Some thoughts on Manchin's notion that he thinks some eligible citizens don't need the add'l $1,400

[Stinky The Clown]

Last edited Tue Jan 26, 2021, 03:57 PM - Edit history (1)

I kinda agree with him or at least am willing to hear more. Here is my thinking right now.

Let's start with anyone who is able to work from home and who is continuing to get paid a full salary or wage. They probably don't need the money. Yes, it would be nice to get it, but the fact is, it is likely a windfall.

There are, of course, exceptions. Those who are still working but incurring costs due directly to the pandemic might be exceptions. As but one small example of such expenses would be a UPS driver who has to buy N95 or genuine KN95 masks at two bucks a pop, plus gloves and hand sanitizers and other PPE, should not have to bear those extraordinary added costs. Teachers forced back to the classroom are similar. Let's not even try to discuss front line health care workers. Et cetera.

So how about excluding those working from home at the same salary as before? The mechanism to include/exclude would be initially cumbersome, I suspect, but it can be done.

As I said above, I am willing to consider this, but I am not convinced it is a good idea, or workable.


Thanks for the discussion. Lots of excellent points. This is one that is best left simple. $1,400 to all up to the limits already stated.

[LizBeth]

1. It would be hard to sort that out, a lot of wasted time. And though it may be a windfall,

it will be useful for a reboot to the economy so not a waste.

[stopbush]

27. This

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

2. Take into consideration the fact that the payments have two purposes:

(1) To help people who are out of work or otherwise really need the cash, and (2) to stimulate the economy. So even if you don't especially need the money you will probably spend it, which means other people will get more money and the economy in general will benefit.

[hauckeye]

3. I don't need the money, I'm retired on Social Security

I’d rather see those who really need it get the checks

[Walleye]

9. Unfortunately it's not an either or situation. If you don't get the money doesn't mean another will

[ooky]

21. Give yours to the needy in your area.

[Bengus81]

23. Give yours to your local foodbank. Problem solved

[Walleye]

25. That's a good solution

[hauckeye]

34. I think I we will- good idea

[soothsayer]

4. It's supposed to stimulate the economy, isn't it?

So I’d think that giving it to everyone (even the employed) would see that money going back into the economy. These things trickle up, which is the only direction trickling seems to work.

I do love the countries who just kept paying like 80% of salaries.

[Walleye]

8. 👍

[redstatebluegirl]

5. I always think of a young guy in our neighborhood.

He worked as a "contractor" for an oil company. That is what they do to keep from having to pay workman's comp and unemployment. He was laid off in April and hasn't been able to find anything since. He has 2 young children, his wife cleans a hotel so her income has been really curtailed. The neightbors are aware of their situation and those of us still working or able to, hire him for odd jobs to try and keep some food on the talbe and a roof over their heads. This is the family that really needs the stimulus money. He doesn't show up on the unemployment rolls because he doesn't qualify for it. There of tons like him down here.

Don't give me the "I bet he's a republican and deserves it" crap I hear on here. He is a human, a father, a husband and he deserves better from his country.

[Walleye]

6. How would we even work that? Sounds like the kind of complications a much needed bill

I could be wrong but it seems to me that that would lead to a whole new level of bureaucracy, when the unemployment websites can’t even keep up now. Better to get that money into peoples hands as fast as possible. We don’t want to have to judge deserves it and who doesn’t. It’s not like the money we don’t send, to the people we decide don’t need it, would go to some other worthy cause.

[Jerry2144]

7. I would rather

I would rather 100 people who don’t need it get the money then have one person not get it who really needs it because the need is very real. And those who don’t need it will spend it, save it, or pay down some debt.

[Walleye]

10. 👍Spending money locally creates jobs

[Yavin4]

11. Did Amazon need Trump's corporate tax cut? n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

40. +1000000!

[Bettie]

12. Bottom line: Getting money into the hands of those who will spend it

will create economic activity and boost the economy.

[JT45242]

13. What about married couples with different circumstances?

I am working from home. My take home pay has not been affected but some ancillary benefits have been removed. So, in the short term I am OK.

On teh other hand, my wife has had her income cut 75% by the pandemic and reduction in her job.

I make more than she does and we always budget off my salary and use her money for lifestyle (eating out, camp for kids, etc) and emergencies. So, we are still paying all our bills.

But -- multiple emergencies over the past year that her pay couldn't pay for... what then?

Makes sense to put a cap at say $200K for a family based on the living wage index. https://livingwage.mit.edu/
Multiple the $200K by living wage local/16.54 (for a family of four)

Adjusts for high or low costs of living in a fair way.

[Brown Feather]

14. The more complicated you make things

The greater chance of people falling through the cracks. Just make it a straight income income cap and send out the checks.

My wife is Paramedic and I am a Letter Carrier we both have been working 12-15 hour days, 7 days a week, both of us had Covid as did all of our friends and coworkers because we are considering Essential workers and forced to work.

