that's just the beginning.

My parents left a sizable estate, in trust. They had also sold their farm, but the sale had not yet closed. Those complications, though, did not have to be taken care of immediately. They will be ongoing for at least a month or even longer. The trust's attorney is going to be sending me a very large bill, I'm sure, but it will be covered. I told him he'd get paid when I can access the assets as the trustee. That is encouraging him to expedite the process.

[plimsoll]

33. I don't know about California,

But assets not in a will or trust still wind up in probate. So that can drag out a couple years.

[MineralMan]

51. Fortunately, that is not the case for me.

[MLAA]

6. Dear MineralMan

Thank you for sharing your experience, it will help others.

From the way you phrased that your sister’s husband paid half, it sounds like your sister has passed as well. You’ve sure had a lot to deal with. My condolences. When my mother died a few years ago I felt such a since of loss because I’d lost one of the two people I’d known my who,e life 💕🙂

[MineralMan]

77. No, my sister is still alive, but has pretty advanced Alzheimer's.

My younger brother died a few years ago, though. His children are part of all of this, as well. In fact, my brother and father were partners in an auto repair business. My father's half-interest passes to his children, so they're also beneficiaries of the trust, as are the other two grandchildren of my parents. We're all exchanging emails, regularly. I'm sending out a group email every day, letting everyone know what's going on and answering questions about things that they bring up.

We all get along very well, and are all friends. There are also a dozen great-grandchildren. My wife and I send each of them a birthday card every year, with a $20 bill in it. Until they're out of school and have their own jobs, anyhow. Four of them are currently in college, which demonstrates how old we all are, I guess.

[MLAA]

98. I love the birthday cards with $20 you are sending.

Brings back such wonderful memories as a kid getting a card with money in the mail!

Alzheimer’s is so, so sad along with dementia. My paternal grandmother suffered from it and now my 90 year old dad is suffering from it. He and his wife (my mom dies about 8 years ago) just moved into assisted living. His memory has progressively gotten worse and recently I’ve noticed other symptoms like lack of patience and illogical thinking. So it is a relief they are in a very pleasant assisted living facility. At 60 I am pretty fearful of following in his and my grandmother’s footsteps. Though I believe I might not suffer long as I think we have pretty much destroyed the planet and it won’t last too much longer 😬

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

7. Periodically this topic comes up here,

and invariably someone will say, "I don't care. I'll be dead." and I just want to smack them.

Everyone should have the joy of dealing with what happens when someone dies.

[MineralMan]

16. Well, many people have real issues in dealing with their own deaths.

They don't make arrangements in advance, because it requires them to think about it. So, all of the stress falls on the survivors. And that stress is not a small thing for most people. In my case, I knew what it would be like, having gone through it with my wife's parents a couple of times. I'm also a very practical person and completely intolerant of nonsense. So, before calling the funeral home (the only one in their community), I visited its website and made all of my decisions before calling them.

Still, though, it is a very, very unpleasant experience to go through, and happens immediately, before you have had any time to process the reality of someone's death.

I went into the process with good knowledge of what I would be facing, but not everyone thinks about those things ahead of time. For them, and especially for people who have strong emotional reactions to negative situations, it can be a horrible experience. I have seen that happen many times with friends who were not prepared at all and were totally wiped out by making those arrangements.

That's why I wrote this thread opener.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

23. I am like you, extremely practical and

completely intolerant of nonsense.

I now have an envelope taped to my refrigerator that clearly says: for EMTs: Health Care Directive. Admittedly, that got put up after my heart attack last month, but I'd already had an updated will, medical POA, and so on, with copies in the hands of my son and my sister.

[MineralMan]

29. My father had no health care directive. He had talked to me, though,

about things he did not want done to him if he was incapacitated and close to death. When they were about to intubate him in the ER, the doctor called me. I had called earlier and left my phone number and demonstrated that I was his next of kin. I explained his wishes to the doctor, who suggested that they simply provide him with palliative care, since he would not survive his case of COVID-19 pneumonia at his advanced age. I agreed, and that was that. He died a few hours later.

We tried multiple times to get him to sign a health care directive, and so did his health care professionals, but he always refused. He knew what he wanted and didn't want, but didn't want to sign a paper to that effect. He was mistrustful of doctors after he passed the age of 90. Of everyone, really, even me, sometimes. He also wouldn't sign a power of attorney. Too bad, really. He had some dementia, but not Alzheimer's, and could be pretty reasonable and made good decisions most of the time, but, he had a fear of signing papers that let others decide. In the end, he left that to me to do.

The one thing he did sign, though, was the papers that put all of their assets into a family trust, with me as the trustee. His attorney convinced him that would save a pile of money when they died. If he could save 50 cents, he'd spend $100 to do that. He was funny that way.

So, as soon as the death certificates are here, I'll be able to consolidate their assets and do what is needful to make sure all of the beneficiaries get their share, according to his wishes in the trust documents.

