And so it begins... Our local McDonalds is selling plant-based burgers.

[hunter]

Someday soon, I predict, these burgers will cost less than beef burgers and most customers will actually prefer them.

This will be good for the natural environment.

I'm not a vegan and I don't believe it's inherently unethical to eat meat and dairy products. I've hunted, I've fished, I've eaten animals I've seen alive. We feed our dogs kibble made from meat.

Yet I know industrial scale meat production is bad for the environment, bad for the people who work in the giant slaughterhouses, and bad for the animals raised in cruel conditions.

It would be a better world if all our beef came from cows, cattle, and bison raised humanely on carefully managed ranges. But that sort of beef is expensive and there's not enough of it to go around. Plant based hamburger can fill that void.

I'm reminded of a clip by Melanie:

Melanie says she was a vegetarian until she was driving past some fast food places one day and had a sudden craving for a hamburger...

My wife is a vegetarian-approaching-vegan and whenever she gets a craving for a hamburger we've been stopping buy Burger King for their Impossible Burgers.

It's little things like tasty plant based hamburgers that make me optimistic about the future.

[USALiberal]

1. +1000 Nt

[ProfessorGAC]

2. Same Here!

I saw it up on their message sign earlier this week.
Also, I found the impossible whopper to be quite tasty.

[MustLoveBeagles]

16. I love the Impossible Whopper

[ColinC]

3. Great post!!

Thank you

[MLAA]

4. Yeah! I'll try it Monday!

Great post. Been vegan for 10 years. Got husband about 95% there. Good for the planet and great for the animals 🙂. Thanks!

[orwell]

5. As someone who has worked in a meat plant one summer...

...thank you for this post.

All I can say is working in a meat plant would turn more people into vegetarians...

[themaguffin]

6. I can't do sodium patties. In fact, there should be just as much pressure on the sodium and sugar in

fast food and food in general. It's insane and linked to so many health issues.

[Xavier Breath]

10. Reminds me of the sodium/fat conundrum.

We don't eat an excess of snack foods, but I do like a little something on occasion. Given health concerns I try to avoid fat, sugar and sodium. The problem is, if you attempt to buy low-sodium or low-sugar food, you'll find they increased the fat content. If you attempt to buy a low-fat food, that will contain more sodium/sugar.

[hunter]

14. I didn't claim it was healthy...

Nobody orders a burger, fries, and a soft drink for their health... vegetarian, vegan, or not.

At home I use a lot of lentils, brown rice, Cruciferae, nuts, and olive oil in my cooking.

[Raine]

7. Yes! 🙂 👍 nt

[jimfields33]

8. I like impossible burgers

But I need to have steak. If they make an impossible steak. That’d be pretty awesome.

[ProfessorGAC]

17. Definitely!

I'd try a plant based steak, for sure!
I checked Impossible Foods website & all their products are ground.
Sausages, meatballs (so to speak), chicken nuggets, and ground beef & pork.
They did a nice job on the website, too. Everything looks very appetizing.

[jimfields33]

23. I'm going to check it out.

I’m sure over time, they will expand. Thanks!

[shrike3]

19. I don't care for them.

But that's me. I agree it would behoove us all to eat less meat.

[Vinca]

9. I prefer veggie burgers to regular burgers and I'm not a vegetarian. They

taste every bit as good and, to me, the texture is more palatable.

[Wounded Bear]

11. Took them long enough...

I've had the Impossible Burger from BK a couple of times and it's pretty edible.

[Baked Potato]

12. Impossible Burgers are tasty. Nt

[LastDemocratInSC]

13. Gardein brand plant based B'ef Burger.

Not expensive. They offer a complete line of products. I've tried most brands and these are quite good.

[CrispyQ]

15. We love Gardein!

Although I'm not sure I've seen the B'ef Burger. I'll look for it. We get the black bean burger, the fish fillets, the chic'n tenders, & the Italian sausages.

