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Celerity

(43,485 posts)
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 08:31 AM Dec 2021

Omicron Threatens Red America

In many communities, most adults remain unvaccinated.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/17/briefing/omicron-spread-red-america.html



Tucker Carlson could do it. So could Laura Ingraham, Mark Levin or Donald Trump himself. One of these conservative figures could go on the air and explain that the Omicron variant has placed much of their audience in grave danger. They could remind people that they have been skeptical of vaccines at times — but that Omicron is different. It is so contagious that it may quickly sweep the country.

As they issued this warning, they could still take their usual swipes at the political left, mocking panicky liberals for wearing masks outdoors and forcing children to sit apart in cold schoolyards. Conservatives don’t need to do any of that; they just need to take a Covid-19 vaccine — the “Trump vaccine” that could save their life.

I don’t have any illusions about how likely this scenario is, but I do think that unvaccinated Americans — who are disproportionately Republican — are now in even more danger than a few weeks ago. Omicron seems to be qualitatively more contagious than any earlier variant. As my colleague Emily Anthes writes, in a roundup of the latest developments: In South Africa, Omicron spread twice as fast as the highly infectious Delta variant. In Britain, officials have estimated that 200,000 people are becoming infected with Omicron every day. In Denmark, Omicron cases are doubling roughly every two days.

‘Needlessly’

In the U.S., partisanship is the biggest factor determining vaccination rates. If Democratic voters made up their own country, it would be one of the world’s most vaccinated, with more than 91 percent of adults having received at least one shot. Only about 60 percent of Republican adults have done so. This vaccination gap has created a huge gap in death rates, one that has grown sharply during the second half of the year.

