Yesterday I posted about friend whose CU-attending daughter was in King Soopers & "unreachable"

[hlthe2b]

Several expressed the concern I share, so I just wanted to update. She is ok but witnessed a significant part of the carnage and had been retained for hours for her witness interview/statement. I'm sure my friends are overwhelmingly relieved but that relief is tempered by what they know lies ahead for her. Still, a bit of brightness in a dark day for Boulder.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100215256742#post29

[Roy Rolling]

1. Great News She's Safe

She must be in shock. Seriously, I’m a retired medic. She’s a prime candidate for PTSD for her traumatic experience and should receive emergency counseling.

[hlthe2b]

3. They are seeking ongoing professional counseling for her today.

[catchnrelease]

32. So important

My niece's daughter was a senior at Stoneman High School during the shooting there. She was in the building next to where most of those killed were and she heard the sounds. I don't think she saw any of the dead, but had to go through all the rest of the chaos that day. I believe she did get some counseling through the school but even now she has problems. She's attending Cornell and one day a fire alarm went off and it freaked her out. She had to go back home for a period of time to kind of regroup and be able to go back to school. I'm sure it will stick with her for years if not her whole life.

I hope your friend's daughter will get all of the help and understanding she needs to deal with this stupid tragedy.

[hlthe2b]

36. I'm so sorry for your Stoneman HS shooting-experiencing family member.

I've met some Columbine survivors in recent years and while I feel so proud of how many of them have put their lives back together and moved on, it is so obvious it will always be part of their life. I think the need for counseling is routinely stressed now in a way it wasn't always in past decades. What a statement--given that is about the only progress we've made on this issue... sigh...

[soldierant]

42. The fellow Don Lemon interviewed on CNN is a professional counselor

himself, and when Don asked would he personally seek therapy for himself, he laughed and said he didn't even get home before he texted his therapist for an appointment.

That's how important it is.

[WHITT]

2. Sadly

Brian Williams mentioned last night about cell phones not being answered.

[malaise]

4. Glad she's OK

but this will stay with her for the rest of her life

[2naSalit]

5. That's the truth.

I hope all the witnesses are able to get whatever help they need to process this.

[callous taoboy]

6. My SIL was in the next shopping center over-

She saw the police showing up, SWAT team getting into tactical gear as she was leaving a nearby pharmacy getting her Covid shot. She shops at King Soopers often.

[FailureToCommunicate]

7. Thank you for the update. Overwhelming relief...

One can only imagine the terrors she was surrounded by.

These gun-slinging white terrorists keep us all on swivel.
Nowhere is safe: schools, theaters, massage centers, concerts, churches, grocery stores...

[wnylib]

12. I started doing something a few years ago

as the numbers of mass shootings in public places have been increasing. Maybe more of us should do it.

When I go into a building, I note where the exits are and how to get to them quickly if necessary. I also think about where good hiding places are and how I am likely to react to the sudden sound of shots. I don't dwell on it or work myself up into a state of fear. I just do it routinely, to be prepared, just in case. Younger people have had "active shooter" drills in school. We oldsters have not, so mental preparation just seems prudent.

I know from work experience in my younger years that retail businesses and restaurants have exits that customers don't see. They are in the back of the store, or through the kitchen of restaurants, where deliveries are received. They are often behind swing doors with a sign that says "Employees only." The deli sections of supermarkets usually have a walk in cooler with heavy doors behind the counter. Better to be chilled for a while than injured or worse.

Sad that even thinking about it is prudent these days, but that is the way it is now.

[xxqqqzme]

13. Thank you.

n/t

[niyad]

17. During the Black Friday mass shooting at Planned Parenthood in Colorado Springs, the employees

at the King Soopers there (same parking lot) sheltered people in the coolers and back room area.
Situational awareness at all times.

[hlthe2b]

22. Excellent list but I may add (for the kids especially): Make sure they memorize SOME phone numbers

So many were separated from their phones yesterday when rescued--including my friend's daughter. Some of them were surely offered opportunities to call family but had no clue how to do so without their cell phone's contact list. Thus the relief for some families was delayed by hours in many cases.

It isn't something that most think about, but we have become so reliant on our technology when separated or it malfunctions, there are consequences to not being able to go "old school."

[FailureToCommunicate]

28. Excellent addition. My father used to always ask if we had our list of numbers before we

went out. It was just a wrinkled index card... but it made sense in retrospect.

We kids got a bit tired of the question, and sometime before he'd even ask we'd say: "Yes, dad, AND we have our toe tags attached too."

When my own kids were little, I admit I asked similar questions. Where you going? How long? What's our phone number here?

[wnylib]

30. Good point. I grew up old school,

but have also become reliant on phone contact lists.

[KarenS]

27. Thank you,,,, These are good tips. n/t

[FailureToCommunicate]

29. Good habit for safety. My mother dealt with the survivors of the Coconut Grove fire and...

after those years, she always made a habit of thinking about and noting where exits were in any sort of building we went into.

She was Red Cross at the time (1942) and the trauma those poor victims went thru left lifelong impressions.

