Medical ethicists criticize doctors refusing to treat the unvaccinated

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

Linda Marraccini, a family medicine doctor in South Miami, Fla., is tired of patients who refuse to get vaccinated, endangering themselves and everyone they come into contact with ⁠— so she gave them an ultimatum: Get vaccinated or find another primary care physician. Marraccini sent out a letter to her patients last month, informing them that since the Food and Drug Administration had fully approved the Pfizer vaccine, she would no longer see those who were not fully vaccinated.

“This is a public health emergency — the health of the public takes priority over the rights of any given individual in this situation,” Marraccini wrote in the letter, according to NBC Miami. “It appears that there is a lack of selflessness and concern for the burden on the health and well-being of our society from our encounters.”

Marraccini is not alone. In the past month, as the Delta variant of COVID-19 has ripped across the country, an Alabama doctor also said he won’t treat unvaccinated adults.

That decision has caused backlash within the medical profession, with many critics saying doctors should not pick and choose who they treat.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/medical-ethicists-criticize-doctors-refusing-to-treat-the-unvaccinated-202958236.html

[Texaswitchy]

1. Bull.

The unvaxed deserve what they get.

[dalton99a]

5. +1. "Many critics are saying" sounds like Trumpian BULLSHIT.

[BlueIdaho]

8. Exactly.

Name names or shit up.

[PoliticAverse]

13. Too much effort for you to read the article and see names? n/t

[BlueIdaho]

20. See #15 below.

[catrose]

2. Critics should take the other doctors' place on the front lines

[Runningdawg]

3. Drs have been choosing their patients for decades; Out of network, too poor, too old,

too fat, smoker, drinker, non-compliant....in OK some OBs won't deliver babies of unwed mothers. There is a big difference in refusing to give a non-vaccinated patient botox and refusing to give emergency care to non-vaccinated trauma victims.

[dalton99a]

4. Pediatricians routinely refuse to accept anti-vaxxers.

[Bucky]

35. But "public health emergency: health of the public takes priority over the rights of any individual"

Not sure why this doctor thinks that her right to pick her preferred patients is somehow exempt from her own logic.

[BlueIdaho]

6. We have a private for profit health care system

Of course doctors can pick and choose who they accept as patients.

[BootinUp]

7. Screw that.

[wellst0nev0ter]

9. I will repeat this quote falsely attributed to Macron

“I no longer have any intention of sacrificing my life, my time, my freedom and the adolescence of my daughters, as well as their right to study properly, for those who refuse to be vaccinated. This time you stay at home, not us,”

This is entirely preventable. I am done with the willfully unvaccinated.

[TreasonousBastard]

10. Where do we draw the line? If we can refuse to treat unvaxxed...

then we can refuse to treat drunk drivers, people shot while committing a crime, overweight people with bad hearts...

This door is best left unopened.

[dsc]

24. None of the people you mention are able to spread their diseases to others

the unvaccinated can. I assume she has a waiting room where patients have to wait.

[TreasonousBastard]

31. She's not talking about people with covid, just unvaxxed, whether...

they have it or not. It's not about protecting her other patients, as much as her own moral judgment.

TB, common cold, cholera... Where's the line?

[Crunchy Frog]

25. I don't think that anyone is talking about emergency treatment.

They're talking about doing what pediatricians have already been doing for decades.

Maybe they want to protect their other patients.

And honestly, do you think that a family practice doc should be treating complex cardiac problems, or do you think they should leave it to specialists?

[TreasonousBastard]

33. Sorry I was using a broad brush. Children have no choice in the...

matter, so other measures must be taken.

Family practice is the first step of many. She may be first to see neuropathy in diabetics who won't give up rice pudding. She could also be fhe first to see potential heart problems due to diet and lack of exercise.

Many medical problems are due largely to lifestyle choices, like skiing. So where does one draw the lines?

[Crunchy Frog]

40. So it's okay to dump children who don't have a choice, but it's not okay to dump adults who do.

Makes sense.

[FelineOverlord]

42. If a disease or condition is contagious

Diabetes is not contagious.

[GaYellowDawg]

34. One of these things is not like the others.

Anti-vaxxers? Fuck 'em.
Drunk drivers? Fuck 'em. One of them killed my grandfather. I wouldn't have minded that bitch dying, too.
People shot while committing a crime? Depends on the crime. If it's a murder or rape? Fuck 'em.

