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Soph0571

(9,685 posts)
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:03 PM Mar 2022

"If Clarence Thomas doesn't resign when will impeachment proceedings against him begin?"




A lot of people in the media are asking "Should Clarence Thomas recuse himself?" (Whether or not the answer to that is "Yes," he won't.) But that's the wrong question. The right one is this: "If Clarence Thomas doesn't resign when will impeachment proceedings against him begin?"


Exactly this
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"If Clarence Thomas doesn't resign when will impeachment proceedings against him begin?" (Original Post) Soph0571 Mar 2022 OP
Thy should begin to get this in the history books. Gore1FL Mar 2022 #1
It wouldn't be, sadly. Ocelot II Mar 2022 #2
Two weeks from never n/t Polybius Mar 2022 #3
Exactly! mucifer Mar 2022 #5
You mean right after Trump's indictment? dem4decades Mar 2022 #7
I was thinking the second Tuesday of next week, but... Wounded Bear Mar 2022 #19
Probably wishful thinking Polybius Mar 2022 #25
This message was self-deleted by its author YoshidaYui Mar 2022 #4
Everyone's in a high dudgeon today. maxsolomon Mar 2022 #6
Doesn't matter. Just keep repeating it over and over and make it stick to him. Midnight Writer Mar 2022 #12
impeachment Slammer Mar 2022 #40
We don't have the 68-70 Dem senators required to convict. JustABozoOnThisBus Mar 2022 #8
Ultimately we all fight a losing battle. In the meantime, I don't advocate sitting on one's hands Tetrachloride Mar 2022 #10
Do useful things to increase the number of Democrats elected...not waste time on impeachement Demsrule86 Mar 2022 #53
Were the impeachments of tfg pointless? crickets Mar 2022 #14
I don't feel it was pointless. At least history will show that he was twice impeached even though totodeinhere Mar 2022 #16
True, but it's not about trying to hurt someone politically. crickets Mar 2022 #22
No because 1) Trump was about to run for reelection and 2) he is still able to run for reelection. Scar Tissue Mar 2022 #34
How did it help us exactly? I am against any impeachment unless you have the votes in the Senate. Demsrule86 Mar 2022 #54
He should recuse, from any proceedings before the Court involving his wife elleng Mar 2022 #9
He should have been impeached in 2011 for failing to disclose $600,000 dollars of his wife's income. Hassin Bin Sober Mar 2022 #49
Lol! Come on! Why would we think this will happen? Scrivener7 Mar 2022 #11
The House doesn't have the votes Zeitghost Mar 2022 #13
If it's a party line vote the House would have the votes. totodeinhere Mar 2022 #18
At this point... Zeitghost Mar 2022 #20
I understand but remember it doesn't have to be a crime. totodeinhere Mar 2022 #29
I think the lame duck period after the midterms would be the perfect time for a quick impeachment Fiendish Thingy Mar 2022 #15
Thomas must resign, period. fightforfreedom Mar 2022 #17
Wait!!! MarineCombatEngineer Mar 2022 #24
What credibility? IronLionZion Mar 2022 #37
Damn right Hekate Mar 2022 #21
Not to worry about about all of the nay sayers, because this is just multigraincracker Mar 2022 #23
"Jan. 6 committee members are discussing privately whether to demand that Ginni Thomas cooperate" L. Coyote Mar 2022 #26
+1 TeamProg Mar 2022 #27
As long as we're stuck with an antiquated Constitution that fails to adequately address malfeasance Mr. Ected Mar 2022 #28
Barbara Boxer made a good point. He should be impeached in order to organize and investigate Karadeniz Mar 2022 #30
We know he has been in trouble with the IRS before with unreported income. However, Demsrule86 Mar 2022 #55
Never budkin Mar 2022 #31
This message was self-deleted by its author Chin music Mar 2022 #32
I'll leave it up to Pelosi, Schumer and Biden if or when Kaleva Mar 2022 #33
K & R & Retweeted! SunSeeker Mar 2022 #35
It would be like trump. DownriverDem Mar 2022 #36
Not happening Rebl2 Mar 2022 #38
Even if there weren't the votes to remove him... AdamGG Mar 2022 #39
Unfortunately never Meowmee Mar 2022 #41
Neither. mysteryowl Mar 2022 #42
This has nothing to do with corruption. There are really no rules for SCOTUS because it was Demsrule86 Mar 2022 #48
I am not alone using the term "corruption..." mysteryowl Mar 2022 #50
Hey, I hate the guy. I wish we could get rid of him...should never have been put on the bench and Demsrule86 Mar 2022 #56
It is so pathetic we can't remove him. He should remove himself! mysteryowl Mar 2022 #57
I think it was that, but also they did not intend SCOTUS to have the power it does. NYC Liberal Mar 2022 #51
No, unless hard evidence is discovered. Kablooie Mar 2022 #43
We still tilting at impeachment windmills? BGBD Mar 2022 #44
Right now we have the House, Senate, and White House Cosmo Blues Mar 2022 #45
On the 4th of Never. BannonsLiver Mar 2022 #46
When we have 66 votes in the Senate... this is an election year and there is no point in impeaching Demsrule86 Mar 2022 #47
Never... Raine Mar 2022 #52