snip

102 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Omicron Threatens Red America (Original Post) Celerity Dec 2021 OP
Don't give those unvaccinated (red line in the graph) people any hospital care they can die at home. Botany Dec 2021 #1
That is an extreme-extremist position that denies all medical ethics Hortensis Dec 2021 #20
Fuck 'em BTW a friend is a nurse in a hopsital and everyday he is at risk treating these clowns Botany Dec 2021 #28
Thanks for the enormous retrench from advocating Hortensis Dec 2021 #32
3 things Botany Dec 2021 #38
I'd say thank goodness this is not on you, but there's nothing Hortensis Dec 2021 #44
This message was self-deleted by its author Eliot Rosewater Dec 2021 #94
a Covid Ward azureblue Dec 2021 #83
Yes though I might add: for the unvaxxed, because it was their choice to put others at risk. JudyM Dec 2021 #84
It's suicide inthewind21 Dec 2021 #67
What a pity, eh? roamer65 Dec 2021 #55
This is what we are dealing with .... CNN C-19 hits a hospital in Michigan. Botany Dec 2021 #62
Yup, we in MI are getting hit hard. roamer65 Dec 2021 #65
I'm Also A Nurse GB_RN Dec 2021 #63
My doctor just took a 6 month leave Tree Lady Dec 2021 #71
COVID Probably Had A Lot To Do With It... GB_RN Dec 2021 #89
This is SO true! Trueblue Texan Dec 2021 #96
I disagree 100 percent Moostache Dec 2021 #33
I get your point, but notinkansas Dec 2021 #37
Professionals in medical ethics make these decisions, Hortensis Dec 2021 #41
Your defense ejbr Dec 2021 #45
Right on! CrackityJones75 Dec 2021 #102
Nobody is talking about excluding Democrats from care. notinkansas Dec 2021 #58
Once you start picking and choosing based on something other than triage criteria NH Ethylene Dec 2021 #87
We tried to get them to get vaxxed azureblue Dec 2021 #100
That's horrible. NH Ethylene Dec 2021 #101
+1/nt ejbr Dec 2021 #43
It's triage in a scarcity situation. Gore1FL Dec 2021 #46
Triage is treating those who need it most but have the best chance to survive. NH Ethylene Dec 2021 #59
And thats the point I think some may be making TheRealNorth Dec 2021 #64
Unvaccinated people have a lesser chance of surviving. Scarcity of resources requires choices. Gore1FL Dec 2021 #70
In general, you are correct. But on a case-by-case basis... AncientAndy Dec 2021 #82
Vaccination status may become considered as part of triage, especially Hortensis Dec 2021 #60
I do love your last sentence. NH Ethylene Dec 2021 #88
"Let" is at least a kinder and gentler death wish Hortensis Dec 2021 #92
This opinion is tossed out pretty often here. NH Ethylene Dec 2021 #56
You are ethically correct but we are talking about people who have no ethics whatsoever. Prof. Toru Tanaka Dec 2021 #97
No it isn't CrackityJones75 Dec 2021 #99
Red states and counties are more concerned about CRT . ..... Lovie777 Dec 2021 #2
They are big fans on WRT. multigraincracker Dec 2021 #18
15 more red voters dying per 100k blue voters? Need the gap to open more, then the fascists Alexander Of Assyria Dec 2021 #3
If their families and friends had been vaccinated I would feel bad for them too Botany Dec 2021 #5
It currently doesn't look as if omicron is lethal enough to do it. JudyM Dec 2021 #85
Shhh...they don't know that yet, Fox convinced them horse medicine cures fake virus, so.... Alexander Of Assyria Dec 2021 #86
No surprises here. I think by the beginning of the year, following Christmas get togethers captain queeg Dec 2021 #4
We need to publicly call out the GOP politicians such as DeSantis and Abbot who are spreading ... Botany Dec 2021 #6
Just call it the Republican virus. wnylib Dec 2021 #26
"I think Covid is the only reason we got rid of TFG" bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #16
In spite of his horrible response to the pandemic, 11 million more people voted for him than in 2016 CrispyQ Dec 2021 #48
Thanks for making this point, because if anyone thinks he cant win again, they are mistaken. Eliot Rosewater Dec 2021 #95
He could have been a hero. He would have sailed to re-election. louis-t Dec 2021 #40
Hmm. What a pity. NurseJackie Dec 2021 #7
This about sums up my feelings and those of several others around me. Probatim Dec 2021 #10
Cafeteria-style science ... that's an excellent way to compare and describe it. NurseJackie Dec 2021 #14
Science a la carte TheRealNorth Dec 2021 #68
That has been my idea for months. BTW we can use a back hoe to dig graves next to the tents. Botany Dec 2021 #17
Perfect! (I was imagining today's white-top tents... but...) NurseJackie Dec 2021 #21
These idiots are driving the pandemic by being living hosts for the virus. Botany Dec 2021 #25
SHUSH Knight of the Middle Dec 2021 #8
You can't warn 'em if you try. Mister Ed Dec 2021 #27
One dangerous aspect not discussed by MSM outlets is the likelihood that among those who survive Ford_Prefect Dec 2021 #9
As to survivors, many will suffer Long Covid for months and years. . . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Dec 2021 #12
pay their own hospital bill's & wipe them out of cash ! monkeyman1 Dec 2021 #81
+ I've also seen these alarming reports, get ready... appalachiablue Dec 2021 #22
History will remember Maine Abu El Banat Dec 2021 #11
Yes, unless we don't stop them in 2022 & 2024 and THEY write History. Tommymac Dec 2021 #69
The media, as usual, is not doing its job on the virus. Lonestarblue Dec 2021 #13
...... And decrease the surplus population. GoneOffShore Dec 2021 #15
++ appalachiablue Dec 2021 #23
Republicans insisted on herd immunity from the start of the pandemic bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #19
If you are looking for advocacy of genocide, you have it right there DBoon Dec 2021 #80
I'd say the article points out that this is taking place... among the 'strong' right. (n/t) OldBaldy1701E Dec 2021 #91
Having been mocked for 20 months for my covid caution, I say fuck them. Orrex Dec 2021 #24
Killing off those uneducated red voters... Historic NY Dec 2021 #29
To the UnVax nwliberalkiwi Dec 2021 #30
That's called culling the herd nt doc03 Dec 2021 #31
They can always shoot it. milestogo Dec 2021 #34
I just heard a radio ad saying Biden's socialism is killing Americans IronLionZion Dec 2021 #35
I am okay with giving them all the horse dewormer and hydroxy that they want.... TheRealNorth Dec 2021 #66
Agreed, they can stay home and self-medicate IronLionZion Dec 2021 #75
Oh, well. Joinfortmill Dec 2021 #36
Danger means less than zip. Tell them it will cost them money gulliver Dec 2021 #39
Forget money, most of them dont have that anyway quakerboy Dec 2021 #47
It will be a Blue Christmas Without You - Elvis Captain Zero Dec 2021 #42
That horse has already left the barn. even if one of these idiots told the mouthbreathers the truth. Javaman Dec 2021 #49
Pay to play. If there is hospital space available, quarantine the area and only housecat Dec 2021 #50
A bit dismissive YP_Yooper Dec 2021 #51
Red areas are less vaccinated than most Blue areas, and Rethugs are far less vaccinated on balance Celerity Dec 2021 #54
I simply have no sympathy Glaisne Dec 2021 #52
Use reverse psychology: "Free vaccinations are only for Biden voters." lindysalsagal Dec 2021 #53
I do think the constant 'selling' of the vaccine was a mistake. NH Ethylene Dec 2021 #90
Oh well? ellie Dec 2021 #57
these red state trump lovers llashram Dec 2021 #61
I can't even pretend to care Bettie Dec 2021 #72
What is the threat? former9thward Dec 2021 #73
Only 38% of Black people are vaccinated in FL madville Dec 2021 #74
Trump got around 10% of Black Floridians IronLionZion Dec 2021 #78
K&R BlueWavePsych Dec 2021 #76
Can't fix stupid Deminpenn Dec 2021 #77
The MAGATS are so self destructive mnhtnbb Dec 2021 #79
I like the looks of that chart. Woo hoo! Missn-Hitch Dec 2021 #93
I'm tired of these Typhoid Marys azureblue Dec 2021 #98

