When will urban liberals do something about the hate am radio incitement of violence

[Tumbulu]

against liberals. In particular for those living in rural or mainly rural states?

The culture in rural states has been altered completely to reject any idea that might lead to community building originating from “the govment” . Only churches and money from billionaires is seen as worth accepting. It has been non stop nearly 40 years of propaganda.

Trump rose to power by seizing the opportunity that these decades of cultivation by the right wing, who funded these miserable am stations, created. That the theology of Limbaugh has metastasized upon his death to minions talking violence and hatred 24/7 of any and all people who try to install responsible governance has brought us to this impasse we find ourselves in today.

With these people itching to lash out and use their weapons. Against public health officials and school boards. At least in talk. In action, they refuse vaccination and masking. The deadly results are rather similar.

The root of this has been the urban liberal’s ignoring of the violence incited against rural liberals that has been going on non stop for my lifetime.

Did it surprise any of us who work in rural areas that those people who trashed the research station and the actual data of the folks at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge were set free? Never served anytime. That those Bundy’s continue to wreak havoc in Idaho and other western states? That hatred of science and scientists is just a given?

Urban people seem to believe that by funding non profits ( who stand no chance of changing a thing in rural areas) such as planned parenthood, that they will make a dent. Get a grip, the rural states will keep electing 2 senators against women's health forever until their population wakes up from the malignant spell that this hate media of decades long alienation has cast.

The answers, imo include:

1. Put an absolute and immediate stop to hate media and far right religious rhetoric that incites violence ( pretty much them all) on all public airwaves and on military channels played at bases.

2. Stop attacking centrist democrats who must be supported at all costs.

3. Focus on a constant call out of the far right politicians. And their supporters. Personally, just as they have been attacking us ( rural democrats) for decades. These guys have no respect for politeness. We must be clear and strong and unapologetic. The district attorneys need to be prosecuting those politicians and individuals who will not wear masks, and turn this around. Use the laws they put in place for those spreading HIV. Get them arrested and in jail. Make them start defending themselves.

4. The democracy seems to be particularly at risk to me. And wow was it ever done cheaply using am radio and Russian bots. All while the urban liberals fight among themselves. And ignored our cries for help all these decades. Using ridiculous “free speech” rhetoric. Inciting of violence and damning an entire political party and all public health officials to a fiery death is not free speech. It is speech with consequence. The rapid spread of the pandemic and unnecessary deaths the actual proof. The attack on the most of us by the few of them absolutely must be prosecuted.

[essaynnc]

1. I agree 100%

While I don't exactly know your situation in rural America, the situation in NC, which is actually the South, is just like what you're describing. I live in Winston-Salem, and half of the population could be considered part of the problem... no respect for science or the government, authority is measured by force, and many believe that the time is coming for them damn libruls.

And R
ight Wing Radio is a HUGE part of the problem. I occasionally listen to it, just to keep up to date. I can usually last all of 10 minutes max., before I get so pissed off I have to turn it off. If you've never listened to Hannity or one of his wanna-bees (there are many), you need to. Lies, half-truths, hatred, intolerance, "democratically controlled cities are war zones", Biden this or Harris that, socialism, communist running our country, "we've got to take our country back!"; the crap flows 24 hours a day! It is inconceivable to me how they get away with saying most of the crap that they spout!!! Why aren't they required to at least somewhat adhere to truth? And unfortunately, we have no way to refute any of that- they're in their bubble, and nothing out of their echo chamber gets in.

So I've heard the left being castigated for not reaching out to the nice rural folks, why aren't we? In my opinion, while they continue to hear Fox News Right Wing Bullcrap, we will NEVER, EVER, EVER BE HEARD.

[Tumbulu]

10. Yes! It is not our job to reach to them

When they attack us endlessly.

The solution is to put an end to their non stop propaganda and incitement of violence against us.

[Bettie]

2. This is the result of the elimination of the Fairness Doctrine

There is no opposing viewpoint, 24 hours a day 7 days a week. It is the background noise in barns, tractors, and small town stores and has been for quite some time.

[jimfields33]

5. For some reason liberal radio never appealed enough

I know it’s been tried. Maybe another try is needed.

[Mr.Bill]

7. I honestly think our literacy rate is higher.

We tend to read more than listen to someone on the radio.

[electric_blue68]

80. I love to read, AND I love radio. I loved (sigh) Air America!

[Tumbulu]

101. I did too.

Now I just listen to music. And NPR.

[electric_blue68]

103. WNYC is my local NPR station. One of the best! Music stations...

Local news station too.

I like Tune In radio - Public Radio, Music.
A DUer recently mentioned ?WCPT in Chicago - liberal, progressive radio which I can get re Tune-In. Has some of our favs from Air America, and their local people as well. 👍

[Tumbulu]

104. I'll look for them, thanks for the tip

[haele]

9. Liberal radio appealed to logic.

Shock jock radio appeals to emotion. It's hard to counter that with logic. Busy or simple "Folks" don't want to think, they want to "feel", and if whatever outrages them also makes them feel like a hero, even if it flies against everything they learned in Kindergarten and Sunday School.

