UPDATE: Seth Abramson scoop: Private mtg Jan 5 evening at Trump Hotel International D.C.

[Grasswire2]

Last edited Tue Jan 26, 2021, 10:29 PM - Edit history (1)

[link:https://sethabramson.substack.com/p/january-5-meeting-at-trump-international|


[link:http://

Link to tweet

?s=20|


UPDATE: Confirmation from another source.

[link:http://

Link to tweet

?s=20|

[FM123]

1. Good article at the Proof, long but def worth the full read.

In attendance at the intimate and only recently uncovered meeting, conducted “in the private residence of the President” at his hotel, were the following individuals (Note: Trump’s presence at the meeting remains unclear, so he is temporarily absent from this listing):

Donald Trump Jr., eldest son of the president

Eric Trump, second-eldest son of the president

Michael Flynn, former National Security Advisor to the president

Peter Navarro, Assistant to the President, Director of Trade and Manufacturing Policy, and National Defense Production Act Policy Coordinator

Corey Lewandowski, 2016 Trump campaign manager

David Bossie, 2016 Trump deputy campaign manager

Adam Piper, executive director of the Republican Attorneys General Association

Tommy Tuberville, United States senator from the State of Alabama

[ok_cpu]

2. Tuberville appears to be a useful idiot's useful idiot. n/t

[Initech]

21. He's a stupid person's definition of a stupid person.

[AZ8theist]

28. I think you're giving him too much credit....

[Qutzupalotl]

83. Or a stupid person's definition of -- what was the question again?

And what's a “definition”?

[Bev54]

41. He definitely should not be allowed to be apart of the trial

He, along with at the very least Hawley and Cruz should be recused.

[trof]

46. Now y'all jus' hold awn, ah say hold awn theah

Wah Tommy is the Pride of Alabam.
Yes he is.
Y'all need to quit bein' ugly and stop pickin' awn him.

[lagomorph777]

4. Turd himself was probably on speaker phone.

[erronis]

23. At first I thought you meant the other turd: Rove - blossom turd

It's hard to keep all the (r)epuglicon shits separate!

[AdamGG]

35. Compared to Dump, Rove is an endless meadow of roses

and Rove is a piece of shit.

[lagomorph777]

76. Donald J Turd, disgraced ex-President

[Ferrets are Cool]

8. Thank you

[Bernardo de La Paz]

81. Lewandowski was civilian appointee at Pentagon, group that BLOCKED NG troops

DC National Guard was hobbled by those civilian appointees / Chris Miller acting Secretary of Defense. The Guard would normally have been able to roll in response to a request, by the command of the commander.

But the tRump appointees explicitly took that authority away from him in the days just before the Insurrection.

Then they were slow to release the Guard. Multiple requests were ignored, until I think it was the Vice President who authorized them. But the party line is that tRump finally authorized them, in which case the question is why was he so slow? We know he was watching coverage.

[triron]

86. WTF is the goddam media?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

87. Reporting on stuff. So much stuff, it gets buried. But I agree. This is very important to report on

Note: I posted because I had read reports in the "goddam" media.

[triron]

89. Guess ok.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

90. More connections re those attendees, from article

That Herbster would have access to Trump’s inner circle is clear. But less clear is why the Trumps had invited, to a private residence outside the White House—and on the eve of an insurrection—

(1) Michael Flynn, a man who that very day had organized a D.C. rally to protest the 2020 election, and would the next day conjoin his Jericho March with the Stop the Steal/March to Save America that Trump was to speak at;

(2) Peter Navarro, a man who would later say on live television that he believed Trump had the unilateral authority to postpone Biden’s inauguration;

(3) Tommy Tuberville, the U.S. senator who in a matter of hours Trump’s personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani would be calling by telephone to demand that he fraudulently contest ten states’ Biden electors (far more than the five Giuliani had publicly declared contestable);

(4) Adam Piper, who in a matter of days would resign from the Republican Attorneys General Association when it was found that he had helped orchestrate robocalls advertising the Stop the Steal/March to Save America event; and

(5) Trump’s former campaign manager and deputy campaign manager—Corey Lewandowski and David Bossie, respectively—two men known for their bareknuckle politics and (in Lewandowski’s case) an alleged penchant for violence (see here, here, and here).