I think he's behind a couple of years in tax filings, but the cost of their 24/7 health care aides will wipe out their small income from the farm, so they'll owe nothing. I'll tend to that later this year.

[plimsoll]

36. In one respect I envy them.

Life without these ultimate responsibilities must be nice.

[mobeau69]

8. MM, isn't it rigged up so that a cremation is as high as a regular burial?

TIA

[Binkie The Clown]

11. I arranged for cremation of my wife, my aunt, and my mother.

Over a span of about 15 years, the prices went up a bit.
It is a small fraction of the cost of a burial.
My wife wanted her ashes scattered so there wasn't even an urn to buy. total cost was less than $700.
More recently, my mother and aunt had pre-purchased spots for their ashes and a $100 urn was purchased in both cases. Total cost of each, less than $1000.

[mobeau69]

58. Thank you.

[MineralMan]

12. Not really. If you prearrange and pay, and do not want any services

to be held, simple cremation and an urn will cost you between $1500 and $2000 for one person. You get the urn and the ashes, and can make your own arrangements later for memorial services, etc. Scattering ashes costs nothing. No permission is required to do it quietly at some convenient time of your choosing. Many extras can be added, but every one of them raises the cost.

A burial, on the other hand, is going to cost you a minimum of about $7-8000. And that is with the least expensive casket ($1000), no embalming, and no services arranged by the funeral home. Burial in a cemetery will cost at least $2500, minimum. Most cemeteries require a vault ($750 and up). Endowment fees to care for the gravesite and grave opening and closing will run you about $2000, or maybe a little less. If a gravesite is not already owned, you will have to pay for that, as well. I don't know the cost, since my parents had pre-purchased theirs.

The difference in cost is dramatic between burial and cremation without burial of the urn.

Keep in mind that the numbers I provided are for bare-bones arrangements. I guarantee that the funeral home will try to upsell you on the casket, etc. If you want the lowest price, you need to look at the funeral home website, pick out the casket you want (keep scrolling down) and stick with your choice. They WILL try to upsell you. They will also offer you a long list of other services they can provide. To arrange a low price, you absolutely must stick to your guns and not allow upselling. The average price for typical funeral home services runs over $20,000. The difficulty with trying to cut those costs is that you are in a very vulnerable place emotionally, so it's easy for them to push their upselling. I told the place I called what I wanted from the very beginning and told them to save their breath, since I wasn't going to pay for extras. They still tried, though. They stopped, however, when I called them on their emotional shaming and said that if they did not follow my wishes, my next call would be to the state authority that licenses funeral homes. They stopped, gave me a total, and took my credit card information.

Note that if you are a military veteran, you are eligible to be buried in the closest national cemetery at no charge. However, that cemetery may be quite a distance from the place a parent died. Spouses are also eligible for national cemetery burial, but I'm not sure if that's free or not. To take advantage of this, you MUST have a copy of the DD Form 214 or discharge papers if the deceased was a commissioned officer. If you don't have those forms, there will be delays. Your local VA assistance agency can help you with that. In my case, despite my father being a WWII vet, they had already purchased gravesites near where they lived.

[plimsoll]

43. The cremation part is relatively inexpensive,

All the stuff that goes with it add up.

If you plan on traveling by air with cremated remains be sure you keep the paperwork.

One thing I hadn’t planned on was the cost associated with the headstone. My mother wanted to be buried in her home town. We had to ship the headstone, and that is not cheap.

[phylny]

48. Our father just died on 1/11. His family has an underground

lawn crypt in a Catholic cemetery in Brooklyn. Our father was embalmed, but we had no open casket. A simple service and burial with military honors cost $20,000. We wondered how the hell people bury their dead, knowing full well that not everyone will choose a $5,000 casket (middle of the road), have to pay to move the big stone off the stairwell of the crypt, etc.

[MineralMan]

50. It is a huge problem for many people.

Eventually, the local jurisdiction will cremate people and store the ashes until someone claims them. Many people in poverty simply let that happen, which is very sad.

Our funerary traditions in this society are very, very strange, it seems to me.

If you are poor, the government should step up, provide a cremation and simple urn for the family. That, sadly, does not happen in most places.

[mobeau69]

56. Thank you.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

24. I just want to second what MM said here.

My brother died last month, and the cost of cremation (including picking up his body, and shipping the cremains to our sister, came to under $1,000. Burial, especially with any kind of funeral service, will always be vastly higher.

[Mariana]

76. It can be.

When my mother-in-law died, having made no arrangements, my husband had to deal with it. I suggested he shop around a bit, and he found the price varied wildly, with one funeral home charging more than 4 times more than another place, just for the cremation itself. If you plan ahead, you have time to check different places and compare the prices.

[CrispyQ]

9. I'm so sorry for your loss.

[MineralMan]

13. Thanks!

[snowybirdie]

10. Thank you

Your message is important and necessary. I've shared it with my children.
And my sincere condolences in this horrendous time of sorrow to you and your family.

