If men could get pregnant

[tk2kewl]

[porphyrian]

2. ...and bacon. Definitely bacon. n/t

[Confusious]

4. Yea! sea salt, ick

The great taste of salty pharmaceuticals.

[porphyrian]

6. Right? Sea salt would be the last one on the shelf.

"Any bacon left?"
"Sorry, all out."
"What about nacho cheese?"
"Nope, all we've got left is sea salt."
"When's the next delivery?"

[CrispyQ]

12. "If you don't take the sea salt, the next delivery will be 9 months from now."

[porphyrian]

15. "Hello, baby? We've got to rely on condoms for a while."

[CrispyQ]

3. If men could get pregnant,

there would be free birth control available to every man at every pharmacy in the US.

[wendylaroux]

5. That is the truth!

or mailed to their home each month.

[porphyrian]

16. There would be birth control beer. n/t

[CrispyQ]

24. DUzy!

Oh &

[Canuckistanian]

54. Ha!

Almost choked on a cracker reading that...

[porphyrian]

75. ...

[LuckyLib]

31. Birth control would be available free in restrooms.

[4th law of robotics]

36. Can you list the things

men get for free as is that compare?

Do men get free condoms? Do men get free vasectomies?

This notion that men have it great on healthcare is belied by the fact that WE DIE YOUNGER. Always have and likely always will. And yet more money is dedicated towards women's health than men's.

Believe me, you don't want to be treated like men when it comes to healthcare.

[Demeter]

39. That's funny

Because my grandfather outlived my grandmother.

And my father outlived my mother.

Even though all of them smoked.

The men quit first, though.

My sister and I think the women died of sheer aggravation with their spouses. She's still married, btw; I'm not, because divorce is cheaper than murder, if not as satisfying.

[4th law of robotics]

40. I'm not sure if you're serious

do you really believe that proves anything?

Men die younger than women on average. That is a well established fact.

[ponsheki]

44. Hmmm....

Condoms are cheap, freely available in any grocery store/corner store/7-11, and do come in many different flavors. There's plenty of places that give out free, basic condoms. The flavored kind you have to pay for of course.

Vasectomies are different because guy don't actually like the idea of getting their tubes tied. If vasectomies were more popular, I'm sure the price would go down.

[4th law of robotics]

46. Condoms can be bought by either gender

so as BC goes isn't that a wash?

Vasectomies are different because guy don't actually like the idea of getting their tubes tied. If vasectomies were more popular, I'm sure the price would go down.

So . . . nothing then?

[ponsheki]

48. Don't you Need to Go Through a Doctor to get Birth Control Pills?

We're arguing about ease of access and cost, not whether it's possible to get it in the first place.

Another example is viagra, take a look at this article:

The anti-impotence drug, Viagra, became available in Japan on Tuesday, just two months after being approved in record time by health authorities.
...
In contrast with the swift approval of Viagra, the Japanese authorities recently delayed a long-awaited decision on whether to legalise the sale of the contraceptive pill - 34 years after it was introduced in other countries.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/301558.stm

I'm a guy but I think it's pretty obvious that women aren't treated fairly when it comes to access to contraception.

[4th law of robotics]

49. As a man I'd love to be able to go through a doctor

to get birth control pills that make men temporarily sterile. But part of my privilege as a man is not having that option.

We're arguing about ease of access and cost, not whether it's possible to get it in the first place.

So for men the options are condoms (same as for women on ease of access and price) or vasectomies (neither easy nor cheap).

Women have a variety of hormonal birth controls, physical insertions, and ultimately abortion as options (plus condoms and the equivalent of a vasectomy).

Men don't have those for any price or inconvenience.

The anti-impotence drug, Viagra, became available in Japan on Tuesday, just two months after being approved in record time by health authorities.

This is a solution to a problem women don't have. When women can get ED I will grant men's advantage in this field. As it stands both men and women can be involved in a pregnancy they don't want.

I'm not sure why Japan hasn't legalized the Pill yet. But since Japan doesn't represent the entire world I'm not sure how that compares to here.

