Bells

[H2O Man]

“Are you a communist?"
"No I am an anti-fascist"
"For a long time?"
"Since I have understood fascism.”
-- Ernest Hemingway; For Whom the Bell Tolls


I had hoped that after arrests started for the January 6 insurrection, the Trump cult activities would begin to dissipate. That our legal system would function as a strong social medicine, and that the threat would disolve, rather than diffuse. Being hopeful can be a good thing. However, recognizing that the FBI had arrested 13 Trump cult members on October 8, 2020, and charged them with planning the violent overthrow of the Michigan state government -- including kidnapping Governor Gretchen Whitmer-- raised doubts. It is perhaps more realistic to recognize the very real potential for violence to metastisize.

When there are attempts to overthrow a state or federal government brewing within, say, four months, we recognize that there is a problem. We know that the wettest dream of the Trump cult militias is to have a civil war, with the military and law enforcement side with them. Indeed, there were members and former members of both participating in the January 6 attack on this country.

However, as events on January 6 showed, to the traitors' surprise, a lot of police actively opposed the insurrection. Thus, their "Blue Lives Matter" beliefs were put on hold, as they viciously attack those brave officers. Today, of course, we hear republicans calling the violence something akin to tourism, and many of those arrested expressing feelings of betrayal -- by the very system they sought to overthrow. The republican politicians are attempting to create a diffusion of responsibility, both on the law-breakers and their own parts. The law-breakers are equally pathetic in their whimpering.

"Diffusion of responsibility" is a sociological-psychological concept that defines almost every state and national republican politician in the country today. Their reaction to January 6 is to try to further deny citizens the right to vote. This restricts their right to vote in any and every local, state, and national election. They are bowing to the madness of the extreme white, er, right-wing of decaying corpse of the republican party.

So, we should ask, what is next? Jill Wine-Banks, the Watergate Girl, said earlier this week that there is a fair chance of further political violence, possible at the state level, in August. I think she is one of the most important voices in the United States today, using her unique mix of education and experience to reach her opinions. I tend to rely upon the sociological - pstchological models to reach mine. In this instance, I recognize that those here with military experience may well have somewhat different opinions which are valid and important for our understanding of current events and predictions for our future.

In the models I prefer, it is important to note that "warfare" is not limited to, for example, the Civil War, with two identified armies engaging in a series of military actions. This type is, by definition, limited to city-states. But warfare also includes raids, feuds, guerilla warfare, and terrorism. The first two define most of the pre-1492 warfare in North America, while last three defined the civil war in Ireland over the centuries. The city-states in Central America pre-1492 also had standing military that were able to conduct war.

In my lifetime, there have been numerous examples of guerrilla -- or irregular -- warfare. The Vietnam War, "the Troubles" in Northern Ireland, and conflicts in the Middle East are examples. But we need not look beyond the United States for such things. Para-military groups such as the Ku Klux Klan conducted operations, primarily in the southeast, to terrorize non-white citizens. In time, the KKK members engaged in terrorist activities without wearing their bed sheet uniforms, including numerous bombing and arsons, of homes and churches.

In the late 1960s through early '70s, there were left-wing groups that engaged in irregular warfare in our country. The Weather Underground is the most obvious example. However, Bryan Burrough's 2015 book "Days of Rahe: America's Radical Underground, the FBI, and the Forgotten Age of Revolutionary Violence" (Penguin) documents how widespread it actually was.

It would be an error, in my opinion, to think that the alt-right will cease violent activities in their war on the United States. Indeed, they are convinced that paragraph two of the Declaration of Independence not only justifies, but demands their activities. Thus, the most important antidote to the threats they pose is the combined and coordinated efforts of local, state, and federal law efforts to investigate, expose, and prosecute -- as we have seen in Michigan and in the January 6 insurrection. Yet there are obvious issues relating to this, when we consider the identities of the insurrectionists, including some that were in the Trump misadministration at the time.

Be awake. Be alert. And stay same.
H2O Man

[ShazamIam]

1. There is reason to suspect all the claims against, lefties, they were infiltrated, even created by

The FBI and other agencies. Private money is now used for this kind of subterfuge, like using people from the militias to commit violence at the BLM protests and demonstrations. (According to Chris Wray's Congressional testimony, none of those arrested for violence at the protests were, associated with left ideas or groups, all were associated with, militias.)
https://www.democracynow.org/2021/3/9/50th_anniversary_fbi_office_cointelpro_exposure

In the late 1960s through early '70s, there were left-wing groups that engaged in irregular warfare in our country. The Weather Underground is the most obvious example. However, Bryan Burrough's 2015 book "Days of Rahe: America's Radical Underground, the FBI, and the Forgotten Age of Revolutionary Violence" (Penguin) documents how widespread it actually was.

[H2O Man]

2. There are films

that show infiltrators attempting to spark violence at BLM rallies. It is not a rare or difficult operation, as the lead insuurrectionists showed on January 6., with their own kind.