[GenThePerservering]

18. I've been getting impossible burgers at Costco

Get the frozen bag of 18 patties (I think it's 18). They're very tasty. You need a tad more oil to fry them up, though - I'm going to try baking one.

[FreeState]

31. These are my go to too

I never add oil though.

I use the paddies for a lot of things - ground beef for tacos/spaghetti, hamburgers etc.

I really like Morning Star sausage and beyond burgers sausage (I hate their burgers, they taste the same in everything unlike impossible burger).

Impossible is working on milk too. Can’t wait to try it for baking. https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/10/20/business/impossible-foods-milk/index.html

[HAB911]

20. Try smoking them

Don't grill them, put them off the heat and smoke for an hour or so. We don't eat dead cows anymore. I do however have leather interior in my cars, lol.

[hunter]

68. That sounds interesting, I'm going to try it.

I cook a lot of meat that way.

We haven't had any big family barbecues for a long time because of Covid-19.

[HAB911]

71. They cook too fast to grill

and release a lot of oil, so will flare up quickly

we try to also put some of the Beyond breakfast sausage patties on at the same time to maximize the use of the fire

[BlackSkimmer]

21. I'd be scared to know what might be in those "plant-based" burgers.

[womanofthehills]

24. Supposedly lots of glyphosate in Impossible Burger

Give me a grass fed/grass finished burger anytime. I would think grass fed beef is healthier than processed burgers made with GMO peas/soy and sprayed with glyphosate. If you are going to eat processed foods better to pick Beyond Beef over Impossible Burger.

Moms of America tests foods for glyphosate levels.

GMO Impossible Burger Tests 11X Higher for Glyphosate Weed Killer Residue than Beyond Meat Burger


https://www.momsacrossamerica.com/gmo_impossible_burger_positive_for_carcinogenic_glyphosate

[FreeState]

33. Interesting site

Do you know if they have done the studies on the foods they are comparing them too (e.g. grass fed beef? I can’t find anything on their site).

Edit to add this group appears to be no better at science than Dr Oz.

The group was founded as an informal organization in 2013 by now executive director Zen Honeycutt and Kathleen Hallal. The group organizes protests, marches and social media protests against pesticides and crop biotechnology. MAAM also sells products via its online Health Solutions Store, including Restore that supposedly boosts “gut health” and molecular hydrogen, which is promoted as a general health panacea. Scientists consider both quack products.

https://geneticliteracyproject.org/glp-facts/moms-across-america-consumer-group-promotes-health-scares-targets-gmos-chemicals/

[Celerity]

38. they are anti-vaxxer nutters

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100216531758#post37

[FreeState]

39. Thanks - I figured something was off n/t

[Celerity]

37. Moms Across America are anti-vaxxer crackpots

CBS Los Angeles Discusses GMOs with Anti-Vaxxer Zen Honeycutt

KCAL9, the CBS affiliate in Los Angeles, invited conspiracy theorist Zen Honeycutt -- an anti-GMO, anti-vaccine, conspiracy-mongering snake oil saleswoman and founder of Moms Across America -- to discuss children's health.

https://www.acsh.org/news/2020/01/13/cbs-los-angeles-discusses-gmos-anti-vaxxer-zen-honeycutt-14503

SETTING THE RECORD STRAIGHT: HOW “MOMS ACROSS AMERICA” LIES TO PROMOTE A DANGEROUS, FUNDAMENTALIST AGENDA

https://impossiblefoods.com/blog/setting-the-record-straight-how-moms-across-america-lies-to-promote-a.html

“Moms Across America” has escalated a year-long campaign against Impossible Foods to push its anti-vaccine, anti-GMO agenda to anyone gullible enough to listen. The group’s latest salvo is a pathetic “news release” full of lies, anti-science rhetoric and ignorance of basic arithmetic.

Please read our comprehensive rebuttal of the latest MAA attack against Impossible Foods here.