[ponsheki]

51. Japan hasn't legalized the pill because of Sexism

Same reason why Republicans like putting in restriction to Plan B and abortions.

Same reason why few Republicans campaign on restricting access to condoms.

I'm not certain why you say both men and women can buy condoms. Are you talking about women buying female condoms or just male condoms?

[4th law of robotics]

56. A) assuming that's true this is still one country

the OP wasn't about Japan was it?
B) that remains to be proven. All I've seen is one blurb that it hasn't been legalized for a long time. No reason was given.

Same reason why Republicans like putting in restriction to Plan B and abortions.
Same reason why few Republicans campaign on restricting access to condoms.

Weird since most republicans are men right? Wouldn't that mean they are restricting the choices of men as well?

I'm not certain why you say both men and women can buy condoms. Are you talking about women buying female condoms or just male condoms?

A woman can buy condoms and require a man to use them. A man cannot buy hormonal birth control pills (if they require a doctors visit) and force a woman to take them prior to sex (as they have to be taken for a while and at regular intervals to work, not just at the moment of intercourse like a condom).

[ponsheki]

52. Also, When Was the Last Time You "Loved" to go to the Doctor?

I personally hate having to go through a doctor for any reason. I was quite happy in Peru when I was able to buy anti-biotics without a doctors note.

[4th law of robotics]

57. I would love to have that option

Do you suppose women are turned off on BC because they have to see a doctor? Given how many use it I'd say no.

So wouldn't it be nice if men had the same options?

[ponsheki]

58. Well, That'd Be Easy

You can campaign on making it required to get a doctor's note to buy condoms. That way men will definitely have the same options.

[4th law of robotics]

60. Except not

as I already stated women have that same option (condoms).

Women have:
condoms
female condoms
various physical impediments
various hormonal treatments
surgery
abortion
abandonment (in many states without fault)
adoption

Men have:
condoms
surgery


Yes, clearly men have the unfair advantage here. Men should have some of those bountiful rights stripped away to make it more even.

[Care Acutely]

101. I've never been able to get a condom on my penis.

Have you been able to take birth control pills to stop your ovaries from ovulating?

See? No. Condoms are for men. That's why they had to come up with a whole different one for women and call it - wait for it - condoms for women.

Oh, and adoption and abandonment are not birth control.

[4th law of robotics]

102. Condoms are for men alone?

Interesting. So women don't get STDs or pregnancy? I suppose that's why women are forbidden from purchasing them.

A condom is something either partner could have on hand and insist the appropriate gender use.

I cannot carry around a tubal ligation with me. Nor can I get hormonal birth control and force someone to take it prior to sex (you need to be a woman and it doesn't work that way).

Oh, and adoption and abandonment are not birth control.

They are ways to not raise a kid you don't want. Are they not?


Check your privilege.

[gollygee]

64. As far as women not having ED

Many women can't have orgasms, however it is not recognized as a problem worthy of medical attention, and if it were, I have serious doubts as to whether insurance would pay for medication for it.

[4th law of robotics]

66. Entirely different problem

ED is pretty much a blood flow issue.

Orgasms are a bit more complex.

Also did you know that viagra was originally developed to treat high blood pressure? They only accidentally discovered it's role in ED.

So it wasn't the US Department of Bros-Before-Hoes (USDBBH) using federal funds to help only guys. It was a pharmaceutical company that accidentally stumbled upon this and marketed it. You can't blame them for not simultaneously accidentally stumbling on a cure for a far less common and far more complex problem in women.

And for that matter researchers *have* been working on sexual dysfunction in females. Apparently testosterone does the trick.

[treestar]

77. We're talking 70s and 80s

Not sure of the value of living longer. Those extra years are years being elderly. What's so great about them? And it's only a couple of years.

Also it's my understanding that there is more spent on research and health care for men's problems.

[4th law of robotics]

90. Yes most old people are screaming for us

to cut medical funding as they are in their 70s or 80s and see no value in living longer.

Also it's my understanding that there is more spent on research and health care for men's problems.

Count the number of prostate cancer awareness marches you've seen. Then compare to the "wear pink for breast cancer" campaign.