Gore1FL

(21,130 posts)
1. Thy should begin to get this in the history books.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:05 PM
Mar 2022

I don't have any confidence the removal would be successful, however.

Ocelot II

(115,683 posts)
2. It wouldn't be, sadly.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:07 PM
Mar 2022

Just as with a president, conviction requires a 2/3 vote in the Senate, and that's not happening.

Response to Soph0571 (Original post)

maxsolomon

(33,327 posts)
6. Everyone's in a high dudgeon today.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:09 PM
Mar 2022

Impeach him for what? Failure to recuse?

Does Mary Trump think that Pelosi and the House leadership have any desire to take that on now? The J6 hearings are coming up, and they're still trying to find something Manchin will allow in a reconciliation bill.

Midnight Writer

(21,753 posts)
12. Doesn't matter. Just keep repeating it over and over and make it stick to him.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:34 PM
Mar 2022

Remember "Lock her Up!"?

Lock her up for what? Didn't matter. For the rest of her life the "Lock Her Up!" and "Crooked Hillary" tag will be the first thing many people think of when they hear her name.

They do it to our good people every day.

Why shouldn't we give it back to them?

For the rest of his life, Thomas should be labeled as the crooked Judge every time his name comes up.

Every appearance, interview, paid speaking event, he should be met with signs, chants, questions about his impeachment.

My, I'm in a high dudgeon today, aren't I?

Slammer

(714 posts)
40. impeachment
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 08:50 PM
Mar 2022

Yeah, he's got to do something worthy of impeachment, something that's not simply "following Supreme Court rules for justices as they currently exist".

His wife has a right to be a political activist.

Even if she crossed the line into being a political terrorist instead, that still wouldn't be an impeachable offense against him.

The Supreme Court has no existing set of ethical guidelines which it must follow. Each justice chooses for himself or herself whether they should recuse themselves or not.

A justice could literally be a plaintiff or a defendant in a case in front of the court and it would still be completely up to that justice whether to recuse himself.

We live in a mad, mad, mad, mad world.

If we'd wanted to install a code of ethics for the Supreme Court, we had effectively decades of control of the court in which to have done it...but deliberately chose not to.

====

As for impeaching him without any basis "just because" or in retaliation for being butt-hurt over something else, that's a terrible idea.

Bill Clinton got impeached because he was involved in business with some sleazy people who ended up going to jail over it. That was objectively bad judgement on Clinton's part. And at one point Clinton as governor vetoed a bill which would have stopped his partners' main way of ripping people off (Selling land without making the purchase agreement allow the purchaser to accumulate equity though payments over time. Foreclosing after getting a couple of years of payments whenever the purchaser was a little late. Then selling the property to the next sucker to come along. All profit and selling the same lots of land over and over.) What Clinton directly took part in might not have been illegal. But some of the things his business partners did went beyond "unethical" into "illegal".

