This fucking trial should have been over already

[malaise]

You don't put your knee on a man's neck for over nine minutes and expect to do anything other than fucking murder him.
Enough of this fucking circus.

[Rorey]

1. 1st degree murder

At some point he made the decision to murder George Floyd.

[malaise]

2. It's that simple

and that's why millions were on the street about this.
Throw away the fucking keys.

[Ocelot II]

15. He wasn't charged with first-degree murder,

which requires proof beyond a reasonable doubt that he both intended and premeditated the killing. State of mind is very difficult to prove, so the prosecutors probably decided they didn't want to risk an acquittal - and therefore they charged him with second- and third- degree murder and second-degree manslaughter, all of which will be easier to prove. I think third-degree murder, the "depraved mind" version of the crime, is the most likely verdict.

[Rorey]

37. That makes sense

I want to see him convicted and sent to prison, hopefully for the rest of his life.

In my mind, there came a point where he did intend to kill George Floyd. Unless he's incredibly stupid, he had to know at some point that if he continued doing what he was doing, Floyd would die.

I do understand what you're saying. Sometimes, though, the laws and punishment make little sense. At least not to me.

[Greybnk48]

3. I so agree Malaise.

We all have seen this cold-blooded murder first hand. They must have covered the technicalities by now. Enough already!

[malaise]

50. Watching teh defense trying to tie up the Police Chief

These folks make me sick

[Siwsan]

4. The defense questioning about Fentanyl being responsible raises a question in my mind

I don't know a lot about that particular drug, but if it was going to kill someone, I'd think it would be a more rapid process than what we've seen, here. AND, even if it was involved, to ANY degree, would it have killed him if Chauvin had not been kneeling on his neck. I somehow think not. It's like if I have a serious heart condition, and you do something to horrifically startle me, and I have a heart attack and die. I wouldn't have died, at that time, had you not, let's say, thrown a giant tarantula in my face, no matter what my heart condition might be.

[malaise]

5. Of I were the prosecution I'd find out Chaivin's drug of choice

[Siwsan]

7. I think they did find it in his system, but they haven't said to what extent.

He was up and around, talking to people. He was very alert when approached and questioned.

I'm beginning to think this defense is using the throw everything up against the wall to see if anything sticks strategy.

[Jim__]

40. There was a significant amount of fentanyl in his system - 11 ng/mL (nanograms per milliliter).

New court docs say George Floyd had "fatal level" of fentanyl in his system (Aug 2020 headline) - from KareNews:

...

Handwritten notes of a law enforcement interview with Dr. Andrew Baker, the Hennepin County Medical Examiner, say Floyd had 11 ng/mL of fentanyl in his system.

"If he were found dead at home alone and no other apparent causes, this could be acceptable to call an OD. Deaths have been certified with levels of 3," Baker told investigators.

In another new document, Baker said, "That is a fatal level of fentanyl under normal circumstances."

But then Baker added, "I am not saying this killed him."

...

At the very least Chauvin played a significant role in Floyd's death. But, the defense will try to raise the level of fentanyl in his system to cause reasonable doubt in some juror's mind.

[Crunchy Frog]

48. Fatal levels are always in relation to a person's tolerance level.

Anyway, cops are supposed to carry Narcan on them. If he was dying of a drug overdose, they should have treated him instead of kneeling on his neck for nine minutes.

[brush]

8. The ER doctor who testified this morning ruled out drug use and heart attack...

as the cause of death. He established that it was asphixia (lack of oxygen).

[Siwsan]

9. The defense is, IMHO, really struggling to gain any ground

But, of course, all it takes is one juror holding out.

[brush]

13. There are 3 possible charges Chauvin can be found guilty of.

Second degree murder, third degree and second-degree manslaughter. IMO those three charges should eliminate a juror holding out. I can see it if there was only one charge.

[Ocelot II]

16. He was not charged with first-degree murder.

The charges are second- and third-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter.

[brush]

26. I stand corrected, will edit. My point is the wide range of charges...

Last edited Mon Apr 5, 2021, 09:10 PM - Edit history (1)

tend to eliminate the chances of a hung jury or an innocent verdict.

[Treefrog]

6. I so agree with you. He should already be serving time.

I truly wonder how this could even go to trial.

[nolabear]

10. No, he needs a complete trial process, THEN to be found guilty.

He’s a monster, but the system itself needs to be laid bare, good and bad, so people can see not only the horror that happened, but how it might be improved.

I’m actually impressed with the information that’s coming out, whether it’s sanitized or not (the street I expect looks far different from what’s talked about on the stand). What they claim to be and how they’re clearly separating themselves from Chauvin is interesting and will cause many conversations.

[malaise]

11. They have heard more than enough

seriously

[Ocelot II]

21. Nope, a complete and thorough trial is necessary

so nobody can claim the trial was unfair or superficial in any respect. This is the kind of case that requires a long, detailed trial. So far the defense hasn't even presented their case, and Chauvin has a constitutional right to do so. All defendants have that right, no matter how despicable they seem or how much we, sitting here in the cheap seats, have decided they are guilty.

[malaise]

22. I hear you

[brooklynite]

12. When did you graduate from Law School?

[panader0]

14. It doesn't take a law degree to see the obvious guilt.

Mean comment.

[brooklynite]

19. So, we should just omit the trial, since his guilt is obvious?

The prosecution is building a case. "It's obvious" is not a legal principle.

[Ocelot II]

25. The defense has not even presented their case yet.

The defendant has a constitutional right to that aspect of due process, no matter how guilty he might appear to be. He has been charged under three different criminal statutes, and he's entitled to have a jury decide which of them, if any, he is guilty of. That's the system, and I can't imagine why anyone, especially anyone claiming to be a liberal, would want to deprive any defendant of his right to a complete and fair trial.

