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Russian prisoner talking to his wife. His entire battalion was eliminated. (Original Post) Fla Dem Mar 2022 OP
Um, "poisoner"? brooklynite Mar 2022 #1
Prisoner.... Karadeniz Mar 2022 #2
Heartbreaking, but... BlueIdaho Mar 2022 #3
I understand your POV. Not apologizing at all for what he may have done. Fla Dem Mar 2022 #8
My sentiments also. Thank you. erronis Mar 2022 #12
It is the leaders who need to be tried for war crimes. Lonestarblue Mar 2022 #11
+1000 smirkymonkey Mar 2022 #22
Camp guards at Auschwitz TxGuitar Mar 2022 #24
You might edit the subject line JHB Mar 2022 #4
Thank you. Fla Dem Mar 2022 #6
"they (Russian military leadership) is killing their wounded OAITW r.2.0 Mar 2022 #5
In history, this is when the superior officers need to worry about their backs. erronis Mar 2022 #13
Fragging? Person of Interest Mar 2022 #27
If the Russians are killing their Ukrainian POWs, this guy won't get swapped FakeNoose Mar 2022 #7
Exactly. dchill Mar 2022 #19
If Russian officers are killing their own wounded they don't care about trading for their soldiers ZonkerHarris Mar 2022 #50
Re killing the wounded: bobacatt Mar 2022 #9
The russian deaths on the battlefield are probably not being reported up the chain. erronis Mar 2022 #15
"Russians would not kill their own wounded." Emrys Mar 2022 #25
Good points. bobacatt Mar 2022 #37
The Mirror's journalism is usually of a high standard. Emrys Mar 2022 #40
Back in December there was an article about new Russian regulations making mass burials quicker Sapient Donkey Mar 2022 #41
Not The First Time I've Read They're Killing Their Own Wounded... GB_RN Mar 2022 #26
Exchange him for Putin. Emile Mar 2022 #10
Heartbreaking orangecrush Mar 2022 #14
I saw a report that pilots of stricken are ejecting but no parachutes open grantcart Mar 2022 #16
There have been videos of captured pilots... Sancho Mar 2022 #18
I think one was, early on. colorado_ufo Mar 2022 #20
When I saw/heard about the portable Mr.Bill Mar 2022 #17
I wonder if they collect the fat to be used for soap? alfredo Mar 2022 #21
He's wearing the light blue striped telnyashka of an elite unit Arazi Mar 2022 #23
This message was self-deleted by its author Sherman A1 Mar 2022 #30
Naval Infantry wear the telnyashka too and there's rumors they're on ships Arazi Mar 2022 #32
This message was self-deleted by its author Sherman A1 Mar 2022 #33
I wish I understood military troop numbers better bobacatt Mar 2022 #38
This message was self-deleted by its author Sherman A1 Mar 2022 #43
Paratrooper, IMO COL Mustard Mar 2022 #36
This may not be popular but releasing this video was a violation of the Geneva Convention. TomSlick Mar 2022 #28
This message was self-deleted by its author Sherman A1 Mar 2022 #31
There is no justification for this violation. It is an obvious use of EPWs for propaganda. TomSlick Mar 2022 #34
Well, that's the high road bobacatt Mar 2022 #39
Taking the high road is what is required by international law TomSlick Mar 2022 #44
IMO, the asymmetry of power in this case makes this particular rule moot. harumph Mar 2022 #42
Russian soldiers are searching for Nazi tattoos by stripping Ukrainians L. Coyote Mar 2022 #29
I have no doubt the Russians are committing war crimes. TomSlick Mar 2022 #35
The Russians in uniform didn't appear to be military? WarGamer Mar 2022 #45
The goon doing the talking at the first did not appear to be in a uniform. TomSlick Mar 2022 #46
The guy talking, in the red sweater is Ukrainian. WarGamer Mar 2022 #47
Having re-watched, you appear to be correct. TomSlick Mar 2022 #48
I thought the same thing... WarGamer Mar 2022 #49

BlueIdaho

(13,582 posts)
3. Heartbreaking, but...
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 03:11 PM
Mar 2022

How many war crimes has he personally committed? Nobody goes home until there is a full accounting for murderous acts against civilians.

