It's Long Past Time to Prosecute Phony GOP Electors

[Nevilledog]

Link to tweet

https://www.thebulwark.com/its-long-past-time-to-prosecute-phony-gop-electors/

While the story of phony electoral certificates submitted to Congress by Republican officials in five states as part of a failed attempt to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election has caught on in a big way over the last week, it isn’t new. The phony certificates were submitted nearly a year ago and, as early as March 2, 2021, American Oversight published the documents themselves after obtaining them through the Freedom of Information Act.

Actually, there weren’t just five states in which, despite Biden having won there, Republican pseudo-electors submitted Electoral College certificates in support of Trump. There were seven. The Republicans in two of those states, however, hedged their bets. The New Mexico certificate was submitted “on the understanding that it might later be determined that we are the duly elected and qualified” electors (emphasis added). The Pennsylvania certificate was similarly qualified “on the understanding that if, as a result of a final non-appealable Court Order or other proceeding prescribed by law, we are ultimately recognized as being the duly elected and qualified Electors” (emphasis added).

The submissions from those two states deserve the benefit of the doubt. They can and should be read as contingent, belt-and-suspenders backup plans to make sure that Trump electors were identified in the event, however unlikely, that the courts reversed the election results in their states.

Not so the other five states. The phony Trump electors from each of the other five states—Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Nevada and Wisconsin—certified that they were in fact the “duly elected and qualified Electors for President and Vice President of the United States of America” from their respective states.

Those representations were lies.

*snip*

[brooklynite]

1. Because "we know what they did" isn't the basis for criminal prosecution

Building a case sufficient for Grand Jury indictment and criminal conviction is more time consulting that it is on LAW & ORDER.

[Nevilledog]

3. Many are on video doing it.

The standard for charging (probable cause - more likely than not) is different than the standard for conviction (beyond a reasonable doubt). It's not the job of the prosecutors to consider or evaluate possible defenses to a crime before they charge.

There is probable cause here, and I'm basing that on a 27 year career as a criminal defense attorney.

[Scrivener7]

23. Such an original argument! Gets sillier with each passing month.

Last edited Tue Jan 18, 2022, 04:04 PM - Edit history (1)

[Gore1FL]

25. We literally have notarized documents of them committing fraud. nt

[gab13by13]

32. DOJ can tape one of Rachel Maddow's shows if it wants evidence.

[QED]

2. Maybe they're still trying to find out who coordinated it.

Who provided the language and format? Apparently these were the same for all the states.

[dem4decades]

6. Well if you want to find that out, arrest them and break them. It's not

That hard, if you really want justice.

[Scrivener7]

22. Meanwhile these same criminals are sewing up the next election.

[gab13by13]

33. One is running for US Senate in Arizona.

[OMGWTF]

28. One of the electors said it came from Traitor Tot's campaign. Sounds about right. Rudy?

[gab13by13]

34. Rudy doesn't have the IQ.

[nykym]

4. Can they prove that

they are duly elected and qualified Electors for President and Vice President of the United States of America” from their respective states.

[Nevilledog]

5. No. To say otherwise would mean any and all could send in separate slates of electors.

[DarwinsRetriever]

7. I think the Michigan AG is the only one so far who refer it to DOJ for prosecution

Maybe DOJ is waiting for the states to refer them for prosecution. Or FBI is still investigating and will refer it when they are done.

[Nevilledog]

8. NM has.

[L. Coyote]

31. Not so, see my post. New Mexico AG reviewing fake presidential electors

New Mexico AG reviewing fake presidential electors

It is a really large conspiracy, this is the largest criminal investigation in all of history.

Link to tweet

[Bayard]

9. They can't be prosecuted

They're busy running for office.

[Nevilledog]

10. Right?

[Mr. Ected]

11. Jurisprudence is a quiet and slow-moving process

None of us has any idea what is actually happening behind closed doors.

What's more frustrating, however, is that the mainstream media seems to be very bashful about presenting any news or theories that might be detrimental to the Republican Party.

[Nevilledog]

12. Might be slow moving for Republicans, not for everyday people.

Drug cases are swiftly charged without lab tests, DUI cases are charged without blood results, rape cases are charged without DNA results. Probable cause is a very low threshold.

[Mr. Ected]

15. But conspiracy to overthrow an election can't be held to the same tight timelines as DUI, drug cases

And the like.

It is not in our best interest to pull one piece of a giant jigsaw puzzle out of the puzzle and try it out of context.

Start at the bottom and move your way up. That's exactly what the DOJ is doing.

Am I anxious? Hell yes. Does our democracy depend on it? Hell yes. Is instant gratification a necessity? Hell no.

[kacekwl]

17. People are arrested all the time for crimes

and then build a solid case against them.

[Mr. Ected]

19. Sounds like something THEY would say

Not a fan of arrest first, figure it out later....even under these dire circumstances.

[kacekwl]

41. They have evidence now that

crimes were committed so it's certainly not without cause.

[Nevilledog]

18. I disagree. Charge them with state crimes right now, even if Feds are still investigating.

Charges can also be added and amended if evidence surfaces. We're seeing this in the Jan 6th cases. Every state has laws regarding election tampering and interference. These people need to start having some fucking consequences or they'll be emboldened. We're seeing it now as many of these fake electors, as well as actual goddamn insurrectionists are running for office or are involved with politics.

[OMGWTF]

29. They fking signed their names to the LIE! How is that not an admission of GUILT?

[Nevilledog]

30. Exactly

[Ligyron]

13. MSM speak Ill of the boss?

Don’t be silly.

[Scrivener7]

21. .

[calimary]

14. Yes! WHY ISN'T this happening???

Consequences!!!

[kacekwl]

16. Like most of these Republican crimes there seems to be

more than enough to charge them with crimes and continue to build the case while we wait for the wheels of justice to slowly grind.

[Scrivener7]

20. You'd think, wouldn't you?

Ahh but we are not allowed to say this. Because they'll get around to it someday. Or so we are told.

[The Wizard]

24. smoking gun

[robbob]

26. Funny how Rethug scandals

never seem to “catch on in a big way…”. 🤬

[KS Toronado]

27. The DOJ should do exactly how they dealt with the oathkeepers

Round them up all on the same day, take 'em to jail, interrogate the hell out of them and find out which ones
would like to stay out of prison by giving up everything they know.

[gab13by13]

37. You do know the big difference?

The Oaf Freepers aren't politicians, can't appear partisan.

[KS Toronado]

42. They do share a common trait though

Both groups attempted to overturn a Presidential election, each in their own way. One with a sword, one with a pen.
"The pen is mightier than the sword"---Edward Bulwer-Lytton, 1839

[Mr.Bill]

35. First we have to have two years of investigations

then it goes to the courts. The Supreme Court should have a decision on this in June 0f 2026.

[Scrivener7]

40. But by that time we will be The Sovereign States of Toxic Trumpiness.

[gab13by13]

36. The Michigan AG has been investigating this for a year,

she was deciding what charges to file when she learned that 6 other states were also involved. Don't tell me that DOJ didn't know about this a year ago, if they didn't Lordy help us.

I have 2 Why fors, Why for DOJ has to wait for referrals from the select committee? Why for when state and federal crimes are involved that DOJ just leaves it for the state to prosecute?

[Wild blueberry]

38. They signed their own crime

Prosecute!

[Emile]

39. Damn right, what the hell is taking so long?