Haele

[Tumbulu]

21. Yes, except I don't really think rural people are listening to these stations

Because of any reason other than that is all they hear in rural areas and the thinking/ rhetoric has become utterly normalized. It is more about claiming which tribe they are in. And the rural tribe is now stalwart republican. The language and lies considered utterly true.

There is no way to get through to any of them now.

I see no solution other than forcing the airwaves to cease and desist the inciting of violence.

[Tumbulu]

22. I don't think this can be countered

I think it must be stopped.

These guys need to be sued, prosecuted and shut down.

[essaynnc]

24. I'm not the lawyerly type....

But how can they be sued? Who's got standing to sue and why??

[Tumbulu]

26. How about the people they have been persecuting?

Why do we not matter?

[brooklynite]

64. Simple question: why has no liberal group sued them?

And why has no Democratic AG prosecuted them?

[Tumbulu]

74. I have no idea why they have not

Have always presumed that they thought the best thing to do was ignore them and they would go away.

[brooklynite]

77. Or (just spitballing) there isn't a legal basis for a prosecution or lawsuit...

…regardless of what people here believe.

[Tumbulu]

81. Well you are more knowledgeable than me,

but do you see the result of this hate speech unchecked for all these decades?

Do you have any ideas on how we might brake this logjam?

Why do you think the voting machine guys have been able to sue? Do you believe they are the first and only groups to have been damaged by these media companies and their voices on the public airwaves?

[essaynnc]

28. how about the jan 6ers that are going to jail???

[Tumbulu]

31. Yes!!!!!!!

[brooklynite]

56. They can't...

And anyone who insists that they can is welcome to name astatine or legal provision that would allow it.

[Tumbulu]

75. Why is threatening to kill Nancy Pelosi ok?

Last edited Thu Dec 23, 2021, 12:51 AM - Edit history (1)

Why were the attacks on Hillary never ending incitement of violence towards her not prosecuted?

I have never understood why these villains have always been given a free pass.

Now it is Fauci they want killed.

[certainot]

121. it's a 95% monopoly - mom and pop vs wall mart - never given a chance, they knew their lying

couldn't stand the competition

[Tumbulu]

11. Yes!

It is ubiquitous!

[Sgent]

102. Yes but the FD

would probably never pass muster to this SCOTUS. In addition, it never applied to cable, satellite radio, or the internet.

[Bettie]

105. But the AM radio is public airwaves

it might not have taken care of everything, but it would have slowed the rise of all of the fuckery we see now.

But, yeah, the current SCOTUS...well, we'll see if they even let us vote.

[Hoyt]

3. Despise hate radio, but it's hard to talk about "democracy" while wanting to ban it.

Believe me, I get it. Everyone of those MFers — Limbaugh, Hannity, Boortz, etc. — deserve a special place in Hell.

[Tumbulu]

32. They do, and I said ban the hate speech or persecute or sue

them enough to get it to stop.

Look at how the voting machine companies have gone after them.

What other tools can be used?

Whatever can be used, they must be employed.

If they don’t work, try something else.

If they are tried and fail, try something else. These are the tactics the far right are using and winning with.

[Hoyt]

57. The rubes that listen to that crud will find other sources.

[Tumbulu]

62. So what, if it is not on public airwaves it may not have the clout.

And let me ask you, why don’t you think it matters that they have built their skills up persecuting rural liberals for generations now?

They control the Senate, and unless we figure out some way to make inroads in the rural states against the propaganda, they will continue to control it.

[Hoyt]

70. Look, it's not going to be banned. Probably good, even as much as we hate hate radio.

[Dial H For Hero]

72. +1

[Tumbulu]

85. Well, for these decades, no one has really tried

And you are probably correct, but do you have any ideas of how to deal with these violent insurrectionists who see no consequences for their actions and who pretty clearly control the conversation ( thanks to that rhetoric that they all believe is true) and who control the senate so fiercely that we may lose Manchin to the GOP and we then have Mitch McConnell in charge again. All because we attack our own instead of the republicans?

Why can’t we color outside the lines and attack them for a change? Why are we always the recipient of their violence?

It feels very much that way to me living in a rural area of a blue state. I am very grateful to be in a blue state, but acutely aware of the powers these guys yield and use without any trepidation. They do things and we have to try to stop them. And I feel as though the nation is now losing. Not just me and other liberals in rural areas.

[walkingman]

4. When Bill Clinton did not veto the Telecommunications Act of 1996 it

opened the door to right-wing radio. Now 6 corporations control 90% of the media in America. Before that it was 50 corporations. That is the reason that so many people see the propaganda that is broadcast these days.

[JI7]

6. People were voting Reagan and Gingrich before that

[Tumbulu]

14. The effect was just beginning then,

we now have 1/3 of the population celebrating killing liberals in one way or another.

This violence against us has metastasized into a crisis.

[JI7]

16. That has always been there. Social Media probably plays a bigger role than

talk radio.

[Tumbulu]

20. If you have never lived or worked in rural areas you don't know

I have and you can see from the posts above that this is universally understood.

The ridiculous downplaying of the problem got us to this crisis.

[betsuni]

65. Yes, they'd mail their propaganda in the seventies, then radio and TV later.

It's been there for a long time. Social media plays a bigger role.

