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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHow is this even still happening? The Los Angeles Archbishop wants to bar Biden from Communion...
My comment first: this is staggering in its arrogance, which even the Vatican seems to recognize, altho they call it divisive (see article).
Under Cardinal Mahoney the usual abuse cover-ups took place, and the usual legal bills piled up. 100 miles North of Los Angeles, a small group of nuns in Santa Barbara ministered to a poor neighborhood for many decades. They lived in a little house among the poor, but being vowed to poverty, did not own the house themselves the Church, in the person of Mahoney, did. The nuns were rather unceremoniously told to find other accommodations so the house could be sold to help pay legal bills. (When it hit the newspaper, a local convent of Episcopalian nuns said that as these women were their sisters in Christ they could stay with them as long as they needed to.)
Why this? Why now? Why not a word about Trump? The arrogance, the hypocrisy, the patriarchal condescension to women and those who support them.
Once again I thank God or deity of your choice that my mother raised me the way she did, so that even as much as I was attracted to the Church at the age of 13 60 years ago! (my beloved Grandmothers faith) I was never able to make that leap to join in my adolescence. My mind balked. My conscience would not turn itself over to someone else.
Hekate
. Tensions rose higher leading up to the bishops June meeting, when they overwhelmingly approved a controversial plan to draft a teaching document that could lay the groundwork for denying the sacrament of the Eucharist, also known as the Holy Communion, to Biden, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and other Catholic politicians who support abortion rights. The head of the bishops doctrine committee, which is drafting the still-unfinished document, has repeatedly stressed that the statement isnt intended to be directed toward any specific Catholic or about any one issue.
Although the bishops actions have drawn support from conservative Catholics and anti-abortion activists, they have deeply disturbed some lay Catholics, as well as a faction of bishops who have argued that the step could weaponize the Eucharist and alienate many members of their flocks.
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The Vatican weighed in on the fray through Pope Francis top doctrinal official, who in a May 7 letter warned the U.S. bishops that their actions could spawn discord rather than unity. The timing of the bishops pending statement they are expected to vote on whether to approve the draft as early as November could further strain the certain-to-be-fractious 2022 midterm election.
Despite the churchs long-standing public opposition to abortion, more than half of U.S. Catholics 56% say that abortion should be legal in all or most cases, according to a Pew Research Center poll. Another Pew poll found that 67% of U.S. Catholics asked about Bidens views on abortion said they thought the president should be allowed to receive Communion..
In his letter to the American bishops whom Pope Francis has publicly admonished before the popes top doctrinal officer, Cardinal Luis Ladaria, urged them to have extensive and serene dialogue on the topic and warned that it would be misleading to draft a statement that gave the impression that abortion and euthanasia alone were the issues that demand the fullest accountability.
Soon after the vote was made public, Rep. Ted Lieu (D-Torrance) tweeted at the bishops conference, saying he was a Catholic who supports both contraception and a womans right to choose.
Next time I go to Church, he tweeted, I dare you to deny me Communion.
https://enewspaper.latimes.com/infinity/latimes/default.aspx?token=42e23962a5d74614be16bae3d62d13e7&utm_id=35391&sfmc_id=2420481&edid=c3359d06-a695-4e4c-b965-2cd376b15001
Jilly_in_VA
(9,983 posts)tell the bishops (and the cardinal is still a bishop) not to politicize the Eucharist? Mahony apparently needs to see someone about getting the knot out of his drawers before his boss jerks a knot in his tail.
lapucelle
(18,276 posts)Pope Francis also announced that no Catholic should be a single issue voter, that no "pro life" issue is more important than any other, and that "pro life" issues include taking care of the poor, the sick. the elderly and the marginalized, being a steward of the environment, welcoming immigrants and refugees, and working for an end to the death penalty, as well as being against abortion.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)Mahoney was voluble as the article says, that is, he was fine in the spotlight. (LA Times says Gomez is quiter, soft spoken. He also doesnt answer the Times calls.) Mahoney got the new cathedral built, and an amazing work of modern devotional architecture it is (I took a tour, after reading all about it for years). There is one nook devoted to abuse victims I was not impressed by the lack of the compassionate figures of Jesus and Mary, the lack of seating, and the presence of a board where people could pin pictures of the survivors of abuse. A nook! A whiteboard! And this was the same Mahoney that decided to sell the Santa Barbara nuns home out from under them because even a poor neighborhood has valuable real estate in Santa Barbara.
