NATO is trying hard to avoid...

[Septua]

..provoking Putin into starting a full scale war. I'm beginning to think Putin is trying to provoke NATO into a starting full scale war.

[Tickle]

1. It certainly looks

that way. He’ll just keep destroying and killing people and places until we step in

[Straw Man]

3. I don't think so.

I think he'll use the nuclear threat to call NATO's bluff, thinking that he can keep picking off countries one by one.

[onecaliberal]

7. This is what he's doing; Ukraine is the 3rd country Russia has illegally invaded.

He will go until stopped.

[Straw Man]

9. So far no NATO countries yet, though.

That would be a war he couldn't win.

[onecaliberal]

11. But it's okay to kill millions of people, so long as it's not the chosen ones.

Where have I heard this story before?
🤬

[Straw Man]

14. No, it's not OK.

I'm just talking about the geopolitical realities of the situation. Morality is a separate question, one that doesn't get the attention it deserves.

[onecaliberal]

15. I can't get passed it.

My head and my heart are in conflict.

My father was a WWII veteran and heard stories about his experience. I used to wonder how in the hell Hitler was ever allowed to carry out the Holocaust. I don’t wonder anymore, I know.

[Straw Man]

2. Well ....

It's hard to understand why he would. It's a war he would certainly lose, even if he went nuclear, in which case everyone loses.

Unless, of course, he has gone off the deep end and wants to be the man who destroys the planet in the ultimate act of suicidal megalomania.

[Poiuyt]

4. Call his bluff

Bullies usually crumple when they get punched in the mouth.

Note: I'm not necessarily recommending this, but I'm getting tired about how we have to keep tip toeing around Putin despite him committing war crimes.

[Septua]

16. I'm beginning to think the same way.

It's been 2 weeks since the original post and the situation has only deteriorated further. Putin shows no signs of backing down, quite the opposite in fact. Biden and NATO keep talking about 'red lines' and vague threats of consequences for crossing them. And all the while, the war crimes continue.

I was never in the military, no nothing about running a war or conducting diplomacy in international relations. And I understand the implications of what might happen if NATO decides to go on the offensive. But whether it's a bully running a country or the bully running a street gang or the bully next door, there are only two options: fight or flight, submit or take a stand.

If NATO wants to avoid direct military action, give Ukraine what they need now and they will win the war. If that's not an option, then turn the fucking lights out in Russia, metaphorically speaking. Just build a virtual wall around the country where nothing goes in, nothing comes out...and do it tomorrow.

[jmbar2]

5. THis is harsh, but

..reminds me of the violent spouse who kills his own wife and kids, and then himself, to get back when she tries to leave him.

[onecaliberal]

12. While the wife has a protection order that will keep her "safe" from him.

[Haggard Celine]

6. I also wonder if that is his goal

His goal and also others. Will he ever, if he get China's permission, have a hand that is as strong as it is now? India has also been lukewarm. He could possibly half the world on his side.

[Submariner]

8. He knows we currently have fast stack submarines in all oceans at Defcon 4

and that they are within weapons strike of Russia's missile boats, that are surely sitting off our east and west coasts, waiting for Pootie to lose his shit and give the launch order.

We're not in a good place right now.

[Straw Man]

10. Yup.

We're not in a good place right now.

I'm old enough to remember the Cuban missile crisis. I was only kid and didn't understand exactly what was going on, but I know that the adults were scared. This is eerily reminiscent of that.

[Septua]

17. And if you remember...

..that was settled via 'diplomacy'...a swap of sorts. JFK removed some missiles from Turkey, which was what actually led Khrushchev to place them in Cuba.

The Ukraine thing is more reminiscent of Hitler to me. But he really was fucking nuts, wanting take over the entire world and replace the population with his Aryan race.

I think Putin is a sane, yet ruthless bully who knows a nuclear war, even on a limited tactical scale, would not be in the best interest of Russia or himself. If he is insane, maybe not.

[FakeNoose]

13. We've got dollars and euros, all Pootie has is rubles

We win!