[JI7]

119. Yes, These people turned to the Republican Party after Civil Rights

Before Talk RAdio. Talk RAdio just provided what these people wanted. It would be better without it but to blame talk radio misses the real issues and why these people vote the way they do .

Daughters of the Confederacy , The Right Wing Christian groups . So many of these people were influencing things like Text books in schools long before talk radio .

[Tumbulu]

33. Yes, but now that we are stuck with this disaster, we need to use every tool

imaginable to stop it.

[walkingman]

84. Correct - we must NEVER NEVER allow this nation to succumb to mob rule.

It is up to those people who understand how important it is to save this nation to no allow those in search of power to win.

The battle has just begun.

[Tumbulu]

86. I hope we do not lose our nation

It is a very scary time, I think.

[onenote]

106. Ah, the old "six corporations control 90% of the media" myth.

Seriously, does it really help us in making the case against media consolidation to throw out ridiculous, easily rebutted claims? Want to make it easy for the other side? THat's what this sort of nonsense does.

For starters, exactly who are the six corporations that supposedly control 90 percent of the media? And what is considered "media"?

Typically, when this bogus claim is made, the six corporations that allegedly control 90 percent of everything we listen to, read, and watch are News Corp/Fox, Disney/ABC, Comcast/NBC, Time Warner, CBS, and Viacom. Lately, some of the references substitute ATT for Time Warner, combine Viacom and CBS, and add Sony

Radio? Well, none of those six companies are substantial owners of broadcast radio stations. The fact is that there are over 11,000 full power commercial am and fm radio stations operating in the US, and more than 4200 noncommercial radio stations. The two biggest owners of radio stations -- HeartMedia (formerly Clear Channel) and Cumulus Media -- together own around fewer than 9 percent of the 15,000 full power radio stations broadcasting in the US. The average number of stations owned by the top 22 station groups is less than 135. And this is only taking into account full power over-the-air broadcasting, not low power stations or online or satellite audio services, whose ownership is even more diverse.

Print? Of the top 100 newspapers in the US, two are owned by News Corp. (the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post). None of the other five companies typically listed as controlling 90 percent of the media have any signficant newspaper ownership. Instead, the other top newspaper owning are the New York Times, Gannett (owner of USA Today and several local papers), the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, Tribune Publishing (owner of the Chicago Tribune, the New York Daily News and several other local papers), and Newsday. And let's not forget magazines: The most widely circulated magazine is published by AARP. Again, the alleged top six purveyors of news and information in the US actually own very few of the hundreds of magazines published in the US. Heck, even Time Magazine isn't owned by Time Warner anymore.

Television? There are over 1370 full power commercial broadcast television stations and 380 noncommercial broadcast stations. NBC, ABC, CBS and Fox, combined, own around 90 of those 1370 full power commercial stations; they provide network program to around 900 stations (way less than 90 percent). The companies that own the greatest number of full power tv stations are nowhere to be found among the list of the six companies that supposedly control the media: Nexstar (with nearly 200 stations), Sinclair (with 193) and Gray (with 180 stations). Even Univision has more stations than any of the companies that supposedly control 90 percent of the media. And then there's cable and satellite -- which have been losing subscribers at a rapid rate: Comcast, which once had around 23 million subs, now has less than 19 million. The second largest cable or satellite company is Charter/Spectrum, followed by DirecTV. None of the other top ten cable/satellite companies has more than 8 million subscribers. By way of comparison, Netflix -- not listed among the supposed six controlling companies -- has over 70 million subscribers in the US. Amazon Prime has even more and AppleTV+ is bigger than any of the cable or satellite companies. As for the producers of content, Comcast, Viacom, Disney, and News Corp are the biggest providers of non broadcast programming for distribution by cable and satellite and they control close to 90 percent of the most popular cable networks. But overall, they don't own anywhere near 90 percent of the hundreds of non-broadcast video channels that are distributed by satellite and terrestrial means.

A special note about ATT, which sometimes shows up as one of the six top companies instead of Time Warner. Time Warner, of course, sold off its cable systems (to Charter), Time Magazine (to Meredith who then sold it to an independent company), and its cable networks (purchased by ATT). ATT, which still controls DirecTV (although it spun off a significant ownership share to a private equity company) is in the process of spinning off the Warner networks (including CNN and HBO among others) into a new company that also will own the Discovery Channel networks.

Of course, none of the above discussion scratches the surface of the gazillion internet sites that are sources of news, information and entertainment. You know, sites like DemocraticUnderground, or any of the many sites that get referenced and linked to by DU posters.

My point isn't to say the current situation is fine and dandy. Its anything but. There is too much concentration, particularly at the local level among broadcast television stations. But winning the battle to restrain media concentration isn't going to happen if folks make easily rebutted claims. Focus on the real issues, not nonsensical statistical bs.