All of these people have taken actions that can harm or kill others. But overweight people with bad hearts - and I say this as a person who's lost 150 pounds after an angioplasty - aren't harming anyone but themselves. It's completely inappropriate given your other examples and I imagine you snuck that one in there to try to make your position more tenable.

If the unvaccinated don't trust medical science when it comes to vaccines, let them do without it altogether. They can stay home and suck horse paste.

[Devil Child]

44. Agreed TreasonousBastard

Surprised the denial of healthcare mindset is being embraced so enthusiastically by some.

[LanternWaste]

49. I'm almost certain you're surprised.

Enthusiastically so...

[Devil Child]

50. Happy Saturday!

Always enthusiastically surprised at the yellowing of My Posts with your loyal reply!

[Phoenix61]

11. Utter BS. I wish my doctor would stop treating the unvaxed.

It is exactly the same as pediatricians refusing to treat unvaxed children. They don’t want them in their waiting room where they could infect other patients. Seems these ethicists have an ax to grind. I’d love to know their names and backgrounds.

[PoliticAverse]

14. "I'd love to know their names" - maybe read the article where names are mentioned. n/t

[Phoenix61]

15. I did. They listed a whopping 3 names.

Not exactly a tidal wave of opinion.

[PoliticAverse]

22. Feel free to post the names of medical ethicists that support not treating unvaccinated. n/t

[Phoenix61]

26. That's not how it works.

A claim was made and it’s on the ones making the claim to support it. While three ethicists meets the definition of “ethicists” it’s not evidence of anything more than a whopping three people believe something. I could ask three America’s Frontline Doctors what they think about the covid vaccine.

[PoliticAverse]

28. They supported the claim with named ethicists. If you would like to refute the claim you need to

do so at least with named ethicists that have a different opinion.

> I could ask three America’s Frontline Doctors what they think about the covid vaccine.

And if their opinion on the vaccine was different than the majority it would be very easy to find more than 3 doctors that disagreed.

[Phoenix61]

30. I guess your happy to assume those three

represent the views of all medical ethicists. I mean the article was from a well respected medical journal …except it wasn’t was it. It’s from Yahoo News.

[harumph]

12. Never seen a medical ethicist in an ER.

Maybe they should just STFU on this issue.

[Phoenix61]

16. +1 nt

[PoliticAverse]

23. Are you in the medical profession? Are you refusing to treat unvaccinated? n/t

[captain queeg]

17. Well, docs have treated smokers, alcoholics, diabetics (this'd whose lifestyles brought it on)

So I’m not thinking the unvaxed don’t get treated but maybe moved down to the bottom of the list. Those other things I mentioned can take many years to affect health and would require a sustained effort by the patients to improve. For Covid it just takes going down and getting a shot or two.

[GaYellowDawg]

36. Alcoholics and diabetics

ARE NOT CONTAGIOUS.

I'm diabetic. I can't spread my diabetes to someone else and kill them with it. And if there was a vaccine that prevented diabetes, I would have had it a long time ago and never gotten it.

I get really tired of my disease getting compared to irresponsible shitheads who endanger everyone else's lives. And frankly, you don't know enough about the disease to even speak about it; type I diabetes is an autoimmune disease that has nothing to do with lifestyle, and not all people with type 2 have brought it on.

There are plenty of people who have genetic predispositions to be alcoholics and didn't "bring it on." One drink and they're hooked. Be thankful that you're not one of them. I'm thankful I'm not.

I'm getting angrier the more I type, so I'm going to stop before I completely fly off the handle. Please, please, PLEASE take a little more care with your examples. If you think that doctors are obligated to treat everyone who asks for help, just say so, but there's not any need to make examples of those of us who don't compare in the least to anti-vaxxers. It's insulting and degrading.

[SammyWinstonJack]

46. +100000!

[Klaralven]

18. I'm pretty sure the unvaccinated can find plenty doctors on the internet

Of course they may have to squeeze patients in between making videos.

[wryter2000]

19. Are these ethicists

Treating unvaccinated patients? If not, they can STFU.

