I am wondering how long before NATO air power against the Russian military.

[Texaswitchy]

No boots on the ground but plenty in the air.

Unless something happens to Putin.

How many pictures and videos of dead babies and kids will finally make it happen.

Putin is temper tantrum.

If he can't have Ukraine he willing to destroy it.

[Voltaire2]

1. He has nukes.

This is the part of the equation the ‘let’s go to war’ crowd keep omitting.

We can give Ukraine stuff to fight with, we would be really stupid to engage directly.

[drray23]

4. So following your reasoning

we would also not do anything if he invades a NATO country and triggers article 5 ? After all that argument that Russia is a nuclear power would still hold.

[Voltaire2]

8. Invading a nato country is our red line.

This has been the ‘rules’ since the 50s.

[Torchlight]

20. The NATO intervention in Bosnia and Herzegovina was a series of actions

undertaken by NATO whose stated aim was to establish long-term peace during and after the Bosnian War.

There is more than one red line.

[hamsterjill]

5. But then what's the answer?

He will always use his nukes as his get out of jail free card. How far do we let him go?

Serious question. I’ve not heard any good answers.

[Voltaire2]

12. Again: NATO is our red line.

But it is an interesting question if one plugs in one of the Baltic states. Are we really going to go to war, likely a nuclear war, over Latvia? I don’t have a good answer.

6500 city killing nukes on each side. If only 10% get through to their target, and if each of those only does Hiroshima level casualties of say 100,000, that is 130,000,000 dead to start with.

[Calculating]

21. That's assuming he gets to launch them all

Before a counter attack destroys much of their launch capacity. Also, would he even use nukes first if people engage him in a conventional war?

[Gore1FL]

13. We let him go to the border of a NATO country and not an inch more. nt

[SoonerPride]

2. You will wait forever.

No NATO country will bomb any Russian target in or out of Ukraine.

[EndlessWire]

9. No, they won't.

But, if they change their minds, they have plenty of pegs to hang their hat on. Russia is seeking to control the Azov Sea, and has fired on noncombatant shipping. That's all the excuse they need to engage. But, cooler heads prevail, and the stronger play is to wait a bit.

Plus, we have thousands and thousands of refugees at the borders. This is a complication that may shape a response.

[Walleye]

3. Dictators display the same traits as rapists and domestic abusers

Only they need to do it on a much larger scale to satisfy their perverse desires

[haele]

6. No. I understand how you feel, but no.

Escalating the conflict directly with Russia with NATO air will not save the Ukrainians, who are not part of NATO, and it will only give the Russian invasion force there a morale boost. And other countries -like China's proxies - will step in to help Russia go from a regional conflict to a greater conflict because "The West is Bad"

Sucks. But treaties are Laws; that's why the Ukrainians have set up their International Legion -and people are flocking to that organization.
And also why they're being given arms and planes and drones.
This has got to play out.
Putin may take Kyiv, but his installed puppet government won't stand because he can't hold it.

Sorry.

Haele

[nycbos]

7. Has Ukaine requested NATO involvment? If they have I must have missed it

[drray23]

10. yes they have been asking NATO to establish air superiority

over Ukraine.

[nycbos]

14. Okay that I missed

[Gore1FL]

11. When a NATO Country is attacked, NATO will get involved directly.

Until that time, there will be no direct involvement by NATO.

[sarisataka]

15. If we join in the air

We might as well send in troops.

Ther will be Russian missiles landing on NATO airbases

[Texaswitchy]

16. Putin is not backing down.

I can see him attacking a NATO country.

The man is insane.

I bet we have special forces on the ground in Ukraine.

Navy seal types.

My Czech cousin as four grandsons that served in the Czech air force.

They have been recalled.

They are jet tech technicians.

They were working for air lines.

We have nuclear weapons also.

Putin has lost his mind.

[hamsterjill]

17. I bet we do, too.

The special forces, that is. This is far too dangerous a situation for the US not to have something within striking distance. Hell, maybe Blackwater? I don’t know the answer. No one does. But I bet you are correct.

[Texaswitchy]

22. Yes.

One of my far neighbors four farms over was a navy seal.

We have lot of retired military out here.

Yesterday he invited us over for barbecue, fresh pork.

Lots of feral hogs around here.

He told me Ukraine would be a Navy Seals dream.

There would be lots of volunteers.

[radius777]

18. If Russia commits genocide the West will go in.

It's all about public support. Before Putin invaded, there was still alot of anti-American cynicism in Europe, ie that we were alarmists who were unfairly demonizing poor Pootie, whose oil/gas they love. But now that everything we said has come to pass, the West is thoroughly united. It's just a matter of time before the West would be unable to stand by - whether or not Ukraine is in NATO (which they begged to be for many years, and this would not be happening if they were). NATO is simply a military alliance - not some final word on which countries go in or not.

Putin/Russia are bluffing about nukes... to scare the West out of the conflict. Even if there is direct conflict between the West and Russia, Putin will not use nukes, knowing we have many aimed right at all of Russia's major cities and it would be an instant end to him and his country.

[LuckyCharms]

19. Both Syria and Ukraine are not NATO members.

Russia killed somewhere around 6,000 Syrian civilians.

NATO did not directly engage with Russia in Syria.

I don't think that NATO will engage directly with Russia unless a NATO country is engaged first by Russia.

[JasonMain]

23. They really need to start soon.