MAA classifies itself as a non-profit, but make no mistake: This outfit is a supplement-pushing e-commerce company that collects and sells consumer data, funded by the sale of utterly ridiculous products such as $60 bottles of “hydrogen water,” coal extracts and other junk. By MAA’s own admission, it gets a commission on sales of supplements from other affiliates — and none of the products it pushes has been evaluated or approved by the US Food and Drug Administration or any other governmental authority. (The FDA confirmed last year it has no questions about the safety of Impossible Foods’ key ingredient.)

It’s sad, but perhaps not surprising, that MAA keeps trying to trash Impossible Foods. MAA’s goal is to eliminate genetic engineering, as well as the vaccines and insulin made using GE technology — while pushing quack products via its marketing and e-commerce site and affiliates. By contrast, Impossible Foods’ goal is to transform the global food system, improve public health and preserve biodiversity — with an approach rooted in science, consumer choice and transparency.

Don’t amplify ridiculous propaganda from charlatans. Don’t buy into quackery.

If you’d like a deeper understanding of Impossible Foods, you’re in the right place. We’re here to answer any and all questions about the extraordinary safety record of our key ingredient, our awesome use of genetic engineering, and our mission to eliminate animal agriculture — and more. After you digest all that info, we’re sure you’ll want to find the closest place to score an Impossible Burger.

[progressoid]

57. + 1 gazillion

[BlackSkimmer]

47. Yuck, well I've got no cow in this fight lol. I can't remember the last time I ate fast food.

Used to enjoy an occasional road trip stop at a fast food joint, but I find their food just vile now.

Doesn’t matter what chain. I think it was Burger King some years ago, and it was inedible.

[flvegan]

54. LOL n/t

[Celerity]

22. Macdonalds has been selling plant based burgers in certain nations for around 30 years, 22 in the US

https://www.motherjones.com/environment/2013/12/history-fake-meat/

1994:
UK-based Quorn introduces fake meat made of Fusarium venenatum.

1995:
A struggling vegetarian food manufacturer called Turtle Island Foods sells 500 Tofurky Roasts. By 2012, 3 million have been sold.

1998:
Gardenburger sees sales surge after it airs a 30-second, $1.5 million animated commercial featuring the voice of Samuel L. Jackson during the Seinfeld finale.

1999:
Boca Burger ratchets up ad spending from $500,000 to $4 million; Worthington Foods (which acquired Loma Linda) pours $5 million to promote its FriPats and Choplets. Gardenburger boosts spending to $18.2 million.

Burger King introduces the BK Veggie Burger. McDonald’s, which sold nonmeat burgers in the United Kingdom, Netherlands, and India throughout the ’90s, launches a US version the following year.

2002:
Quorn hits US shelves. The American Mushroom Institute complains that fusarium is not in fact a mushroom. Quorn later removes the phrase “mushroom in origin” from its packaging.

[hunter]

35. I've never seen any of those on the drive-up menu. This plant based burger was headlined...

...to me, of all people, driving my cowboy truck.

[druidity33]

41. I despise mushrooms... but love Quorn...

I first had it in the UK in 1993. Loved it. Searched for it for years here in the US. It finally became readily available here in the early aughts. I have been trying to source it for the commercial kitchen i work in. Mostly we use tempeh and tofu.

[BlackSkimmer]

48. "Fusarium venanatum". Eek.

That even sounds horrid.

[Celerity]

49. Quorn is huge here in Sweden. It is quite good.

[LeftInTX]

58. Fungus amongus..LOL

Fusarium is a soil born fungus that causes damping off of seedlings

[Emile]

25. I ate a veggie burger once and it was awful!

[LeftInTX]

59. There is alot of variation

I liked the impossible whopper.

Of course, there's lots of lettuce, tomatoes and condiments, so you can't tell that it's plant based

[LongtimeAZDem]

26. I'm a transitive vegetarian /nt

[bif]

27. Beyond Meat burgers are excellent!

And unlike Impossible Burgers, they're totally non GMO.

