Biden, Democrats shred spending, tax plans to get a deal done

[Celerity]

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-democrats-shred-spending-tax-plans-get-deal-done-2021-10-21/

Oct 21 (Reuters) - For months, U.S. President Joe Biden and Democrats touted a $3.5 trillion Build Back Better plan as a transformational piece of legislation that would reshape the world’s largest economy for decades to come. They have spent recent days painfully deciding how to pare down parts of the plan, and which parts to scrap entirely as they seek to satisfy demands from within their own ranks to cut the size of the package.

Congressional and White House sources say that among the ideas now on the chopping block are: a $109 billion plan to provide free community college to all Americans and a $150 billion program to push utilities to switch to renewable energy. The highly touted child tax credit extension was slashed to one year, and paid family leave could be gutted as well, they say.

Most significantly, a fundamental mechanism for paying it all, raising the corporate tax rate, is on ice, because Senator Kyrsten Sinema, a key swing-vote Democrat, is unlikely to support it.

snip

Paid family leave, a cornerstone of Biden’s economic agenda, and a topic some members of his women-heavy economic team have spent years advocating for, also faces severe cutes. Biden’s initial plan called for providing up to 12 weeks of paid leave for new parents and caretakers for seriously ill family members, and compensating workers for at least two-thirds of their earnings. Now the benefit could shrink to just a few weeks, alarming supporters who view this as the best chance to secure a crucial safety net for workers, particularly women.

child tax credit extension was slashed to one year

[BeckyDem]

1. omg

[samsingh]

2. they should get a deal and then run on getting more Democrats elected in the midterms so that

we can have more progressive policies passed.

[Walleye]

3. ☝️👍

[Celerity]

5. that can backfire in at least 3 ways

1. If too many programmes are simply pulled altogether it opens us to easy targeting for breaking promises.

2. We had control (granted very marginal) of all 3 main parts, the White House, the Senate, and the House, and yet could not get a lot of it done (if we end up there). Low info voters are often unforgiving.

3. You are taking a huge gamble that we retain control. The map is against us in the House and in the Senate it will be extraordinarily hard to have a net gain of 2. Partisan gerrymandering already likely puts us in the hole in the House before a vote is cast, the historical trend for 1st midterms for Dems is horrific, and we also are unlikely to be able to pass any voter protection bills, as Sinema and Manchin show zero inclination to do a filibuster carve-out. The lack of those voter protections are a massive nail in the coffin for both 2022 and 2024. Warnock in GA, for instance will be dead in the target sites for voter suppression and shenanigans. If Sununu runs, Hassan is in serious trouble in NH as well, iirregardless of voter suppression. NC and PA, the two open Rethug seats, are already trying to pass voter suppressions laws, as is WI, FL, AZ, OH and IA.

[JustAnotherGen]

6. Senate By the Numbers

They are part of disenfranchising 30 million Americans . . . who just happen to be black:

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/10/21/key-facts-about-black-eligible-voters-in-2020-battleground-states/

The number of Black Americans eligible to vote for president has reached a record 30 million in 2020, with more than one-third living in nine of the nation’s most competitive states – Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Iowa, Michigan, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin – a higher share than the 29% of all U.S. eligible voters who live in these states. Nationwide, Black eligible voters now make up 12.5% of the U.S. electorate, up from 11.5% in 2000.


AZ - Mark Kelly - Latinos and Natives
FL - Val Demings - Black Americans can get her over the finish line
GA - Rafael Warnock - ditto
Iowa - Who cares
MI - No race
NC - Primary is Wide Open to take Burr's seat - A shot
OH- Ryan *crossing fingers - I think he can win* - Ohio has a bad history of taking minorities off the roles
PA - Three Contenders *crossing fingers I think two of the tree can win - Anxiety in 2012 - that can happen again.


*****************
Hold the House, get rid of the filibuster with Loyal Democratic Party Members in the Senate -- and we can and SHOULD do whatever we want. That's all it takes.

Voting rights is how we get there.

[Celerity]

11. 'That's all it takes.'

Hold the House, get rid of the filibuster with Loyal Democratic Party Members in the Senate

all of those are Olympian-level lifts, unfortunately, atm

We need to have an exception to the filibuster for VRA bills to pass.

I see nothing to suggest Manchin and Sinema are changing their minds to allow a carve-out in the filibuster for VRA.

Look at the huge wins they are getting via their slashing and burning of the BIF and the BBBA by playing stonewalling obstructionist.

[JustAnotherGen]

13. Not olympian at all

And we might be getting into Executive Order territory here.

I didn't vote for Biden in the Primary to have him act as a bridge builder - I voted for him because we need a little LBJ in our White House. He needs to be speaking with Garland about how far he can go without getting impeached.