[nini]

14. Dealing with cemeteries is maddening.

I am amazed at how often they have no record of plot ownership and if survivors can’t find their deed - well good luck.

Great post and sorry for your losses.

[MineralMan]

18. It can be, for sure. Fortunately, I found the papers.

Also, the managing director of the cemetery in my home town and one of the members of the board of directors of it are high school classmates of mine, so I called on that relationship to help simplify the process. it's a small town. Everyone there knows my parents and most of them know me, as well.

Burial plot deeds should be kept with other vital papers by everyone. Those papers should also include birth certificates, life insurance policies, military service records, social security cards, and bank account numbers and bank names. Such a stash of papers should be clearly labeled and everyone in the family needs to know where those records are kept.

[nini]

104. After my mom died

We had her deed etc Her wishes were to have my sister eventually be buried with her. She paid for my sisters burial costs etc ahead of time. We had that receipt too. They wouldn’t honor it because my moms trust didn’t specify the exact lot number and had no record of the payment though we had the receipt It was maddening. We got it done but had to get lawyers involved because my sister didn’t want to wait then put the burden on her kids.

It was absolutely avoidable to have to jump through the legal hoops we did. This is a huge cemetery in the LA harbor area and they are evil

[Horse with no Name]

15. Sorry for your losses

I went through this recently. I meticulously made all the plans prior and the funeral home still fucked everything up which caused so much extra grief.
Great tips.

[yellowdogintexas]

20. My sisters, my mom's oldest granddaughter and I prearranged everything

for my mom and prepaid it. Fortunately she had the funds and one of us had full power of attorney.

Mom had Alzheimer's and never knew we had done this, although we all knew exactly what she wanted.

My plans are to follow my husband's grandmother's plan: she donated her body to sciende and there were no costs involved.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

26. My mother donated her body to the cadaver lab at a nearby medical school.

When the students were done with it, they cremated her remains and returned them to us. We eventually scattered her ashes in New Hampshire.

We could have chosen not to have the cremains returned to us. I'm guessing that's pretty much the choice in any such donation of the body.

[BlueDawn]

86. My father-in-law did the same thing.

A year later my husband and I drove to the medical school and picked up his cremains.

We made arrangements for my husband to donate his body to a different medical school. He does not want a memorial service but only a small gathering of his closest family and friends.

I am the one who needs to make arrangements for myself. I really appreciate this thread topic. It is a wonderful reminder that I need to get all things in order for the sake of my own children.

Thank you.

[Stuart G]

17. Sorry For Your Loses, Thank You for Sharing This..

[yellowdogintexas]

19. my aunt & uncle had pre arranged cremation through a cremation society

Cremation is the only thing they do. When they died, I went up to Oklahoma City and picked up their remains. Eventually we got those back to KY for burial in my grandfather's family plot. My mom and one of her stepbrothers arranged joint services for my uncle and the other stepbrother in their hometown. I do not know the cost today but it was less than $800 when they purchased it.

I had copies of the contract with the Cremation Society and all I had to do was call them to pick up the body and then present the contract to pick up the remains.

The contract for the cremation is actually an insurance policy which covers those costs only, and it is good in all 50 states.

My uncle was career military and they let us all know they wanted cremation because they could have been anywhere. After he retired they did the pre arrangement.

[MineralMan]

21. The Cremation Society is a good organization, for sure.

[QED]

22. One of my neighbors died in a house fire two years ago...

He had no will and his family went to war over the house, etc.

This prompted me to get a will written - not that I have much to dicker about but it makes things easier for those left behind in terms of probate. I can't see my family arguing over anything.

I also went through the house and identified important, not necessarily valuable, items from family etc. Some had stories my mom had told me and I wrote these out and placed a copy with the item. It might mean something to my nephews, it might not, but at least they'd know before putting it in the Goodwill pile.

My biggest concern was my dogs. One of mine came from a woman who died whose family didn't want. She would have gone to the pound had a neighbor not stepped in and surrendered her to our rescue. (I began to foster her just before the pandemic hit - we paused adoptions and by the time we resumed, this girl was home. Foster failure #8.)

[marble falls]

25. Our big shock: After my folks spent $20,000 on a prepaid funeral for both of them ...

... they handed my dad a bill for another $12,000 at my mom's viewing.

MM, you've done a wonderful job of doing the right things and holding it together through an exceptional situation - and in a pandemic.

You have my admiration and respect.

[MineralMan]

32. I'm just doing what's needful, really.

Thanks for your kind words, though. They help.

[TexasBushwhacker]

27. And just a reminder, have a will

How could Prince have died without a will?!

Chadwick Boseman died without a will. WTF?
He had a wife. Why complicate things for her?

[MineralMan]

34. People think they'll live forever. That's why.

[bucolic_frolic]

28. Also

passwords, accounts, beneficiaries. I daresay it is possible to die today without anyone knowing you have an online account at so-and-so because you don't get a paper statement anymore. I doubt there is even a requirement in some states for estate or beneficiaries to receive a reconciliation from a financial institution. If assets go unclaimed for several years they can become inactive, liquidated, and given to the state for safe keeping, it's call escheated to the state. They could languish there forever as unclaimed property - earning nothing.

