Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Rustynaerduwell

(664 posts)
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 12:39 AM Feb 2021

There is more than enough evidence that Trump was aiming for an excuse for martial law,

not a real attempt to turn the election results. It fits the means, motive and opportunity and provides for specific premeditation. This is a charge that is more explicit and specific than some general call to action in vain hope of succeeding. In fact, the riot itself would be the ends he was looking for. The idea of martial law was in his head from the beginning. The death of anyone in the line of succession- specific targets of the mob- would have been all that he needed to pull it off. Why not present the case that way?

16 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
There is more than enough evidence that Trump was aiming for an excuse for martial law, (Original Post) Rustynaerduwell Feb 2021 OP
Too speculative. However, it does seem he was being counseled that way by some. Frasier Balzov Feb 2021 #1
Bannon for one, I suspect. n/t Whiskeytide Feb 2021 #12
And Flynn, according to recordings of the General from December. n/t Frasier Balzov Feb 2021 #16
You have My Pillow guys notes exboyfil Feb 2021 #2
That, IMO, was one of the alternative plans that seemed to have a good chance of being realized. Eyeball_Kid Feb 2021 #3
This is what I felt while watching the insurrection in real time. liberalmuse Feb 2021 #4
I was almost certain that would be the next step... regnaD kciN Feb 2021 #10
#4 would be my guess. liberalmuse Feb 2021 #11
He really screwed up, didn't he. C_U_L8R Feb 2021 #5
Martial law is irrelevant, wouldn't affect the transfer of power- overturning the EC would. Nt Fiendish Thingy Feb 2021 #6
Let's say anti-tRump protesters showed up in the tens of thousands Wednesdays Feb 2021 #7
There is no mechanism to suspend the Constitution, not even using the Emergency Powers Act. Nt Fiendish Thingy Feb 2021 #14
It certainly would affect the transfer of power... regnaD kciN Feb 2021 #8
Martial law doesn't suspend the Constitution, which stipulates presidential term ends January 20. Fiendish Thingy Feb 2021 #13
Irrelevant to you and others who aren't Trump misanthrope Feb 2021 #9
If Michael Beschloss thinks it's a possibilty, or at least a question, that's good enough wiggs Feb 2021 #15

exboyfil

(17,863 posts)
2. You have My Pillow guys notes
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 12:48 AM
Feb 2021

when he went to the White House the next day outlining this plan. Someone needs to squeeze him like one of his cheap pillows.

Eyeball_Kid

(7,432 posts)
3. That, IMO, was one of the alternative plans that seemed to have a good chance of being realized.
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 12:52 AM
Feb 2021

Trump was positioning Pence to get assassinated SO HE COULD DECLARE MARTIAL LAW. Nancy Pelosi or Chuck Schumer would have been decent substitutes, but any event that resulted in the killing of a small handful of members of Congress would have been sufficient means for a declaration. Trump's non-reaction to urgent requests for help is the tell.

liberalmuse

(18,672 posts)
4. This is what I felt while watching the insurrection in real time.
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 01:07 AM
Feb 2021

I was so afraid Trump was going to declare Martial Law. I think the brave Capitol officers and especially Eugene Goodman who diverted the mob from the Senate Chambers likely prevented the deaths of elected officials that would have given Trump the excuse he was waiting for.

regnaD kciN

(26,044 posts)
10. I was almost certain that would be the next step...
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 02:47 AM
Feb 2021

...but the $64,000 question would then be "why didn't he?"

I can come up with several possible alternatives:

1) First, of course, that he never planned to do it in the first place.

2) That he was, for the sake of appearance, counting on the groups of resistance activists who had organized to fight a coup to be out in the streets as promised, and that the clashes between them would give him his excuse to declare a national emergency because of "violent disorder from both sides." I was reading a few days ago about the behind-the-scenes efforts to fight an attempt to overturn the election, and how the organizers worked with progressive groups to tamp down any attempts of a "street presence" among such organizations on 1/6, with everyone agreeing to put off any protests unless such attempts appeared to be succeeding. This, in itself, may have foiled Trump's plans.

3) That he was actually counting on something more brazen: that the insurrectionists would manage to capture and/or kill enough Democratic Congresspersons to give Republicans a majority in both houses; whereupon the new "leadership" could proceed to reject the Electoral College vote and pick the president themselves before states could appoint replacements. By the time it became clear that the mob, while successfully breaking into the Capitol, wasn't going to be able to get to the Representatives and Senators, it was too late for a convincing case to declare martial law.

4) The one option that few people seem to be considering: that, maybe, Trump did decide to declare martial law, notified the Joint Chiefs to send the troops in, and was told by them they would refuse to obey such an order. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there was more going on at the White House than just Trump enjoying television coverage of the attack, but no one in Trump's inner circle is ever going to admit if such a scenario played out, and the military brass probably considers it a point of honor to never reveal such a thing.

Of course, we may never know, but you have to think there was some payoff in mind when they were planning and organizing this insurrection, and it wasn't just to have a large mob vandalize the Capitol building and then go home.

liberalmuse

(18,672 posts)
11. #4 would be my guess.
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 10:39 AM
Feb 2021

But you are right that we may never know. I think there will be more investigations once we get our AG confirmed. Lindsay Graham has really been trying to stall that particular appointment. I wonder why?

Wednesdays

(17,380 posts)
7. Let's say anti-tRump protesters showed up in the tens of thousands
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 01:38 AM
Feb 2021

and all hell broke loose on January 6th. Hundreds dead. It isn't much of a stretch to suppose tRump would declare martial law and a "state of emergency" to suspend the Constitution. If enough blame was pinned on the anti-tRump people in the media, we'd still have him as president... likely for life.

regnaD kciN

(26,044 posts)
8. It certainly would affect the transfer of power...
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 02:28 AM
Feb 2021

...if it was an "indefinite" state of emergency "for the foreseeable future"...which never came to an end. There is certainly precedent in other countries -- of course, that would assume the military would go along with it.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,624 posts)
13. Martial law doesn't suspend the Constitution, which stipulates presidential term ends January 20.
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 11:55 AM
Feb 2021

The Civil War didn’t stop the election of 1864, it just changed who could vote.

misanthrope

(7,418 posts)
9. Irrelevant to you and others who aren't Trump
Thu Feb 11, 2021, 02:31 AM
Feb 2021

At that point, he was throwing everything at the wall. Anyone who had experienced him in action the last few years could see what he was doing and hoping for. He might be devious but he isn't that crafty.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»There is more than enough...