[walkingman]

113. Well, excuse me.

[certainot]

123. you are missing the most important part - radio. political talk radio is a 95% monopoly and it domin

dominates buzz and politics in 40+ states with 80 senators

all russians had to do to push the GOP even further toward fascism and disfunction was figure rout how to feed one asshole - limbagh - who had been used by the establishment republicans. his 600 stations and their dittoheads - who couldn't call him - managed/policed content on 1000 more in what was the biggest example of political correctness every seen - while labeling people who complained about racism as being PC

equating rw radio with all other media is a mistake. all the others are generally part of the free speech spectrum, with free easy alternatives

rw radio should not be considered part of the free speech spectrum

[onenote]

124. Sorry, but the first amendment doesn't work that way.

And how do you calculate the 95% monopoly?

[certainot]

122. the monopoly ahead been going for about 10 years before that, pushing clinton to do it

the heritage foundation etc was already using limbaugh on 600 stations to manage 1500 - corporations are people, deregulation will lower costs etc - for 10 years, while dems ignored it

[Frasier Balzov]

8. A 527 organization is needed to challenge licenses and cultivate public interest licensees.

I'm not aware of the existence of any such watchdog / incubator fund.

Terrestrial radio is tremendously influential and needs to be fought for.

[Tumbulu]

15. That is a good idea

Thanks!

[Dial H For Hero]

12. So your "something" is to make right wing radio illegal and prosecute the hosts?

The 1st Amendment would like a word with you.

[Tumbulu]

17. Yep, always just throw that out, but the first amendment has limits

and inciting violence against individuals is not protected. This idea that threatening people on public airwaves is protected is a huge part of the problem.

Perhaps you have not been the beneficiary of the hate media’s attack. But I have and it is not acceptable.

We are loosing public health people left right and center. We are losing many public servants of all sorts.

The right pushes the envelope on everything. It is time for us to push back.

In a very big way.

[Dial H For Hero]

23. Even were such legislation to be passed (and it won't) it would be tossed out by the courts

in a heartbeat.

[Tumbulu]

25. Nope, it is already illegal to cry fire in a crowded theater

It is already illegal to threaten people with violence.

What has been going on is that these people have been given too much latitude. The speech is not taken seriously. They always claim it is a joke. But it is not a joke.

And it has impacted all of us in rural areas for decades.

And now our democracy is completely under threat. And if we do not push back, it is over.

Push back.

[USALiberal]

27. Not the same! Nt

[Tumbulu]

29. What is not the same?

A media host telling people to kill Fauci?

Another advocating killing Nancy Pelosi?

Another advocating killing me?

Please tell me why you think a radio host has the right to tell their listeners to kill or hurt particular people, or people of a political group.

They need to be sued and prosecuted.

Look at how the companies who made the voting machines sued those making those claims.

[Dial H For Hero]

30. Do you really think the Supreme Court would find such legislation Constituional?

[Tumbulu]

34. We don't need legislation, we need prosecutors and lawsuits

Case in point the voting machine companies and their lawsuits.

Why aren’t the prosecutors going after those telling people to kill Fauci?

Seriously, even if deemed frivolous, that does not stop the republicans, it only energizes them.

Don’t you think it is disillusioning for us in rural areas to be threatened every day of our lives for nearly 4 decades?

Wonder why you never see any Democratic signs or stickers on cars in rural areas? We know we will be targeted. By neighbors, by law enforcement.

Nobody has stood up for us, not the entire democracy is under siege and still people cannot see it?

[Dial H For Hero]

40. You're calling for rightwing radio to be made illegal, and all its hosts to be arrested.

That's not going to happen....period.

[Tumbulu]

43. I am calling for the hate speech to be prosecuted

and if a host tells listeners to go kill an abortion provider, or a liberal farmer or Nancy Pelosi, and Fauci or Biden, then they need to face consequences.

This idea that their speech is only suggestive is preposterous.

If you want to waste your time arguing about it, do so.

But we lose our democracy. And anyone coming up with reasons not to hold these insurrectionist responsible is playing on their side.

[Dial H For Hero]

50. Hate speech is legal in the US.

and if a host tells listeners to go kill an abortion provider, or a liberal farmer or Nancy Pelosi, and Fauci or Biden, then they need to face consequences.

Just to pick one of your examples, which hosts have told their listeners to kill the president?

[Tumbulu]

54. Wow, guess you never listen to these monsters.

I can take maybe 5-10 minutes max. Then I just have to turn them off.

Do you have an idea of how to change the hate speech issue from the radical right wing?

Am I to believe that you have never suffered any consequences from these guys?

[Dial H For Hero]

68. Very rarely. I find them boring and roll my eyes a lot.

There was one I did listen to regularly back in the '80s, though. Bob Larson. Televangelist. Regularly had on guests who were (allegedly) witches, Satanists, etc. Performed exorcisms on the air. My favorite was when he had a caller who was doing their best impression of Linda Blair:

(growling voice) "Give up, Bob, you can never defeat the forces of Hell!"

"I rebuke you in the name of Christ!"

"Aaaaaarrrrrggggghhhh!"

He then put the "demon" on hold to ask his viewers to send him money. For 20 minutes.

Comedy gold.

Do you have an idea of how to change the hate speech issue from the radical right wing?

Not without trashing the Constitution. Given that I'm not willing to do that....

Am I to believe that you have never suffered any consequences from these guys?

On a personal basis? Nothing comes to mind...and I've lived in rural areas for about half of my life.