You can make an argument for an investigation into a president (of either party) who has such shady business partners. I can't think of any valid arguments in favor of the government ignoring possible wrongdoing and not looking into it.

And the House's legal counsel (title?) at the time (a Democrat) looking through the Starr Report listed 13 (or 14) impeachable offenses out of the contents of that report. (I had a link to the legal counsel's list six or seven computers ago.) The House Republicans chose to look at four of the possible impeachable offenses and to impeach on two of them, without conducting investigation or calling witnesses.

The Senate Republicans chose to not have an investigation or witnesses. They also chose not to look at any of the other possible offenses though it was entirely their right to do so. And they chose to hurry up and finish their trial because the rape allegation against Clinton was going to go public on Sunday and the Republicans had no desire to get public pressure into looking into rape allegations.

In my opinion, the Republicans had no intention of finding Clinton guilty of anything. They certainly didn't try very hard to find him guilty of anything. They used the impeachment to try to damage the Democrats politically but didn't want the Democrats to be able to put it behind them by having VP Gore to take over "after Clinton left office in disgrace".

====

We chose not to impeach Trump over things which were proven, admitted, and were constitutionally a slam dunk because they were mundane items rather than being the sexiest things we could have tried to have nailed him for.

We could have impeached Trump, with valid evidence that was already in the hands of the government with no need of an investigation, in February 2017. But we didn't because nailing him for doing something rather mundane but completely unconstitutional (like receiving money from selling things to the government) wasn't sexy enough.

So we waited for the next impeachable thing to happen. And when that wasn't sexy enough, we waited for the next thing. And the next. And the next. And the next, all the while with him getting away with illegal things and becoming bolder in breaking the law because from his point of view "no one dared to hold him accountable" and from our point of view "this violation isn't quite sexy enough yet to give me complete satisfaction over nailing him".

(I've heard that syndrome referred to as "The Danger of Doing Cool Things" where people go after the impressive and flashy rather than the effective because they're more concerned with being impressive than being effective. The opposite of that was the FBI finally nailing Al Capone on tax fraud because he didn't explain his income and didn't end up nailing him for the murders and crime sprees which most everyone thought he was guilty of but couldn't quite prove.)

And that refusal to impeach Trump for things he was guilty of left him in position to commit his two big impeachable defenses. And left Republicans still willing to stand beside him rather than throwing him under the bus for the justification of "Trump just can't avoid publicly committing impeachable offenses so it's better to have Pence".

Even now, we find things in the news that are clear violations of law and I bring up, "Prosecute him and put him in jail now because sitting in jail will break his political power now", I get pushback from well-meaning Democrats who would rather nail him for everything he ever did and risk losing the country (by the delay that would entail) than to have him sitting safely in jail.

It's The Danger of Doing Cool Things.

====

I think if we could talk to one of the signers of the Constitution and tell them that we weren't impeaching a justice, high-ranking federal judge, or a president every thirty years or so that he'd think to himself, "Either every American has become a saint...or people don't understand the intended role of impeachment at all".

Do we want to have impeachment as a tool to deal with Donald Trump, Don Jr., Eric, or Ivanka next time one of them becomes a high government official?

If we do, we can't use it inappropriately to harass Justice Thomas now.

We couldn't win impeachment in the House right now even with a majority of Democrats there because there's too many Democrats who understand and honor the Constitution and wouldn't be part of using a knowingly-fake impeachment charge as a harassment tactic.

If we were to try, not only would the attempt fail but it would make it much, much harder to hold real criminals who are in office accountable for their actions.

And at some point we are going to have more criminals in office who we need to hold accountable for their actions.

/rant

JustABozoOnThisBus

(23,339 posts)
8. We don't have the 68-70 Dem senators required to convict.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:12 PM
Mar 2022

Impeachment proceedings would be entertaining, but pointless.

