General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI feel shitty even owning a gun
Since this mass shooting. Just feel like I don't even want mine anymore. But I'm conflicted too. Someone who is also transgender. Being without protection scares me. But I don't like carrying anymore. But I feel I have to because i don't want to be a victim. What am I supposed to do? Please be kind. I'm not a gun humper.
EthanBlue
(48 posts)I think that you have to know for yourself what works for your protection. Honestly I cant own a gun. Im too forgetful and lose things all the time. So a gun was never going to work for me.
Honestly I think we just need to implement that weapons ban for automatic weapons from the 80s? I believe once we let that lapse you started to see school shootings.
Just be a responsible gun owner and maybe get rid of any automatic weapons.
vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)Handgun and two rifles. One pump, one bolt action.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)Mosby
(16,319 posts)They are very expensive because they had to be made prior to 1986. They run 15-50k.
Celerity
(43,415 posts)https://rocketffl.com/who-can-own-a-full-auto-machine-gun/
Contrary to popular belief, it is perfectly legal for a law-abiding American citizen to own/possess a machine gun (sometimes called a full-auto firearm or automatic weapon). The absolute easiest way is for someone to get a Federal Firearms License or FFL (even a home-based FFL).
Depending on the type of FFL, the FFL-holder can purchase and sell machine guns, regardless of when they were made (more on this below), and they can even legally make their own machine guns or lawfully convert current firearms into full-autos. The best part about getting a machine gun as an FFL is that you can get it at dealer cost and fast.
Even without an FFL, a private citizen can still lawfully own a true machine gun if certain conditions are met. However, machine guns for non-FFLs are EXTREMELY expensive as the available supply is limited. As an FFL, you can buy a brand new machine gun for less than $2,000 and have it transferred to you in a few days.
As a private citizen (without an FFL) you can only buy an old machine gun (over 35 years old), itll likely cost north of $15,000, and youll have to wait around a year for the transfer via an ATF Form 4. For example, a private citizen can lawfully own a machine gun only if:
the possessor isnt a prohibited person,
the full-auto machine gun was made before 1986, and
their relevant state law does not ban that the firearm (whether banning machine guns outright or any firearm with certain features).
As you can see, machine gun possession by non-FFLs is regulated based on the person (possessor), the firearm itself (when it was made), and where the firearm is possessed (which state).
Kaleva
(36,312 posts)Celerity
(43,415 posts)Chuuku Davis
(565 posts)I don't think a legally acquired automatic firearm has ever been used in a crime.
ornotna
(10,803 posts)You're one of the good guys.
Tetrachloride
(7,847 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,815 posts)... with owning a gun for protection.
The problem is owning an arsenal of killing machines while pretending you're expecting an army to show up at your door any minute.
You're not a gun-humper. If you were, you wouldn't be concerned about anyone thinking that you are.
vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)No killing machines here. I just worry about the neighbors across the road and next to me that are the nutters kicking in my door looking to execute us.
Joenobody
(90 posts)Even if someone "owned an arsenal of killing machines" as you said....why would that be a problem if they weren't actually killing people with them?
NanceGreggs
(27,815 posts)... need an arsenal of killing machines?
They only serve one purpose - to kill. So why would an arsenal be necessary, instead of just one gun for protection?
Joenobody
(90 posts)Need is irrelevant. They point is that they want them and, as said, if they aren't shooting and aren't planning to shoot anyone.....why does it matter and who's hurt?
inthewind21
(4,616 posts)That's why.
NanceGreggs
(27,815 posts)... because you "want them" is an indicator of mental and/or emotional instability in and of itself.
That's why most people consider hoarders to be "not quite right". Accumulating a massive cache of broken umbrellas and old cereal boxes may not be dangerous - but it does speak to some form of mental imbalance.
Joenobody
(90 posts)Some people like to shoot guns and never hurt anybody.
NanceGreggs
(27,815 posts)... and hurt a LOT of people , like concert goers, mall shoppers, nightclub attendees - AND innocent school children!