[Tumbulu]

88. Well, I am glad that you are able to ignore them all

and it is why I think the problem has festered.

I do not see how we get out of this insurrection that we are experiencing. I feel very beaten down by the power this propaganda has amassed.

But maybe I am just too tired and sad from this never ending pandemic.

One of my old friends just died of Covid, not vaccinated because of the hate media influencers. I cannot wrap my head around all this death, and worry very much that the Senate will go Republican.

Then what?

Can you reason with your rural neighbors who listen to these radio personalities? Is your area mostly Republican or libertarian?

[Dial H For Hero]

90. I no longer live in a rural area; I'm now in a suburb west of Denver. Roughly a 50/50 D/R split.

One of my old friends just died of Covid, not vaccinated because of the hate media influencers.

Please accept my condolences.

Can you reason with your rural neighbors who listen to these radio personalities?

I can't recall ever discussing politics with my neighbors, rural or otherwise.

[Tumbulu]

94. Thank you for the condolences

I thought she was a smart person, but it seems that this rhetoric is so normalized.

I have lived and work in areas that are about 60% Republican, 25% libertarian and 15% democratic.

And it really has been brutal. This pandemic has made me want to flee to a blue area pretty much every day.

But the problem for the nation remains wether I flee to relative safety or not.

The rhetoric that has corroded people minds so deeply and the sheer number of people whose goal is to destroy the democrats is just so shocking to me. And the unwillingness to believe that any form of functioning government is possible.

[AncientAndy]

59. To defeat the fascists, we must become one first.

[Tumbulu]

99. It is not fascist to demand that public airwaves not be used to advocate

violence or insurrection. It is common sense and decency.

[uponit7771]

110. YES !!! ... no, but it felt good typing it. We do have to uphold laws on encouraging firearm violenc

... from the GQP

[Tommymac]

112. You are right. The OP is wrong. 1st Amendment prevents all he is saying, and I support the 1st.

I don't want us to become the other side.

I respect the Constitution.

There are other ways to achieve the same goal. The best, but lengthy solution, is to re-establish Public Education and teach children Critical Thinking Skills, not rote 'pass the standardized test' skills. And add history, social science, ethics and civics back into ALL public school curriculums.

Boycott all professional and college sports that air on these RW stations. Universities and advertisers need to be pressured to avoid any RW station that promotes Hate Speech.

Establish our own radio networks, though in the past ratings have not allowed them to survive - see education above to solve.

Take legal action against any unconstitutional and/or illegal hate speech on a station be station basis. Local action is always more effective then National action when we talk about isolated rural areas.

Establish and maintain a 'Network of Shame' on social media to literally shame these people LOCALLY. Again with rural folks, it's all about peer pressure.

TAX any religious institution that is using the airwaves for political propaganda. Hit them where it hurts - from the largest to the smallest.

[kimbutgar]

13. In SF we used to have this great progressive Green 960

It was rated number 1 in the Bay Area and after Obama was elected Clear channel pulled the station. We called to complain and the guys were snarky and said it came from corporate and hung up on us. We sent petitions, protested etc. but it never came back.

When I brought a new car in 2011 it had Sirius satellite and I’ve paid for it ever since.

[Tumbulu]

18. There was a Congressional candidate (CA 2) who told us in 2006how the Republican National Committee

funded the am radio hate stations. How cheap it was for them and how successful it all worked out for them.

[WarGamer]

19. The problem is... there's a market for RW radio.

If people didn't listen, broadcasters wouldn't broadcast it.

[Tumbulu]

35. No, it was paid for by the Republican National Committeee

and it was all there was to listen to.

If you have even had a job where you had to drive hundreds of miles a day, believe me you end up listening to a lot of this stuff.

There is nothing else to listen to in much of the country.

The republicans figured this out in the ‘80’s and ran with it.

[WarGamer]

36. Haven't seen evidence of that

[Tumbulu]

38. Well you can investigate it if you doubt me

I learned about their support from a retired Pulmonologist from the US Army who was running for Congress in outer very red district.

He shared with us the funding streams. It took very little. They stuck with it all these decades.

It paid off except I think that now that they created the monster, they are surprised.

We have a DU member who posts quite a bit about the history of this propaganda machine.

I bet he knows a whole lot more that I heard from this candidate.

[AncientAndy]

67. Got a better source...

than a retired pulmonologist who we all know doesn’t exist?

[brooklynite]

61. No, it wasn't

I hate to ruin a good consoiracy theory, but every dollar the RNC spends has to be reported. And can be checked at the FEC website.

I suspect that what someone considers “paying for” actually means “bought advertising on”.

[Tumbulu]

66. Could be, but those am radio stations were financially propped up

For decades. And it may have been Republican donors, not the committee.

It was very cheap for them, but highly efficacious.

[brooklynite]

69. That doesn't make sense either...

These are commercial radio stations. They don’t take “donations”.

Not clear why people can’t accept the idea that RW talk radio is successful because the programming model works.

[tenderfoot]

83. Radio stations broadcast Limbaugh etc for free.

It seems that the right weren’t desperate for money. Now tell us that there’s huge market for right wing talk radio on military bases.

[Celerity]

37. Divisive, trying to blame city mice for country mice's poor choices

to keep living in deep red rural shitholes.