Botany

(70,567 posts)
1. Don't give those unvaccinated (red line in the graph) people any hospital care they can die at home.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 08:49 AM
Dec 2021

We should not be going through this 'cept for MAGA idiots with their MDs from Google Med School & Facebook U. have decided not to get vaccinated and they became "hosts" to the virus where it can live and mutate.

Red line in graph July spike = delta
Nov/Dec. spike = omnicron

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
20. That is an extreme-extremist position that denies all medical ethics
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:03 AM
Dec 2021

and all democratic principles. Democrats would pour out into the streets to demand and give care to people dying outside hospitals.

Russia and China are too civilized for the "solution" you advocate. That's how extreme it is. It might find a home in NK for any nutcases who defied the government's edict to be vaccinated, but care would be denied in the jails and prisons they were sent to for attitude adjustment.

Botany

(70,567 posts)
28. Fuck 'em BTW a friend is a nurse in a hopsital and everyday he is at risk treating these clowns
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:30 AM
Dec 2021

there has been a # of times the hospital has not been able to give care because they are filled up
w/Covid Idiots

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
32. Thanks for the enormous retrench from advocating
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:39 AM
Dec 2021

genocide of this group to, I assume practically speaking, giving them the finger. Generally speaking, I don't believe DU is too good for that.

Botany

(70,567 posts)
38. 3 things
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:01 AM
Dec 2021

1) If people end up in some kind of palliative only care because they refused to get vaccinated
it is on them. It is not me or anybody else.

2) By refusing to get the vaccine they are becoming hosts to the virus where it can grow and
mutate. aka spreading the disease.

3) I still remember the case of a boy in Florida last summer who couldn't get into an ER for
pain management of his cancer because all the beds were filled w/C-19 patients who refused to
get vaccinated.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
44. I'd say thank goodness this is not on you, but there's nothing
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:14 AM
Dec 2021

accidental about the protections that guard our right to life. Of course it's not on you.

Response to Hortensis (Reply #44)

azureblue

(2,149 posts)
83. a Covid Ward
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:49 PM
Dec 2021

should be established. isolated as if it were smallpox, and with a set number of beds. And if the hospital has no more Covid beds they should go find another hospital. And not take up beds for those who need it.

roamer65

(36,747 posts)
55. What a pity, eh?
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:02 PM
Dec 2021


I’m in your camp, Botany.

There will be 3 groups in a couple of years.

1. Vaccinated
2. Recovered
3. Dead

roamer65

(36,747 posts)
65. Yup, we in MI are getting hit hard.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:48 PM
Dec 2021

The only way one should be going around in MI without a mask is if you are triple vaxxed.

GB_RN

(2,373 posts)
63. I'm Also A Nurse
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:38 PM
Dec 2021

Clowns like the ones you picture are partly why I went back to school. I got tired of the increased COVID risk from the antivaxxers and and MAGAt Covidiots.

Tree Lady

(11,484 posts)
71. My doctor just took a 6 month leave
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 01:08 PM
Dec 2021

Of absence, don't know why but I just thought she needed a break from all of this.

GB_RN

(2,373 posts)
89. COVID Probably Had A Lot To Do With It...
Sat Dec 18, 2021, 10:18 AM
Dec 2021

Providers and nurses are burning out at unbelievable rates thanks to COVID and the deniers/antivaxxers.

Trueblue Texan

(2,440 posts)
96. This is SO true!
Sun Dec 19, 2021, 11:04 AM
Dec 2021

I'm two years from retirement and every day I have to talk myself into not calling it quits early. I am so burnt out, worn out, disgusted with it all. It's all I can do to force myself to remember why I'm there every day.

Moostache

(9,897 posts)
33. I disagree 100 percent
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:40 AM
Dec 2021

This is NOT an extreme position.

These people - the intentionally unvaxxed - are biological terrorists, full stop.

Their "choice" is to remain unprotected against serious illness and unmitigated against potential infection. That allows the virus to find new hosts and ample re estate to replicate, mutate and make existing vaccines less effective.

Treating these people as priority cases that cause other care to be denied others is the extreme position.