Investigating suspected "leftist" groups started long before the 1950s, of course. And there is a wonderful clip in Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 9/11" that shows county law enforcement's infiltration of an anti-war's cookies & milk meeting. As an old man familiar with such inflitration by way of experience, I can say without risk of error that there are three general types: those seeking information on group members and plans, those looking to create internal disruptions and conflicts, and those who, as you have noted, advocate for violence. Hence:

"Mr. Moderator, Brother Lomax, brothers and sisters, friends and enemies: I just can't believe everyone in here is a friend, and I don't want to leave anybody out. ...." -- Malcolm X; The Ballot or The Bullet"; Cleveland, Ohio; April 3, 1964.

Likewise, Martin Luther King, Jr.'s movement was infiltrated. With groups that frequently included ex-cons -- including and not limited to the American Indian Movement (AIM) and the Black Panthers, it was possible to infiltrate at relatively high levels. At the same time, groups such as the anti-war movement, the YIPPIES, and the women's movement were infiltrated, and made the target of the various operations to destroy them.

The advantage of reading Burrough's book, if one is not familiar with events back in the day, is that there were also groups such as the Weather Underground who were able to avoid infiltration. There were others that smaller ones, such as the SLA that kidnapped Patty Hearst, that were simply led by mentally ill individuals. And still others -- including the Citizen's Commission to Investigate the FBI, that engaged in monkey warfare in Media, PA, and were never identified by law enforcement investigations.

Having experience over the decades in politics, I've had the pleasure of identifying infiltrators with each of the three agendas I identified above. In Native American work, I was tasked with having talks with infiltrators to inform them that we knew who they were, and that they were not welcome. An obvious clue was when one fellow frequently advocated criminal behaviors. No thanks.

Corporate intelligence also has a long history. The group that morphed into the CIA was composed of intelligence operatives, generally from the oil industry (for obvious reasons). It also included some faculty from schools, colleges, or universities -- such as Bill Barr's father, who recruited Jeff Epstein. And they are active today, along with groups similar to Black Water.

[malaise]

3. Thanks bro

Their violence will be resisted - they will be locked up
I posted this without seeing your OP

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100215626452

[H2O Man]

4. Thanks!

I've been concentrating on the teachings of King lately. I do recognize the importance of law enforcement's investigating & prosecuting the criminals. At the same time, I think of King's methods for trying to change the thinking of those who aren't criminal, but have had their realities warped to such an extent that they agree with the violent thugs on many issues.

[malaise]

5. If they support the violent thugs

they're on their own.
These are the same people who blame African-American males when they are killed by police. They are the ones who say the victims should have obeyed the cops. They can't have it both ways.

I actually understand their anger after reading that piece Black Swan. It's time they understand the rest of society.

[H2O Man]

7. Right.

I don't see how anyone can justify January 6. The republican politicians who attempt to are purposefully lying, openly violating their oaths of office. And some people who appeared intelligent and somewhat "normal" -- whatever that might be -- who have lost their ability to identify reality. And there are also a heck of a lot of those with very racist core beliefs, who by no coincident tend to be gun lovers.

[malaise]

14. It's one thing to not understand reality

It's another if you fail to understand consequences for actions.

[H2O Man]

15. There is something

pathetic about some of those arrested for January 6 whimpering that they were just following Trump's instructions. And it is worse when republican politicians pretend that the FBI is denying people their rights.

[malaise]

18. One of the most important things my parents and grandparents taught us

was that you think about the consequences of every action. No rational persons should follow Trump. Eff their whimpering

[H2O Man]

20. Since they were

wee-little, I taught my children to think not only of the potential best outcome of their actions, but also the worst possible consequence. And you have hit the nail on the head, for that it what my parents and grandparents taught me.

[malaise]

21. Good dad with good parents and grandparents

[malaise]

19. One of the most important things my parents and grandparents taught us

was that you think about the consequences of every action. No rational persons should follow Trump. Eff their whimpering

[panader0]

6. "What is next?" I think there will be more violence, but I also believe that the core is smaller.

Of course, even a small force can do damage, but these guys are not real sharp.
Whatever type of BS they may start will be quickly ended. Just my opinion.
I once bought an old truck with a bumper sticker that said "Be alert, the world needs more lerts."

[H2O Man]

8. I agree.

It will be smaller groups, and that includes a lot who are stupid. Hopefully, investigators pick up on things such as their internet trails before they can strike. And small groups -- including those that have stupid people -- can do serious damage. Likewise, there may be more of the lone wolf-types of Trump cult members.

[Saoirse9]

9. Faux Noose has done a wonderful job of brainwashing these people

Without Fox we wouldn't be looking at this threat, I'm convinced of it.

They have a platform capable of doing so much good but they're choosing evil instead.

[H2O Man]

11. Absolutely!

Fox News is a huge factor. It is one of the keys. Another is the republican effort to make a martyr out of the woman who was shot on January 6, and the demand to identify the officer who shot her. It is important to identify the emotional keys that motivate those who are on edge and capable of commiting violence.