In fact we spend far less public funds on men's health than women's.

[treestar]

95. I read little is known of women's heart attacks

because all the research involved men.

I don't say old woman don't care about living longer, everyone does - and that includes the men that live longer. But the idea that having an average higher life span is a great big advantage is silly. You're talking about an average couple of years being old.

And that may even out as women do more things. It may have started since women had less stress. Also, childbirth was dangerous, which was no health benefit. But technology has made that less of a problem. Those are the things that affect an average.

[4th law of robotics]

97. If it's no advantage would you give it up?

Would most women?

I read little is known of women's heart attacks

Fewer women have heart attacks. More is known about the effects of breast cancer in women than in men. Does this prove researchers are biased? Or that they have more female patients to work with?

But the idea that having an average higher life span is a great big advantage is silly. You're talking about an average couple of years being old.

Change the discussion, let's say we're comparing whites to blacks. Would you say that black people dying younger on average (and they do in this country) is a silly little thing that they shouldn't worry about? It's just a couple of years.

Funny how shifting the group from men/women to anything else exposes bigotry.

And that may even out as women do more things. It may have started since women had less stress. Also, childbirth was dangerous, which was no health benefit. But technology has made that less of a problem. Those are the things that affect an average.

It doesn't seem to be evening out. What 'things' are women doing more of that will change this?

[NYC Liberal]

82. How many people are out protesting condoms or vasectomies or Viagra?

How many legislators are trying to ban either?

How many pharmacists have refused to dispense Viagra to men? How many drug stores have been bombed for carrying it? Can you name any doctors who have been murdered for prescribing it?

[4th law of robotics]

91. Well viagra has nothing to do with

this so I'll ignore that.

Some people are protesting condoms and vasectomies and any other BC methods.

However you miss the point: if women lose the right to have an abortion (which obviously I oppose and think is horribly unlikely) that is still a right that men never had.

You also forget that more women than men are *against* abortion by national polls (and represent the majority of total voters).

How many pharmacists have refused to dispense Viagra to men? How many drug stores have been bombed for carrying it? Can you name any doctors who have been murdered for prescribing it?

I can think of a few male doctors who have been murdered for this . . .

And the graphic in the OP wasn't that no one would oppose abortion if men got pregnant. It was that it would be free and widely available and pleasant. Which going by other public health issues that affect men . . . er no.

[Arugula Latte]

84. Cry me a river. Women pay more for health insurance.

[4th law of robotics]

92. Would you take the discount if it mean dying younger?

Yeah, so men get the privilege of dying younger and paying less for health care (due to receiving less of it because of the whole dying younger thing).

You can really stick it to those insurance companies and just not get any health coverage and die at 50.

[Sgent]

100. Only younger women

once you reach mid 40's or so, it reverses where by the time you reach 60 men are usually charged 50% or more than women of the same age.

[trof]

55. And birth control pills would be a sacrament in the church.

[Mad_Dem_X]

99. So true! And abortion would be safe and legal

in all 50 states.

[nichomachus]

7. If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament nt

[Egalitarian Thug]

9. Jinx!

[Liberalynn]

14. My US History Professor

Had this bumper sticker in his collection, which he had in a display case right outside his office. That Professor was one of the main reasons I became a Democrat. He also had one that said "Another Man for Women's Rights."

Boy I miss him. RIP JACK!

[Egalitarian Thug]

8. If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament. n/t

[4th law of robotics]

42. Because the law, set up by men, would never allow a man to be saddled with a kid he didn't want

right?

Explain our child support laws then where men are by laws created by men saddled with the job of raising (at least financially) a kid they might never have wanted.

Men will always bend the law to benefit other men, right? So why is it that men have no "bail" option built in to the law should they decide not to want a kid?

[laundry_queen]

59. ?

[URL=/][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

Uploaded with [URL=http://imageshack.us]ImageShack.us[/URL]

[4th law of robotics]

61. No, it's pretty obvious

the point of this OP is that if men were the ones getting pregnant men being in charge of everything would set it up such that they maximized their reproductive choices and ease.

BC would be free and readily available and pleasant.

