Jim Jordan sent one of the texts to Mark Meadows highlighted this week by the Jan. 6 panel.

[Nevilledog]

https://www.politico.com/minutes/congress/12-15-2021/perry-wading-into-trouble/



What's the latest: Rep. Jim Jordan’s (R-Ohio) office confirmed that he is the sender of a text message to former White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, partially revealed this week by the Jan. 6 committee.

Here's the full text: “On January 6, 2021, Vice President Mike Pence, as President of the Senate, should call out all the electoral votes that he believes are unconstitutional as no electoral votes at all — in accordance with guidance from founding father Alexander Hamilton and judicial precedence. ‘No legislative act,’ wrote Alexander Hamilton in Federalist No. 78, ‘contrary to the Constitution, can be valid.’ The court in Hubbard v. Lowe reinforced this truth: ‘That an unconstitutional statute is not a law at all is a proposition no longer open to discussion.’ 226 F. 135, 137 (SDNY 1915), appeal dismissed, 242 U.S. 654 (1916).”

The story: The committee released the portion of the text (the part preceding the dash) as it argued to hold Meadows in contempt of Congress, attributing it only to a “lawmaker.” Jordan’s office has confirmed he was the sender but emphasized that the message was merely the Ohioan forwarding analysis by another attorney — former Pentagon Inspector General Joseph Schmitz.

Jordan’s office has taken issue with the committee’s presentation of the text, which omitted the complicated legal citations in the second half. Schmitt’s words are an argument that Pence had the unilateral authority to simply refuse to count electoral votes he deemed unconstitutional, akin to arguments made by Trump allies John Eastman and Jenna Ellis.

Jordan’s text does not make clear that it was a forward, and the committee has indicated that it would have questioned Meadows about the context of the text message had he appeared for a deposition.

What’s still unclear: Why did Jordan forward this analysis to Meadows? Was it something the former chief of staff solicited? Or did Jordan send it unprompted? Meadows’ attorney George Terwilliger did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

— Kyle Cheney and Nicholas Wu

*the end*

[C_U_L8R]

1. In other words, he conspired

With or without citations

[NightWatcher]

2. Conspiracy Count 1 against Gym and possibly Marky Mark.

[gratuitous]

3. And we determine the constitutionality of things by what the vice president believes

I'm sure that's in some Federalist Paper somewhere, right Gym? I mean, who decided that 81 million was more than 74 million, or that the majority wins the election instead of the minority?

[malaise]

4. And McCarthy named him to the Committee

Thank you Speaker Pelosi for rejecting this fascist scumbag

[Joinfortmill]

5. Hope they can nail this creepo.

[malaise]

8. Cheney already nailed him on Jan 6 - You did this she shouted as she shoved him away

[Traildogbob]

16. She sure did

She knows and he is as much her target as trump. Cheney revenge is deadly.

[malaise]

21. THIS

he is as much her target as trump

[Maeve]

38. I certainly hope so!

I loathe the creature and hate that he is from my state

[EYESORE 9001]

6. You mean to tell me Gym Jordan didn't come up with that stunning citation on his own?

Stellar constitutional scholar that he is.

[mitch96]

18. To me this has the stink of Rodger Stones Brooksbrothers riot technique, but it got out of hand

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Brothers_riot

The Brooks Brothers riot was a demonstration at a meeting of election canvassers in Miami-Dade County, Florida, on November 22, 2000, during a recount of votes made during the 2000 United States presidential election, with the goal of shutting down the recount. After demonstrations and acts of violence, local officials shut down the recount early.
Both Roger Stone and Brad Blakeman take credit for managing the riot from a command post,
m

[AngryOldDem]

22. Jim Jordan analyzing the Federalist Papers.

Now I’ve read it all. Alexander Hamilton’s up to 500 rpm.

[Kingofalldems]

7. Kick and rec.

[Mary in S. Carolina]

9. OMG pedophile teacher Mary Katherine Letourneau (Schmitz)

is Trump's Pentagon Inspector General Joseph Schmitz's sister. Is there anyone related to the Republican Party that does not have pedaphile ties????

In addition, I believe, the Bush Administration got rid of him because he was not a good steward of his position and he worked for Blackwater International.

[spooky3]

11. I think she passed away. Nt

[Mary in S. Carolina]

12. Sorry to sound callous,

but she was still a pedophile.

[tishaLA]

10. "complicated legal citations"?

[pecosbob]

33. I have to call B.S. on the 'complicated legal citations' as well

More like specious sh*t that stuck to the wall.

[oldsoftie]

13. But the VP has no legal authority to "deem" something unconstitutional.

Unless i'm missing something

[bucolic_frolic]

15. Precisely

Pence is not SCOTUS at that point or any other time. None of this is about what someone "believes". It is the culmination of a closely guarded and metered procedure that is a celebratory political ritual. Republicans could trash anything for political power or monetary gain.

[radius777]

20. Problem is all of this could've wound up in SCOTUS

where they could've found some tortured logic to give it to Trump. Roberts would not have gone along but the other 5 possibly would have. Scalia's SCOTUS gave us W, remember. Repubs are experts at stealing elections.

[oldsoftie]

34. I doubt it; they tossed all his OTHER cases. This would've been bigger than those

I think it wouldve been abridge too far

[radius777]

35. They tossed cases having to do with alleged fraud

and other state election process questions - not with whether Pence or state legislatures could arbitrarily throw out electors or appoint alternate slates - ie Constitutional questions which are not entirely clear.

