The United States during the Obama administration and the Trump administration imposed sanctions on Russia. People can look for themselves. None of these sanctions were effective. Russia did not withdraw from Ukraine.

Mary in S. Carolina

(1,364 posts)

5. LOL. The sanctions have not worked really?

Reply to former9thward (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 27, 2022, 01:30 AM

Jan 2022

What was the Russian GDP before the sanctions and what is the GDP now?
How much did the Soviets make per month before the sanctions and what do they make today?
Let's talk about Russia's economics, isn't that what sanctions effect?

It is going to be a lot harder for Russia to cross the Ukranian border than it was to take over a peninsula.

Not sure why you think I distorted your words? But I respectfully disagree.

Russia is going to get crushed - Putin and Trump are weak.

See the article military.com

www.military.com/daily-news/opinions/2022/01/25/russias-vietnam-why-invasion-of-ukraine-would-be-disaster-putin.html[link:http://www.military.com/daily-news/opinions/2022/01/25/russias-vietnam-why-invasion-of-ukraine-would-be-disaster-putin.html|

Chainfire

(17,644 posts)

6. We really don't know if the sanctions have worked or not.

Reply to Mary in S. Carolina (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 27, 2022, 10:50 AM

Jan 2022

Putin has not taken Ukraine, Poland, or the Balkans, so perhaps they have worked. However, he is threatening to initiate WWIII, so perhaps they are not working. As far as the article linked above, the premise of the author is that Putin will take a rational approach to international relations. Putin is a tyrant, if personally threatened, all logic is off the table. Putin's real danger comes from the Oligarchs who feel that they may lose some of their vast fortunes, and the power that it brings, if Putin breaks bad.

Putin is right about one thing, NATO was founded to keep The Soviet Union and now Russia in check. The main purpose of their existence is to make war on Russians. As long as the NATO allies present a united front, Putin dare not start a full-scale war. It is time for Europe to send a message that sanctions are not as far as they are willing to go to maintain European borders. If Putin continues to threaten, then German, France, Poland and GB need to make a point of mobilizing their troops for battle. Putin is using brinksmanship to get what he wants. We need to show him our Churchill side, not our Chamberlain side. Nothing impresses a bully like overwhelming power and the knowledge that the other side is willing to deploy it.

I am not suggesting that I think that war is a solution to the crisis that we are facing. War is never a good solution to a dispute, but if we do not prepare for war with Russia we will be doomed to fight it.

We need to send an unambiguous message that, If Putin really wants the Breadbasket of Europe, he will need take it from the inside, not with tanks. What the world, including Putin, needs to remember is Russia is best attacked from the inside; if you don't believe it, ask Napoleon, Hitler or for that matter, Nicholas II.

Putin sees himself as a successor to Nicholas, but he best remember how it ended for the unfortunate Nicholas the Second, by the grace of God, Emperor and Autocrat of all the Russias, of Moscow, Kiev, Vladimir, Novgorod, Tsar of Kazan, Tsar of Astrakhan, King of Poland, Tsar of Siberia, Tsar of Tauric Chersonesos, Tsar of Georgia, Lord of Pskov, and Grand Duke of Smolensk, Lithuania, Volhynia, Podolia, and Finland, Prince of Estonia, Livonia, Courland and Semigalia, Samogitia, Białystok, Karelia, Tver, Yugra, Perm, Vyatka, Bulgaria, and other territories; Lord and Grand Duke of Nizhny Novgorod, Chernigov; Ruler of Ryazan, Polotsk, Rostov, Yaroslavl, Beloozero, Udoria, Obdoria, Kondia, Vitebsk, Mstislav, and all northern territories; Ruler of Iveria, Kartalinia, and the Kabardinian lands and Armenian territories; hereditary Ruler and Lord of the Cherkess and Mountain Princes and others; Lord of Turkestan, Heir of Norway, Duke of Schleswig-Holstein, Stormarn, Dithmarschen, Oldenburg, and so forth, and so forth, and so forth."

Mary in S. Carolina

(1,364 posts)

7. Thank you Chainfire

Reply to Chainfire (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 27, 2022, 10:28 PM

Jan 2022

for your analysis. Even though Putin is a ruthless dictator in my opinion, he is smart enough to know when he is beat. He is beat and needs to go away and be lucky that we allow him to exist. The sanctions have weakened him, so he started his propaganda machine which has worked to a point....to a point. If he advances, I think he is going to have a very rude awakening. NATO will crush him, it may take 20 years, but when it is all said and done, there will not be a Russia.

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