Exclusion from the socal contract here is a voluntary act. Not a government pogrom.

I invite them to pray for healing if they refuse to take all available precautions.

notinkansas

(1,096 posts)
37. I get your point, but
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:54 AM
Dec 2021

isn't it also unethical to turn away non-covid patients who desperately need immediate care because no space has been reserved for non-covid patients? Some of those patients are also facing death.

There has to be some provision made to treat the non-covid emergencies.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
41. Professionals in medical ethics make these decisions,
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:09 AM
Dec 2021

and both the lives of patients and legal exposures of the institutions are taken very seriously. Of course there is provision to treat non-Covid emergencies.

Since virtually all of us will need hospitalization, it should be reassuring to know that in our nation people are never targeted for exclusion from care because they belong to a certain group and that the right to life means that all people have a right to medical care. Even if the Republicans were to impose an authoritarian state, it's extremely unlikely that any hospital would exclude Democrats from care, even if some of us do eat children's faces and outraged social media mobs angrily demand we be tossed out to die.

ejbr

(5,856 posts)
45. Your defense
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:16 AM
Dec 2021

Of those who refuse to get vaccinated appears greater than your concern for those whose sickness was not their choice. They f'd around, now let THEM found out, not the rest of us

notinkansas

(1,096 posts)
58. Nobody is talking about excluding Democrats from care.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:16 PM
Dec 2021

Many hospitals have had to divert ambulances to other hospitals - even to other states - for care because their emergency rooms are overrun with covid patients. Sometimes a hospital cannot be found for a non-covid person requiring special care because of the same reason. Sometimes those people die when they normally would survive with treatment.


Struggling hospitals are in a no-win situation under this scenario to be sure. I expect they feel they are doing the best they can, but I'm not so sure decisions are always made that will allow for care for emergency non-covid patients.

https://www.koin.com/news/health/coronavirus/oregon-hospital-overcrowding-causing-patient-deaths/

PORTLAND, Ore. (PORTLAND TRIBUNE) — COVID-19 is now killing Oregonians who haven’t even contracted the disease.

As unvaccinated people with COVID-19 fill Oregon hospitals to their capacity and beyond, other patients are dying because they can’t get needed care.

Erik Thorsen, CEO of Columbia-Memorial Hospital in Astoria, has had several patient deaths in his 25-bed facility during the recent pandemic spike. They died, he says, because they could not be transferred to larger, more specialized hospitals for the more complex care they needed.

“They’re folks that need a heart specialist or need to go to a (cardiac catheter) lab,” he said of the patients who’ve died, adding that they were “all non-COVID.

NH Ethylene

(30,816 posts)
87. Once you start picking and choosing based on something other than triage criteria
Sat Dec 18, 2021, 10:14 AM
Dec 2021

Anything goes.

Even excluding Democrats, under the right set of political circumstances.

It's not a door that should be opened.

azureblue

(2,149 posts)
100. We tried to get them to get vaxxed
Sun Dec 19, 2021, 06:33 PM
Dec 2021

and they refused. Then, when the catch Covid, they have the gall to demand treatment that is being taken away from others, because their choice made the sick. Nope. They decided to go that route - let them continue without medical care, to its conclusion. There are others who desperately need medical care, who are being sidelined because of these self assholes.

Family member has cancer, and got really sick from chemo, and had to go to the hospital with low hemoglobin. The effin covid anti vaxxers had taken up all the beds in ICU, and he had a mild heart attack while waiting for a bed in ICU. A family member saw it on the monitor and had to yell for the code team, who was (you guessed it) trying to save an intubated anti vaxxer. Took the hospital 2 days to get family member a bed in ICU. Meanwhile, FM is in ER taking up a bed that someone else could be using. The hospital was over loaded with anti Vaxxers and top add to it, idiotic family members demanding some cure they heard about from Trump. Denying the patient had Covid (calling in the flu), and being belligerent. FM said he heard one say he didn't want "no tracking device jabbed into his arm", and was refusing to be treated. Refusing to leave the ER even though there are rules the ER and number of family members allowed. Same bunch of anti vaxxers standing it the hallways of the ER and making nurses and doctors walk around them. FM said the ER had to get security to precede a patient on a gurney, just to get the idiots out of the way.

Nope.

NH Ethylene

(30,816 posts)
101. That's horrible.
Sun Dec 19, 2021, 08:17 PM
Dec 2021

Maybe there should be dedicated wings for non-Covid patients which maintain a certain number of vacancies all the time no matter what's going on elsewhere in the hospital.

Gore1FL

(21,151 posts)
46. It's triage in a scarcity situation.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:20 AM
Dec 2021

There are needed hospital beds. Those that chose to avoid protection should not take precedent over, for example, heart patients that took their medicine.