The fact that men have done nothing at all like that for the BC options that *are* available to men doesn't make a dent in the ideological shield of many who believe men have it great.

Yeah the guy in the WH has the same basic genital configuration as I do. That and 4.50 will get me a coffee at starbucks. And pretty much nothing else.

[laundry_queen]

71. Reproductively, men DO have it great

and until you've been pregnant, been through hours and hours of labor, tears (of the 2nd degree kind) or c-sections or a hemorrhage, it's difficult for you to understand just how much this affects a woman's life, her body, her health, her finances. Child support doesn't even compare, dude. Try going back to work with an open c-section scar and leaky boobs. The reason that men have done nothing for BC options that they currently already have is BECAUSE their lives just aren't impacted in the same manner, especially physically. It IS easier for them, and that is the point, which completely zoomed over your head.

[4th law of robotics]

73. Really?

What options do men have that women do not?

Men can get abortions? Or hormonal BC pills? Men can unilaterally abandon a child/put it up for adoption?

Which of these wonderful options does a man have?

hild support doesn't even compare, dude. Try going back to work with an open c-section scar and leaky boobs. The reason that men have done nothing for BC options that they currently already have is BECAUSE their lives just aren't impacted in the same manner, especially physically. It IS easier for them, and that is the point, which completely zoomed over your head.

Which is why the ones who are pregnant get all those options. Huh. Imagine that, our approach to family planning is based not on the patriarchy and bros before hoes, but rather on the practical notion of who gets pregnant.

So if men got pregnant it would be about the same, just flipped.

Besides the OP wasn't talking about the horrors of pregnancy (which presumably would be the same in this hypothetical) but rather that availability of things that PREVENT pregnancy.

How rough is it for a woman to not be pregnant?

[laundry_queen]

83. Previous cartoon applies. Still missing it. nt

[4th law of robotics]

89. If your argument is based on a cartoon

well . . . do I have to finish that?

[laundry_queen]

106. LOL...Sigh.

[bettyellen]

85. you seem completely unaware family planning and prenatal care is woefully inadequate in the USA?

your post sseem like you think fertile women are some kind of welfare queens scamming all this great free care.
Seriously, it's embarrassing how you begrudge us even the paltry substandard care we get!

I'm AM gladdened to hear you say that it's not hard for women to NOT get pregnant around you, LOL.

[4th law of robotics]

88. I would thank you not to put such words in my mouth

Especially since I've said nothing of the sort.

I merely pointed out that women have more options to prevent and unwanted reproductive event than men do.

Can you use any logical argument to refute this?

I'm AM gladdened to hear you say that it's not hard for women to NOT get pregnant around you, LOL.

This also doesn't make any sense. Perhaps you're responding to the wrong person?

[CrispyQ]

103. Perfect graphic for this poster!

[treestar]

78. What do you suggest?

Men should be allowed to determine if they are not going to accept paternity?

[4th law of robotics]

87. I wasn't suggesting a solution

I was pointing out that in this awesome male-centric society where everything is done to make life easier for men (which is why we'd have abortions on demand if guys could get pregnant) we . . . don't actually do everything we can to make life easier for men.

So the OP is based on nonsense.

Yes or no: we bend every rule to benefit men in this society when it comes to reproduction, including making all reproductive services for men readily available, free, and convenient?

[treestar]

96. The only downside for men is where they don't want a child that a woman

chooses to have. And now with DNA testing, there is no danger of being stuck with some other guy's kid. (Previous methods of determining paternity could have had mistaken results, based on what the kid looked like and evidence about opportunity).

Men have never had it better - they can have sex without marriage, and the only problem is a possible pregnancy they don't want that the woman in question does, and decides to make him responsible for - some women are "honorable" enough not to press it.

So to make it complete, should we make a legal procedure where the proven DNA father can make a case he didn't want the child and be legally let off the hook for support?

[4th law of robotics]

98. You're trying to go off on a tangent

Yes or no: we bend every rule to make things awesome for guys when it comes to reproduction thus justifying the notion that if men got pregnant we could get abortions at starbucks.