[wnylib]

31. I experienced a house fire in the middle of the night

when I was 14. All those school fire drills paid off in automatically knowing what to do. Forget everything but getting out. Move quickly but calmly to the nearest exit. I paused only once when I heard my brother struggling to get my younger sister out because she had panicked, would not move, and fought his efforts to grab her. Between us, we dragged her out after giving her a hard slap.

We had to pass the double door arch that opened onto the living room, where the fire was roaring up the entire back wall, in order to get to either exit (front or back door). The heat was so intense that I felt like running back upstairs to get away from it, but knew that was a death trap. Besides, my father was following behind all of us to make sure we kept moving. Nobody was hurt, but there was a lot of fire, smoke, and water damage.

I learned a few things from that experience. 1. If you stay calm, you can think clearly, even in an emergency. 2. The heat from a building fire is much more intense than you would think. 3. The smoke travels into all rooms, nooks, and crannies. 4. It pays to be prepared from drills and awareness in advance of what to do.

For a very long time afterward, I was always aware of exits wherever I went. Mass shootings these days have reactivated my awareness of surroundings and advance thinking about what to do in case of emergency.

[Neema]

43. I find myself doing this as well. I've discovered

that I’m one of those people who remain very calm in an emergency. In fact, time seems to slow down for me while I run through possible solutions in my head. It’s a surreal experience but one that’s saved my life at least once (and saved my dog’s life once as well). So I’m grateful for that. And I hope, if I ever find myself in a harrowing situation like this, I can use that ability to get at least a few people to safety.

I will note that, once the emergency has passed, I collapse from indescribable exhaustion. So it’s a short-lived skill.

[wnylib]

44. I've learned that about myself as well,

from a few experiences. It's like my emotions disconnect from my mind and my mind zeros in on identifying the situation and what needs to be done, very pragmatically. Afterward the emotions return and it feels almost like I was some different person during the emergency.

It's been a long time since I faced such an emergency. Don't know for sure if I still have it in me and hope I don't need to find out.

[Neema]

45. I'm guessing it's something you either have or you don't.

It's a very odd experience though, isn't it? It is like you're a different person living in an entirely different dimension where time stands still.

[wnylib]

46. Yup. You don't see, feel, or hear anything except

what is relevant to solving the situation. Time becomes "fluid," almost irrelevant, except that you act smoothly and efficiently because you know, without specifically thinking about it, that you must act quickly. It's like an altered state of reality, triggered by the emergency, not by drugs.

But, like I said, it's been a very long time since I faced that kind of emergency. Don't know if I would still be able to act that way and sincerely hope I don't need to find out.

When it's over, and the emotions kick in again, they can be overwhelming. Maybe that's why they disconnect in an emergency. To prevent being paralyzed and overcome by fear, we shut down feelings until it's safe to have them again.

[Neema]

47. I think you're exactly right. And some people don't have that switch to

shut down their emotions until it's safe. My guess is, if we didn't live in a society and protect one another (at least in theory), those people would have been removed from the gene pool long ago.

I hope you never have to find out again as well, but I bet you will still have it if you do. I experienced it once when I was younger, and then again more recently (so 30 or so years in between).

[wnylib]

48. I think that a lot of people

have that emotional shutdown ability, in varying degrees. I think it's what allows ER personnel to handle one emergency after another, focusing on what they need to do instead of on the horrible mess in front of them. I think it's what allowed nurses and doctors to keep functioning at the peak of the NYC covid pandemic when there weren't even facilities for handling all of the dead, let alone the sick who were still living.

I think it's what allowed people in the JFK administration to solve the Cuban Missile Crisis without a war.

I think that many people have the ability, but don't realize it until circumstances call on them to use it.

I also fear that it's the same kind of emotional shutoff that allows sociopaths to lie, steal, and kill without conscience. Maybe their problem is that the switch only works one way for them and once turned off, does not come back on.

[Neema]

49. Excellent point about sociopaths.

Sounds very plausible.

[Sophiegirl]

8. What a horrible situation

I’m so glad to hear she is safe.

The emotional and mental challenges are yet to come. Survivor guilt is real thing and she may consider seeing a therapist who specializes in that.

I suffered from survivor’s guilt about eight years ago and your mind does awful thing. (Serious car crash.) My brain reminded me all day long with “why did I make it out and others did not. I went to see a therapist and that helped a lot.

[niyad]

9. Thank you so much for letting us know that she is safe. My heart goes out to her, and all who

witnessed yesterday's horrors.

[wnylib]

14. One account from yesterday's shooting

really got to me when I read it and later heard a relative discuss it on You Tube.

A husband and wife were in line for their covid shots at the store's pharmacy. Their children were with them. The woman in line in front of them was shot as they stood there. They fled to a second floor coat closet where they hid for over an hour. First they turned off their phone ring tones so the sound would not reveal their location if relatives or friends tried to check up on them. Then they texted the woman's father to let him know that they were not shot and were in hiding.

They stayed there until police came to escort them out.

I think about the psychological impact for them, especially the children, as they witnessed a woman being killed and then waited over an hour in fear of being discovered.