[Slammer]

24. Deem

I haven't read their thoughts on the matter but I'd imagine that they're thinking about the oath of office in which the officeholder swears "to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.''

So if you don't think something is constitutional, as someone who has taken that oath, you shouldn't be doing it.

That came up with President George W. Bush who signed campaign finance reform into law while he was saying that he didn't think it was constitutional and said that the courts would have to look at the new law to figure out whether it was constitutional or not...and a lot of people threw a fit about it because they didn't think a president should be signing things into law that he thought was unconstitutional.


As for a more scholarly look at the topic of whether it gives an officeholder the power to deem something to be unconstitutional:

https://constitution.findlaw.com/article2/annotation06.html#1

That the oath the President is required to take might be considered to add anything to the powers of the President, because of his obligation to ''preserve, protect and defend the Constitution,'' might appear to be rather a fanciful idea. But in President Jackson's message announcing his veto of the act renewing the Bank of the United States there is language which suggests that the President has the right to refuse to enforce both statutes and judicial decisions on his own independent decision that they were unwarranted by the Constitution. 102 The idea next turned up in a message by President Lincoln justifying his suspension of the writ of habeas corpus without obtaining congressional authorization. 103 And counsel to President Johnson during his impeachment trial adverted to the theory but only in passing. 104 Beyond these isolated instances, it does not appear to be seriously contended that the oath adds anything to the President's powers.

Footnotes

[Footnote 101] Act of March 1, 1792, 1 Stat. 239, Sec. 12.

[Footnote 102] 2 J. Richardson, op. cit., n.42, 576. Chief Justice Taney, who as a member of Jackson's Cabinet had drafted the message, later repudiated this possible reading of the message. 2 C. Warren, The Supreme Court in United States History (New York: 1926), 223-224.

[Footnote 103] 6 J. Richardson, op. cit., n.42, 25.

[Footnote 104] 2 Trial of Andrew Johnson (Washington: 1868), 200, 293, 296.

[Mr.Bill]

27. Unfortunately we have undereducated Sheriffs

in this country who think they have the authority todo this.

[Comfortably_Numb]

14. Hit the showers Gym. You can't turn a blind eye to your own sedition.

[Traildogbob]

17. He may

Get a closer look at shower abuse and not be able to be silent and let it slide. Not promoting that at all. But Karma May May show up for those abused athletes.

[Mr.Bill]

28. He may do well in prison.

At least he's not a snitch.

[Comfortably_Numb]

37. I despise that shitbird Gym, and I long for the day when he gets his karmic ass whooping!

Those students that he turned his back on deserve nothing less.

[murielm99]

19. Remember, this is someone who

never took the bar exam. He is no expert on the law.

[EleanorR]

23. Seems this Schmitt guy may be an anti-semitic Holocaust denier

One of Donald Trump’s foreign policy advisers doubted the extent of the Holocaust and bragged about firing “the Jews” during his tenure as inspector general at the Defense Department, according to allegations surfaced by McClatchyDC on Thursday.

After working for the federal government, Joseph E. Schmitz worked as an executive at Blackwater Worldwide and now works as a private practice attorney in Washington. He was named as an adviser to Trump’s campaign in March.

In a complaint file obtained by McClatchy, senior intelligence official Daniel Meyer wrote of Schmitz, “His summary of his tenure’s achievement reported as ‘…I fired the Jews.’” Meyer, who worked in the Pentagon inspector general’s office, cited another Pentagon official, John Crane, as the source and witness to Schmitz’s alleged remark.

Crane reported Schmitz also made remarks casting doubt on the Holocaust, Meyer wrote in the complaint, which is now before the Merit Systems Protection Board.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/joseph-schmitz-trump-adviser-allegations-anti-semitism

[FakeNoose]

25. When did Gym Jordan get a law degree?

Maybe he's a constitutional expert and none of us knew it?

[LW1977]

26. Well he never represented any rape victims if he is a lawyer.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

31. IIRC he's got the law degree but never passed the bar exam.

[JohnnyRingo]

29. Honestly can't imagine anyone asking Jordan for his guidance

I'm pretty certain that the smug gentlemoran from Ohio was trying to come off as a real legislator by plagiarizing someone's words and offering them up as advice. That's how he is.

[monkeyman1]

30. he can't even do that right !! ol'jock strap acting smart ? that's funny !!

I needed that !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Historic NY]

32. From the guy that can't pass a bar exam...

is trying to use the Federalist Papers to suborn Sedition.

[link:http://www.let.rug.nl/usa/documents/1786-1800/the-federalist-papers/the-federalist-78.php|]

[BobTheSubgenius]

36. When I read the paragraph headed "Here's the full text." I was just about gobsmacked.

Gym Jordan wrote this? Gym F'ing JORDAN??? Get outta town.

Forwarding an email containing someone else's legal analysis AND citations seems way more within his skill set.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

39. Lock him up!!!!!

[crickets]

40. That's one name, within a day or two of the texts being revealed.

Who's next?

[twodogsbarking]

41. In other Ohio news.... Story also on DU.

Last edited Thu Dec 16, 2021, 03:46 PM - Edit history (1)

[link:https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/dec/16/ohio-police-ask-for-help-finding-thieves-who-stole-entire-bridge|