Plus you apparently do not understand some fundamental elements of free speech law.

[Tumbulu]

39. No, I am a liberal who has worked and lived in rural areas my adult life and there are many of us

But we have been under attack for decades, and urban liberals have utterly ignored the violence of these people. Who have become only emboldened by being ignored. Rhetoric amplified and normalized by jumping to the likes of Fox News, etc.

The lawsuits by the voting machine companies are one way to approach this.

Why do you think the first amendment gives a radio host the right to ask people to go kill Fauci, or anyone else?

[Celerity]

47. Please go study the mechanics of Constitutional free speech law.

As for urban Dems 'ignoring' rural Dems, go see the 50 state strategy and also how many urban based candidates for statewide offices go to every country in their state.

As for political policy and legislation, as a party we are not going to limit ourselves to only things that could pass muster in Pig Hollow, West Virginia. (a real place btw)

Rural areas should NEVER get the ultimate say on national government. They are so in the minority population-wise, yet our tragically flawed US Constitution's deep, long wave systemic weaknesses and flaws have been gamed by the RW over the past 55+ years to give them a FAR too powerful voice.

[Tumbulu]

52. Dems have ignored the threats to us from these hate groups using the public airwaves

and I absolutely do not think Dems should pander to the right wing.

But the voice of the right is the only voice allowed to be heard in rural areas because of this nearly 40 years of violence against liberals directed to us. But these toxic personalities.

And so any politician who questions the talking points of the RW media is pilloried and stands no chance. The Senate is now filled with these ideology, but it did not happen overnight. It happened over these decades of propaganda.

I am saying that ignoring the power of this propaganda is what got us to this juncture in the road.

Where we may loose Manchin and the Senate goes back to being run or ruined by Mitch McConnell.

Because we will pick on him, but not one of the republicans gets called upon to explain their vote.

All because this hate rhetoric have been so normalized in these rural states.

It did not used to be this way. It took a long time to get to this point. But we are at the brink.

We who have lived in these areas have seen it coming.

I knew Trump was going to win in the summer of 2016, it was utterly obvious to every liberal living or working in rural areas. But, our perceptions are dismissed.

If you think my ideas of how to change the narrative do not work, how would you tackle this brainwashing? Have you ever tried to even talk to any of these people?

And before you dismiss them all as kooks, there are plenty who seem smart, and are capable people doing important work. But utterly brainwashed by these media personalities. They used to run the Republican parties in rural areas. They used to be the sane bookkeepers and accountants and city managers. And bankers and mainstream layers. And the doctors and hospital admin folk. People used to listen to them. But not anymore.

Now anyone who sees the government as anything other than the enemy to be destroyed is viewed as a traitor to their cause. Which remains the destruction of the federal government. And the owning of the libs.

All incited by the propaganda.

Yes political talk is free speech. But how is calling for Fauci to be killed protected? How is calling for me to be killed protected?

[Dial H For Hero]

71. Which talk host called for you to be killed?

[Tumbulu]

78. Rush Limbaugh

These guys think it is funny. Look at how t gave Limbaugh a congressional Medal of Honor.

Wow, what about all the people that he destroyed?

Ignoring these monsters has allowed them to flourish.

Ok, I shared my ideas and my fear of them. And you say they will not work.

Do you have any ideas of how to tamp down the rhetoric so that there would become a way for rural states to start electing normal people as Senators, not anti government anti women politicians only?

Do you have any idea how to stop crucifying the very few moderate dems who somehow manage to connect to people whose brains have been pickled in this insurrectionist nonsense for decades?

[Dial H For Hero]

82. Details, please.

Do you have any ideas of how to tamp down the rhetoric so that there would become a way for rural states to start electing normal people as Senators, not anti government anti women politicians only?

I know of no way to silence right wing radio without tearing up the Constitution.

[Tumbulu]

89. So you believe the constitution protects inciting violence against individuals

and particular groups? I do not believe that anyone has the right to use public airwaves to incite violence against individuals or groups. Standing on street corners, yes, perhaps. But not airwaves owned and funded by taxpayers.

What are your ideas?

[Dial H For Hero]

92. When did Limbaugh call for you to be killed? What did he say?

[Tumbulu]

95. Im not going to go into it

But he frequently advocated violence against all sorts of people.

There were great jokes about what his hell would look like posted on DU once.

I got a good kick out of them. Wished that I had bookmarked them.

[onenote]

96. The Constitution requires that "incitement" be narrowly defined.

A summary of the case law on "incitement."

https://www.mtsu.edu/first-amendment/article/970/incitement-to-imminent-lawless-action

[Tumbulu]

98. It does not seem that narrow to me

When I took a constitutional law class back in the ‘70’s advocating actual violence was not protected speech. In fact people used to sue and win for slander when someone was attacked in print back then. Very different than what is considered normal today.

Everyone on DU sure maintains that it is.

But reading this does not give me that impression either.

When we studied Roe V Wade I could simply not imagine how anyone would not be able to understand it’s flawless logic. It was so fascinating to read all of the background documents. I consider these recent justices who clearly are incapable of grasping its logic as deficient in some serious way.

