The world's tallest populace is shrinking, and scientists want to know why

[mahatmakanejeeves]

Europe

The world’s tallest populace is shrinking, and scientists want to know why

By Rachel Pannett
Today at 1:25 a.m. EDT

For years, the Netherlands has held the world title for having the tallest people on the planet. But new data from the office for national statistics suggests that the height of the average Dutch person is shrinking. And scientists are puzzled as to the reasons.

At just over 6 feet for men and about 5-foot-6 for women, the Dutch are still the world’s tallest population. But the growth that has seen the country top global height charts for decades appears to have ground to a halt.

“In the course of the last century we have become taller and taller, but since 1980 the growth has stopped,” government statisticians said Friday in a report on the findings written in Dutch.

Dutch women born in 2001 are on average more than half an inch shorter than those born in 1980, while for men the decline is 0.39 of an inch.

{snip}

By Rachel Pannett
Rachel Pannett joined the Post's foreign desk in 2021 after more than a decade with The Wall Street Journal, where she was deputy bureau chief for Australia and New Zealand. Twitter https://twitter.com/rachelpannett

[Effete Snob]

1. They haven't had a big flood in a while

The average water depth in the canals is about five feet.

I once wondered what they do to keep children falling into the canals, and a friend mentioned, “Did you ever notice that Dutch people are really smart?”

[flor-de-jasmim]

2. American junk food, perhaps??

[jimfields33]

6. Yeah we force feed them.

[paleotn]

17. They're human. Salt, sugar and fat combined always win out....

We were just the first ones to turn those three into a gargantuan industry and export it world wide.

[highplainsdem]

28. Unfortunately, it's worldwide junk food now.

And yes, it's possible that a lousy diet has something to do with this.

[doc03]

3. From what I have heard from visitors to the Netherlands they have a

huge drug problem.

[DFW]

5. I'm there every week and speak Dutch. No, they don't.

The fact that drugs are more easily available in the big cities has made those cities a magnet for foreign consumers, not so much the Dutch themselves.

There is also the fact that the port of Rotterdam is the biggest and busiest port in Europe, which makes it a prime transit point for drugs coming in by sea, to be distributed elsewhere.

[doc03]

7. I have heard the streets are full of young people high on drugs.

So they are not Dutch they import them? I have never been there basing this on some friends that made a trip there a
couple years ago. The way they described it the streets are full of drug addicts passed out. Basically there is a whole generation
that don't care to work just get high.

[eShirl]

11. sounds like familiar republican talking points in this country

[DFW]

12. That is so full of sterotypes, I don't know where to start

There are a few areas near the main Amsterdam train station that have some people like that, as well as a few slums, for sure--like any big town, and there ARE streets you just don't visit after dark (nowhere near as bad as Stockholm or Hannover, for example).

However, on the whole, the Netherlands is like most other northern European countries. My office there is near Utrecht, and has people working there from their twenties to their seventies. Aside from the occasional casual smoker or beer drinker, none of them have any drug issues at all. I have been to many of the larger cities in the country, and although REALLY crowded, it is a highly educated country with interesting, educated people, very much including the young generation who work like beavers. A large percentage of the western Germans take their summer vacations in the Netherlands for just this reason.

Your friends' description of the country sounds like some European from a little developed place, Albania, maybe, who gets to visit Venice Beach, California for a weekend, speaks no English, and then reports back that the USA is full of skateboarders and surfers who never work, but just get high and hang out at the beach all day.

Just speculating here, but I'm betting your friends have no Dutch friends, never got around much in the Netherlands, and speak no Dutch at all.

[Roxi]

14. I've only visited the Netherlands

But my experience with the country has been similar to yours.

I really enjoyed my travels there, and I can’t wait until I can go back.

[DFW]

19. Their language sounds like complete gibberish if you're unfamiliar with it

But if you check it out closely, it's not so difficult, and they REALLY like it when someone from an English-speaking country learns some and tries to use it. Always keep some cotton balls to shove down your throat in order to get the pronunciation right!

[Irish_Dem]

21. (OT). Hi DFW. I read about how you went the extra mile to help a fellow DUer.

And saved the day for him on a serious issue.

I just wanted to say Hi, and shake your hand!

[DFW]

26. Hi back!

Unfortunately, I have saved nothing so far. However, I may have put something in motion that WILL save the day down the road. At least, it's not hopeless any more, and a few days ago, that is what it looked like.

[Irish_Dem]

29. Yes, you saved the day in terms of hope. And a possible life line.

The person in question now has a respected official listening and taking the case seriously.

We all want a fair chance with a problem and that is what you did. Helped get someone a fair shot.

[Roxi]

31. I love their language!

I have picked up a few words here and there, but I haven’t spent enough time there to really absorb much.

I doubt I’ll ever try to speak more than necessary, though, because I am afraid of mispronouncing something and accidentally insulting them.