[central scrutinizer]

16. And the gun humpers will deny this should be called terrorism

And callously dismiss stories like this.

[LastDemocratInSC]

18. A humper won't consider it terrorism

because it's something he has fantasized about all his life. How can the achievement of a major life goal be a bad thing?

[Rorey]

10. What a nightmare!

I'm relieved for her that she's physically ok, and I hope you can ALL get through this somehow.

Please keep us all posted.

[Evolve Dammit]

11. Glad she's OK, but this will have a life-long effect. Sickening.

[mountain grammy]

15. My daughter has three friends who live in that area

All checked in safe last night.. Thank goodness your firend's daughter is also safe.

[qanda]

19. Thanks for the update

I saw your post and came back this morning to see if there was any news. While I know she's not okay, I'm glad she's alive. I'll be keeping her in my thoughts. I hope common sense changes will be coming soon.

[randr]

20. That King Soopers was my grocery store when I lived in Boulder

Boulder is a town that prides itself on kindness. My heart is broken while my rage boils. This must end.

[ananda]

21. A witness said: I can't believe it's happening in Boulder.

Sheesh

The way people think these days is amazing.

[hlthe2b]

24. It is a coping response. We all want to feel as though our community is uniquely safe & protected...

even though we must know no community can be... fully.

[ananda]

25. Possibly. But considering how mass murder has been operating...

in this country so frequently, in so many different places and for
so many years... this is some special kind of denialist thinking,
or perhaps elitist and entitled and too special for others who might
live in a more murder-accommodating place?

[secondwind]

23. My daughter relocated to CO in 2017............ and left in 2019... Here's why:

One week after arriving in Broomfield, CO, a Walmart was shot up. There were deaths.

She left two years later when a man drew a gun on her in a local parking lot.. over a silly disagreement.

And now this... this particular Soopers was her supermarket, she went twice a month for large grocery shopping, and I just learned today about this... It took her two days to tell me.

[hlthe2b]

26. Sorry this happened to her, but I've lived throughout the US and always return to CO-- thankfully.

Big cities are problematic and Denver/Denver suburbs are no different. But my most serious experiences of crime and potential harm for me occurred in Richmond, VA, and Atlanta. So... we need to deal with the issue nationally, IMO. Make everyone safer, especially via (measured) gun-control efforts.

Where I live now, I feel safe walking 2 miles pre-dawn along a well-lit Boulevard to meet friends at the dog park each morning, though I carry pepper spray and keep my wits about me (more so because of the errant coyote in the wee hours than the two-legged predators, but one never knows).

[leighbythesea2]

37. I had to lockdown

In Santa Monica. In an office. It was the guy who killed people "while moving across town" ultimately ending at the community college. Many killed. I also lived 1 block from the college.

If Santa Monica isn't a "doesn't happen here" place what is? (For record i don't believe there are such places).
Less than 2 weeks later a guy in a car sped down pedestrian area of Venice boardwalk trying to hit as many people as possible. Deaths.

Those mentioned in OP will have ptsd. I think i did, and didn't witness, directly, anything. I hope they get help!

I march, contribute, and call congress people most on this topic now.

[turbinetree]

33. I still relive my childhood trauma of what happened when I was in grade school

when a student in our school shot and wounded a student and killed our principle and his body was lying on the ground, whenever I hear of one of the senseless acts, I relive that scene in my head and reinforces my belief that a gun is worthless ............
I am glad to see and read that she fine now this is just more sadness that will never go away...........

[hlthe2b]

35. Oh, my. I am so sorry you experienced that. I didn't recall too many school shootings where the

the principal was wounded or killed, but then I looked at the Wikipedia page on school shootings and boy was I wrong.

All those school shootings in the past decades and ever-increasing. It is just so devastating. I've never gotten over Columbine (I was home recovering from orthopedic surgery at the time and watched far too much coverage). Years later, I provided some infection control assistance and consultation to what turned out to be former SWAT team members during Columbine response who had gone on to provide supervisory staffing at a very large jail facility in the Denver area. It was truly eye-opening to hear their perspective of that day and what followed. To say that they remain affected to their core would be an understatement but most have remained empathetic and introspective about it. I've likewise met many of the then-" children of Columbine" as well who have gone on to do many great things but admit to never being able to truly feel free of that day.

I so wish I had the answers to prevent the next one (and the cure for those forever scarred). I hope you were able to get some help too.

[riversedge]

34. there was a tweet yesteday about all the folks who rang up their loved ones

who they though might be at the store--and getting nothing but silence on the phones or boxes full etc.

It does not have to be this way. #gunreformnow

[BobTheSubgenius]

38. Even people who were bystanders are having their lives ruined.

This is even worse than the horror it started out to be.

[mzmolly]

39. Oh my. Poor

kid. I'm so glad she's physically safe.

[Traildogbob]

40. Very thankful

She was not a fatality victim of the shooting but she certainly is no less a victim. Wishing your family the very best.

[cilla4progress]

41. Omg this thread -

So many of you have been in shootings, or shooting adjacent!

I weep for my country.