[Ms. Toad]

28. Not likely.

Every vegetarian or vegan restaurant I know of that tries to imitate meat - rather than exploiting the veggies characteristics - has failed. The one I know which started (and thrived for years) providing real vegetarian meals failed within a year of offering pretend meat.

If what you really want is meat, fake meat won't be an adequate substitute.

If what you want is vegetarian, fake meat is somewhere betweeen pointless, disappointing, and disgusting.

[hunter]

36. Is there anything on the McDonald's menu that pretends to be fine cuisine?

Even their oatmeal is a little off...

Nobody stops at McDonald's for fine beef, chicken, fish, or vegetarian fare.

I use fake meat in my own cooking occasionally when I don't want to bother cooking separate meals for everyone. About half my extended family is vegan or vegetarian.

Curiously it's the bacon cult who are most militant about these things. I rarely buy any kind of pork, not more than once or twice a year for larger gatherings of friends and family, mostly for the older people who expect it.

One of my grandfathers ate bacon for breakfast every morning, with eggs fried in the grease, and that may have knocked a few years off his life.

[Ms. Toad]

40. It's not a matter of fine cuisine.

It's a matter of human nature.

People who want meat won't be satisfied by fake meat (whether McDonald's, or a $100/plate restaurant).

People who are eating vegetarian or vegan because of preference are not likely to even order something made out of vegetables which pretends to be meat. That's pretty much the most boring way to eat veggies. I do eat some meat - but mostly prefer vegetarian meals. Not a chance I'm going to order fake meat in McDonald's. I'll order real meat - or a salad.

As for food being prepared for family and friends - I prepare foods which don't pretend to be meat for everyone. I pretty much do that whenever I'm cooking for a crowd because cooking vegan/gluten free is pretty much the only way to be inclusive to the most people. And I won't cook somethng (i.e. fake meat) that I wouldn't enjoy eating myself. If, on the other hand, I was vegetarian guest, I wouldn't complain if someone believed they were being kind by serving me fake meat.

So you're not (McDonald's is not) going to convert people to eating vegetarian with fake meat.

[hunter]

43. People will eat plant burgers for all sorts of reasons.

Maybe they don't think cows should be killed for their meat.

Maybe they want to reduce their environmental footprint.

Maybe they are thinking about abusive slaughterhouse work.

Maybe they are just trying to impress a new romantic partner.

And from my own personal experience, the Impossible and Beyond Meat burgers served by fast food places taste pretty close to the "real thing." Some people might even like them better.

I'm not any kind of food purist. Sometimes you just want something you can scarf down quickly between jobs. Which is how I ended up in the drive-through in the first place.

[Ms. Toad]

45. There are lots of things you can scarf down quickly that aren't meat.

And there's a difference between things which go in sandwiches which aren't pretending to be meat (e.g.. veggie burgers which focus on the flavor of the ingredients (spicy black bean burger, or falafel patties or balls - as one example) but are made in a convenient patty form to make it a convenient sandwich which can be "snarfed down quickly" - and trying to make veggies taste, feel, etc like meat (e.g. Impossible and Beyond Meat burgers or Gardein chick'n).

If I'm going to eat meat, I'll eat meat - not something pretending to be meat.

[Hortensis]

64. I know what you mean, though like to think fake meat's getting

acceptable and that we'll end up routinely eating it for some dishes at least. We like vegetables nicely cooked and those are what we turn to for meatless meals. Frankly, so far we've been letting other consumers bring fake meat through the trial and improve period. The appeal of fast food is limited to begin with, except for French fries.

Reminds me, though, of when our daughter was admitted to a hospital with a famously awful vegan kitchen. My husband had to bring food or I would have starved. I'd expected some trays of simple vegetables would be available, there weren't any. The dishes were all styled as meat favorites, like fake beef stroganoff and breaded chicken under fake chicken gravy, created from ruined vegetables and veggie products. The only decent offering was a bin of "dinner" salad (iceberg with some carrot shavings).

