Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

WHITT

(2,868 posts)
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 07:28 PM Oct 2021

Why Not A Different 50th Senate Vote?

Sanders needs to come out and announce that he's the new 50th vote in the Senate. Now, I'm NOT suggesting he hold his breath until he turns blue, or call anybody names, but merely establish a new negotiating position.

He needs to urge the House Progressives NOT to vote for the anti-worker, anti-consumer, debt-busting, corporate Repub bill, until the Senate passes the BBB with vision, hearing, and dental are added to Medicare, with paid family leave, and negotiated prescription drug prices, and possibly more.

He can ask some VERY embarrassing questions. The American people, particularly those in WV and AZ, approve of all the different plans in the BBB proposal, including in WV and AZ.

Why are two Senators OPPOSING what their constituents want?

Why are two Senators spouting false propaganda? The cost of the BBB proposal is ZERO, as it is completely paid for, so the claims that it is too big or too expensive are BOGUS. The claim that it would be inflationary is BOGUS.

He can claim this is what President Biden campaigned on and was elected on, and what the American people want by VERY wide margins.

The best part is, the Corporate Dems can't blame the Progressive Dems, as Bernie IS NOT A DEMOCRAT. They can use the Corporate Dem tactic that Sanders doesn't represent us, but we agree with his agenda.

34 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Why Not A Different 50th Senate Vote? (Original Post) WHITT Oct 2021 OP
Bernie Sanders has been the adult throughout the whole process wellst0nev0ter Oct 2021 #1
Sanders tends to work with others AZProgressive Oct 2021 #2
No WHITT Oct 2021 #5
Infrastructure bill opposed by repubs manicdem Oct 2021 #3
The Repubs Aren't Involved WHITT Oct 2021 #6
Just an FYI. Bernie has been asking those questions. He has been pointing out what Americans, even Autumn Oct 2021 #4
Math is your friend. Scrivener7 Oct 2021 #7
Please explain how the Infrastructure Bill that President Biden and ALL SENATE DEMOCRATS support... brooklynite Oct 2021 #8
Eh WHITT Oct 2021 #15
I've been working on DBOM projects for decades... brooklynite Oct 2021 #18
I'm Afraid You're Conflating WHITT Oct 2021 #19
Public transportation service charge a fee for every trip... brooklynite Oct 2021 #20
I'd Say WHITT Oct 2021 #21
Yes, I'm aware that the highway system was built to be used for free... brooklynite Oct 2021 #24
Wow WHITT Oct 2021 #26
Because he is a reliable Dem vote in the end. BradAllison Oct 2021 #9
Fifethirtyeight posts weekly updates of this site: George II Oct 2021 #11
Wow, look at Manchin. What's that about? Sanders' yellow dot Hortensis Oct 2021 #13
I always look at the %s below the chart with the dots. As far as voting for Biden's agenda.... George II Oct 2021 #14
The junior senator from VT's record shows that he is the least reliable vote of any D or I lapucelle Oct 2021 #17
With regard to your second paragraph, he already did that two or three weeks ago..... George II Oct 2021 #10
Of Course WHITT Oct 2021 #16
The junior senator from VT is already the 50th vote. He's already dead last lapucelle Oct 2021 #22
That's because he didn't announce he's the new 50th vote. George II Oct 2021 #23
WHO Claimed He Did? WHITT Oct 2021 #25
I did, and I also read your post #16: George II Oct 2021 #28
Except WHITT Nov 2021 #34
If Sanders won't blow up the agreement he's been working to achieve, Hortensis Oct 2021 #12
He won't blow it up, but he's advised his colleagues in the House to do so. George II Oct 2021 #27
A month ago, fwiw. It's expected that they would use the intransigence Hortensis Oct 2021 #29
As of around noon yesterday all 50 Senators did commit to President Biden that they would..... George II Oct 2021 #31
Promising. But, voting in the senate chamber. Word of a gentleman Hortensis Oct 2021 #32
Eh - the GOP is more at fault here JustAnotherGen Oct 2021 #30
Oh, gosh yes. And any of them could switch their votes from wrong to right. nt Hortensis Oct 2021 #33
 

wellst0nev0ter

(7,509 posts)
1. Bernie Sanders has been the adult throughout the whole process
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 07:31 PM
Oct 2021

The other side of the Democratic party have revealed themselves to be empty suits who don't actually follow what's popular but instead dance to the tune of what their deep pocketed donors want.

And it's sad that too many people on this board choose to give these bad actors cover rather than demand that they support Biden's agenda.