I know 'that guy'. I was an intern in DC during the VAW discussions. This guy can be a real son of b8tch - if we can all just let him shove us out of the way.


And I don't want to hear a single word out of the progressive legislators mouths if he does it.

If this doesn't happen - no taxation without representation - and not a single minority should file taxes to the IRS in 2022.

We can hurt America. Unless they give us what is our right -

We hurt America.

I'm there.

[Celerity]

16. Biden doesn't have the power to use EO's to bypass actual passage of voter's rights legislation

by Congress and simply enact it all with a stroke of his pen. It would be shot down in the courts.

Look at how passive and slow he was been with a simple student loan debt reduction via EO (at the reduced $10K, not even talking about Schumer and Warren's $50K). That is well within his legally-delineated power, yet he is doing nothing so far. He asked for an opinion back in January, and has done nothing since. When it comes to executive power, he is not a fire-breathing radical.

[JustAnotherGen]

18. So what

He should try.

LBJ was not a fire breathing radical - he was an SOB who did the RIGHT thing and gave up any chance of a second term as a result.

I'm sure my nieces and nephews (20's) and my cousins's children (20s to 30s) could give a rats ass about their student loans right now. Most would like to move to Hot Lanta or Houston/Austin but can't because they will be paying taxes - and not allowed to vote.

Ask them.

This is simple - the GOP hates black people and want to take away their votes and give their money to lazy people - and the more of us that say this - the more pressure on Biden to break laws.

Oh yeah - there aren't enough votes in the House to Impeach him, and not enough in the Senate to convict. So just do it Biden.

It will put 52 Senators in their place.

Question - do you fear him doing something that would completely topple the GOP Playbook?

The worst thing that could happen - won't happen. Pelosi and Schumer wont' let him get impeached and convicted.

[Celerity]

19. Why should he try an illegal power grab? We are not a Party that wants a dictator. That is

the Rethugs.

It would set a horrific precedent if Biden tries to go all imperator.

[JustAnotherGen]

20. Oh well -so be it

This is the ONLY way.

Now -you have a choice - Trump Doctrine Dictator for the rest of your life. . . .


Or one PATRIOTIC ACT to ensure that every single American is given the right to taxation with REPRESENTATION.

The only thing you are telling me -is that progressives don't have the guts to go along with it.

[Demsrule86]

9. It doesn't matter...if we get nothing and we lose the house and/ or the senate...we get nothing at

all. This way we get something and it might help with the midterms...pass the reconciliation bill getting what we can and pass the infrastructure bill...paint it as a victory...with more to come after we elect more Democrats in 22 and 24.

[JustAnotherGen]

12. Exactly

Voting Rights is where its at.

[Celerity]

14. We are going to pass a vastly reduced BBB Act, barring a complete blockage in the House or

Sinema going full rogue.

But all of the issues I raised are still there.

I truly hope Biden can get Manchin and Sinema to budge more on certain key things.

The problem is that those two have different areas of the BBB that they are attacking.

[Demsrule86]

35. We get what is possible and pass it. We could lose the

Majority at any moment with all the really old senators.

[BlueLucy]

27. We need to make the American people understand WHO stopped Biden from fulling all his promises.

It's not helpful and even deceptive to say it was Democrats as a whole or even to blame Biden on this. I know what you mean though... The Green Party, Jill Stein who was seen having dinner with Putin and others blamed Obama and Democrats for not getting things done. Joe Manchin can come around to voter protection but Sinema can not. Sinema has no core beliefs. Sinema is just a empty shell willing to go with whoever offers the most money, attention and praise. Whoever tells Sinema how wonderful she is and compliments her... that's who she will go with.

[Demsrule86]

8. Exactly right...it will help during the midterm.

[Kingofalldems]

17. Exactly.

[JustAnotherGen]

4. Republicans are against all

Black Americans Voting.

Pass this as is - and then - break laws to secure the franchise.

I seriously don't care about anything other than VRA now.

[Celerity]

7. The huge problem is Sinema and Manchin's refusal (so far, and I see nothing to suggest they are

changing their mind's, look at the huge wins they are getting via their slashing and burning of the BIF and the BBBA by playing refusenik) to allow a carve-out in the filibuster for VRA.

[JustAnotherGen]

10. All they need to do is

Be branded by black Americans as stone cold racists. Ditto Latinos and Indigenous Americans.

If this doesn't happen -

The progressives will never get anything again.

To be clear - they will install Trump Doctrine Dictators and America is over.

I'm crossing fingers for an executive order.

And it's not just Sinema and Manchin it's every single member of the Senate who is a Republican.

They deserve anything and everything awful that happens to them going forward. I look at every single GOP Senator - EVERY SINGLE ONE -

As a combination of Bull Connor, Strom Thurmond, and Nixon.