Meanwhile, the presence of Trump’s personal attorney at the meeting all but ensures that Trump himself was aware of the event.

https://sethabramson.substack.com/p/january-5-meeting-at-trump-international

[Cha]

100. TY for this.. if it was so "secret".. how

was it discovered?!

ETA~ Leakers!?

Hope they have to pay.

[C_U_L8R]

3. Bring evidence and witnesses to the impeachment trial.

All of it. For however long it takes.

[bullimiami]

14. Evidence for the treason trial.

These bastards took a hard right at Election Challenge City and went straight to Treasonville.

My belief against the death penalty is wavering.

Fucking Tuberville. He’s as stupid as the earth is flat.

[littlemissmartypants]

37. Don't you mean as the world is round?

'cause it's not too flat...
❤ lmsp

[bullimiami]

45. Naw. They're a bunch of flat-earthers. Or I could have said Sure as Abraham rode his dinosaur.

[awesomerwb1]

5. Doesn't Abramson strike out a lot?

Hope this is true and that trump was there. But...........

[Grasswire2]

6. huh? nt

[Zoonart]

7. Traitor Flynn's prints are all over this.

[DrToast]

36. IMO, not very credible

[KayF]

9. how does DU feel about Seth Abramson?

I have very strong negative feelings about him, and about this tweet, is this a welcome topic of discussion?

[GusBob]

12. Im with you. It took me awhile to realize that

but lately I am seeing things jaded when it comes to him

he went on and on about Trump breaking the law with the Georgia phone call

he doesnt ever seem to be right about anything

[KayF]

17. thanks

good to hear someone's with me. No need to belabor it I guess, it is what it is.

[Grasswire2]

27. you gotta be kidding.

End of discussion.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

82. Do you think this image is a deep state deep fake? (part of the report)

[KayF]

92. No

Why would the deep state or anyone fake that pic?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

93. Yet you feel Abramson is a fake. Hmmm. . . . nt

[triron]

95. +1000

[KayF]

96. More exploitative than fake

Imho

[stopdiggin]

97. I've felt the story is a little thin

And that would be somewhat in keeping ...

Not denying there was a gathering ... So, okay .....?
(guess we'll see)

[Demsrule86]

20. Sure OK...whatever.

[GusBob]

22. There are at least 3 other posters in this thread questioning his veracity

I believe one is allowed to have opinions you may not agree with

Edit to add "at least" now the count is 5

[Demsrule86]

26. Yours was the first I saw...see no reason to repeat myself.

[Grasswire2]

29. 55 recs, to 5 people here who have some kind of a beef with Abramson.

Plus the untold number of books he's sold.

And his 928 THOUSAND twitter followers.

[reACTIONary]

34. Twitter followers? Boy that's convincing. nt

[Grasswire2]

47. Just stop.

Either disprove what Abramson wrote, or take your grief somewhere else.

What's the point in just heckling?

Huh?

[reACTIONary]

54. Disprove what? That, as reported elsewhere, some republican big wigs met...

... the night before the their big rally? And, as reported elsewhere, discussed strategy and tactics? Of course they did. So what?

All Abramson added to that was some speculative innuendo. He didn't "prove" anything, so there is nothing to disprove.

Disapprove, however, I do of "reporting" of such a low standard. I think we can do better, and I hope that by pointing it out we will move in that direction.

And I apologize for the crack about twitter. Twitter is another of my hang ups, and it was just too tempting.

[Grasswire2]

56. He's not a reporter. He's an investigative writer, lawyer, professor.

But you keep right on with your righteous self. (Your credentials, again?)

[reACTIONary]

61. You are right, he isn't a reporter...

... he claims to be a "curatorial journalist".

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/22/trump-russia-too-complex-to-report-we-must-turn-curatorial-journalism#:~:text=This%20is%20where%20emerging%20models,germane%20reporting%20from%20other%20sources.

[Dorian Gray]

72. There is no need to disprove it

I think Abramson has put forth MANY threads in the past that seemed hopeful but didn't lead anywhere. And in this case, it seems promising and problematic.

But will it go anywhere? Will the impeachment managers link to this? Will the news pick up on this meeting? Is there real proof that this happened and they conspired?

Preaching caution when a lot of SA's threads fizzled to nothing in the past isn't a bad thing.

He has a load of twitter followers. WHOA! So did Trump. That doesn't mean much. People follow people they want to hear.

If there is real proof of wrongdoing here (and there very well MAY BE), then it will hold up to investigation and questioning.