When a group of people is fueled by emotion rather than reason -- and January 6 is a prime example -- it is easy for a small core group to spark violence. Indeed, this is a prime example of the overlap between sociology and psychology. It is, among other things, what our friend was making a reference to in the first response to the OP -- even someone who infiltrates an otherwise peaceful group protesting an emotional event can create havoc that will be attributed to that group, diluting the truth of the original protest. And in the January 6 example, we see "herd instinct," with the leaders getting the group to behave like bison following their leader over a cliff.

[Saoirse9]

23. Babbit is just another QAnon follower

She brainwashed herself into thinking she needed to storm the Capitol, even though she used to be a guardian of that same building.

This thinking got herself killed, and 4 others besides.

H we have a very serious mental health pandemic in this country.

[H2O Man]

24. It is of

global proportions.

[kentuck]

10. Vigilance, my Friend...

...is on the menu.

[H2O Man]

12. Definitely.

Even in something as mundane as finding a spot in a parking lot outside of a grocery store, I am alert to the surroundings. I have encountered individuals who are hyper and looking to be offended, be it by a mask or a t-shirt. Factors including the extreme heat in parts of the country can play a role in people's behaviors (and misbehaviors).

[librechik]

13. stay sane?

apologies, and I will! (I hope) Same as usual.

[H2O Man]

16. Exactly!

Thank you!

Your message is right on target. It reminds me of years ago, when I was working on Onondaga Nation territory. A Clan Mother said when events on the outside begin to swirl out of control, to pull inside yourself to maintain balance.

[Elessar Zappa]

17. While I don't foresee

a society-changing civil war, I do think we’re at high risk for terror attacks, similar to “The Troubles” in Northern Ireland. I hope not but it’s definitely a possibility.

[H2O Man]

22. Right.

There isn't going to be two armies fighting in battles. But the Northern Ireland example -- even at a lower level of intensity -- remains a possibility. It is sad to see tensions growing in that part of Ireland today. At this point, it appears to be primarily angry, frustrated young men, which I suspect could become an issue here. Young men are far more prone to follow the directions of, for lack of better description, what their high school gym coach orders them to do.

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

25. I think there must be a treasure trove of information

available on social media, from before the January 6th attempt to overthrow the government, that connects an enormous network of both active fascist guerilla insurrectionist cells with their inactive fascist advocates.

I suspect the DOJ and FBI are deep mining these accounts for association, many of which have been deleted, or had content deleted, to connect active domestic terrorist insurrectionist cells and their currently inactive sympathizer advocates.

I hike almost every day, and am seeing a lot of these insurrectionist (middle age, camos, pickup trucks, classic Duck Dynasty alt-right beard) types in the desert and forest, mostly in pairs of men but sometimes in larger groups, in semi-remote National Forest campsites. They are not hunting, fishing, hiking, or camping with their families, although sometimes they stay overnight. They always clearly exhibit signs of surprise, suspicion, and paranoia if they encounter me. Of course, they could be making a meth deal or something of that nature out there, but this is a relatively new phenomenon, that began after the advent of the Big Lie.

A group of of what appeared to be Qanon wackos overstayed their 2 week limit at one site, and built a large, bizarre, unenclosed, and clearly ceremonial "structure", with a large central fire pit near their camp. I was horrified, and later spoke with a Forest Ranger, and they were kicked out, and Forest Service workers spent a day restoring the site of the structure so that it could go back to a natural state.

I went back a few days later, explored the area, and found a rock colorfully painted with cultish Christian "commandments", and "1776" scratched into the earth nearby. I don't know if the group was prosecuted; and apparently the Forest Service folks later removed the rock. I scratched out the "1776".

Strange Days. Vigilance is necessary to preserve democracy.

[H2O Man]

28. Yikes!

Now, this might sound odd, but reading this, I was reminded of when i was about seven years old. We lived on a rural road in the middle of nowhere. My friend and I built "forts" along the foundation of an old stone wall along the side of the road. We'd throw berries at the few passing cars, fancying ourselves to be soldiers. In the fall, we began throwing garden produce, until we found that cars not only stopped, but easily identified our location -- to our great surprise.

Having been a boy many decades ago, I understand bored kids engaging in such foolishness. But it is less acceptable -- actually, totally unacceptable -- when grown men engage in such nonsense.

[Wounded Bear]

26. Some serious historians think the American Civil War really begain in 1854...

in Kansas. Widespread guerilla type warfare raged there over the slavery issue in the territory/state for nearly 5 years in the era prior to the actual Civil War. It's where John Brown honed his skills he would use in his seizure of the Harper's Ferry arsenal.

[H2O Man]

29. Very interesting!

I really appreciate this! Thank you very much!

John Brown was a fascinating character.

[spanone]

27. K&R

[H2O Man]

30. Thank you!