Its and things to be hated.

[Celerity]

15. I really do not think that will work with them, especially Manchin. As for Rethugs, they not only

do not care, they would LOVE to have labelling wars. Most are de facto white nationalists, some are bolding open about it.

[JustAnotherGen]

21. Yep - it won't work with them

But Manchin has to die eventually (circle of life) and Sinema won't be Trump Doctrine enough to win in a general when she is up for re-election.


I'm okay with labeling wars - born in 73 - black military brat (mom is white).

That scum has been labeling me since the day I was born - and at 48 -

I'm full blown evil and wish a mother fucker would say it to my face.

[Demsrule86]

36. And when he dies, we lose the seat permanently.

Where will we win progressive Senate seats? We will win majorities only with moderate candidates. But holding a continuing majority and passing even moderate legislation, will move the country left as Americans see what is possible.

[JustAnotherGen]

37. This

All of it.

[JustAnotherGen]

22. And I'm sorry

It's not 'you' per se -we just agree to disagree.

I'm a rabid radical and you are moderate - and I can accept that.

[Celerity]

23. Me a moderate? LOL I think you have the wrong person.

[JustAnotherGen]

24. Generally 'moderates'

Have 50 million reasons why something CAN'T be done - and not one reason why or how.

I've given a why and how -

All you've given me are reasons why and how it's awful, and we will be dictators, and and and . . .

And none of that matters. Very simple.

No blacks and latinos voting -

You Get Nothing. You get a Trump Doctrine Dictator - most likely Ivanka. Good luck.

[Celerity]

25. The idea that Biden should NOT go the dictator route is hardly a 'moderate' one.

All you've given me are reasons why and how it's awful, and we will be dictators, and and and . . .

And none of that matters. Very simple.

Erm, the reason I gave is the US Constitution.

I will never advocate for the destruction of the rule of law, the binning of the entire apparatus of American governance, and the installation of a strongman/woman dictator.

If THAT makes me a 'moderate' then perhaps I am one.

[JustAnotherGen]

26. Agree to Disagree

Either you are on the side of black American tax payers or you are not.

When did that constitution protect my dad, his parents, grandparents, and former slaves and natives he descended from.

Fuck the USA - I hate this country.

[Celerity]

28. absurd false choice dilemma

Either you are on the side of black American tax payers or you are not.

Installing a dictator is not only NOT the sole way to be on the side of my fellow black Americans, but it is literally one of the worst ways possible to attempt to do so.

I daresay 99.9% of American Democratic Party members, regardless of racial makeup, would NOT support us moving to a dictatorship.

I have had some far-out conservations and colloquies here, but this one is deffo edging into the top 10.

[JustAnotherGen]

30. Wrong

There is nothing in the Constitution about the Filibuster.

Show me it. Seriously.

You can't.

It doesn't exist.

It's a white supremacist CSA piece of shit 'rule' that is not in the constitution.


I'm honored to be in your 'top 10'.

I will not - and not a single member of my family - will go BACK to the taxation without representation that the GOP is angling for.

So I stand where I stand -

You are either with us or against us.

If this does NOT happen -

Your precious little Constitution is gone. Without our votes - you can never win again.

[Celerity]

31. What are you talking about? I NEVER defended the bloody filibuster. I have posted

hundreds of posts here on DU condemning it. Many of them fairly detailed.

I said that Biden cannot legally substitute Executive Orders to do the same thing that the multiple voter rights bills do. It is not legal, and to try and to simply do it anyway and then ignore the Judicial system and the Constitution itself would be swiftly moving into attempted dictator land.

[JustAnotherGen]

33. Well - I'm talking about the filibuster

He can issue an executive order and force the issue in the Senate.

VRA does not have to be bi-partisan.

EO - get rid of the filibuster for voting rights.

50 +1 (Harris) makes a law.

Voting rights is how we get there.
100 divided by 2, plus 1 ='s a majority.


ETA:

Hold the House, get rid of the filibuster with Loyal Democratic Party Members in the Senate -- and we can and SHOULD do whatever we want. That's all it takes.

You even quoted me

[Celerity]

34. Biden cannot change Senate rules. That is basic Constitutional separation of powers.

His Executive Orders have zero bearing on the Senate rules, and IF he tried to make the entire voter rights bills the law of the land via EO, it would be instantly shot down by the courts.

this:

EO - get rid of the filibuster for voting rights.

50 +1 (Harris) makes a law.

is NOT how our Constitutionally mandated federal government works.

Biden cannot override Senate rules. I have no idea why or how you came to believe this.

[BlueLucy]

29. Who are these "moderates?"

Manchin and Sinema do not speak for moderates. Manchin might be a moderate but Sinema is not. Sinema, is only moved by money and flattery.

[ecstatic]

32. smh. nt