But I caution is warranted. Don't get wrapped up in this narrative and believe it is true without that investigation and questioning. Because that leads to disappointment. People who have followed his threads for years can tell you that. He's had many that have led nowhere in the past. (Wrong doing may have been there and likely, but it came to nothing.)

[TwilightZone]

42. How many Twitter followers did Trump have?

Number of Twitter followers is beyond meaningless.

[triron]

60. Tell it!

[BGBD]

25. I agree

He never gets it right.

[VidH]

65. He was correct about that.

Seth Abramson was correct the call violated Georgia law. That Donald Trump has not yet been indicted for it does not mean SA, a professor and attorney, was incorrect.

My problem with Seth Abramson is that he typically packs his facts and inferences into one big slushball, so as you start digging into the facts, you confront his biases and excitable personality. '

But the facts are solid here. A major group of plotters met at the TIH the night before the attempted coup.

What they said or did we don't know. But multiple participants confirm they were there. Sen. Tuberville has been caught lying about it while his spokesperson told the truth.

And a video by a participant says "several senators" were there.

About which: Seth Abramson leaps to the conclusion we don't know the names of multiple other senators in attendance. I think that's an example of him running with inferences: In fact, the attendee who made that video just might have been exaggerating or wrong, with Sen. Tuberville in fact the only one.

[triron]

16. Then don't read it. WTF!?

[DeminPennswoods]

18. At first, he seemed credible, but

over time, not so much. I think there's usually a grain of truth, but he usually goes on to exaggerate the impact or event. To me, he's in the same category as Scott Dworkin.

[FreeState]

24. Agreed

unfortunately he seems to feed into the talking points we want to hear, whether they are true or not.

[reACTIONary]

33. He practices what he calls "curatorial journalism" which...

... seems to mean presenting other peoples reporting slathered in innuendo and speculation.

Like this article. Where's the beef?

[Takket]

38. he says a lot of stuff for clicks but very little of it do i ever see actually being proven true

[moonscape]

39. I don't use or see him as a

source of information so mostly ignore. Instructing in CAPS to be retweeted and to subscribe pretty much validates why I stay away.

[TwilightZone]

44. He tends toward the sensational.

I generally takes what he posts with a grain of salt and look for corroborating evidence/analysis.

[Dorian Gray]

71. I stopped paying attention to him last year

He had long long posts that I thought were well sourced. But then I realized he's not in an official position and is sort of a less toxic Louise Mensch. Putting out guesses and trying to back them up with long ass threads that support his narrative, but he's very singularly focused and doesn't allow for variables. I would need to see this picked up by more mainstream news outlets for any faith that this is going somewhere.

[marble falls]

80. Don't mock him by gender, race, orientation, faith, national origin, don't slam Democrats ...

... promote a Republican candidate over a Democratic candidate, post off the wall conspiracy or woo.

Should be good.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

84. And perhaps you think this is ANOTHER deep state deep fake?

First: https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=15014878

[chia]

91. Coincidentally, I just saw this tweet about him in my timeline this morning

Link to tweet

?s=20


and it reminded me that I'd unfollowed Abrams a long time ago after one too many "please RETWEET"s

[mtnsnake]

94. Someone from Daily Kos agrees: "Please don't cite Seth Abramson as a source -- for anything"

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/12/18/2002883/-Don-t-cite-Seth-Abramson-as-a-source

[chia]

111. Thanks for that, it seals the deal for me.

[Kid Berwyn]

101. I have a very positive feeling, based on the facts.

Education

Ph.D., University of Wisconsin
J.D., Harvard Law School
M.A., University of Wisconsin
M.F.A., University of Iowa
B.A., Dartmouth College

https://online.unh.edu/person/seth-abramson

There’s a reason his reporting isn’t perfect: it’s often ahead of everyone else’s.

[TomVilmer]

105. He jumps to strong conclusions very fast...

Though I like his collection of quite good evidence, it is not as strong as he then claims:

"... How could a “peaceful” gathering of Trump voters standing well off Capitol property possibly have exerted “pressure” on members of Congress"? They "... could only exert extraordinary pressure on members of Congress if the participants in those events illegally entered Capitol grounds."

OR - like any other peaceful demonstration, hope to add pressure just by showing up in great numbers outside. Well, more did happen, but his argument above would not hold in court.