Fla Dem

(23,642 posts)
8. I understand your POV. Not apologizing at all for what he may have done.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 03:29 PM
Mar 2022

Last edited Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:58 PM - Edit history (1)

Agree there has to be accountability, especially at the top; Putin. What a travesty it would be if all the captured Russian soldiers who were ordered into this conflict, with lies about a training mission, or they will be welcomed with open arms end up spending years in a prison, while the madman responsible gets away scot free.

Yes I'm heartbroken for all those in Ukraine, every single one of them. Does not mean I cannot feel some empathy for those soldiers conscripted into service, lied to about the situation and then ordered to invade, destroy and kill. It's a tragedy all the way around.

Lonestarblue

(9,967 posts)
11. It is the leaders who need to be tried for war crimes.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 04:30 PM
Mar 2022

The soldiers, seemingly inexperienced, are following orders, which is what soldiers do. Yes, some have walked away, but I suspect the Russian punishment for disobeying orders is beyond harsh and could even be death. I hope Putin and his military leaders are all tried for war crimes.

OAITW r.2.0

(24,446 posts)
5. "they (Russian military leadership) is killing their wounded
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 03:15 PM
Mar 2022

Last edited Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:45 PM - Edit history (1)

That has got to be a real morale booster. Forced into a shameful war and knowing how little your CO's care about you..... I wonder if we will see large scale troop desertions soon?

FakeNoose

(32,620 posts)
7. If the Russians are killing their Ukrainian POWs, this guy won't get swapped
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 03:19 PM
Mar 2022

A swap only happens when both sides have POWs to trade.

bobacatt

(23 posts)
9. Re killing the wounded:
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 03:50 PM
Mar 2022

I think he means Russians are killing Ukrainian wounded. Therefore there will be no prisoner exchange.

Russians would not kill their own wounded. More deaths on the battlefield is NOT good for Putin.

When he says “No one is collecting the bodies” I think he means it in general: neither side is bothering or neither side has safety to do it.

erronis

(15,223 posts)
15. The russian deaths on the battlefield are probably not being reported up the chain.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 04:35 PM
Mar 2022

Just like the body counts in wars I have known, don't report the bad news. Amplify the good. Light at the end of the tunnel.

I'm guessing the allied (fair to use that term now?) intelligence service have a much better count of casualties than the Kremlin does.

Emrys

(7,228 posts)
25. "Russians would not kill their own wounded."
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:18 PM
Mar 2022

On the contrary, there have been many accounts of Russians killing their own wounded, not least from Russian POWs.

Morale be damned, they don't have the resources, infrastructure or luxury of time to cope with wounded.

All these accounts are obviously shrouded in the fog of war, but if you truly believe what you've just written, tell me - or even show me ANY videos - of wounded Russian military personnel being tended or shipped out.

"More deaths on the battlefield is NOT good for Putin."

Again, on the contrary, any evidence of failure on the ground is bad for Putin. Wounded soldiers would be a telling part of that evidence. Far better for him if they just go MIA, forgotten and unburied, or as has been documented, piling up in morgues in Belarus or temporary cold stores near the battle fronts in Ukraine, with only a proportion claimed and accounted for and shipped back to Russia.

He doesn't give a fuck for his troops, and his troops can't afford to give a fuck for each other, especially when wounded or dead.

bobacatt

(23 posts)
37. Good points.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 09:36 PM
Mar 2022

I don’t know. I mean, of course it is cheaper to shoot the wounded than care for them. And I have no illusion that Putin cares about the troops. He will do whatever is good for Putin.

(Aside: In the WWII Soviet army, I’m pretty sure it was policy to prevent desertion by having officers in the rear shoot any grunts who tried to dash away into the woods. Which is more understandable in war than shooting wounded, but still brutal.)