[laundry_queen]

107. Nice and dumb push poll. nt

[4th law of robotics]

110. It is directly applicable to this OP

if you don't like the implications then perhaps you should reconsider this OP in light of that.

[RC]

10. I used to whole hardly agree with this and similar things.

I still do. But there are a couple of loud militant, bullying groups on DU that are starting to make me think of misandry, when I see this now.

That is not good.

Blowback?

Blowback is the espionage term for unintended consequences of a covert operation that are suffered by the civil population of the aggressor government. To the civilians suffering the blowback of covert operations, the effect typically manifests itself as “random” acts of political violence without a discernible, direct cause; because the public—in whose name the intelligence agency acted—are ignorant of the effected secret attacks that provoked revenge (counter-attack) against them.[1] Specifically, blowback denotes the resultant, violent consequences—reported as news fact, by domestic and international mass communications media, when the actor intelligence agency hides its responsibility via media manipulation. Generally, blowback loosely denotes every consequence of every aspect of a secret attack operation, thus, it is synonymous with consequence—the attacked victims’ revenge against the civil populace of the aggressor country, because the responsible politico-military leaders are invulnerable.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blowback_%28intelligence%29

[CrispyQ]

11. If men could get pregnant,

sex education, the scientific kind, not the Atkins kind, would be required for all young people so they are fully aware of the consequences of unprotected sex.

[CrispyQ]

13. Now, let's start on "If men had periods..."

[treestar]

79. They could always take the day off for cramps

It would be like enshrined in the law. First couple days of your period you are off work.

[lunatica]

17. If men got pregnant women would be running the show

Maybe even making it illegal for men to have any real power in their lives.

Just saying...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

18. It would make "Go fuck yourself" more hazardous than it already is.

[frazzled]

19. As my mother used to say

If men could get pregnant, we wouldn't have any babies.

I remember her coming to stay with me after my first child was born. You know, ladies, how you kind of look like a mess after 26 hours of hard labor, and you waddle around for a week or two (episiotomy, you know). I remember her saying to me, in a sort of remembering way, "oh, you poor baby. Men could never go through this. They simply wouldn't be able to take it."

But back to the point: men would be having abortions right and left because if they were pregnant at 17 (or 26, or 34) and single, and had an education or career to consider ... they would not think twice about controlling the planning of their families. But they never think of women, our daughters, in this way: the impact an unwanted pregnancy would have on their entire lives.

I hope to god science figures out a way to make men pregnant.

[porphyrian]

20. If men could get pregnant, gestation would be genetically engineered to last a week, tops. n/t

[Mr.Bill]

21. The Catholic Church

Would declare abortion to be a sacrament.

[redqueen]

22. K&R

[nolabear]

23. I always wished it would be a tossup as to who got pregnant.

Might be either, both or neither. Birth control would be number one on everybody's list!

[CrispyQ]

25. "The Left Hand of Darkness" by Ursula Le Guin.

Ohhh, it's been years since I read this book, decades, actually. I believe this story had a theme like that. I'll have to pull it out & read it again.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Left_Hand_of_Darkness

snip...

It is considered by some to be one of the first major works of feminist science fiction.

[nolabear]

27. I love Le Guin. I'll look it up too!

[CrispyQ]

29. I read it for an Eastern Religion class taught by a former Catholic nun.

One of the best classes I ever took! Everyone had to give a book report. The teacher provided a list of titles. I was surprised to see a sci fi title on the list, much less by the author of Earthsea!

TLHoD was a good book. I see it won Hugo & Nebula awards.

[LiberalEsto]

33. A great book - I wholeheartedly endorse it

"The Left Hand of Darkness" is one of LeGuin's best.
Most of her other books are also worth reading - "The Dispossessed", about an anarchist from an entirely anarchist society on a planet's moon, confronting a capitalist society on the home planet after generations of separation and isolation.
I also love "The Earthsea Trilogy", which recently has grown to six books.

[HopeHoops]

26. I've got the bumper sticker, "If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament."

[Cleita]

28. A friend of mine, a mother of four children, once said to me that if men could get pregnant,

they would only do it once. She felt they were too chicken to do it a second time.