There are still a handful of states with estate taxes. Don't die while a resident of such a place if you can avoid it! Any escape plan that provides a certificate of moving and domicile in a non-tax state is an improvement.

[TNNurse]

31. Excellent advice

with details. My mother died after a long illness. My father died 31 years before her and I know she had help planning then since it was unexpected. But she had been involved in several family funerals since. When she as in the hospital and I thought she would die soon, I made a visit to the local funeral home, the one which had handled my father's arrangements to see what she had planned. The kindly Mr. Patterson said " I had asked Emily about this and she said "My children will take care of it". He looked sympathetic. She lived about 6 months more at home and did not go back to the hospital.

All of her children lived out of state. Actually my brother lives in Canada. I made a folder that sat behind the clock on the mantle. It was shown to those who cared for her at home. The first thing I said to them was that she was to never be sent back to the hospital. She had two terminal illnesses and her existence was minimal. So, if they could not call the ambulance, they needed to not be here. Then, there was a list with phone numbers for whom to call when she died. The law may be different in your state on who should be notified first. So, I started with legal and then to family. I was called first to tell me how she had changed and I said I was on my way. It took a little over 3 hours door to door. Since we had had many elderly relatives, funeral clothes were always ready.

She died before I got home. The person who had cared for her the longest was with her. She had asked on the phone about calling an ambulance, coughing up blood was new. I reminded her to sit with her, wipe her mouth and talk to her. When I got home, they had taken her body and I was told, "You were right, we were here and it was peaceful".


It is going to be hard to lose a loved one, but some planning will help make it a little easier.

Mineral Man, my husband's aunt and uncle died the same day in the same hospital years ago. One was in surgery, the other taken to the ER. Their children handled it by saying "They did not have to grieve for each other". Hope that is a comfort.

[MineralMan]

44. Thanks. I am glad they died on the same day.

My mother could not have understood what had happened, though. Had my father died, she was not to be told. Her dementia was so far advanced that she would not have understood at all.

Death comes to us all, but we are rarely prepared for it. I'm not sure what's to blame for that in our culture. Maybe it's religion or maybe it's just human nature. I'm not sure. My parents were not religious in any way, so I've never quite understood my father's insistence on being buried, rather than cremated. It must come from his parents, long ago.

Our society, with a lot of help from the funeral industry, makes the end of life far more complicated than it needs to be. Cemeteries can demand vaults with impunity. That is a completely useless expense. You can be buried in a place that does not require them, but such a place may be hard to find or unavailable in your area. The funeral industry has been consolidated into being run by just a few companies, despite there being funeral homes in every town. All are almost certainly owned, though, by one of the major companies.

The same industry owns almost all cremation facilities. It's an industry that has a steady stream of customers, sadly, and that has gotten many states to pass laws that benefit the industry financially.

I saw an article recently in our local paper that responded to many questions people have. One of those questions was, "Can I scatter my parent's ashes in the river?" The response in the paper, from a Department of Health official was, "No. Not without a permit. However, nobody is watching the river, so most people just do it. There's no harm from cremated remains, so we don't enforce that rule. I can't tell you it's OK, but we are not concerned if you do." That is sensible, and rare from government agencies.

Many people just keep loved ones' ashes in the urn at home. At an estate sale I went to, there were three urns on a bookshelf. Nobody had noticed them, so I spoke to a relative there and reminded them of that. The relative thanked me and went right away and took them elsewhere.

[TNNurse]

60. I have a double name, Alice Beth

Alice and Elizabeth were my grandmother's baby sisters and lived together all their lives except for college. When they became unable to care for themselves they were in the same room in a nursing home. Elizabeth required more care after awhile and was moved to a different wing. She had some dementia. Alice, the elder, stayed mentally sharp. Alice died first at 90. Had I been there, Elizabeth would not have been told, but the staff did. We hoped Alice would go first since she would have grieved Elizabeth so much. After Elizabeth was told, they observed her maneuvering her wheel chair through a couple of hallways to the door of the room where Alice had been. She rolled inside, sat there for a moment and travelled back to her room, just that one time. No one had any idea she could have found her way there. Their bond was strong.

[OhNo-Really]

35. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️ Condolences 💐😢😢

I’m so sorry for your losses. Nothing prepares for the mourning. I’m crying with you.

Wonderful advice. We had time to because of slow cancer.

But Covid will have many unprepared.

You have provided a wonderful help today.

I made a very bad mistake and didn’t take care of myself for a year because of grief & paid a big price. So please take good care of your body even when you don’t feel like it.

Mourning takes time. {{{HUGS}}}

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[MineralMan]

45. Thanks so much.

[OhNo-Really]

91. Oh. Those tears again. You're welcome

Please reach out if you feel yourself sinking

Also Medicare pays 100% for hospice grief counseling. Probably on line now.