[electric_blue68]

93. Limblarg...

to you directly as a person, or as part of a group he hated?
Either way it's terrifying! And disgusting.

I can remember people calling into his show sometime after Clinton was inaugurated that women should lose their right to vote. So, yeah, being a woman... Yikes.

(Listening to him was like yelling at the tv)

I don't know ... if there's in A1, and I think there is a distinction between saying on the radio person x should be killed vs being a speaker in a crowd and pointing at some perceived "problem person" x standing aways a bit as an onlooker any saying "kill that person.

[Tumbulu]

97. Yes, they all seem to know how to say things in particular ways

that they skirt being prosecuted.

But the thing is that we never pushed him or anyone else on the far right either.

Everyone is so hell bent on protecting speech, but not on protecting any of those whose death or demise was being called for.

And this is why I want to know why everyone spends all this time looking for ways to protect their speech, it no ways to protect our lives, or our work. Or our well-being that is put at risk by their calls for violence.

[Hoyt]

60. +1.

[tritsofme]

41. Save Democracy by imprisoning and banning your political opponents?

Authoritarians like OP, whether on the left or right, are quite disturbing.

[Dial H For Hero]

42. +1

[Tumbulu]

46. And advocating spreading the pandemic to more people

by glorifying not masking and advocating not getting vaccinated.

I want these people prosecuted.

Why don’t you think they should bear any responsibility for what they have been promoting on our public airwaves?

[Dial H For Hero]

51. Saying that vaccines are dangerous, while idiotic, is not a crime. Nor should it be.

[Tumbulu]

53. Well, guess what I disagree and

If you want to pretend that our democracy is in great shape, go right ahead.

But it is not.

And a good deal of the peril we are in is caused by the fact that this propaganda has been normalized and the culture impacted terribly by it.

Disproportionality in rural areas that have greater power per person per vote.

Another idea is to move masses of liberals to rural states and get them to vote these suckers out.

What is your solution?

[Tumbulu]

44. Don't twist my words. I said for inciting violence.

Have you ever listened to any of these “shows”?

They incite violence. A lot of it.

[tritsofme]

45. Incitement is a very high standard under Brandenburg.

It’s not just stuff you don’t like.

[Tumbulu]

48. 800,000 people dead of Covid?

What about the medical professionals attacked- see how it is 25 a day now?

See all the public health people resigning?

These calls for violence used to be only directed at us rural liberals. And female public servants such as Hilary and Nancy Pelosi.

But now it is any liberal anywhere.

I just do not think most people have any idea how ruthless and violent these guys are.

Ignoring it has allowed has not worked.

[tritsofme]

49. I'm sorry you disagree with the First Amendment.

I don’t think I can help you.

[Tumbulu]

58. Good luck, hoping that you can understand the depth of the disaster we find ourselves in

interpreting the first amendment the way you are saying it has acts as though it is a dead thing. Not subject to reinterpretation over time and changes in media.

Notice how in Europe after Hitler they cracked down on hate speech on public airwaves? You think we are incapable of evolving?

Am I to understand that you have no courage to try to protect those who have born the brunt of their violence. For decades.

The point is that they have honed their skills picking on us, now they are out for the rest of the nation.

[tritsofme]

63. I'm glad that our system didn't empower AG Jeff Sessions to prosecute "hate speech"

I think his definition might have differed somewhat from yours…

[Tumbulu]

76. What liberals are on radio and tv advocating killing their opponents?

What liberal goes anywhere near the incitement of violence that these terrorists advocate.

Have you ever tuned into any of them?

[tritsofme]

79. If anyone is truly inciting violence, they should be prosecuted.

The test under Brandenburg sets a very high standard, incitement is not just words you don’t like.

The First Amendment is always quite frustrating to authoritarians, I understand.

[Tumbulu]

91. And as a victim of the terrorization of the violent right wingers, you

accuse me of being an authoritarian.

No, any group of people who have suffered from their attack, asking for help in stopping it, is not asking for authoritarianism.

It is demanding that groups of people not be allowed to use public airwaves to terrorize other groups.

And the subject of this op is not me.

It is how I see that these guys began with rural liberals and have now gone national. Any way to crush liberals anywhere, anyhow is their goal.

And we need to be united against them, not each other.

[tritsofme]

115. If you don't want to be accused being an authoritarian

I would suggest you stop advocating for authoritarianism.

The First Amendment is not optional.

[Tumbulu]

116. The first amendment does not allow death threats and other forms of violence

being advocated. On public airwaves no less. And protecting abused people from being victimized further is not advocating authoritarianism.

Anyone is free to spend your live’s energy supporting the rights of neo nazis and kkk people, but those doing that sure have no respect from me.

I have had it with how these creeps have been protected enough to go around terrorizing rural liberals unchallenged for decades. Now the rest of the country gets to experience what we have been going through. I just don’t understand why urban liberals all are so mystified about it.

The crazed hatred against all democrats and liberals were cultured in these decades of hate speech being condoned, ignored and allowed unchallenged. If you want to waste your time arguing with me about asking to be defended against violent extremism, go right ahead. But as a victim of their abuse for far too long I say, your support of their violence is not anything but violence against all of us who have been victimized by these people whose goal remains to destroy our system of government and all civility.