This is the point in the discussion where the obvious response is are you REALLY that stupid? But apparently, you are.
Don't forget to 'alert' on me for calling you out. It will be a badge of honour - and I ran out of fucks to give about 'hides' a long time ago.
inthewind21
(4,616 posts)the "law abiding gun owner" bit. They are ALL law abiding. Right up the second they aren't. No one is a drunk, until they are. No one is a drug addict. Until they are. No one is a thief. Until they are. So, what's wrong with people having an arsenal if they want as long as they are not mass killing. Well, right up until they do. This country has shown time and times and time again it cannot be responsible with dangerous things. But keep beating that dead horse. Literally!
niyad
(113,346 posts)stopdiggin
(11,317 posts)for owning a firearm. And plenty of thoroughly decent and moral people who do so. You've explained some of your reasoning - and at the same time (benefit of the doubt) I'm assuming you are not threatening your neighbors, robbing banks, or planning to storm any government installations - so we're all good. Done and dusted.
SYFROYH
(34,172 posts)Yes, there are DUers here that will assume the worst of you for owning a gun, but in the end you have to be true to yourself.
Keep it safely, practice once in a while, and know that your life and the lives of your loved ones are worth protecting.
Peace
maxsolomon
(33,345 posts)Where and when was this survey?
SYFROYH
(34,172 posts)One in the mid 2000s and another in the mid 2010s.
They were up for a food amount of time in General discussion.
Granted, these were self-reports but thats all that is possible.
Maybe someone took some screen shots or can find them.
maxsolomon
(33,345 posts)I'm just suspicious that DU would skew to Gun Ownership by such a degree over the general US population, which is 1/4 of the population owning a firearm, 40% of households.
Internet polls are self-selecting.
ProfessorGAC
(65,076 posts)I have one. I'm not a gun person but i got into target shooting (rifle) in the 80s & 90s.
A bank manager i knew (i was on the board) moonlighted at a high end rifle & shotgun store.
He got me into target shooting (scopeless) and turned me on to a 75th anniversary reissue of the Springfield M1903.
That range got turned into a subdivision 17 or 18 years ago. So, now it just sits here in the locked case.
I don't even have any ammo.
But, I'm a gun owner & most here would probably be surprised to see that.
I doubt I'm all that unique.
Lots of vets here, too.
kaotikross
(246 posts)And are at a high risk of being assaulted I'd keep it for sure. Nobody I know is talking about banning pistols. Just the fact that you feel bad about it tells me enough about your character, you aren't a gun fetishist or worshipper, you aren't using a gun as some extension of your manhood or self esteem prop, you have a genuine safety issue. I read your entire post and didn't see any false bravado or "we can discuss it in person" internet bully bullshit. Carry on, stay safe.
Joenobody
(90 posts)Which are tossed around on this site like nothing, would ban most pistols in use today.
Most standard pistols available now are semi autos with 16+1 round mags. Even smaller models are 10+1. If magazine capacity were limited to 5, let's say, every glock owner in the US would be a criminal unless they ordered new altered mags, which glock would almost certainly not be able to supply immediately.
Same for sig, S&W, Ruger, etc.
Banning semis would make all of those illegal outright.
Hell, most. 22 rifles are semi autos with 20ish round mags.
MichMan
(11,938 posts)Few are with long guns and even fewer are with assault weapons.
Skittles
(153,169 posts)yup
Grumpy Old Guy
(3,170 posts)But I've been thinking about getting one. We travel by RV a lot and sometimes sleep in a lot of out of the way places. Not everyone is friendly when they see California license plates.
PJMcK
(22,037 posts)My wife and I are planning to sail from New York to the Florida Keys this fall. Because our boat is Documented (registered with the Coast Guard), we're supposed to put our boat's name and hailing port on the stern. I had the hailing port made up as a decal that can be applied to the boat but my wife, who is originally from the South, is concerned that some rednecks won't like seeing New York, NY on our boat. I don't know if her concerns are merited but I've read stories of aggression against Northerners by nut cases. Like you, we'll be traveling in some pretty out-of-the-way places and I remember seeing "Deliverance" (wink).