Demsrule86

(68,556 posts)
53. Do useful things to increase the number of Democrats elected...not waste time on impeachement
Mon Mar 28, 2022, 01:32 PM
Mar 2022

when conviction is not possible in the Senate.

crickets

(25,969 posts)
14. Were the impeachments of tfg pointless?
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:44 PM
Mar 2022

I'd say not. Even though conviction was not likely, the effort was required and made.

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
16. I don't feel it was pointless. At least history will show that he was twice impeached even though
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:49 PM
Mar 2022

not convicted. But it doesn't seem to have hurt him politically. Biden's approval rating is no higher than Trump's was at an equivalent point in his presidency according to at least one poll.

https://www.newsweek.com/biden-trump-identical-rating-same-point-presidency-1689201

crickets

(25,969 posts)
22. True, but it's not about trying to hurt someone politically.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 07:04 PM
Mar 2022

It's about doing the right thing. It may take a while, but history will judge harshly that Republicans put party above country and refused to convict a president who was clearly guilty. Twice. Among the reasons for tfg's public opinion ratings are constant social media bombardment by Russian bot farms as well as the fawning of our own 'news' media.

Biden's approval rating has nothing to do with any of this, but the reasons for it are similar: our own media undercuts him daily, and makes a point of ignoring his successes. Most people hear what they want to hear and judge accordingly.

 

Scar Tissue

(9 posts)
34. No because 1) Trump was about to run for reelection and 2) he is still able to run for reelection.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 07:55 PM
Mar 2022

I would say impeaching him both times absolutely impacts his ability to run. It doesn't end it - and he can still win - but it does have an impact. How could it not?

Impeaching Thomas without removal has no ramifications whatsoever on him. Even if Americans turn against him, he can still continue doing what he's doing as his position is a lifetime appointment. When dealing with a position that doesn't have to report directly to the American people, impeachment without removal is toothless and pointless.

elleng

(130,895 posts)
9. He should recuse, from any proceedings before the Court involving his wife
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:15 PM
Mar 2022

and her 'friends,' but there is no basis for resignation or impeachment within S. Ct. rules.

Hassin Bin Sober

(26,326 posts)
49. He should have been impeached in 2011 for failing to disclose $600,000 dollars of his wife's income.
Sat Mar 26, 2022, 06:42 PM
Mar 2022



https://www.politico.com/story/2011/01/thomas-revises-disclosure-forms-048086

Last week, watchdog group Common Cause reported that none of the nearly $690,000 the Heritage Foundation said it had paid Ginni Thomas between 2003 and 2007 had been reported on Justice Thomas’s annual financial disclosure forms.

In a statement Monday, the group said did not believe Thomas’s explanation.

“Justice Thomas sits on the highest court of the land, is called upon daily to understand and interpret the most complicated legal issues of our day and makes decisions that affect millions,” said Bob Edgar, Common Cause’s president. “It is hard to see how he could have misunderstood the simple directions of a federal disclosure form. We find his excuse is implausible.

Scrivener7

(50,949 posts)
11. Lol! Come on! Why would we think this will happen?
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:26 PM
Mar 2022

Of course it should happen. Yesterday. But it won't.

Zeitghost

(3,858 posts)
13. The House doesn't have the votes
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:40 PM
Mar 2022

to impeach and the Senate has even fewer that would convict.

Trying and failing badly this close to the midterms would be disastrous, especially with no evidence of an actual high crime or misdemeanor.

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
18. If it's a party line vote the House would have the votes.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:51 PM
Mar 2022

But of course as you said the Senate is a dead end.

Zeitghost

(3,858 posts)
20. At this point...
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 06:56 PM
Mar 2022

We wouldn't come close in the House, especially before the mid terms. There is no evidence of any crime and without that, it's a non-starter in the House.

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
29. I understand but remember it doesn't have to be a crime.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 07:21 PM
Mar 2022

The House has the power to impeach him for any reason or even no reason at all.

multigraincracker

(32,674 posts)
23. Not to worry about about all of the nay sayers, because this is just
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 07:07 PM
Mar 2022

the begging of what we will find out about him and the Mrs. Lots more to come out, so stay tuned in.

