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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSub-Orbital Space Tourism Contributes Nothing to Future Space Travel
I remember the very first sub-orbital space flights. I was a 15-year-old kid when the first such flights happened in 1961. It was really exciting. They were followed by orbital flights, and even people stepping on the moon. But, that was 60 years ago. The Virgin flight did no more than that first sub-orbital flight. It took some people 55 miles above the earth and lasted about an hour.
We all have dreams about the possibility of humans moving off the Earth to some other, unspoiled place that hasn't been damaged by human activity. Dreams. At this time, however, we're still using chemical rockets to go to space. As long as we are limited by such propulsion methods, we cannot reach any such unspoiled planet to colonize it. There just aren't any near enough, and we don't know where the closest one might be, really.
It's exciting to think about space travel. A few wealthy people will pay huge amounts of money for a brief sub-orbital flight, certainly, but they won't be going anywhere for very long. A really wealthy person might get to the International Space Station to orbit our home planet for a few weeks, but that would be a waste of space that could be used for actual research - not tourism, it seems to me.
So NASA isn't doing a lot of manned missions at this time. More information can be obtained with unmanned rovers and other craft. More information can be obtained from high-tech telescopes and research tools, too, about even more distant parts of the universe. NASA is seeking knowledge, at the same time as it is looking at alternative propulsion systems that might replace chemical rockets for longer, much faster movement outside of our immediate vicinity.
More can be learned, and for far less money, by keeping people on the ground while technology investigates other future options.
No doubt it is thrilling to take a ride on one of the commercial spacecraft, but that's a short-term thrill, and you'd soon be back on the planet. All of those "space ships" are limited by the chemical rocket used to boost them beyond the atmosphere. Virgin's craft will never, ever make more than a short, sub-orbital flight. We have known how to do that for 60 years. Where is the benefit? How does that help us leave the planet and move somewhere else?
It doesn't. Nope. We're working on new propulsion systems and exploring with technology. Eventually, one of those propulsion systems might allow us to think seriously about manned missions to distant places, but right now it's still just a dream. NASA knows what it is doing, and is making enormous strides in providing us with the information we will need. Someday. Not now. Not as long as we're still using chemical rockets. With those, the fuel is soon gone and we reach a limit of the distance humans can travel, even in a lifetime.
Research is ongoing, but results that can take us into deep space are decades away at a minimum.
Don't plan on taking a trip to some new planet in your lifetime, or even watching others do so. That's not happening. It's just not.
Pantagruel
(2,580 posts)"Billionaire Branson's Virgin Galactic Files To Sell $500 Million In Stock One Day After Reaching Space"
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)AZSkiffyGeek
(11,029 posts)Can he use his technology for faster global flights w/ Virgin Air? Some sort of rocket-assisted commercial air flight? I remember reading some novel years ago that posited bouncing planes off the atmosphere for faster intercontinental flight. That would make sense for Virgin Air.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Go anywhere in under an hour.
Also, Branson uses a similar technology to launch small orbital payloads.
Turbineguy
(37,343 posts)worshipful, narration.
Response to MineralMan (Original post)
Post removed
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)I'm just an observer. You have read my observations, and responded with mere snark.
Walleye
(31,028 posts)I think really wealthy people have a hard time getting a thrill out of normal things. I really cant harbor much resentment for it. Fun is fun
EYESORE 9001
(25,943 posts)not vanity flights for billionaires. If one of these jokers accidentally made a discovery or breakthrough with their private endeavor, you think theyd share that with anyone else? Hell NO they wouldnt! This country is going down the shitter scientifically unless public funds are spent on pure research. Billionaires and corporations will only spend money on research that benefits them. I wish folks would stop smooching their pasty backsides and realize that theres infinitely more benefit to humanity when these endeavors are funded and conducted as a society and not a dick-waving contest.
unblock
(52,253 posts)They're looking for profit. There's no profit in trying to colonize an exoplanet, at least not in our lifetimes.
Mine a comet for diamonds, maybe.
Otherwise, space tourism seems to be the only profit opportunity.
Capitalists leave the basic research and discovery to academia and in some cases the military. Then they figure out how to appropriate that knowledge and use it to innovate a product or service that makes them money.
fescuerescue
(4,448 posts)1st they are spending their money and that money is going to middle class people.
2nd, they are spending their money paying scientist who use that money to fund their research and development.
So what if they are interested in profit? It's profit that pays scientist and researchers.
unblock
(52,253 posts)They do not generally fund science, research, and discovery.
What they fund is engineering and innovation.
PortTack
(32,778 posts)Dial H For Hero
(2,971 posts)PortTack
(32,778 posts)Science, which is the real issue
Dial H For Hero
(2,971 posts)panader0
(25,816 posts)Perhaps someday we may find out how much the vanity flights cost. And the carbon footprint
involved. I'm sure the money could have been put to much better use here on the ground.
They could have funded voting rights, food for the poor, education--you know, real life stuff.
I'm with Senator Sanders on this one--he said that kind of wealth is obscene.
hunter
(38,317 posts)Some people LIKE to commute in automobiles, the bigger the better, to and from jobs that do not make the world a better place.
That's obscene. That's where the larger carbon footprint is. That's where we waste money that would better be spent on the "real life stuff."