My Moms hospice forgot to mention that to me. As last to survive entire family that would have helped.

[malaise]

37. Great post

Rec

[DeminPennswoods]

38. Having a small life insurance policy helps

My parents both had small life insurance policies that reinvested dividends until the day I needed to make the claim. In both cases the policies covered the entire cost of each funeral. My folks were both cremated, but the urns were not that expensive, around $250 for plain ones. Since my dad was a WWII vet, he and my mom are eligible to be buried in the closest National Cemetary at no additional cost. Both had traditional funerals with viewing, then service. The cost was about $8000 everything included, however, cremation without service is much cheaper, less than $1000.

[kooth]

39. Thank You

First of all, I'm sorry for your losses. Secondly, thanks for posting this -- this is valuable information and we all should be prepared. I find your postings extremely useful.

[Traildogbob]

41. Very eye opening

Thank you. I only have my daughter and want her to have everything. Should be easy, but there are vultures swarming looking to prophet from death.
At this rate there will be no burial site left, the space is needed for Walmart’s, Dollar stores, and Mimi malls. One day cremation may be mandated for all.
Then watch that free market soar.

[MineralMan]

47. Here's a tip for you:

Add your daughter's name to all of your bank and other accounts. When you do, make sure you include the right of survivorship. The banker will know what to do. Your daughter will have to sign a signature card. Also, check your life insurance, if any, and make sure that she is named as the sole beneficiary.

That way, there will be a minimum of delays, and your daughter will be able to write checks on your accounts.

That is easier than setting up a power of attorney, although that is also a good idea.

[Traildogbob]

63. Thank yo so much

No more delays. I will do this ASAP. Much gratitude for your help.

[MineralMan]

64. It's my pleasure.

[flying_wahini]

73. Don't forget the titles to cars, too.

[MineralMan]

79. Yes! My father, bless his heart,

apparently knew he didn't have long, so he signed all of the vehicle titles a few days before he died. They were all in one place in the papers my nephew boxed up and sent to me. None of them are worth much of anything, but it does make it easier to deal with them.

[beaglelover]

42. My dad wrote his own obituary prior to his death. Of course that is not possible for everyone

but it sure was very helpful since us kids didn't have to deal with it on top of all the other things. He had also left us a file with notes of everything which had to be taken care of after his death, who to contact for what, etc. He was very organized like that his whole life. Again, it was very helpful. Must have been the Engineer in him.

[Tracer]

46. One other thing to handle:

A church service, a funeral Mass (for those who want to have one), or a memorial service.

As a Catholic, I needed to prepare for my mother's funeral Mass. Luckily, I was a member of my church's choir and so was grateful to my choir leader who volunteered to provide the music and another member volunteered to sing. My music choices were also accommodated.

The only totally unexpected and unpleasant necessity was that I had to shop for some clothes for my mother to be buried in. She had died in Florida and I'm in MA, so she was sent north. That was a sad and distressing chore.

[MineralMan]

49. Not in my case. I do not believe my parents had been in a church, except

for weddings and other people's funerals, for over 75 years. They were completely non-religious.

There will be no such services. They would hate that.

[cally]

106. Yes, picking out outfit was hard

And the one my Mom picked for herself couldn’t be worn. Funeral Home requires long sleeves. Hard

[Marthe48]

52. My husband and his Mom

were the first ones we had to handle. We had everything in place.

I have most of the things managed for myself, so it is easier for the kids. I have some loose ends and I'm hoping to take care of those after I get the vaccine.

Thank you for taking the time to remind us about end-of-life matters, when you have your own losses to take in.

[MineralMan]

55. Well, I've been writing instructional materials for decades

as a profession, so whenever something happens, I tend to write about it to help others. It's in my nature, I guess.

[Operaweeble]

54. My Spouse, her parents and I all went with The Neptune Society

I am from a small rural community and have an extensive family history. In the rural area by my ancestral home is a small cemetery that rests on a hill over-looking the valley where our thousand acres of farm land are. The graves of my parents, grandparents (both sets), Great-Grandparents and Great-Great Grandparents (Paternal), are up there, and they provide comfort that they are all together. Since it is a rural cemetery, we will all be up there together. The plots were fairly inexpensive, much less than has been quoted by others on DU.

The Neptune Society will pick up your body from where-ever you are in the US, take you to the crematorium of your choice, and take care of the cremation. They also provide a very nice wooden box where you can place the ashes of your loved one. We are all paid for and ready to go when the inevitable happens. I would recommend this for anyone-it does provide peace of mind, and you can also pay for it over time.

[MineralMan]

61. My wife's mother grew up in a small town in South Dakota

All of her relatives are buried in a cemetery next to the church she attended and was the organist for a while.