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
28. As long as we're stuck with an antiquated Constitution that fails to adequately address malfeasance
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 07:19 PM
Mar 2022

At the highest level of government, a system that permits suggestions but little in the manner of prescription, we are limited in our jurisprudence. The boundless dearth of ethics on the right was not a concept entertained in the 18th century but without them, a self-policing judiciary could pose an existential threat to our democracy.

Karadeniz

(22,513 posts)
30. Barbara Boxer made a good point. He should be impeached in order to organize and investigate
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 07:27 PM
Mar 2022

all his conflicts of interest. I think he also failed to report income.

Demsrule86

(68,556 posts)
55. We know he has been in trouble with the IRS before with unreported income. However,
Mon Mar 28, 2022, 01:34 PM
Mar 2022

there is no way to remove him short of a successful impeachment in the House and a successful conviction in the Senate.

Response to Soph0571 (Original post)

AdamGG

(1,291 posts)
39. Even if there weren't the votes to remove him...
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 08:48 PM
Mar 2022

I'd at least get to hear him babble about a high tech lynching again to bookend his "career".

Meowmee

(5,164 posts)
41. Unfortunately never
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 08:51 PM
Mar 2022

The only way he goes is if dies or becomes totally incapacitated, my prediction. Senate would never remove/ convict him even if he were impeached.

mysteryowl

(7,383 posts)
42. Neither.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 08:54 PM
Mar 2022

I am getting very cynical that there is no justice in our branches of government.
Maybe the corruption and anti-American is too thick and deep.

Demsrule86

(68,556 posts)
48. This has nothing to do with corruption. There are really no rules for SCOTUS because it was
Sat Mar 26, 2022, 06:38 PM
Mar 2022

expect by our founders that honorable men would-be judges and Senators...and sadly Republicans are not honorable.

mysteryowl

(7,383 posts)
50. I am not alone using the term "corruption..."
Mon Mar 28, 2022, 12:52 PM
Mar 2022
https://democraticunderground.com/100216534938

Definition:
"Lack of integrity or honesty (especially susceptibility to bribery); use of a position of trust for dishonest gain"

I do know what you are getting at though.

Demsrule86

(68,556 posts)
56. Hey, I hate the guy. I wish we could get rid of him...should never have been put on the bench and
Mon Mar 28, 2022, 01:37 PM
Mar 2022

I think he is corrupt as hell...but there is no way to get rid of him except through impeachment and conviction...and I think impeachment would hurt us politically when there can be no conviction. Poll after poll show voters are sick of 'politics'.

NYC Liberal

(20,135 posts)
51. I think it was that, but also they did not intend SCOTUS to have the power it does.
Mon Mar 28, 2022, 01:01 PM
Mar 2022

It assumed the power of judicial review for itself based on its own interpretation of the Constitution. Judicial review is why SCOTUS is so powerful. And both checks on the court — impeachment or amending the constitution — have very high bars. No other checks have that high of a bar.

If the founders had intended judicial review to be a power, I think they would have either made those checks easier or structured the court differently.

Kablooie

(18,632 posts)
43. No, unless hard evidence is discovered.
Fri Mar 25, 2022, 08:56 PM
Mar 2022

To say it's likely his wife's politics influenced his decisions isn't enough.
There must be hard proof and I don't expect that to emerge.

So this too will pass ... with no consequences for Republicans as always.

Cosmo Blues

(2,481 posts)
45. Right now we have the House, Senate, and White House
Sat Mar 26, 2022, 05:56 PM
Mar 2022

For the 6th year in 42 years. It would take 60 Republican House members and 18 Republican Senators, to join with us to oust a member of the Supreme Court. Our time is better spent doing things we might be able to get done

Demsrule86

(68,556 posts)
47. When we have 66 votes in the Senate... this is an election year and there is no point in impeaching
Sat Mar 26, 2022, 06:36 PM
Mar 2022

without a Senate willing to convict.

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