[VidH]

107. It's Abramson's embellishments that undermine his otherwise solid reporting

To wit:

In my first post here, I suggested he was embellishing an inference of extra senators at the meeting into a fact.

Then I reread, and no, he had only written that there were suggestions of other senators there.

BUT TODAY: HE ASSERTS THE EXISTENCE OF TWO MORE SENATORS AT THE MEETING.

But of course, when Mr. Beck said "several senators" in his own video he might have been wrong or exaggerating. Not for the ever-excitable, who, having inferred those extra senators, after 24 hours has turned them into attendees he claims he knows were there.

I WROTE MR. ABRAMSON TO SCOLD HIM ON THIS, REMINDING HIM THAT JOURNALISM IS NOT A LEGAL ARGUMENT OF PREPONDERANCES AND DOUBTS, BUT DOCUMENTING FACTS.

And I am quite certain he does not care, because that is his M.O.: get his facts right, embellish them, insist the embellishments are true, then rant how nobody gives him credit for cracking stories HE HAS NOT FULLY REPORTED AS HE CLAIMS.

[malaise]

10. K & R

Truth will out and it will not be pretty

[spanone]

11. They directed it all....I have little doubt

[GeorgeGist]

13. Very interesting.

[magicarpet]

15. Roger Stone wasn't the master of ceremonies of this Fascist get together ?

No Bannon ?

[MartyTheGreek]

19. And on that fateful afternoon, Princess Ivanka tweeted to the Insurrection: "American Patriots."...

...then deleted the tweet! You can see when the Family was gleefully watching the video of the mob under the white tent; they were dancing and apparently hoping that it was gong to be a successful Coup d'état day!

And, if the requested orders from DC Capitol police to the Pentagon and replied to the negative by Trump appointees, and this stand down was designed as part of the plan to allow the mob to turn it into an insurrection, then the planners and all involved should pay dearly!

Who the Fuck Planned to trap them in the Basement and "Turn on the gas?" As, was noted in one chat.

Lock Them Up ASAP!

[bucolic_frolic]

30. Nothing spells revolutionaries like suits and sparkling dresses - they never get their hands dirty

Insurrectionists throughout history would be absolutely ashamed of these princely cowards.

[monkeyman1]

31. re-activate flynn

re-activate Flynn & court Marshall him. take his benefit's & try him for treason against the U.S. . put a end to this bull shit trump started !! pres. donny putin & kgop need a big giant going away party !!! i would donate to a new prison for them. i'm sure we could get a " GO-FUND-ME " going on this ?????????

[asiliveandbreathe]

32. I hope the impeachment managers take this info and investigate the hell out of it..

Trust but verify..and if necessary subpoena the assholes..

[Fiendish Thingy]

40. This really isn't a scoop, just an interesting tidbit worthy of further investigation

On its own, without further details or corroboration, it’s almost useless, except as guidance for congressional and FBI to investigate further.

Nobody is going to jail based on this story alone.

[groundloop]

43. Very true....but I can certainly see the possibility of this meeting being tied to the coup attempt

[Grasswire2]

59. It sounds like the same M.O. as the "it was just adoptions" mtg at Trump Tower.

The chances that Trump was on speaker phone as he was that day seem high.

[stopdiggin]

99. were illegal activities planned, discussed, promoted ..?

The fact that the Trump camp was still intent on derailing the electoral college result -- really isn't a secret. (and that's why a number of people here are saying, "Well .. OK ....?"..)

[Nevilledog]

50. Link to article in post 49

[Grasswire2]

51. It's a SCOOP in that no one had previously reported a first-person account of a meeting..

....the night of January Fifth of Trump family members, advisors -- an account posted publicly on social media by a Trump administration official. A secret meeting, in the president's own quarters at Trump Hotel.

Nobody claims this story is sending anyone to jail.

God almighty. Reporting comes in bits and pieces. Investigative writers gather the bits and pieces, and add to the known narrative.

Now we know about this meeting.

Get some coffee or something.

[Fiendish Thingy]

52. Compare this "story" to the reporting on the attempt to replace the acting AG

And use the DOJ to block/overturn the Electoral College count.

THAT was journalism- Abramson’s story is not. It connect a couple dots, mostly drawn from publicly available information, and adds a heap of speculation and conjecture.

I hope real journalists, as well as the DOJ will any leads that emerge.