[Ms. Toad]

65. I wish they would just go by the wayside -

for precisely the reason that you encountered in the hospital - it's not going to convert anyone, and folks who enjoy vegetarian food are going to go find it somewhere else.

[Hortensis]

72. :) Probably a waste of energy to imagine this isn't the future

for many, though, Ms. Toad, or part of the future for almost all. Most will prefer to continue to focus on enjoying eating, rather than on the reality that they can no longer eat what they once did. The day's already here-and-coming when people will just continue to pick up a (fake) hamburger without thinking about it.

No coincidence at all that preference for veganism is having a wave as meat, at least in the amounts of the past, is becoming increasingly a thing of the past. Really big forces are behind this societal shift.

A shame that these new foods can't have names, and forms, that don't mimic meat, since that makes me queasy, but there's apparently already a good market for fake fast-food hamburger. Really perverse when you think of how what goes into the "real" thing is best not thought about.

[LeftInTX]

63. I bought some Beyond Meat sausage because I could not find pork brats in my grocery

It's not very good...

I don't know if HEB stopped carrying pork brats..I won't eat smoked beef brats because smoked beef is not brats, it's smoked sausage...

[LeftInTX]

62. I have a hilarious story

About 25 year ago or so, my mom said, "Come on over for an old fashioned brunch like we used to have when you were growing up"

So, that's what we did...We packed our families up and were so excited....


But my mom served all fake sausage and eggs......
It was so depressing....LOL

There was other depressing stuff besides plant based sausage and fake eggs...

[Thtwudbeme]

46. Interesting

all the vegetarian restaurants I know of that have fake meat are doing great.

We are in NC.

[BlackSkimmer]

50. That's my thought too. I rarely eat meat, but if I decided I wanted a burger, I'd get a burger.

I’ve never felt the need for fake meat. I love veggies though.

I had a wonderful cauliflower dish today.

[Mosby]

51. Have you had it?

Beyond or impossible beef. It's actually really good, even the crumbles.

What we like to do is cook the burgers in a pan, saute peppers onions and sometimes mushrooms, and then serve them plain with beef gravy.

BK for a long time served a veggie burger, it was OK.

[Ms. Toad]

52. If I want meat, I'll buy meat - not something pretending to be meat.

I have tasted it, but that doesn't change my perspective (or the perspective of most people I know who believe meals require meat).

Until people can overcome their prejudice that a meal isn't a meal unless it is centered around meat, we are not going to move to a world in which we are eating fewer animals and more vegetables. Moving from that prejudice won't come from creating more and better fake meats. It will come from learning to center meals around vegetables and the characteristics which they are best at.

[hunter]

53. Throughout human history I think most every food dish has started out...

...pretending to be something else as people have migrated across the planet.

When people move to a new environment they seek familiar foods. If they can't find these foods they find substitutes. Eventually these substitutes evolve into new local cuisines and the process repeats.

We're now living in a world that probably can't support cheap "real beef" hamburgers for everyone.

Maybe the fast food giants have seen that writing on the wall. If they want to expand and provide a uniform product across the world, serving eight billion or more potential customers, they'll have to turn away from meat.

[Ms. Toad]

61. Not at all the same thing.

Trying to use alternate raw ingredients to make familiar foods is not the same thing as taking extraordinary measure to create a plant-based raw ingredient which "bleeds" the way meat does, which can be cooked in the same way, etc.

[hunter]

67. With global warming and the rapid growth of the human population...

...we've all been thrust into a new and unfamiliar environment whether we like it or not.

Meat substitutes, developed locally or by large industry, are an adaptation to those changes.

Furthermore, increasing numbers of people have decided that common industrial scale meat and dairy production practices are abhorrent for multiple reasons.

The fast food places are responding to those market realities.