We retained part of her ashes. The rest were buried with her husband at the national cemetery at Fort Snelling. We called the church in Dakota and were put in touch with the cemetery manager. We told him we would like to bury the retained part of her ashes between her parents graves, if that was possible. "Sure. No problem" the manager said. Just let me know when, and I'll come to help." So, we drove there one weekend and the manager showed up with his pickup truck and a shovel and a rake. He took us to the gravesite and showed us where to dig. He was about 80 years old, and I was only 70, so I carefully cut out a square of sod between the two graves, and dug down until he said, "That's deep enough." We had the little ceramic urn in a wooden box I had made to hold it. It went in the hole and I backfilled and replaced the square of sod. Then, we stood there silently for a few minutes, including the cemetery manager, who explained that he knew her parents and some other relatives.

That was it. No cost. No fuss. We just did it. Then, we drove back to Minnesota.

[Hekate]

94. Perfect

[OMGWTF]

57. Mineral Man, I am sorry for your loss and appreciate you sharing your story

My husband is a USAF veteran and we're both going to be buried at the local veteran's cemetery at no charge to us for the plot and ceremony. Even if I die first, I can still be buried there. We attended a service for his former in-laws at the veteran's cemetery and it was lovely.

[yonder]

59. Thanks for this thread, MM and the posts borne from it.

Again, condolences on the loss of your folks.

My wife and I have made a few arrangements for ourselves, baby steps really. The real problem is my own mom. She doesn't want to deal with any of it or even acknowledge that her time will eventually come. This thread will be helpful in focusing our efforts in that direction.

[Cozmo]

62. MM sorry for the lose of your parents. Very helpful as it's incumbent upon me to plan for my demise

[flying_wahini]

65. Don't forget CostCo sells caskets for about half price of what funeral homes charge.

It was very nice one and they shipped it to funeral home in about 36 hours.
Saved us around $5000. Yes, really.

[MineralMan]

68. At most funeral home sites,

if you scroll down to the very bottom of the list of caskets, you will find a plain, non-gasketed metal casket with a satin lining for less than $1000. At mine, it was available in blue or white. They'd rather sell you a more expensive one, but if you're not having a funeral or graveside service, it doesn't matter, really. Just tell them the model name of the casket and the color, and stick to it.

They won't tell you about that casket unless you know it is there, so do your homework.

[flying_wahini]

74. In our case, the Costco casket was exactly the same casket but $5000 Cheaper.

[CaptainTruth]

66. I'm so sorry for your loss, & thank you for sharing valuable advice.

[Gothmog]

67. We lost my father in law two years ago

It was a mess arranging for the funeral and other issues

[MineralMan]

69. It is, indeed, a mess.

The funeral industry makes it a mess, all for profit.

[roamer65]

70. My mom did a wonderful job.

God bless her soul. She could have a CFO of a major company if she wanted it.

[MineralMan]

71. Good for her! She was taking care of her children.

[roamer65]

72. Everything is in a revocable living trust.

I am conservator and have power of attorney now for dad.

[MineralMan]

81. Perfect. That simplifies everything.

[roamer65]

89. Yup.

I recommend it to everyone.

[cally]

107. Banks make it difficult to gain access to accounts

It was tortuous with multiple arguments and I had power of attorney. Get on accounts!

[roamer65]

108. Nope not ours.

I have full control of everything.

[FakeNoose]

75. This is great advice Mineral Man

I have another bit of advice, for those of us who are still "of sound mind and body..."

Collect all of this info yourself and save your son, daughter or other family member the trouble of having to do it after you are gone. Collect all the necessary info in one file and save it in a useful place that your son or daughter can find on your computer. If it's password protected, make sure they know or can retrieve the password.

We should never rely on luck or fate, we need to make our wishes known. The important info - just as MM lists here on his post - as well as our last will and testament must be easily found or readily retrievable.

I'm going to do it so that my son (my only heir) knows everything he needs to know when the time comes. I'm turning 70 this year, and it's about time I started facing reality.

[MineralMan]

78. Thanks. Glad to hear it.

[Liberty Belle]

80. Thank you, and sympathies on your loss. More important things to keep in mind:

If you don't yet have life insurance but have dependents, please buy a policy if you can.

A family member of ours, with no life insurance, is dying of COVID and he was the sole breadwinner for a large family.

If you have elderly parents, try to get them to agree to provide you with a medical and financial power of attorney, and add you onto their bank accounts.

My parents set up a trust years ago, thankfully. Dad is gone now and Mom has dementia. Dad had the foresight to make me the successor trustee if Mom was no longer able to do so, and the co-trustee as soon as he passed on. I didn't realize this for a long time; it would have helped if he'd told me that. I finally found a copy of their trust when Mom gave me access to a safe deposit box.

Now with access to her account I am able to takeover paying her bills and with medical power of attorney, to make decisions when she is unable to do so.

It's helpful to make sure other family members you trust know where your assets are -- bank accounts, stocks, valuables hidden in the house even, so that nothing gets given away or sold that might have jewelry, money etc. hidden behind a drawer or wherever.

