General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsBeating a horse I hope is not dead. What is the difference between . . . . .
. . . . Javelin and Stinger missiles, well used MIG29s, and old A10 Warthogs?
Really, why is any one of these weapons seen as more confrontational to Putin than another?
Aristus
(66,096 posts)The Stinger is a shoulder-fired surface-to-air missile.
The A-10 Warthog (Actually the Thunderbolt II) is a ground-support aircraft.
The MiG-29 is an air-superiority jet fighter.
NewHendoLib
(59,940 posts)and my feeling is that Putin cares not a whit about any of it. I am sure he already feels like this is a war.
I am utterly fed up watching innocent people getting butchered by a mentally disturbed monster
I_UndergroundPanther
(12,452 posts)He has a sociopath personality it is who he is and therapy and meds cannot do anything about who a person is.
Cant wait until the sociopath pig putin is dead.. hell I wish all the psychopaths were dead.
Its the only thing that stops them.
Caliman73
(11,694 posts)Javelins and Stingers are weapon systems that are relatively cheap, easier to use, and effective defensive weapons.
MiG29's are Soviet/Russian built fighters that are fairly advanced but that Ukrainians based on history, are used to flying.
The A10 is a uniquely American aircraft that we do not export anywhere and which only American pilots can use. Anyone advocating for the use of A10s is either saying, "In about 3 months to a year the Ukrainians can have an effective aircraft to destroy Russian armor" OR They are saying American fighter pilots need to engage against Russian targets.
Stinky The Clown
(67,697 posts)What one and not the other? All are weapons.
Caliman73
(11,694 posts)All are certainly weapons and all are confrontational to the Russians and hence Putin.
As I said about the A10, that is just out of the question based on what I said. The A10 is an American plane ONLY flown by Americans. It's use would be a signal that America is directly in the war.
MiG 29's are, as another poster said, "Air Superiority" fighters. They are considered offensive, as well as defensive, but they are a much bigger expense and much more of a sign of "commitment than a weapon system that can be wielded by one person or a very small team as the Javelin and Stinger are.
Currently, it appears that the MiG is not considered a viable weapons system by the Pentagon. I don't agree but there must be some reason that the people who are responsible for taking us to war or keeping us out, have in not approving.
Stinky The Clown
(67,697 posts)This debate is like the gun debate and what makes a gun an assault rifle. It is meaningless.
Arm Ukraine to the teeth is how some people see this.
Mr.Bill
(24,104 posts)lots of things can happen. But one thing that always happens are POW pilots.
Stinky The Clown
(67,697 posts)Not sure where you got the idea that pilots would be going. I certainly could have missed that.
Mr.Bill
(24,104 posts)Just that pilots do get captured. Many if not most of the POWs in the Vietnam war were pilots.
Stinky The Clown
(67,697 posts)Mr.Bill
(24,104 posts)Thankfully, so far, so good.
uponit7771
(90,225 posts)... away. Mig 29 is an air superiority fighter (there's no "dogfights" any more) and an A-10 is for close in air support usually to protect long US columns from attack.
2. Yes, IMHO the javilen and stingers are more confrontational for what RA is doing seeing it makes it damn near impossible for them to move large troops with armored vehicles cause those devices can kill tanks and airplanes from more than a mile away.
The Mig 29s aren't made for close in air support and again, there's no dogfighting above UKR even though the can be used to shoot down the 1 or 2 air attacks that happen
The A-10 would be VERY useful to UA but is advanced and needs training to use that UKR doesn't have time for and doesn't have the support machines for.
Stinky The Clown
(67,697 posts)The fundamental issue is not the efficacy of one weapons system over another. Instead it is why we are okay supplying the small missile systems but not bigger airplane systems. I fail to see the difference (again, efficacy aside).
As to A10s, Ukraine says they have some pilots who can fly them.
uponit7771
(90,225 posts)... Flying the weapons system is fairly a 2 week long training ... BUT ... using the Vulcan 30 cal without stalling the plane into the ground is another whole issue.
Instead it is why we are okay supplying the small missile systems but not bigger airplane systems.
MY arm chair estimate on why we're okay with the more deadly small missiles vs airplanes is because Putrids generals don't see those as effective against Russian tanks ... and still don't
THEY ARE REALLY REALLY WRONG AND STUPID .. with US Javs you can stand a 1.5 miles away and kill a tank or helicopter.
We should be seeing for UKR the Stinger and Javs are Waaaaaay more deadly than the A-10 or Mig 29 would be in that area.
These Putin "red lines" the DoD is coming up with aren't even factual and sound silly at best seeing the weapons given to them already are deadly as all get out.
I ... NO DOUBT ... think the DoD and Biden admin don't want something else to happen vs why is one weapons system worse than the other in regards to escalation.
Putin has already declared we are at Economic War ... RIGHT NOW ... we've gone beyond "escalation" when it comes to crushing the Russian economy.