Personally, I can cook a wide variety of vegan meals using lentils, beans, tofu, etc.. My wife has been a vegetarian-approaching-vegan for many years and I do most of the cooking and all of the grocery shopping in our home. For all my life I've never feel food secure unless I have a large supply of rice and lentils in my pantry. Using those two food staples as my base I can make all sorts of interesting meals with whatever else is on hand. But I'm not any kind of purist. Sometimes I just want a burger and fries.

It's my personal opinion that these new meat substitutes are acceptable. They are not being forced upon anyone and I doubt they are hindering the development of more sophisticated vegan diets.

[Ms. Toad]

69. I never said they weren't acceptable -

I was countering the implication in your OP that fake meats will be leading the way toward moving away from meat centered eating. As long as meals are centered around something looks, tastes, feels like meat we're not moving away from meat centered eating and - just like fake sugar as a substitute for real sugar are rarely successful in decreasing sugar consumption, eating fake meat is unlikely to be successful in decreasing meat consumption

[flvegan]

56. That's funny.

Not sure where you live or what "vegetarian or vegan restaurant(s)" you "know of" has failed, but that's a funny and likely untrue take. Or maybe those places just didn't have a chef as good as say, Burger King, or KFC. Just two silly examples of sellers of "fake meat" not JUST doing fine. But good for you posting...this.

fAkE meaT is PointLeSs, DisaPpoiNtiNg and diSguStiNg. LOL, tell the market.

[Ms. Toad]

60. Thanks for accusing me of lying. n/t

[kimimer]

29. Vegan business news letter

For anybody interested, The Vegconomist is a site and newsletter covering the many new vegan products that are being developed ... vegconomist.com

[IcyPeas]

30. It's good for the people who want a plant based burger from a fast food place.

and maybe it'll make a dent in the environment (I hope so). I am a vegetarian (not vegan) but I would never go to McDonalds or Burger King or any other fast food place for a veggie burger. If I am craving one I would go to a place that caters to vegetarians/vegans. I also don't know how they grill the veggie burger.... on the same grill as the meat burgers? yuk. Plus I can't stand the smell of those places.

[hunter]

55. In the U.S.A. they are cooked on the same grill as the meat.

In the United Kingdom regulations are such that they have to be cooked on separate grills.

[panader0]

32. While I know that eating meat is not as healthy as eating veggies, both for the body

and for the environment, I know that everything you eat was once alive. Plants too. You have to
yank that living plant from the ground or hack it down and cook it or eat it raw. So from a
morality point of view, I can't see how vegetarians are inherently more moral than carnivores.
My first wife was a strict vegetarian and she converted me until we split up. That said, I eat much
less meat than I used too. You have to kill to eat, animal or vegetable.

[mcar]

34. We like Beyond Burgers and meatballs

The crumbles are yuck.

[druidity33]

42. GOOD! K&R, nt.

[FakeNoose]

44. Well of course they are, they're losing business

McDonald's has lost customers for years by not offering non-meat burgers. If the other fast food restaurants can do it, why couldn't they?

Well the answer is that they could, but they didn't want to. Now they have to because customers are leaving.

[Autumn]

66. Carl's Beyond Beef Burger is the best hamburger I've ever had. That has made me a fan of the Beyond

Beef brand. I find Carl's burger to be much better than Burger King, much juicier and more flavor. Our Costco sells the patties and Beyond Beef meatballs. Fantastic flavor.

[Torchlight]

70. After dramatically cutting our household's meat intake last year

we tried a variety of plant-based substitutes and were pleasantly surprised by the taste. I thought they'd cook/grill badly and she thought there was no delicious substitute for a bacon-cheeseburger.

We were both wrong.



(we're not vegan, but after finding out about the cost/benefit of large scale meat production, we thought it our obligation to cut way back)

[Hugin]

73. WHEN are they going to do the nuggets!???!!!ii1(one)i1!!

There's the gold, baby!