AZProgressive

(29,322 posts)
2. Sanders tends to work with others
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 07:37 PM
Oct 2021

He could have went after Biden during the primary like his advisors wanted but he knew that tactic would backfire and he didn’t want to be responsible for Biden losing in case he did.

I can see him doing this earlier in his career but he has built a lot of power for himself working with other Democrats. He still fights hard for his agenda but I can see this backfiring especially when it comes to the not a Democrat stuff. I say this as someone who defended him for 5 years.

WHITT

(2,868 posts)
5. No
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 07:57 PM
Oct 2021

It would backfire if a Dem did it. It can't backfire because Sanders isn't a Dem. The Corporate Dems can't blame the Progressive Dems, which you know damn well they would if it were a Progressive Dem doing it.

manicdem

(389 posts)
3. Infrastructure bill opposed by repubs
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 07:41 PM
Oct 2021

The infrastructure deal is opposed by most republicans. I believe only a dozen or so repubs voted for it. And Manchun said he'd be fine if the BBB didn't pass. So that's not going to work.

Autumn

(45,107 posts)
4. Just an FYI. Bernie has been asking those questions. He has been pointing out what Americans, even
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 07:46 PM
Oct 2021

those in WV and AZ want and how their needs are being ignored by those who supposedly represent them. He has been out there pushing and working for Biden's agenda. Compared to those other two I say thank dog Bernie is NOT A DEMOCRAT.

brooklynite

(94,598 posts)
8. Please explain how the Infrastructure Bill that President Biden and ALL SENATE DEMOCRATS support...
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 08:32 PM
Oct 2021

…is “ anti-worker, anti-consumer, debt-busting, ”

WHITT

(2,868 posts)
15. Eh
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 04:36 AM
Oct 2021

been there, done that umpteen times, but just one major glaring example:

The bill funds public/private partnerships, which is simply corporate welfare, where they build roads, but charge tolls that workers and consumers have to pay to the corporations for the rest of their lives, build bridges and charge tolls that workers and consumers have to pay to the corporations for the rest of their lives, take water owned by communities and then sell it back to them at greatly inflated prices for the rest of their lives.

Workers and consumers will pay tens of billions in tolls and tens of billions in fees to corporations.

The CBO scored the bill as adding hundreds of billions to the federal debt, and that's without the fake 56 billion from 'dynamic scoring' which has never happened and never will.

brooklynite

(94,598 posts)
18. I've been working on DBOM projects for decades...
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 09:02 AM
Oct 2021

Well-crafted DBOM arrangements result in lower capital costs and faster delivery of transportation services.

nb - you’re aware that basically ALL of the projects funded by the Infrastrcture Bill will be contracted out to the private sector, right? Government agencies don’t have construction teams standing by to build things.

WHITT

(2,868 posts)
19. I'm Afraid You're Conflating
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 09:38 AM
Oct 2021

contracting work or projects out to the private sector with Corporate Welfare.

Other than the expenditure of taxpayer's money, the American people do not pay any additional tolls or fees when projects are contracted out.

Whereas, with public/private partnerships, the American people keep paying, and paying, and paying to corporations, for the rest of their lives. Pure Corporate Welfare.

Government agencies don’t have construction teams standing by to build things.

Yikes.

brooklynite

(94,598 posts)
20. Public transportation service charge a fee for every trip...
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 09:57 AM
Oct 2021

I’ve never understood why people assume that driving (highways, bridges or tunnels) should be free.

WHITT

(2,868 posts)
21. I'd Say
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 10:08 AM
Oct 2021

'The Dwight D. Eisenhower National System of Interstate and Defense Highway System' would disagree.



brooklynite

(94,598 posts)
24. Yes, I'm aware that the highway system was built to be used for free...
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 10:12 AM
Oct 2021

…which helped to ruin the public transportation system in America. Is that a benefit.

BradAllison

(1,879 posts)
9. Because he is a reliable Dem vote in the end.
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 08:39 PM
Oct 2021

And the people who are on here every day trashing him while always making excuses for West Virginia Joe and the Desert Cinnebon in the same breath know it.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
13. Wow, look at Manchin. What's that about? Sanders' yellow dot
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 09:56 PM
Oct 2021

is missing on my screen but appears where you'd expect it when I search for him.

George II

(67,782 posts)
14. I always look at the %s below the chart with the dots. As far as voting for Biden's agenda....
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 10:10 PM
Oct 2021

....both he and Sinema, along with a total of 35 Senators (including those two), they're at 100%.

