General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums**BREAKING**: Russia claims 'parts of peace deal' with Ukraine are close to being agreed
Last edited Wed Mar 16, 2022, 08:09 AM - Edit history (1)
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-russia-war-peace-talk-deal-b2036930.html?utm_content=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=Main&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1647424443Russia has claimed that a peace deal with Ukraine could be possible with some parts close to agreement.
Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov said that neutral status for Ukraine is now being seriously discussed along, of course, with security guarantees.
Doesn't mean anything coming from Russia seeing they broke the last deal, I'd pound these bastards into the ground before they left if I was Zel.
Putrid is the process of knocking over all the chess pieces and strutting around like he won ... nope, humiliate him.
***UPDATE***
Things are fluid, looks like Zel still has some fight in him ... Putrid needs his ass kicked some more
Link to tweet
underpants
(182,793 posts)That is most likely what Russia will settle for now.
I say that frozen Russian assets are given to Ukraine to rebuild after this is over.
unblock
(52,209 posts)They didn't really talk about conquering the whole of ukraine. They only really talked about the Donbas and about not wanting ukraine in NATO.
So if they get that, then invading the entire country will turn out to have been just a crazy negotiating strategy to get everything they wanted originally.
They can't overtly "get" the Donbas. Maybe some assurances. Unfortunately, any such agreement with Russia gives them a legal interest in that area and an excuse to invade later.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)unblock
(52,209 posts)The man of principles in me says "riiight, because obviously ukraine has no need for any help from NATO nations, whatever"
But the strategist in me says there might be a workaround where they don't officially join but have informal assurances...
thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)which ended up being essentially useless.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum_on_Security_Assurances
unblock
(52,209 posts)assurances from NATO nations to help protect ukraine would he of more consequence
Happy Hoosier
(7,305 posts)and then basically said they dont count. Without a formal arrangement, we are not a reliable guarantor.
thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)which ended up meaning nothing.
Check that wiki link, about the meaning of the word "assurance" vs. "guarantee," and how the U.S. went out of their way to avoid any obligation, which would have required Senate approval. So we only provided a meaningless "assurance."
unblock
(52,209 posts)Republicans decided the supreme law of the land can be revoked with a presidential shrug of the shoulders, so an ironclad guarantee only means whatever is politically convenient at the time.
That said, I think the political calculus has changed in favor of more support for ukraine... for now at least...
Buckeyeblue
(5,499 posts)He's essentially asking for a draw. Which is fine if the fighting stops. But I don't see how the world returns to normalized relations with Putin.
uponit7771
(90,335 posts)unblock
(52,209 posts)It's more like trying to sell a house. Market says it's worth $200k, you want $300k, so you list it for a million. Everyone goes "that's crazy, I wouldn't buy it for half that number!" So you say no I want a million but I'll settle for $400k. They counter $300k and you say groan, ok.
Lovie777
(12,260 posts)Trusting Ukraine that Ukraine remains the same before the February 24, 2022 unprovoked invasion and the killings, maiming of Ukrainian citizens will have retributions.
That Ukraine will join Nato.
Mike Nelson
(9,954 posts)... I trust the leader of Ukraine and the leaders of NATO privately consider this a Russian war tactic. Lavrov should not be trusted.
Tommy Carcetti
(43,181 posts)Ever.
barbtries
(28,793 posts)when i hear news that appears to come from russia i just don't believe it anymore.
pazzyanne
(6,552 posts)barbtries
(28,793 posts)that some foxbots (such as my brother) are coming out from under their spell about now.
LiberalFighter
(50,912 posts)Tommy Carcetti
(43,181 posts)uponit7771
(90,335 posts)cayugafalls
(5,640 posts)Russia then claims deal falls through.
Russia then claims Ukraine wants war and that Ukraine is the aggressor, "Mother Russia wanted Peace all along..."
Typical Russian tactics.
kentuck
(111,092 posts)He cannot be trusted.
Ford_Prefect
(7,895 posts)IronLionZion
(45,435 posts)close to agreement
uponit7771
(90,335 posts)AngryOldDem
(14,061 posts)Of course Russia will spin that into a deal is in the works.
Who trusts Russia and Putin? This is another sign of desperation. I cant see either Ukraine or Zelensky agreeing to the terms as laid out by Lavrov. Security guarantees means Russias boot will be firmly placed on Ukraines neck. Ask any postwar Soviet satellite what that phrase meant.
Eagerly awaiting Zelenskys remarks to Congress this morning.
AllyCat
(16,186 posts)When our State Department or the Ukrainian team says it, Ill believe it.
JoanofArgh
(14,971 posts)deal and the next day launch chemical weapons against Ukraine
DFW
(54,370 posts)And now, that the Russians are getting their asses kicked despite having overwhelmingly superior numbers, and are causing untold misery on the Ukrainian civilian population, they want to talk about peace combined with neutrality, with terms dictated by RUSSIA? With no guarantees that Russia won't infiltrate their own paid fifth column, just like they did to us with the "Republican" Party and Fox "News?"
If I were Zelensky, my answer would be, "That's interesting. Keep blabbing, and maybe, by accident, you'll say something useful. Just because you haven't yet doesn't mean you won't."
anamnua
(1,111 posts)I smell a rat.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)Putin and Lavrov are psychopathic snakes. Nobody should EVER trust them.
luv2fly
(2,475 posts)That is as laughable as all the "experts" who have been saying the orange turd may be in serious legal trouble any day now for the past year.
turbinetree
(24,695 posts)in drones to take out air launch sites and more ability to launch attacks with drones
L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)Botany
(70,502 posts)* Kill the Russians who are still fighting in Ukraine and have the rest leave the country including the Crimea.
* The death of Vlad Putin.
A peace deal with Russia? R you kidding me? Russia told certain Ukrainian cities that they could evacuate
and then attacked those unarmed people as they left their homes.
dalton99a
(81,485 posts)Botany
(70,502 posts)AngryOldDem
(14,061 posts)If they guarantee safe passage and then proceed to bomb the hell out of that, surely well believe their peace offers.
Nope.
AllaN01Bear
(18,194 posts)BlueIdaho
(13,582 posts)Period.
dalton99a
(81,485 posts)marmar
(77,080 posts)..... he wanted to project strength to the world but Russia actually looks very weak.