NH Ethylene

(30,816 posts)
59. Triage is treating those who need it most but have the best chance to survive.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:16 PM
Dec 2021

Picking and choosing who to treat based on their behaviors is a slippery slope to a very bad place.

TheRealNorth

(9,500 posts)
64. And thats the point I think some may be making
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:46 PM
Dec 2021

A covidiot that has been stabilized may get a bed instead of someone that got vaccinated.

Gore1FL

(21,151 posts)
70. Unvaccinated people have a lesser chance of surviving. Scarcity of resources requires choices.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 01:07 PM
Dec 2021

My preference that the people supporting society get preferential treatment to those tearing it down is secondary.

 

AncientAndy

(73 posts)
82. In general, you are correct. But on a case-by-case basis...
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 05:10 PM
Dec 2021

an unvaccinated 30 year old probably has a better chance of surviving than a vaccinated 75 year old. So who would get the bed?

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
60. Vaccination status may become considered as part of triage, especially
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:18 PM
Dec 2021

when crisis standards of care would be implemented and the major criterion is likelihood of survival if given care. It would only be one of several factors predicting chance of survival. (Who knows, maybe if survival was a coin flip, silent notions of who "deserves" more come into play but never written down.)

It would not be a blanket exclusionary factor for receiving medical care.

What you say about the cardiac patient who took his meds is, of course, reasonable in itself.

But behind the anger on all social media sites these days is not just that decent concern but also frustrated partisan rage against the other faction. Both are real. Both sides have some who are eager to weaponize the medical system (the authorities) against the enemy, using the innocent as the rationale.

The latter is what people try to do who sic the police (the authorities) on members of a group they don't like. Gotta keep the authoritarian beast chained, because it can be turned on all of us. We've been watching it breaking its chains on the right, where mobs are embracing fascism to weaponize government against Democrats. Claiming protection of innocents and The American Way as their rationale.

Btw, a basic guideline for me is, never join an angry, excited mob I wouldn't run toward in a dark ally.

NH Ethylene

(30,816 posts)
88. I do love your last sentence.
Sat Dec 18, 2021, 10:18 AM
Dec 2021

At my age I tend to be cool-headed about nearly everything and am often dismayed by the 'let them all die!' passions expressed here by my fellow Dems.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
92. "Let" is at least a kinder and gentler death wish
Sat Dec 18, 2021, 10:55 AM
Dec 2021

than the insistence of some. If I thought the toxic phenomena spread on social media were representive of our fellow Dems, I'd be an ex-Democrat and trying to escape town before it got me too. But of course it's not, as you underline.

Happy Saturday.

NH Ethylene

(30,816 posts)
56. This opinion is tossed out pretty often here.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:13 PM
Dec 2021

It's morally wrong, of course. Even mass murderers are given health care.

Prof. Toru Tanaka

(1,980 posts)
97. You are ethically correct but we are talking about people who have no ethics whatsoever.
Sun Dec 19, 2021, 01:23 PM
Dec 2021


I agree with Botany; they have completely exhausted my patience and I have no sympathy for them whatsoever.

My spouse and I got our vaccine and booster and we mask and social distance. If they can't (won't) do it also, then the hell with them. Where is THEIR personal responsibility to their country and family values they love to yack about so much?

And those T-shirts....funny how they call US commies.
 

CrackityJones75

(2,403 posts)
99. No it isn't
Sun Dec 19, 2021, 06:29 PM
Dec 2021

When they take icu beds away from people need them for things other than covid it is a rational position.

multigraincracker

(32,714 posts)
18. They are big fans on WRT.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:01 AM
Dec 2021

White Replacement Theory. I imagine there will be parents at school board meetings demanding it be taught.

 

Alexander Of Assyria

(7,839 posts)
3. 15 more red voters dying per 100k blue voters? Need the gap to open more, then the fascists
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 08:58 AM
Dec 2021

and their fascist media panic and the Big Lie will be flushed down the toilet bowel along with the science denier shit.
Same shit, really.

Botany

(70,567 posts)
5. If their families and friends had been vaccinated I would feel bad for them too
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:08 AM
Dec 2021

But i have no shits left to give about those idiots who have kept the pandemic going by
willing becoming hosts to the virus. They don't want to believe in the science behind the
vaccine then they don't need the science behind Drs, nurses, & hospitals either.

captain queeg

(10,235 posts)
4. No surprises here. I think by the beginning of the year, following Christmas get togethers
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:05 AM
Dec 2021

and travel, we’ll be seeing numbers like the previous worst peak. That it’ll be hitting RWers will no doubt give me some satisfaction, but they’ll be spreading it to others and moreover providing plentiful subjects for mutations. Just looking at the graphs it’s obvious that a new variation comes along at regular intervals. I’d been hoping, like many others, that we were starting to get past the pandemic. But the way it looks this is the new reality going forward. I’d thought that as people got sick and or died many people would see the light who had been resisting vaccines and other precautions. That hasn’t really happened. Maybe enough of them will die off to reduce their political clout. Or maybe it’ll at least drive liberal voters to make sure they vote. I think Covid is the only reason we got rid of TFG. Maybe by mid terms the turnout will be good enough to solidify our position.