That tour and a later attendance at mass with a cousin of mine at the San Diego church where she was married so long ago convinced me I really should no longer try to enter a Catholic church thinking to find sacred space: I am just too angry. The confusion of my adolescence (why cant I do this?) , the lingering guilt into my young adulthood (really, Catholic guilt is inherited) , the sense of being utterly appalled at the revelations of their crimes at the same time as I was trying to come to terms with my own abuse as a child all of these have distilled to a nugget of rage.
It is amazing how I can compartmentalize certain things. But seriously, todays LA Times article really triggered me. The arrogance of judging a good man of faith like Joe Biden, the chutzpah of holding Nancy Pelosi up to scorn. So explicitly do these men deny a womans moral agency.
msfiddlestix
(7,282 posts)every single point, and I totally get what you are experiencing in this context.
well done.
Maru Kitteh
(28,341 posts)So in this guy's case? Inclined to be a wannabe authoritarian, small person with a small amount of perceived power.
Girard442
(6,077 posts)Long ago they completely lost any credibility as an institution guided by any discernable moral or spiritual principles.
They should take care not to let the doorknob hit them in the ass.
Mariana
(14,858 posts)should order the IRS to enforce the Johnson Amendment, vigorously.
crickets
(25,981 posts)Scrivener7
(50,955 posts)Hekate
(90,714 posts)Bishops and archbishops form an overarching group of policy and administration. They have an interest not just in their own regions but in the country as a whole, and they communicate accordingly. At the very top of the hierarchy, of course, is the Pope, in this case Francis. I am under the impression that Francis tries to rule with a moderate hand, as each country and culture is different in nature.
However, being human, the men who comprise the priestly hierarchy differ in their inclinations to autocracy. Pope Francis may mildly admonish that there is more to being pro-life than fulminating against abortion, but these @#$&*@#$ are trying as hard as they can to reassert their primacy against women as moral agents.
In so doing they seek to punish any Catholic men, especially politicians, who see women as having the right to control their own lives. Why would they go after Catholic politicians and not MFers like Trump? Because in the religious realm they can. In their minds it is part of their job to keep tabs on specifically Catholic people lest they stray.
The fact that this intersects with politics is just a happy accident, so to speak.
Scrivener7
(50,955 posts)Biden is under the aegis of Lori or Tobin or Perez. Mahoney has nothing to do with who does or does not take communion in Delaware or D.C..
And the Pope has already told the Bishops to back off. That applies to the Archbishops too.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)Anyway, I wonder if I added that on edit. I am sorry that I was unclear in my OP or later. I was trying to respond to a question as best I could I also wonder how they have the gall to threaten the President or the Speaker of the House of the US.
Mahoney casts a long shadow, though. I never paid much attention to him, unlike one of my Latina friends, who couldnt say enough bad things about the man, as he fundraised all over the place to build his cathedral (the great erection, she called it) while the scandals rolled on. What got my enduring wrath was that bit about the local nuns, whose home was sold out from under them to help defray legal expenses.
As for what the Pope does about the American bishops or any nations what can I say. I am glad to be nothing more than an interested observer.
msfiddlestix
(7,282 posts)twin_ghost
(435 posts)Scrivener7
(50,955 posts)A Jesuit education is a weird thing. They teach you how to critically question the institution they serve.
So I did.
hunter
(38,317 posts)... if there's anything worth saving.
Progressive Jones
(6,011 posts)hunter
(38,317 posts)... no matter what Pope Francis tells them.
Any argument among them always ends up as some kind of dick waving contest.
The authoritarian Catholics feel threatened by President Biden. It's all about power.
If they weren't so fucking clueless they's celebrate President Biden as a man who loves his neighbor and embraces his faith.