The fundamental problem of our society is not billionaires playing with rockets. The problem is right wing billionaires playing with politics.
fescuerescue
(4,448 posts)To flipping a switch and everyone going into space once it's "figured out"
This will be an incremental process over a much much longer time than we are alive. Heck we could see space wealthy space tourism go on for centuries before it's affordable for all.
Much the same as intercontinental travel. That was realm of only the wealthy and professional for thousands of years.
But if it was just scientist studying intercontinental travel in their offices and labs only, we would still be trying to figure out how to get to North American.
If the super-wealthy want to spend it on small incremental steps for their fun excursions. That's great.
Probably a much better thing than them just hoarding their wealth.
msongs
(67,420 posts)MineralMan
(146,317 posts)They're on my mind, of course, and there will be one, no doubt. Machines break. That is the rule of machines.
0rganism
(23,957 posts)If one wanted to advance interstellar travel for colonization purposes, there'd be a whole bunch of other priorities in action, as you observed. A long-term Lunar presence, including mining and superscalar construction facilities, would be the first sign we were taking such ideas seriously.
But if one expected vast tracts of the planet to become uninhabitable for several decades in the near future, along with associated civil unrest, getting a low-orbit space station to act as a haven for a select set of ultra-wealthy families and their cronies would be on their development short-list. Preparing efficient supply chains including the lowest-possible transport costs would be an important prerequisite. I see these sub-orbital flights as early trial runs for shipping solutions.
The wealthy don't have to totally leave the planet to distance themselves from our earthbound plight.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)"Sorry, Elon! We can't make that next supply flight to your orbiting mansion. Good luck to you."
0rganism
(23,957 posts)Single points of failure are red flags. I think these guys are doing early work on the supply fleet(s) that will provide for all the orbital mansions of the uber-rich families when they make the move. The one with the cheapest and most reliable fleet will gain a lot of power in the orbital oligarchy.
FoxNewsSucks
(10,434 posts)We have a few years yet before they can abandon the polluted planet for their orbiting mansions.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Personally, I think these billionaires are doing this for shits and giggles, mainly. Plus some publicity to drive up their stock values.
0rganism
(23,957 posts)not being so well-heeled myself, I have difficulty imagining the lengths someone who has that kind of money will go to for thrills. It's easy to attribute underhanded motives to what might just be really rich assholes showing off.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)lot of money without it affecting your lifestyle at all. So people do that and quite often. They liked a vacation in some place, so they buy another house there. Then, they get bored with going there, and buy another house in some other place they like.
They don't care. It doesn't affect their financial health at all.
It would be like me buying an 80" TV. Now, I don't want one of those, but if I did, I could buy it without dropping a beat, and would not notice the expense much at all.
That's the kind of scale billionaires use to measure such things.
DinahMoeHum
(21,794 posts). . .about very little, and this is little more than a cock-wagging contest among billionaires.
https://www.salon.com/2021/07/07/no-billionaires-wont-escape-to-space-while-the-world-burns/
Space tourism will inevitably suck. Our billionaires won't find anything up there but a whole lot of time to sit with the gaping void in their hearts, which space certainly won't fill, while forcibly holding their asscheeks to a suctioning toilet seat, because they're constipated as hell from astronaut food.
The world is burning, and billionaires are arguably the people most responsible. But at least they will not be able to escape to some other, better place. They will live and die (alone, like all of us) on this beautiful, precious, one-in-a-gazillion planet.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)demigoddess
(6,641 posts)they are so stupid.
Disaffected
(4,557 posts)I doubt that space or near space travel contributes more than a very small amount to global warming.
Disaffected
(4,557 posts)can be used for v rapid human (or cargo) transport over large distances on earth. Perhaps that it what it will morph into if it ever becomes cost effective. I understand the military is also considering it for rapid deployment (for better or worse).
I also understand SpaceX has such am ambition in mind.
Disaffected
(4,557 posts)"Don't plan on taking a trip to some new planet in your lifetime, or even watching others do so. That's not happening. It's just not."
I wouldn't dismiss that with such certainty. I believe there is a v good possibility that SpaceX will land folks on Mars, maybe not within "Elon" time, but within say 10 years from now.
hunter
(38,317 posts)... no matter how much money we throw at it, public or private.
Ordinary natural born humans will never have a significant presence in space. We're just too damned fragile. Even here on earth Antarctica is a difficult environment for us despite abundant air, water, and radiation shielding.
Antarctica is the one place without indigenous humans. We humans managed to thrive almost everywhere else we landed, including remote Pacific Islands, the shores of the Arctic Ocean, and the deserts of Australia, many thousands of years ago.
Likewise, faster-than-light travel doesn't seem possible in this universe. That's a good thing because dangerous invasive species are largely quarantined within the solar systems they evolved in.
If this is a created universe that was probably part of the plan. (Shout out to Ben Franklin.)
A lot of science fiction is pure fantasy.
I think the people building rockets for joy-riding billionaires have much better jobs than those building useless things like the F-35 or aircraft carriers.
World War III was never going to be a repeat of WWI and WWII. Everything changed on on July 16, 1945.
This future seems more likely to me:
Here's your future Martian. Be nice to her.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2317225/
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Lots of wishful thinking out there.