[Crunchy Frog]

21. I don't understand what all the pearl clutching is about.

Pediatricians have been doing this for decades. I don't understand how this is any different. If you have that kind of philosophical difference with your doctor, then you're probably not a good match anyway.

Find one who will give you horse paste when you want it.

[LowerManhattanite]

32. I've seen far more "in the field" doctors documented of late...

…supporting the opting to NOT take on the risk of the willfully unvaccinated exposing their vaccinated patients to the Delta variant.

“Boots on the ground” as opposed to “REMF”s (Rear Echelon Mother F*ckers)?

I’m going with the former. There’s a lot more of THEM speaking up than the pearl clutchers.

[Ilsa]

27. Some doctors don't like wasting their time on non-compliant patients.

Sometimes they give patients alternatives to do X or not to come back when refusing to do X is killing them.

[PoliticAverse]

29. That's a somewhat different question. How much is a doctor obligated to continue to treat a patient

that repeatedly refuses to follow their advice? After all, if you can't get a patient to follow your medical advice are you really helping them?

[Ilsa]

47. Yeah, you have to wonder how drs cope and

decide on when to ask a patient to change service.

For example, I am overdue for a colonoscopy. I keep up with my fasting labs, mammography, eyes, teeth, etc. But a colonoscopy takes a lot more time and assistance, because the patient is doing "prep", is sedated and can't drive, and may or may not be sleepy the rest of the day. When that patient is caring for two disabled people in the household, it becomes much more difficult to plan out, others take time off work, etc.

My dr knows all of this, so she doesn't hold my noncompliance against me, especially since I'm getting everything else done. (I haven't been under sedation since 2006.)

[Bucky]

37. My heart goes out to those frontline medical professionals. However...

policies rooted in the notion of "I'm gonna teach you a lesson" rarely work out as planned.

We need to educate the unvaccinated, we need to vaccinate the unvaccinated, and we need to treat covid victims who are unvaccinated.

[Silent3]

38. Once crisis levels of care are reached...

...like those in Idaho and Alaska right now, and tough choices are forced on doctors and other health care workers about who gets treatment and who does not, I absolutely believe someone's vaccination status should be one of the criteria considered, just like smokers are low on the list for things like heart and lung transplants.

If medical services are not at a crisis care level, I supposed that's a bit different, but even then, I don't see why unvaccinated people who might pose a greater risk to other patients who are being treated shouldn't face some limitations on who will treat them where.

[Hoyt]

39. Not a medical ethicist, but think care should be rendered in 99.783% of cases

for COVID and everything else.

[Snackshack]

41. I have been informed...

By another in this site that Doctors no longer take the Hippocratic Oath so they are free to treat who they want without self-loathing.

It seems what is getting lost here is that non vaccinated people are willfully deciding to stay a much, much greater threat to them and others. As another put it a “biological suicide bomber”. This is not the case with someone who has diabetes or one of the many issue being overweight can cause or smokers. You can be around any of these people all the time and you’re not going to become a diabetic or overnight or start smoking. So I don’t have a problem with the doctor telling their patients either be human or go somewhere else.

[mnhtnbb]

43. Med Students do take oaths upon graduation

but generally have been involved in writing them now for some time. This is an excellent article which gives examples from a number of different med schools. They all basically come down to defining the physician's duty to their patients.

https://www.aamc.org/news-insights/solemn-truth-about-medical-oaths

[TreasonousBastard]

45. Impressive! My innate snark suggests they edited out the parts where...

they insist on double billing, demand hospital ownership, and lobby for higher Medicaid payments and legalizing drug kickbacks. Oh, and how to nail one of the better-paying specialties.

But that's just mean. The thought of these kids spending a good chunk of a semester discussing ethics and how to live the life of a doctor is encouraging. Perhaps there is hope after all.

[lark]

48. I call BULLSHIT on these critics.

So it's ok to not wear masks, kill others & themselves but then doctors have to take care of the yellilng, spitting, screaming asses? Fuck NO. Let them stay home and take Ivermectin which they are always pushing on others and hydroxychloroquine both of which could kill them for real. If the unvaxxed want Regeneron, let them pay for it themelves, cash upfront. Save the free cures for people with breakthrough infections or the too young to vaccinate or those with health conditions (there are very few) that makes getting the vaccine too dangerous.