[Grasswire2]

53. Gee. Where is it that you teach? nt

[AntiFascist]

48. Oh, and what about "Trial by COMBAT" Rudy Giuiiani?

as Trump's lawyer, won't his video be entered into evidence?
I mean REALLY!

[Nevilledog]

49. This looks like confirmation

Link to tweet

https://www.alreporter.com/2021/01/26/trump-appointee-says-tuberville-raga-director-met-with-trump-family-top-advisors-on-eve-of-capitol-attack/

[Grasswire2]

55. and there's more now...

[link:http

Link to tweet

?s=20|

[triron]

57. Thanks. Now look out for our naysayers!

[Grasswire2]

58. well, it's always useful to see the goats separated from the sheep.

So there's that.

[uponit7771]

69. People meetting at a hotel is proof of conspiracy?!?!!

[triron]

62. knr

[triron]

63. knr

[highplainsdem]

64. K&R

[VidH]

66. SOLID REPORTING BUT SETH ABRAMSON SELF-SABOTAGES INSISTING IT'S A "WAR COUNCIL"

Over and over, SA finds a way to end up sulking in the corner that no one listens to him enough, or re-reports his work enough.

This time, to my eye, it's labeling it a "war council" helps give those who wish to ignore it a reason to.

All we know is a very suspicious group of people got together, presumably coordinating some of what actually occurred the net day, but until someone claims to know what was said, it's easy to see why major media mostly won't touch this yet.

[Grasswire2]

67. joined DU today, eh?

Did you come for this?

Or did something else catch your eye?

Thanks for the kick.

[Dorian Gray]

73. That person is right

Even if new. You're bullying won't change the fact that for this to have real legs means that it needs to have a first person source saying that they spoke about coordinating the riots on the 6th. Otherwise it's a hotel get together.

(Do I believe it was a non-nefarious meetup? NO! But that is my BIAS. I believe they're all self serving jackals that would sell out our democracy in a second.) But real investigative reporting uses sources and real trials require proof.

Speculation and supposition doesn't cut it.

[Dorian Gray]

74. (Do you get what I'm saying here?)

I'm not saying that meeting didn't happen nor that it wasn't problematic. I believe it was.

I AM saying that SA isn't always a reliable source for information. He gets our hopes up when his threads don't lead anywhere. I hope in this case, that is NOT the case.

[stopdiggin]

102. agreed. not saying that the meeting didn't happen

My push back is directed at the "breathless" .. "Breaking News!" .. "smoking gun!" quality imparted. (and that is Seth Abramson front to back)

And if you have to resort to denigrating newcomers .. that's pretty weak as well.
---- ----

[malaise]

75. Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

I have often wondered if holding meetings in his properties facilitated hiding the names of the meeting attendees.

[triron]

78. Of course. Like what happened in the late spring and ssummer of 2016.

That's when the coup began.

[malaise]

79. Yep

Everyone better be vigilant - he meant every word he said

[uponit7771]

70. +1, people meeting at q hotel isn't proof of conspiracy. Most likely they did some crime but that

... doesn't mean.a hotel meeting is proof of it.

[Turin_C3PO]

68. I take anything Abramson posts with a small grain of salt.

He’s interesting but he’s been wrong quite a few times. Hopefully this turns out to be something punishable.

[oasis]

77. Definitely worth having a good look. Thanks.

[lastlib]

85. Tommy TuberHEAD is going to have a lot to answer for!

[triron]

88. kick for visibility

[IndyOp]

98. Someone needs to question Tuberville - he'll get flustered under questionning

and will spill the beans about everything he knows.

Wasn't he saying the other day that the "official inauguration" won't happen for another week or so?

[bdamomma]

103. More evidence

coming out everyday. Cruz wants us to move on????? I don't think so.

[Nitram]

104. "We talked about...what to expect on the Hill tomorrow." Smoking gun?

[triron]

106. Please elaborate.

[Nitram]

110. The full text: "Wetalked about what to expect on the Hill tomorrow...TRUMP WILL RETAIN THE

PRESIDENCY!" Anyone who can't parse the meaning there is a moron. Or a Republican.

[triron]

112. Wouldn't it be nice if there were recordings?

[BlueInPhilly]

108. All conjectures

Don't get your hopes up because Abramson's deductions are not facts. He is in the same league as Dworkin and Louise-whats-her-name. Abramson is bloviating as usual.

[triron]

109. Sigh. Another one.

[triron]

113. kick again