I just think what’s good for Putin is having families welcoming home their patched-up sons, not families torn with grief and raising hell. But yeah, you make sense too.

The article you link to doesn’t strike me as reliable. I’d guess it’s part true, but exaggerated.

Emrys

(7,228 posts)
40. The Mirror's journalism is usually of a high standard.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 10:24 PM
Mar 2022

It's been at the forefront of revelations about the UK government for quite a while now. It's also far from the only media outlet (along with individuals) that has been making similar reports.

However, having written what I did above, I have found some reports of Russian casualties being shipped around - notably not directly to Russia, but to Belarus:

In Homel, the regional capital, a laboratory for the city's main hospital was refitted earlier this month, with existing equipment being moved out and beds and other medical equipment being brought in, residents said.

Homel residents told RFE/RL that wounded Russian soldiers were being brought to three separate medical facilities in the city, including one specializing in cancer treatment.

A doctor at Mazyr's main city hospital told RFE/RL that the facility was now under guard by police and security agencies, and that doctors had been threatened with firing if they spoke about conditions. The doctor said that all physicians on staff, even those from more specialized professions, had been tasked with treating wounded Russians.

"There are not enough surgeons. Earlier, the corpses were transported by ambulances and loaded on Russian trains," the doctor said. "After someone made a video about it and it went on the Internet, the bodies were loaded at night so as not to attract attention."

At Hospital No. 4 in Homel, officials began to discharge current patients on March 1 in order to make room for wounded Russians, according to multiple residents whom RFE/RL spoke to. "There are so many wounded Russians there -- it's just a horror. Terribly disfigured. It is impossible to listen to their moans throughout the whole hospital," said one resident who was treated in the Homel hospital.

https://www.rferl.org/a/belarus-morgues-russian-soldiers/31760144.html


This bears out similar reports from other sources. (There's more at the link, but I've hit DU's paragraph limit for media quotes.)

I'd put it this way: we see videos of Zelensky almost every day visiting injured servicepeople and civilians in hospital - and this in war zones. I can't find any reports or evidence that Putin has done anything similar anywhere. If this invasion is such a heroic mission, you'd think he'd want to publicly laud the heroes - and their families.

Instead, we see scenes like this distraught mother of a young Russian conscript serving in Ukraine, who's terribly concerned for her son and herself in fear of the police while she's being interviewed on camera:




It's almost like Putin is ashamed of them all.

Sapient Donkey

(1,568 posts)
41. Back in December there was an article about new Russian regulations making mass burials quicker
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 10:46 PM
Mar 2022

Maybe it was covid related, but given how things are going I'm thinking they knew what they were up and they expected there be carnage.

https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-mass-burials-regulations/31619324.html

GB_RN

(2,347 posts)
26. Not The First Time I've Read They're Killing Their Own Wounded...
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:18 PM
Mar 2022

The reason being reported by the captured Russian troops is because of a lack of medical supplies to treat them in the field. Therefore, the officers are essentially performing "mercy killings".

The Russians are leaving their dead where they fall and the Ukrainians don't give a flying fuck about dead Russian troops at the moment, as they have bigger concerns on their hands than trying to pick up and bury dead enemy bodies.

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
16. I saw a report that pilots of stricken are ejecting but no parachutes open
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 04:38 PM
Mar 2022

Not a single pilot has been captured.

colorado_ufo

(5,733 posts)
20. I think one was, early on.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:00 PM
Mar 2022

I saw a video where the plane went down, and a voice said that the pilot ejected. Next part of the clip, they show them finding the helmet and said that later the pilot was found.

Mr.Bill

(24,274 posts)
17. When I saw/heard about the portable
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 04:50 PM
Mar 2022

crematoriums the first thing I thought was they could cremate their dead and report them as having deserted or just MIA.

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
23. He's wearing the light blue striped telnyashka of an elite unit
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:07 PM
Mar 2022

He may have been part of a Spetsnaz battalion or similar.

He’s not a conscript. He’s a professional soldier and the likelihood of swapping him is zero. The Ukrainians would never return such a trained pro to the other side. That’s why this guy wants his wife to try to pressure the Russian side to advocate for him.