[panader0]

31. Of course the defense has to present their case.

We have seen the direction it will take with their questioning of the witnesses.
I think the process needs to be completed, but I cannot see any viable defense.
I am a liberal, a progressive liberal, and I want justice. I have seen things that show me
many errors in what is supposed to be justice. Was Kavanaugh innocent? Ok, he was not
on trial. Were the guys who burned down Black churches in the South innocent? No, but
they were found not guilty. As a poster said above, it will take only one juror to vote for
Chauvin's innocence to make a mockery of the system. Chauvin is guilty, period.

[Ocelot II]

33. The jury has to decide *which* of the three charges he's guilty of.

It's not enough to just decide he's guilty; he has to be found guilty of some specific crime as defined by these statutes. The jury has to make that decision, and charging him under three different statutes rather than just one makes it a lot easier for the prosecution to convince the jury that he's guilty of something. That's why they appealed (successfully) the judge's initial decision to throw out the third-degree murder charge, which requires a finding that the defendant perpetrated "an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life." Even if some jurors don't think he intentionally killed Floyd, the video easily supports a "depraved mind" verdict.

[panader0]

34. I know that you were an attorney, and I have always respected your knowledge of law.

Let's hope the jury finds him guilty. I have.

[malaise]

17. About the same time you graduated from Pol Sc.

Down memory lane: Donald Trump will not be the first person to be impeached twice.

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

18. O how nice let's do away with trials

Just go with crowd noise.

Smdh

[malaise]

20. Says who? n/t

[sarisataka]

23. Damn this stupid legal system

Where we give the accused rights. When everybody knows the accused is guilty we should just march them in, read the charges then send the jury out to render the verdict.
We can then jump to locking up or executing them.

FWIW, I believe he is guilty. However is I do not stand for the rights of every accused person, I don't really stand for the rights of the accused.

Even when the entire crime is caught on video, the accused is allowed council, due process, the right to face their accusers and to present a defense.

[malaise]

24. For the record

I grew up in the legal system.

[sarisataka]

28. That make it sadder

How many cases did you see go to jury not even halfway through the prosecution and before the defense called a single witness?

Did a judge ever stop a trial and render a summary judgment of guilty?

[Ocelot II]

29. And he's been charged under three different statutes,

each of which carries a different sentence. So the particulars of the case - the specific facts the prosecution can establish beyond a reasonable doubt - are crucial in determining whether, if he's found guilty of one of them, he will serve 10, 25 or 40 years in prison. The videos certainly seem to show culpability, but of what? That's for the jury to decide, not us.

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

27. Prosecutor is in danger of losing jury

With all this round and round.

[Ocelot II]

30. That's what closing arguments are for - to get them back.

All real trials, as opposed to TV trials, have long, boring stretches, but they are necessary under the rules of evidence to establish foundation and relevance for testimony and qualifications of witnesses. It's up to counsel to tie it all together at the end.

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

32. Basic security officers are trained

To turn a subject in handcuffs over off the stomach in use of force training.

Guess I'm just curious to hear the chief about that day.

[PoliticAverse]

35. Yeah really, TV trials typically take under 15 minutes total. n/t

[marieo1]

36. Right On

I agree totally - why haven't they charged him with murder? If a black man did this to a white man they would hang him from the nearest tree!!!

[malaise]

38. I support the rule of law so I like a trial

I'm simply suggesting that the evidence is so overwhelming here that it should have ended in a week.

[BlueJac]

39. Yes, tell it like it is!

[malaise]

47. I've been thinking long and hard since you folks sent the racist in chief packing

Why are the only people who are called Americans without something in front of that white?
Talk about cancel culture - the only true Americans are the indigenous ones. Melania Trump (with her atrocious Englihs) and immigration violations is considered more American than the descendants of enslaved Africans who have been around for over 400 years.

IF this were a fair trial he'd be facing Murder 1

[NoMoreRepugs]

41. Putting on my tinfoil hat securely. I wonder, with the

number of Deplorable voters that exist, if a trial by one’s peers is even possible anymore??

[PatrickforB]

42. First degree murder, life without parole. That is the appropriate punishment

for this creep.

[Ocelot II]

46. He wasn't charged with first-degree murder for reasons described above.

If he is convicted of the most serious charge, second-degree murder, the maximum sentence is 40 years.

[PatrickforB]

51. Well, 40 years is better than nothing. But it should have been 1st degree.

[OldCicero]

43. It took 11 months for the defense

To prove that O.J. Simpson had nothing to do with Nichole Brown's and Ron Goldman's murders.

Have a little patience, don't jump to concludions. These things take time.

[Jay25]

44. Thank You!

[IcyPeas]

45. Chauvin is about 145 pounds and he is 5'9" tall

the defense is going to say he isn't big enough.

I thought he looked much taller. so they are going to make him out to be this small lightweight guy who couldn't have killed Floyd.

Curious to watch the defense's case when they are up.

[Ocelot II]

49. 145 lbs. on a prone, handcuffed guy's neck should do it,

no matter how big the handcuffed guy is. It will be a very tough sell.

[ecstatic]

52. I know right? It's infuriating

I watched a little bit of the trial on HLN today, but I don't think I'll do that again. A bunch of attorney talking heads discussing what the defense should be doing and saying so that Chauvin can walk.

[alittlelark]

53. I would be cool with dismissing all charges

If he agrees to experience the exact same treatment he gave George Floyd.

I think his commanding officer should be the one to do it, along with 3 officers of his choosing.