Botany

(70,567 posts)
6. We need to publicly call out the GOP politicians such as DeSantis and Abbot who are spreading ...
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:13 AM
Dec 2021

... the virus on purpose.

bucolic_frolic

(43,257 posts)
16. "I think Covid is the only reason we got rid of TFG"
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:53 AM
Dec 2021

Sadly I think that is true. 2020 was, in essence, a non-combative campaign. The Biden campaign was cerebrally executed by policy and strategy without a lot of travel. Trump barely had a target to shoot at. Joe aced the debates with controlled dislike for his opponent. Removing Covid from the year alters almost all of that.

CrispyQ

(36,501 posts)
48. In spite of his horrible response to the pandemic, 11 million more people voted for him than in 2016
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:24 AM
Dec 2021


If he had handled Covid like an adult, like a real president would have, instead of politicizing it & making it about him, he probably would have won a second term.

I'll never forget the rage I felt when I heard that Jared told Trump to ignore the pandemic when it first showed up in the US, because it was only in blue states. The last science class I had was in high school, but even I know that something contagious doesn't stay in one place.

Eliot Rosewater

(31,113 posts)
95. Thanks for making this point, because if anyone thinks he cant win again, they are mistaken.
Sat Dec 18, 2021, 11:05 PM
Dec 2021

His taking power again is the end of America and the end of us.

louis-t

(23,297 posts)
40. He could have been a hero. He would have sailed to re-election.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:08 AM
Dec 2021

If he had done one thing. "We have a little problem, we're going to have to mask up and work really hard to get a vaccine. A temporary shutdown, keep a little distance between us for a bit." He was totally incapable of any compassion. It was all about him. Afraid someone might think it's his fault. Remember what Chris Christie said about getting COVID? TFG asked him "You're not going to say I gave it to you, are you?"

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
7. Hmm. What a pity.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:14 AM
Dec 2021
Only about 60 percent of Republican adults have done so. This vaccination gap has created a huge gap in death rates, one that has grown sharply during the second half of the year.
Hmm. What a pity. And by "pity" what I really mean is too fucking bad. The only shame in all of this is that they're needlessly wasting bed-space in hospitals, they're needlessly using time, money, resources that ought to be used on others.

I'm all in favor of letting the National Guard (or FEMA) set up a "field hospital" with cots so that these people will have a place to die. (Mother Teresa was won a Nobel Prize in 1979 and was canonized in 2016 for doing damn near the same thing... so let's follow her lead!)

This is a death-cult... it's what they want. They've committed to it. So when Death comes a-knocking... there's no take-backs. A heated or air-conditioned field hospital tent would give them a place out of the weather to draw their last breaths... or drown in their own fluids.

I think we can spare the morphine... but there's an oxygen shortage, so too bad. I know this will make their loved-ones sad... but as they've so often said: "FUCK YOUR FEELINGS!" So I'm sure they can understand where we're coming from.

I'm sure there are enough county fairground fields (or other open spaces) that can accommodate the tents and porta-potties.

I should have invested in the body-bag industry. Or the funeral home industry. Or any company that provides funeral services: vault-makers, casket makers, urn makers, embalming chemical makers, pancake makeup makers, furnace makers, etc.

Probatim

(2,538 posts)
10. This about sums up my feelings and those of several others around me.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:29 AM
Dec 2021

I will add that it offends me that they deny science but will be the first in line for monoclonal antibodies and ventilators when they do get sick.

I've thought that if you're going to deny science, deny all of it, then it occurs to me their cafeteria style science denial matches their selection of Biblical passages.

Botany

(70,567 posts)
17. That has been my idea for months. BTW we can use a back hoe to dig graves next to the tents.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:57 AM
Dec 2021


Use recycled wood to build the cots and make 'em so they can become coffins with
a big eye hook* on one end so a fork lift or bobcat can carry the box and body out at
one time with a chain and then drive right up to the pit and drop 'em in.

Minimize exposure to others at all time.


*

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
21. Perfect! (I was imagining today's white-top tents... but...)
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:03 AM
Dec 2021

Perfect! (I was imagining today's white-top tents... but... if there are any military surplus tents like this that can be used one final time, that would save money.)