Not all newspapers charge for obituaries and some charge much less than others, so it's worth checking more than one place.

It's helpful to designate one family member to deal with posting on social media and fielding calls etc., so that the person closest to the deceased or who is most distraught does not have to deal with those tasks.

In lieu of flowers consider asking for donations to a favorite charity.

If you know a family who has lost someone and does not have much money, consider setting up a GoFundMe site to help with funeral and medical bills, and their children's future needs.

Take care; I know how difficult this can be.

[MineralMan]

84. Thanks for your additional pointers.

My parents lived in a small town. There's a local weekly paper and a countywide daily paper. That's it. The daily charges a lot. It's how it is surviving, with ad revenues down drastically. The weekly paper doesn't charge much. Since my father was a prominent figure in that town for 75 years, they ran the obituary I wrote on the front page. Since I'm a professional journalist, it was very carefully written and told the story of their lives together, in a way that made it a front page story. They didn't edit it at all. It was all in there.

I had actually written my father's obituary a couple of days before he died, knowing that he wouldn't survive. Then, when my mother died on the same day he did, I had to redo it as a joint obituary. It wasn't really that hard to do, and made it a much stronger story, in the end.

Here's a link to it in the local paper. I've posted it before, but:

http://www.fillmoregazette.com/front-page/former-fire-chief-george-campbell-wife-lawanda-remembered

[GusBob]

82. Oh I went thru this and still am. Hope it doesn't get worse for you like for me

They both had dementia so many of the details of their
Estate are all mixed up lost and confused. Even with a trust it's complicated. Even with will

For instance
A key to a safety deposit box lost. Takes court order to open
Trust documents lost
An IRA nobody knew about
They didn't have a lot of money maybe 100k but it was in a bank in Wisconsin and they had residence in another. Big problem
Dying and sick in and out of hospitals nursing homes and hospice. During COVID. Huge ambulance bills
Trying to cancel accounts, credit card, etc. Trying to pay taxes

Mineral Man not to make light but funeral arrangements and obits are a piece of cake. We are on our 4th lawyer, 3 gave up

Plan for the estate, not just funerals

I spend entire days on the phone

[MineralMan]

85. My parents had an excellent attorney, who I'm working with now.

Actually, I talked my father into creating the trust almost a decade ago, explaining how it would help keep taxes down in the end. He got recommendations for attorneys from other farm owners in the area and chose this one.

It is a complicated estate, but the trust is very clear and has appendices listing every asset, with account numbers, etc. I'm just waiting for death certificates to arrive. The rest will go quickly.

I had all the trust documents, as did the attorney. I'm doing a lot of the paralegal work involved. The attorney laughingly asked me the other day if I wanted a job at his firm. Apparently, I'm handling things pretty well. I had to decline the job offer, though. I'm 75 years old and not looking for work.

[LovingA2andMI]

83. Most Individuals Aren't Prepared at All....

They avoid subjects like obtaining Life Insurance when the costs can be optimally affordable (before a Critical Illness or Many Comorbidities impacting their health) or avoid Final Expense Insurance (Due to a desire to not plan in advance for what we all will face one day -- death).

This leads many families in a last minute scramble attempting to take care of the final arrangements of a loved one.

Avoidance is truly not an option in the age of COVID and every person need to have either Whole, Term or Universal Life or Final Expense plan to ensure the loved ones left behind are not stuck figuring out what to do while grieving the passing of their loved one.

Visit the following link to discuss a plan (Whole, Term or Universal Life Insurance and/or Final Expense) or obtain a quote.

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

87. All my ducks are in a row to make it simple for my SO

to deal with all the business of my kickin' off.

Great post, thanks.

[MineralMan]

88. That's great!

[Colorado Liberal]

90. My partner passed away unexpectedly Thanksgiving weekend

We talked any number of times about what our wishes were, but neither of us have a will, no medical orders in writing, and the entirety of the documentation I have to go on is a text message with what she wanted done with her inheritance from her parents. We were having a normal conversation at 3 in the afternoon, and by the time I arrived at the ER at 5, she was gone.
I'm probably not over the shock of it all yet, but there were so many unexpected turns: getting a call from the coroner that same evening because they were trying to track down her medical history (and she hated to go to doctors), trying to track down the contact information for everyone who needed to know what had happened (still finding people who don't know), discovering an unknown to anyone storage unit...
It's mentioned elsewhere in the thread, but my experience is that the cell phone company will not get you access to the deceased's phone, the e-mail provider will not get you access to their e-mail - if all of your records are electronic, you need to leave behind some list of passwords, access codes, PIN numbers, whatever in case of your passing. I finally got her credit union to give me hardcopies of a few months worth of statements so I could try to derive what bills were getting auto-debited, so I could then try to call the billers to explain what had happened.
You discover the innate goodness in so many people, and we were blessed with a lot of good friends, all of whom offer their help at every turn. But there is so much to be dealt with that no one can really help with. COVID has of course only made things worse; I was able to get her remains cremated in accordance with her wishes, but there are so many people who would want to attend a celebration of her life that there is no choice but to wait until circumstances are better and people can gather together without restrictions. It's going to be months (years?) before everything can be taken care of.
Sorry about the rambling post, but thanks MM - your lessons learned are spot on. Death is VERY complicated for the survivors.