[seabeyond]

30. if men could get preg, they would handle it the same as women who get preg.

some doing it well, some not doing it well. some thrilled. some, not so much. some making different choices from others.

i hate these type things....

[One_Life_To_Give]

32. +1

Thank you

I would love it, but suspect I am in the minority of Guys who feel that way.

[seabeyond]

34. lol...

i dont think you are so far off. i have seen enough men that are able to be honest and not feel less "manly" cause they are. they are the keepers.

but.... yea you. and thanks for the reply.

[4th law of robotics]

37. A surprisingly fair statement

I fear we are in agreement.

This thread is a hive for bigotry.

/If men could . . . is always followed by examples of how they'd fail. If women could be put on the hook for child support for 18 years for a kid they never wanted because someone else lied to them about birthcontrol . . . oh wait, that wouldn't be funny.

[silverweb]

38. That's not the point of this particular quote.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]If men could get pregnant, there would be absolutely no controversy or even discussion about whether they have sole authority over their own bodies and the absolute choice to abort or continue a pregnancy.

[4th law of robotics]

47. This is based on nothing

If you were designing a society that gave absolute autonomy to men with regards to reproductive choice without regard to the woman then we'd have free vasectomies if not a male version of the Pill, the choice to abort would be entirely in the hands of the male parent, and men would always have the option to abandon or place their kid with an adoption center unilaterally (or just walk away and not be required to make any sort of payments).


None of those are the reality.

[seabeyond]

69. thank you for the clarification. nt

[redqueen]

53. The OP is about access to abortions and the morning after pill...

How those two things, specifically, would be different, if it were men who got pregnant instead of women.

Not about men's reactions to being pregnant. About the right to control their own bodies.

[4th law of robotics]

63. Men have access to all sorts of free or subsidized family planning options such as . . .

um . . .

keeping it in their pants. Or STFU.

[gollygee]

65. I don't see how this is a benefit to women

Women have the options because it's generally considered the responsibility of women. It being the responsibility of women isn't any great honor. It's a pain in the ass. And expensive, and the hormones suck.

[4th law of robotics]

67. Now you get it

Think about what you just said, then reconsider the OP.

[gollygee]

68. I agree with your point about the OP

Men would simply have the same problems women have. The suggestion in the OP is that men wouldn't have their rights taken away. I can see both potentials there.

[bettyellen]

81. men have access to the resources they demand. there is no market for male contraceptive in the USA.

because very few men want to change the status quo. #womensproblems

[4th law of robotics]

93. That's a statement based on nothing

Utterly absurd.

Men don't want to have control over their reproductive rights because hey, an accidental pregnancy/wearing condoms is awesome? You don't speak for all men. Please remember that.

/for the longest time we didn't have a pill for women. Is that proof that prior to 1960 women had no interest in such matters?

[bettyellen]

111. It's based on conversations with drug marketing executives

Who happen to be friends.
There is no demand, dude. You're pretty much the only one squawking about it.
Perhaps you could start the movement?

[4th law of robotics]

112. I will admit that there is not demand

for something that does not exist.

Just like no one is buying time machines thus proving no one wants such a device.

And prior to the invention of the Pill no woman wanted such a thing.

[seabeyond]

70. thank you for the clarification. nt

[lunatica]

62. Basically my response in post #17

If men got pregnant then women would be in charge telling men what to do or not do with their bodies.

[Bonobo]

94. Thank you. You seem pretty fair-minded to me, seabeyond. nt

[4th law of robotics]

35. The assumption being that we dedicate far more resources to men's health

than we do to women's.

Which is why we spend so much more on men's health care and men live longer than women.

/prostate exams are free and non-invasive!

[Demeter]

41. The Assumption being that Men get a choice (power)

but they can take a woman's choice away.

[4th law of robotics]

43. What choice do men get in this regard?

Men in power take away the choices of men out of power all the time.

Do you think the draft is voluntary? Of the 93% of prisoners who are male are there by choice?
What about male judges and laws written by men that say a man has no choice with regards to having a child: if his wife/gf/one night stand wishes to keep it he is on the hook for child support for 18 years.