It would really piss off a lot of people who had to be out in this pandemic daily to be told you don't deserve the stimulus.

[obamanut2012]

19. 100% this

I put my health on the line almost every day to do my job.

[Demsrule86]

16. I agree in that 300,000 income is to high to get stimulus. I would prefer to see more for the

unemployed even though hubs is back at work. Kids are going hungry.

[cannabis_flower]

17. Another consideration

Some of us used available credit cards to pay bills and other needs when schools closed (I was a substitute teacher) and people quit going to bars and restaurants ( I was an Uber driver). I have a new job. I don’t make quite as much as those 2 jobs together and each of these stimulus payments helps me pay down those credit cards.

[obamanut2012]

18. It is supposed to stimulate the economy, so everyone needs it

And, if the cutoff is say, $50k: that's a really good salary in a rural area, but in SOFL that amount barely gets you a room in someone's house. You need a roommate here if you make less than 60K or so, and that 60K means you have a studio, with a ten-year car and you can't buy people Xmas presents.

And, what if you make good money but your roommate or fiance lost their job, so you are carrying most of teh bills?

And, again, if you don't need the money, others do, so go buy a new computer or bike, get delivery from a local place every day until it runs out, or give it to charity.

The only people who say we need to try and decide who needs it obviously are doing okay. Under your and others' means testing, many, many folks who desperately need it don't need it. You are wrong.

I have a job. My roommate had their hours cut, so I am paying more than I used to, but there is zero way for you or Manchin to find that out, because on paper, I don;t need a "windfall," nor does the economy.

[Wounded Bear]

20. He's kind of right, but so what?

Money has been flowing upwards to the 1%-ers for decades. More money to low and mid-income folks gets the economy moving far more than any "trickle down" bullshit.

The USA needs a HUGE dose of "socialism"... like right fucking now.

[SheltieLover]

22. This!👆

[Bengus81]

24. How would Manchin even have a CLUE as to who "needs it"??

I don't FUCKING think he "needs" nearly $200K per year and perks out the ass including PREMIUM health care for a pittance.

[Karma13612]

35. I wish someone would record him saying those words

And then broadcast it on every channel in every part of his state. Mostly the rural poor areas. Betcha they would be THRILLED to know that the DINO they vote for term after term feels this way.

[Bengus81]

38. Yep...keep wondering when that asshat is finally going to jump to the GOP

[ananda]

26. While that is true, do we make others suffer for it?

???

[aikoaiko]

28. I'm fine with Manchin posturing, but then he needs to vote for it.

[panader0]

29. I just looked it up and West Virginia is the third poorest state per capita in the US.

So I'm sure many of his constituents would disagree.
I heard something on the tube today about setting a $75,000 limit on who can get funds.
I'm on SSecurity and get $870 a month. I wouldn't complain about a check.
How much did the trump and kushner get the first time for PPP? Millions.

[Kaleva]

30. I live on SSDI and I don't need it.

The $16,164 I get annually more then meets my needs. But I'm not going to return it if they do deposit that into my account as I'll use it to pay for upgrades to the home and such as I did with past amounts received.

This probably indicates how complicated it would be to disburse the money based on need.

[Karma13612]

31. The PPP was an utter

Disaster when it was rolled out.
There were very vague, muddy guidelines.
Money never got to small businesses. It went thru banks who sometimes limited their fund distribution to only bank customers, etc. Fraud was rampant.

Trying to slice and dice who gets a check based on your proposal would be so cumbersome, as you say. And I was shocked that so many people who were unemployed were getting paid well beyond what they were used to.

Technically, hubby and I didn’t need the stimulus money. We are retired, on fixed incomes and live close to the vest. No money wasted, no surplus. We don’t spend a lot so during this pandemic, we have hardly changed our spending habits....up until the stimulus money.

We decided to use it to pay for a 4 month winter away from NY-21. We are living in snow free North Carolina on the Emerald Isle crystal coast.

Every bit of the stimulus money, along with our tax refund from 2019 (my last year of work) has funded the trip, and it’s all been spent. Lots of food stores, restaurants, hotels and a home owner (who we are renting from) have been happy with getting our money. We are helping the economy tick over.

[liskddksil]

32. We don't have time for these who needs it / who doesn't need it discussions. Time is a wasting nt

[LAS14]

37. We'd better discuss it if it's a way to get Manuchin on board. nt

[theaocp]

33. Ridiculous to penny-pinch at this time.

It can be dealt with during tax collections if it's actually an issue.

[LAS14]

36. I've heard that one reason for not changing the cutoff amount is increased...

... difficulty in distribution. Is the cutoff amount tied to some other governmental cutoff that is already being tracked?

[Mr.Bill]

39. The only reason republicans gave us the first stimulus check

is they knew putting that money into the economy would help the stock market. Now they will try and keep us from getting another check for the same reason. They are not going to do anything to help the economy while Biden is president.