[MineralMan]

99. Thanks for sharing that.

[Blue_true]

93. The deaths of both parents is the hardest.

I understand what you are going through and will go through because I have been there. Believe it or not, you will feel better in a year from now and be more reflective on the meaning of life and relationships.

After my parents passed, I learned to accept that death is our destiny, so how we live life is important. In the last year and a half, I have lost a sister and two nephews, instead of sorrow, I learned to celebrate their lives and be closer and more understanding of the living members of my family.

[MineralMan]

100. Yes. Thanks!

[Hekate]

95. Thank you so much for starting this topic, MM

The experiences everyone is sharing will prove invaluable to more people than you can know.

As before, condolences on the loss of your parents. Even when expected and in the fullness of old age, it’s hard to lose that link in the chain to one’s past.

[MineralMan]

101. Sharing what I learn is what I do. It always has been.

[h2ebits]

96. I am sorry for your loss

and thank you so much for opening this discussion. My brother died unexpectedly on October 30 but he had prepared well in advance having had the family responsibility of handling the affairs of my father, mother, and three aunts over the years. As traumatic as his sudden death was for all of us, his wife and two children had detailed instructions and plans already made with a funeral home to ease them through the process. My sister-in-law said that it was a surreal experience trying to cope with everything even with so much already completed.

(Due to COVID-19, we plan to get together for a celebration of life later this year when we are vaccinated and it is safer to travel.)

While I have my will and other important documents completed, I have not taken any steps in preparing for the actual end of life process. Although the thought has crossed my mind regularly, I have brushed it aside each time until I see another burial method pop-up online besides standard burial or cremation.

I have read through the comments and copied your opening discussion remarks, as well as some other comments in this thread, into a document for planning purposes. I hope that no one has a problem with my method of organizing my thoughts and plans using information provided here as a checklist. I particularly liked the comment regarding cremation since it provided me with the information I needed that enables me to make some plans free of having to deal with a funeral home and/or cemetery until a little later in the process. I also appreciate the comments regarding up-selling attempts. I have worked hard for my money and would like my kids to inherit as much of it as possible. As such, my pragmatic self wants my end of life to be accomplished as cheaply as possible.

My thanks to each of you who have shared your thoughts.

For anyone who does not have a Will, Living Will, Durable Power of Attorney, and Durable Medical Power of Attorney already completed, I urge you to take care of these documents immediately. It took me a long time from start to finish because there are many decisions to be made and trying to make all of them at the same time is exhausting. Important to remember is that these documents are a point in time and as your life goes on and things change, the documents can and should be changed to accommodate your life. Many form documents exist online to help you and my best suggestion is to start with a document called "Five Wishes."

[MineralMan]

102. Thanks for your additional ideas.

[Delmette2.0]

97. Thank you MM.

My 39 year old son died in his sleep in the middle of the day while I was taking care of my 91 year old Mother. He had Muscular Dystrophy. I was numb, grief stricken, feeling guilty for not watching over him better. It left funeral arrangements up to his younger brother who knew nothing about what to do.

I have made my son joint owner or beneficiary on on my financial accounts. I sold my house to him just enough to pay off the mortgage. I have made a book of documents, my "treasures" and the story that goes with them.

The one thing I haven't done is make my funeral arrangements. I am doing that this week!

He doesn't want to know all these little details, aka Mom is preparing to die. But we all will go some day. Make the process as easy as we can for the one we leave behind.

[MineralMan]

103. You're very wise.

[cally]

105. Things I learned after handling my Mother's affairs

Sorry for your loss and thanks for the thread. I thought we were prepared but not really. My Mom was 90 and in full control of herself til the end. I had gone with her and set up a Trust, she had bought a burial site (I knew where the papers were), I was executor and knew where the records were.

Big mistakes: I only had immediate access to her checking account and not her other assets. We hired a home health care towards the end and I could not transfer funds into the checking. Also, to cover all the funeral expenses and other costs. I was very worried towards the end and my Mom was near the very end of life and I wasn’t sure any bank would allow her to transfer funds. Get on the accounts if loved one has assets!

Things done right:

She had a trust and only one executor. Much easier.

She told me what she wanted in a funeral service.

I asked my Mom if she was willing to have an estate sale when she died. She said yes and when both and my sisters tried to argue that this was too invasive, I pointed out that she was willing. (60 years in the same house. Lots and lots of stuff)

After family took what they wanted, I hired an estate firm that handled it all. Literally—ALL. Swept empty house and hired junk company to take away what did not sale. We pretty much broke even but so much easier to empty the house.

You will need detailed information on all heirs.