Where are the choices that the male dominated society gives to the average male?

/didn't male scientists come up with the Pill for women? So far no equivalent exists for men. Privilege.

[bettyellen]

72. in the real world, men routinely refuse to wear condoms, to pay child support. Most couples I know

men assume you'll get on the pill as soon as you're exclusive.

God knows way too many try to do without a condom from the get go. I don't know a woman who hasn't been through that sad song and dance more than once. Women who have serious side effects from the pill, whose docs won;t give them IUDs because it could diminish fertility (no matter how much you insist you KNOW you never want a baby- yes they do refuse) are shit out of luck.

Since we have the pill, men have expressed no pressure on the medical community for male contraceptives. Vasectomies are RARE. If there was a potential market, they'd be working on it log ago. Men largely prefer to leave this burden (and ingesting hormone pills is often a burden) where it has always been -on women.

The point is, if the serious inescapable consequences fell on men, the zeitgeist would be different. No squeemishness or reluctance to support abortion (which I often see on DU), no stigma, no roadblocks to access. Do you dispute THIS?

And women believe this because we still do not have equal rights, and we remember a time when our Moms and Grandmoms were largely treated as their husband's property. Men legislated themselves into a dominant position in the past, and we believe they'd do it again. But of course, if we women couldn't have babies and thus had more independence and control in our lives, maybe we wouldn't allow men to get out from under us and do that. They sure as heck wouldn't have the time and freedom to do it.

But if they all magically woke up tommorrow with the ability to get knocked up, hell yeah all that ambivalence or distain for abortion would very quickly be a thing of the past. We all know this would be the case. Even Dem men here constantly make excuses that it's not their issue- and LOL, women will get mad at them for butting in. If you support choice wholeheartedly, women are never going to criticize that- but guys here always have an excuse to give nothing but lip service. So again, they leave the problem to women.

[4th law of robotics]

74. Do you dispute THIS?

Yes, obviously.

For all the reasons I've stated over and over again and get tired of repeating.

[bettyellen]

76. sorry- but you refuse to acknowledge the reality of both history and biology and double down with

some BS about women having it better just because men don't LIKE going to the doctor.
They don't have less access, they are just more hesitant to go. That's be shown in studies for years, and is probably part of the reason women feel like men could't hack pregnancy.
You have no reasons grounded in fact. It appears you're just emotionally hurt by the suggestion.

Boo hoo.
Go get frequent checkups and you'll be one up on all your bros!

[4th law of robotics]

86. Heaven forbid I take liberties with biology

on a thread about men getting pregnant.

some BS about women having it better just because men don't LIKE going to the doctor.

I don't even know what this is a reference to.

They don't have less access, they are just more hesitant to go. That's be shown in studies for years, and is probably part of the reason women feel like men could't hack pregnancy.

And women cry about every little thing which is why some feel they can't hack being on the front lines. But that would be an unfair and sexist stereotype would it not?

You have no reasons grounded in fact. It appears you're just emotionally hurt by the suggestion.

Your right, I should cite the studies on what happened on earth2.0 when they tried making it so that men could get pregnant. That would be a factual rebuttal to the "if men could get pregnant there'd be abortion clinics on every corner" theorem.

Go get frequent checkups and you'll be one up on all your bros!

Lack of medical care isn't the only reason men live shorter lives.

[David Zephyr]

45. Sooo true! K&R.

And it would happen without a dissenting vote in Congress.

[TeamPooka]

50. If men could get pregnant the words "sibling" "brother" "sister" or twin" would not exist....

because we would be living in a world of "only children".

[WillyT]

80. HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!!

[LanternWaste]

104. If men could get pregnant, we'd have to cook dinner and get married

If men could get pregnant, we'd have to "cook dinner and get married so our children don't start shooting up public places..."

I read that somewhere in a binder full of women's names.

[tk2kewl]

105. but we might get flex time at work

[mstinamotorcity2]

108. My Husband's flavor

would be Bacon double cheeseburger

[Megahurtz]

109. LOL

SO true!