Just look at how normalized the constant attack on Biden is. All of this is the result of these decades of propaganda. We cannot stop the right wing chatter, but certainly the death threats and slanders absolutely could have been and should have been prosecuted in some way shape or form. The unwillingness of the left to do anything to protect those victimized by these coordinated efforts speaks volumes.

Now it is being directed at urban liberals. They got the idea that they could do what they wanted. And they just keep pushing it.

[Tumbulu]

120. You call me an authoritarian for calling for threats and violence to be prosecuted, wow

I am exactly saying that threats and inciting violence is not protected speech. And the fact that this speech has been ignored and allowed for decades is what has created the disastrous situation that we find our nation in today.

[Calista241]

87. Saying what they say about Covid and vaccines may be dumb, but it's not violent speech.

You’re basically talking about banning conspiracy theories and theorists. Which is impossible, and not something we want to try and do.

The only people that listen to that shit are old people anyway. This problem is going to resolve itself.

[Tumbulu]

100. That is what everyone said 35 years ago and now we have

a senate that is 50% crazy right wing nut jobs.

And no hope of 60 senators who will be reasonable in any way shape or form.

And we pick on fellow dems for not doing the things that the crazy right wing controlling the Senate and almost the House prevent us from doing.

When it is not the fault of the democrats, but the result of this long term propaganda campaign that has changed the culture of rural areas in such a serious way that so many are at risk of dieting from a disease that they could be immunized against. But believe these nuts.

I am not saying ban them, I am saying sue them for the consequences of their rhetoric.

Calling for the death of public servants is not ok. Some people here like to say it is protected by the first amendment. I don’t think so. I think that these am stations have been mostly ignored and the damage has corroded our body politic immeasurably.

[Calista241]

107. We'll, lets go ahead and start banning shit that doesn't seem right.

Wonder how long that'll take to completely backfire on us.

[Tumbulu]

109. Using public airwaves to blast hate speech

is not “ something we don’t like” it is what brought us to today, where most rural areas are predominantly brainwashed.

And there is no way to communicate with them.

And this coordinated hate speech for decades must be tackled or we will remain controlled by obstructionists and insurrectionists.

In every level of government.

[tritsofme]

114. The First Amendment contains no exception for "hate speech"

[Tumbulu]

117. So, first of all, my post is about how to stop these guys from terrorizing the nation

Instead of just us few rural liberals that they learned their techniques on.

So, if you don’t think death threats can be prosecuted, fine,

I do. But so what? It does not matter what we think. On some anonymous discussion board. It matters what happens.

The fact that these people have terrorized us all for decades and now have their sights on the nation as a whole should be the topic.

Any idea how to stop them from taking the nation down?

I welcome your ideas since you don’t think death threats can or should be prosecuted.

What should be prosecuted? Just after the person is murdered? Threats don’t count?

[brooklynite]

55. Depends; when will YOU start?

Or is planning these efforts someone else’s job?

[Tumbulu]

73. I am a rural liberal and have been beat down by these guys

Last edited Thu Dec 23, 2021, 12:49 AM - Edit history (1)

and see what the country is facing. And I just cannot see how anyone, no matter how logical or caring or reasonable can reach these people who have been so brainwashed by the propaganda.

Most of us liberals in rural areas have been crying the alarm for a long time.

Seeing the work of the scientists at Malhuer just literally pissed on, thrown out, trashed…..

It is terrorizing.

And more are bragging about being insurrectionist and proud of how they will take the government down.

The normalizing of this disproportionally effects us as a nation because of the Senate and the electoral college. One voter in Wyoming is equal to like 3 in LA.

One idea is for great numbers of retired liberal seniors move to rural states, enough to vote in sane Senators. Maybe that would work.

But I cannot even begin to get past the decades of hateful rhetoric that these people consider to be the truth. And I have felt, for most of my adult life are risk. It is a form or terrorism. I see it now unleashed on everyone, not just us rural liberals. There are so few of us, we just have learned to hide for our own safety. But now the nation’s safety is at risk.

[Mysterian]

108. The radio airwaves are full of hateful, fascist propaganda

I was sickened driving through western Virginia this week and scrolling through stations....nothing but religious nuttery, Alex Jones and other Limbaugh wannabe fascist propaganda.

How did we get here? The billionaires who own these right-wing media companies apparently want to destroy democracy in the USA and install a dictatorship. Do they really believe they will flourish if this transpires?

[Tumbulu]

111. Generations have been raised on this too

and it is considered the normal way to think.

There is no getting through to any of the people so brainwashed. And the enemy of them all are liberals.

For the first few decades, just the few liberals in rural areas were the target.

But now the nation is being attacked as we have been.

By utterly controlling the Senate and the main media narrative, their views are unchecked.

If you look through all the comments on this thread you will see all sorts of dismissals of the danger they ( the coordinated far right messaging blasted for 35+ years all over rural areas) have created to the nation.

They have always underestimated the threat and have applied no creativity towards means of stopping it.

And now we as a nation are held hostage not by Manchin and Sienna, but by the 50 Senators from the red states for whom this way of thinking is completely accepted as normal.