There was no shortage of tents when Trump was detaining/separating children from their families. Let's use those.

Botany

(70,567 posts)
25. These idiots are driving the pandemic by being living hosts for the virus.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:16 AM
Dec 2021

Make sure the tents have heating and cooling, give them all the pain killers they want,
plenty of food and water, and minimize their contacts with uninfected people. Remember
nobody needs to go through this crap because they just need the vaccine to avoid having
to go to "a tent city."


Ford_Prefect

(7,917 posts)
9. One dangerous aspect not discussed by MSM outlets is the likelihood that among those who survive
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:28 AM
Dec 2021

or almost survive will be the genesis of the next variant after Omicron. This matters because Omicron has already demonstrated a marked ability to attack those who are fully vaccinated. In Britain there is serious concern over how many vaccinated people have been hit by Omicron. One report said it was more than 20% of new infections in London area.

The important part of this situation is the probability that more variants are coming and as long as there is a large supply of unvaccinated hosts whatever the next 2 or variants are will spread rapidly throughout those hosts.

Herd Immunity, or something like it, will never happen as long as roughly 50% of the population isn't helping contain the virus.

Maine Abu El Banat

(3,479 posts)
11. History will remember
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:33 AM
Dec 2021

They cared more about stopping black history from being taught than saving their own lives. We all make our choices. They've made theirs.. RIP!

Tommymac

(7,263 posts)
69. Yes, unless we don't stop them in 2022 & 2024 and THEY write History.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 01:07 PM
Dec 2021

It is so important to start the Democratic grass roots GOTV for 2022 NOW.

And hold the MSM accountable NOW.

And get some of the main insurrectionist LEADERS helo legally accountable NOW.

This Pandemic is not happening in a vacuum.

Lonestarblue

(10,053 posts)
13. The media, as usual, is not doing its job on the virus.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 09:39 AM
Dec 2021

Articles will say that Biden’s poll numbers are down because he hasn’t contained the virus—and never mention that it is Republicans actively working to spread the virus. Articles will mention the number of cases and deaths but only occasionally mention that it is Republicans who are getting sick and dying. Just saying red states are hit harder doesn’t clarify enough for people who are too sharp to start with those who live in red states will assume that it is the minorities who are getting sick and dying, and they’re okay with that (and some of them are minorities, of course). One of Trump’s most pernicious actions early in the pandemic was withholding aid from Democratic states because the early data showed that it was minorities who were suffering most from Covid.

The media regularly prints negative headlines about Biden and Democrats. I’d like to see headlines that say that governors like DeSantis and Abbott are deliberately working to spread the virus. It’s the truth because of their anti-masking policies and rhetoric about freedom to not be vaccinated.

bucolic_frolic

(43,257 posts)
19. Republicans insisted on herd immunity from the start of the pandemic
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:01 AM
Dec 2021

They've invented every excuse they can to continue down that path. Have at it, guys.

DBoon

(22,395 posts)
80. If you are looking for advocacy of genocide, you have it right there
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 03:23 PM
Dec 2021

Not just because it initially hit urban democratic voters first.

Because like any true fascist, they aim to remove the "weak" from society so the "strong" may prevail.

Orrex

(63,220 posts)
24. Having been mocked for 20 months for my covid caution, I say fuck them.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:15 AM
Dec 2021

Sensible America has all but literally begged them to adopt even the most basic standards of safety and prevention, but MAGAT America has rejected these "attacks on freedom" and has continued on its merry, ignorant way.

Now they're paying the price.

Well, fuck them. We've pushed for compassion and responsibility and basic hygiene, and all along they've mocked us.



Fuck them.

nwliberalkiwi

(367 posts)
30. To the UnVax
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:35 AM
Dec 2021

Let your unvaxed Grandma die in the gutter, and not clog up the hospitals. You Right-wing assholes---Fuck Your Feelings!!!

IronLionZion

(45,514 posts)
35. I just heard a radio ad saying Biden's socialism is killing Americans
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 10:48 AM
Dec 2021

by denying them treatments for COVID like ivermectin and hydroxycholoroquine

These people are dying to own the libs. And that's their choice. They've had enough chances to take free vaccines and wear a simple mask.

There must be some good health reforms in the works if they're paying for ad time to oppose it already.

TheRealNorth

(9,500 posts)
66. I am okay with giving them all the horse dewormer and hydroxy that they want....
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:52 PM
Dec 2021

And telling them to stay the fuck out of the hospital.