Newsflash! He’s not going back to Russia anytime soon

Response to Arazi (Reply #23)

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
32. Naval Infantry wear the telnyashka too and there's rumors they're on ships
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:55 PM
Mar 2022

In the Black Sea near Odesa. If Putin is getting short on troops (and I think he is), it’s not inconceivable Naval Infantry is pulled into the fight before they attempt to take Odesa.

It would be super stupid to thin the Naval ranks but jayzus, who the fuck knows anymore.

Response to Arazi (Reply #32)

bobacatt

(23 posts)
38. I wish I understood military troop numbers better
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 09:51 PM
Mar 2022

According to Wiki, Russia has a military of like 1.2 million active members. I’m guessing that maybe 3/4 are in support positions (cooks and clerks, etc). Of the actual fighters, maybe only 2/3 can be deployed to Ukraine due to others protecting Russia’s borders etc.

But that’s still about 200,000 soldiers. Even if 15K have already died, that’s a drop in the bucket.

Response to bobacatt (Reply #38)

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
28. This may not be popular but releasing this video was a violation of the Geneva Convention.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 05:45 PM
Mar 2022

GENEVA CONVENTION RELATIVE TO THE TREATMENT OF PRISONERS OF WAR OF 12 AUGUST 1949

Article 13:

Likewise, prisoners of war must at all times be protected, particularly against acts of violence or intimidation and against insults and public curiosity. (Emphasis added.)


The world rightly accuses Russia of war crimes - and there are many and far more serious - but using enemy prisoners of war for propaganda purposes is a violation.

Response to TomSlick (Reply #28)

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
34. There is no justification for this violation. It is an obvious use of EPWs for propaganda.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 06:17 PM
Mar 2022

I get it, this violation pales in comparison to Russia's more serious war crimes. However, Ukraine should be scrupulous in its compliance with the Law of War to make the comparison with Putin all the more clear.

bobacatt

(23 posts)
39. Well, that's the high road
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 09:56 PM
Mar 2022

But I can’t help thinking that if this video could trend on Russian social media, it would help stir outrage against the war and calls for a speedy peace.

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
44. Taking the high road is what is required by international law
Sun Mar 20, 2022, 02:41 PM
Mar 2022

It is always the case that the purpose of propaganda is to stir up the public. The ends do not justify the means.

harumph

(1,897 posts)
42. IMO, the asymmetry of power in this case makes this particular rule moot.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 11:07 PM
Mar 2022

Putin is literally risking all of our lives. What he's doing is so batshit insane and cruel.
So my response to the constant reminders
that filming Russian POWs is against the rules, is... so what?
Murder is wrong too.

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
35. I have no doubt the Russians are committing war crimes.
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 06:28 PM
Mar 2022

I very much suspect the "Ukrainian militants" this goon detained were not humanly treated. Nevertheless, one side of a conflict committing war crimes does justify the other side doing so.

These Russian goons did not appear to be military. I am concerned they may be members of the Russian MVD.

WarGamer

(12,427 posts)
45. The Russians in uniform didn't appear to be military?
Sun Mar 20, 2022, 02:55 PM
Mar 2022

Or those civilians they were frisking? The civilians were Ukrainian citizens deemed to be citizens of Mariupol and not UKR soldiers.

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
46. The goon doing the talking at the first did not appear to be in a uniform.
Sun Mar 20, 2022, 08:00 PM
Mar 2022

The other goons' uniforms didn't "look right." I suspect they are MVD.

WarGamer

(12,427 posts)
47. The guy talking, in the red sweater is Ukrainian.
Mon Mar 21, 2022, 05:39 PM
Mar 2022

He's a civilian stopped by the RU military and asked to show their body to check for tattoos.

TomSlick

(11,096 posts)
48. Having re-watched, you appear to be correct.
Mon Mar 21, 2022, 07:47 PM
Mar 2022

I was confused by his justification for the searches for tats.

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