#50 screams out at me though.

lapucelle

(18,275 posts)
17. The junior senator from VT's record shows that he is the least reliable vote of any D or I
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 06:07 AM
Oct 2021

in the Senate when it comes to voting for Biden's agenda.

And that's in a state that Biden won by +35.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The fiery independent from Vermont is actually dead last on the "votes with Biden" list. Both Manchin and Sinema have 100% records.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-congress-votes/

George II

(67,782 posts)
10. With regard to your second paragraph, he already did that two or three weeks ago.....
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 09:00 PM
Oct 2021

I think it's been posted here somewhere.

lapucelle

(18,275 posts)
22. The junior senator from VT is already the 50th vote. He's already dead last
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 10:10 AM
Oct 2021

among Democrats and Independents in voting with and in support of the president and his agenda.

He doesn't need to make an announcement. His record speaks for him.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-congress-votes/

George II

(67,782 posts)
28. I did, and I also read your post #16:
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 11:02 AM
Oct 2021
WHITT (1,938 posts)

16. Of Course

But not in conjunction with announcing he's the new 50th vote.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
12. If Sanders won't blow up the agreement he's been working to achieve,
Thu Oct 28, 2021, 09:38 PM
Oct 2021

and it does seem like the moment of truth is at hand for those he's disappointing, maybe it's time for a new populist leader, LW class struggle type of course.

In Sanders' defense, the working class voters he wishes to serve chose Biden, and Sanders chose to both serve their needs and fight off fascism as part of the Biden administration. But of course that's not revolution.

George II

(67,782 posts)
27. He won't blow it up, but he's advised his colleagues in the House to do so.
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 11:00 AM
Oct 2021
https://vtdigger.org/2021/09/29/sanders-calls-on-house-progressives-to-vote-no-on-infrastructure-but-welch-plans-to-vote-yes/

Sanders calls on House progressives to vote ‘no’ on infrastructure, but Welch plans to vote ‘yes’

As the U.S. House of Representatives prepares to vote on a $1 trillion infrastructure bill, Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., has become one of the most forceful advocates of its defeat.

Passing the more limited measure now, he has argued, would “end all leverage” that progressives have to convince moderates in the U.S. Senate to support a far more ambitious, $3.5 trillion package that has become the centerpiece of President Joe Biden’s domestic agenda.

But so far, at least, Sanders has failed to convince the sole member of the House hailing from own state: U.S. Rep. Peter Welch, D-Vt. In an interview with VTDigger on Wednesday, Welch said he planned to back the infrastructure bill if it came to a vote on Thursday.

“Our democracy is at stake,” said Welch, a member of the House Progressive Caucus. “My Republican colleagues are making an argument that government doesn’t work. I’m doing everything I can to build trust in government … by passing legislation that will help people back home, like with an infrastructure bill.”

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
29. A month ago, fwiw. It's expected that they would use the intransigence
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 01:58 PM
Oct 2021

more zealous/radical sorts are famous for as leverage. But it's important to note that to this point they've been using it to get the Democratic Party's BIDEN PLAN passed, as much of it as possible. They haven't gone off the team to insert their personal demands, for instance. And we all have more we'd like in it.

Jayapal and a third of her caucus did alarm by threatening to trash both bills in their entirety. If they meant it, that'd mean a group of extremists capable of destroying everything were threatening to from inside the Democratic Party. Extremists have already taken over the GOP, and sabotaging control of our party, and its ability to come through on promises to the electorate, could ultimately be fatal. Alarming worst case.

But, a congressional scholar on O'Donnell last night believed it was coming along and predicted that once all 50 senators committed to passing the reconciliation package, the house's delays would also resolve. (And then Pelosi would hold both bills in the house rather than send to Biden as "leverage" on senate Republicans to pass the reconciliation package. Sigh.)

In any case, today Sanders is reported as "signaling" the house to hold off the vote until all 50 senators commit to passing the reconciliation package. Again.

So, so far looks as if Sanders is invested in passing this historic progressive legislation, which, incidentally, would be, by far, the most significant achievement on his own legacy.

George II

(67,782 posts)
31. As of around noon yesterday all 50 Senators did commit to President Biden that they would.....
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 02:29 PM
Oct 2021

....vote for the reconciliation package. That's why Biden went to the House yesterday to speak with the remaining holdouts.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
32. Promising. But, voting in the senate chamber. Word of a gentleman
Fri Oct 29, 2021, 02:56 PM
Oct 2021

was once enough among senators, but many no longer even pretend to be even close to one.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Why Not A Different 50th ...