IronLionZion

(45,514 posts)
75. Agreed, they can stay home and self-medicate
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 01:35 PM
Dec 2021

since they can't trust what the hospitals are giving them and know so much more than the doctors.

gulliver

(13,186 posts)
39. Danger means less than zip. Tell them it will cost them money
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:01 AM
Dec 2021

They want the risk. Pointing it out just makes them happier they aren't vaccinated. It makes them feel free. Tell them their freedom isn't free. Make them pay every cent of the huge added hospital costs they create by charging the unvaccinated higher insurance rates. That will get shots in arms

quakerboy

(13,920 posts)
47. Forget money, most of them dont have that anyway
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:23 AM
Dec 2021

Remind them that for every Murikan that dies of covid.. that leaves a job open that will eventually need to be filled by immigrant workers that we will need to let into the country.

Javaman

(62,532 posts)
49. That horse has already left the barn. even if one of these idiots told the mouthbreathers the truth.
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:32 AM
Dec 2021

they would be shouted down as now part of the "deep state".

we are so far past the stage of reasoning with the anti-vaxx/conspiracy morons. nothing at all, at this point, could turn back the clock.

housecat

(3,121 posts)
50. Pay to play. If there is hospital space available, quarantine the area and only
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:39 AM
Dec 2021

unvaccinated medical staff can work there. Let the selfish anti-whatevers pay their own bills

 

YP_Yooper

(291 posts)
51. A bit dismissive
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:44 AM
Dec 2021

NYC is clearly not red, but the city's daily life looks ominous if, and it's a big if, omicron is anything like delta. It's evading the vaccinated, so everyone needs to look at the calendar to get an idea when you need boosted again, not just the red (or rather orangutan) America. The chart also doesn't reflect that the more red things go, the worse the health, worse medical care, more rural, and is just not an (R) mental deficiency.

Celerity

(43,485 posts)
54. Red areas are less vaccinated than most Blue areas, and Rethugs are far less vaccinated on balance
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:59 AM
Dec 2021

than Dems are, so no, it is not dismissive. If you had a Red area with the population density and size of NYC, it would be a true shitshow of death.

The Rethugs are a death cult, and not at all just limited in that framing to Covid.

Glaisne

(517 posts)
52. I simply have no sympathy
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:47 AM
Dec 2021

for Trumper MAGA morons dying from their own willful stupidity. This only helps overcome the widespread voter suppression and election rigging that is going on in swing states. So I see this as a positive.

lindysalsagal

(20,726 posts)
53. Use reverse psychology: "Free vaccinations are only for Biden voters."
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 11:53 AM
Dec 2021

If you tell them they're victims, and being ripped-off, they'll demand equity. They're too stupid to figure it out.

NH Ethylene

(30,816 posts)
90. I do think the constant 'selling' of the vaccine was a mistake.
Sat Dec 18, 2021, 10:22 AM
Dec 2021

People tend to be distrustful of salespeople. It's better to make something just a little scarce, be a little bit indifferent to whether people get it or not.

llashram

(6,265 posts)
61. these red state trump lovers
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 12:23 PM
Dec 2021

are adults and when that tube is shoved down their throats, so be it. My only concern about them is that they are like the plague carriers of other times. They hurt innocent people. They KILL innocent people. #1 above has it right. Any concern for a trump lowlife shows an incredible weakness for the enemy.

They do not care. Why should we?

madville

(7,412 posts)
74. Only 38% of Black people are vaccinated in FL
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 01:34 PM
Dec 2021

Anyone cheering on and wishing for the deaths of the unvaccinated hopefully isn’t considering the potentially 10s of millions of traditionally Democratic voters nationwide that are lumped in that group. BBB I seriously doubt the unvaccinated 62% of Black Floridians are all Trump-loving right-wingers, as many consider all “the unvaccinated”.

IronLionZion

(45,514 posts)
78. Trump got around 10% of Black Floridians
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 02:56 PM
Dec 2021

many of the unvaccinated are nonpolitical. I would think most of the vaccinated are Dems.

mnhtnbb

(31,401 posts)
79. The MAGATS are so self destructive
Fri Dec 17, 2021, 03:03 PM
Dec 2021

they are literally killing themselves off. How stupid is that? The only problem I have with it is they are overwhelming hospitals when they get sick. Their greed and determination not to care about anyone but themselves is tying up resources. Put them in a tent in the hospital parking lot and give them palliative care if they are unvaccinated. Fu*k'em.

azureblue

(2,149 posts)
98. I'm tired of these Typhoid Marys
Sun Dec 19, 2021, 06:28 PM
Dec 2021

Me, Me, Me. They don't care if they spread Covid, they don't care if they kill anyone as a result. I have no sympathy for people who knowingly try to kill other people. If they catch it and are not vaccinated by choice, then put them in a hospice until they pass. They made their choice, let them die from it, and stop wasting money saving them Let the new strain kill them off - it's called Darwin's law.

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