[DFW]

32. Don't be!!!

They are used to people mangling their language. They have unique vowel sounds and that gutteral G which confuses non-natives. On trains between Germany and Holland or Belgium, when the German conductors (there are usually both) try to make an announcement in Dutch, even my ears cringe. And when I hear native speakers of Afrikaans speak, I try to remember that these people aren't being funny (Afrikaans is sort of 300 year old Dutch of the early Dutch settlers of South Africa). Worse yet--once in the Netherlands, while speaking Dutch, I was told that I had ALMOST lost my accent, but they could still tell that I was originally a native Afrikaans speaker from South Africa, a place I have never been in my life!

[secondwind]

13. I think they have low crime rate because they legalize drugs?

Folks who need a hit know where to go. Personally, I think this is the best way to handle drug use, and get rid of the cartels once and for all.

[AllyCat]

16. Heard this story from parents warning me before I traveled there

Never saw it. I hear almost every older American say it in those words. Not true.

[paleotn]

18. What?!

[LanternWaste]

24. Any objective sources or data to confirm your assertions?

Or simply a series of "I heard from someone somewhere sometime..."?

[Elessar Zappa]

27. You heard wrong.

Everything you said is absolutely false.

[Effete Snob]

30. Lol

That is a wildly inaccurate description.

[chowder66]

25. +1000

[Hortensis]

4. Very interesting. Wonder if it could be partly response to a stressed planet?

Last edited Sun Sep 19, 2021, 09:33 AM - Edit history (1)

Everything's interconnected, even if many factors' ability to make themselves felt through uber-extravagant supplies of food might be hard to assess.

As long as people remained healthy, though, sounds like it might be of benefit to the entire planet. Houses, clothes, cars, etc, could all lose this last 50 years' bloat. Yeah, I know. Unlikely.

But we know that not only do factors in early development significantly impact each person, but apparently whether the generation before has lived easily and abundantly, like the current ones in the Netherlands, or had to struggle affects the next generation, and not all in the ways one might expect. Ongoing adaptation.

[DFW]

8. I'd like some more detailed statistics on this before forming an opinion

The reason for that is that the Netherlands has been very liberal in their immigration policies over the last 60 years. So, does this study concern ONLY ethnically pure "Nederlanders," or is it an average taken of the population as a whole? The Netherlands has assimilated huge numbers of Indonesians, who are, on the average, diminutive in size compared to the average native Northern European. To a lesser extent, there are also immigrants from other ethnic groups (Moroccans, Eastern Europeans, etc.) who tend to be shorter in stature. If those Dutch citizens of foreign origin are included in the study, the statistic would make perfect sense without any shrinkage in the purely ethnic Dutch population. If not, then the answer is less obvious.

After all, the percentage of Americans with Asian features in the year 1500 was about 100%. Immigration diluted that statistic rather drastically, too.

[smirkymonkey]

22. Hi DFW! Good to see you! I think this is most likely the best response. Simply interbreeding with

other ethnic groups of shorter stature. It's not really alarming or anything. They are still tall, just less tall on the whole.

[karynnj]

9. Could it be that as the world became more globalized, everything will move toward the global mean?

Here, could it be that tall Dutch men may have become more likely to marry women from less tall backgrounds - such as Indonesian refugees? (I have NO information on how tall that population is, but the concept that people have become less likely to marry outside is probably true.)

[hlthe2b]

10. I had thought Nigerians were the tallest--maybe because they produce some of the tallest

athletes. In reality, after googling, Nigeria is on the list of the five shortest populations. Interesting.

[SYFROYH]

15. Maybe more genetic variation in the mix.

And regressions toward the mean.

[Backseat Driver]

20. That's one theory. Another: the Dutch diet is apparently a global trendy thing

that, apparently, results in larger brains - hence; less need to subdue an "enemy" competitor for food with a taller body? Sounds very primal; but also that the height trend initially began around 1840 until now the Dutch are again shrinking in height but apparently have larger brains.

LOL - https://n.neurology.org/content/90/24/e2166.long

[snip] Results We found that better diet quality related to larger brain volume, gray matter volume, white matter volume, and hippocampal volume. Diet quality was not associated with white matter lesion volume, lacunes, or microbleeds. High intake of vegetables, fruit, whole grains, nuts, dairy, and fish and low intake of sugar-containing beverages were associated with larger brain volumes.[snip]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/09/19/netherlands-average-height-shrinking-tallest/

[snip] - The statisticians said the decrease relates partly to “the increased immigration of shorter new population groups and the children born from them in the Netherlands." [snip]

There's always this, but it fails to address the height issue: Scroll down on link in post for video: Awww...looks so friendly...https://democraticunderground.com/12297432#post1

[maxsolomon]

23. Immigrant populations skewing the data?

I find it tough to believe that the 2 million Masai in Kenya/Tanzania are shorter than the Dutch. Or Danes/Swedes/Norwegians, for that matter.

On edit: I had not read BSD's post #20 immediately above mine, I just guessed!