However, we don't own any guns and I'm not going to start building an arsenal. There are other ways we can protect ourselves.
Grumpy Old Guy
(3,170 posts)There was a jerk in GlenAllen, Alaska, in front of me at a gas pump. He saw my California plates, and proceeded to take about twenty or thirty minutes to fill the gas tank of his beat up Honda Accord. My trailer and truck have a combined length of fifty feet, and it would have been difficult for me to back up and go to a different pump. He screwed around in his back seat for a long time after he finished filling his tank just to piss me off.
There was another incident when I was overnighting in a Walmart in Susanville, California. There was a retired corrections officer from Nevada who was parked near me in his motorhome. He knew I was from California, and did his best to bait me into a debate about California's gun regulations. I didn't bite.
I would think things would be better on the Ocean, but you can never tell. Funny thing, I used to do a lot of blue water sailing about forty years ago. A boat was one of those places that I thought having a shotgun on board was a necessity. You're a long way from law enforcement.
BlueMTexpat
(15,369 posts)in MT, so I grew up in a gun culture. That was MANY years ago.
Many in my extended family still own and use guns, although I doubt that any has an assault weapon.
In days of yore, the NRA was about arms safety and responsibility. It has now become a killing association and avoids responsibility.
I personally do not own a gun and never will. That is because I am not willing to take on the responsibility of having one, of storing it safely, and of practicing regularly at a shooting range, among other things.
As for personal safety, I am also afraid that if I had one, it could all too easily be turned against me by an aggressor.
As an elderly woman and one who mostly lives alone (my husband and I are usually on different continents) and also one who has lived and traveled in many other cultures, I am more comfortable with other means of defense: a dog; pepper spray; sensible locks; as much self-defense training as is possible for me; and common-sense awareness of my surroundings.
But that is my personal opinion.
I do NOT condemn any gun owner who demonstrates responsibility and is willing to be accountable should anything happen.
Please do whatever you must!
JustABozoOnThisBus
(23,350 posts)vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)Only way I'd feel okay carrying was through proper training. And thanks for the link. Didn't know LGBTQ gun safety group existed
Fla_Democrat
(2,547 posts)Pink Pistols https://www.pinkpistols.org/
Armed Equality https://armedequality.com/
Operation Blazing Sword https://www.blazingsword.org/
National African American Gun Association https://naaga.co/
Black Gun Owners Association https://blackgunownersassociation.org/
I recall the Socialist Rifle Association, but I think they had some trouble a few years back.
The BBC did a piece on AE.... https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-47502573
Find a support group you feel comfortable with. Take courses with people who have the heart of a teacher, and will work with you to improve your proficiency. Practice, practice, practice, but in the end, if God forbid you are ever in a situation that requires you to protect yourself (oh, another good one, Active Self Protection. https://activeselfprotection.com/) you are your own first responder.
C Moon
(12,213 posts)I have no ill feelings toward those who own gunsonly toward those who dedicate their lives to guns and want every aspect of gun-ownership protectedeven after events we are all dealing with now.
mnhtnbb
(31,392 posts)about a recent study
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/apr/07/guns-handguns-safety-homicide-killing-study
Public health research in the US has shown for years that having guns in the home raises the risk of a violent death by gun for occupants of the home.
I am a 71 year old woman who lives alone. I do not own a gun--never have-- and have no interest in obtaining one.
Amishman
(5,557 posts)The article does not mention that factor at all
mnhtnbb
(31,392 posts)which identifies how the population studied was chosen.
https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M21-3762
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,862 posts)And having a gun in the house vastly increasing dying from that gun. Isn't that bizarre?
BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)Last edited Mon May 30, 2022, 03:20 PM - Edit history (1)
I've never felt the need to carry a weapon around with me.
llmart
(15,540 posts)73-year old woman who lives alone and I have never felt the need to own a gun either. When you get to be our age, one can look back and do an "inventory" so to speak of how many times in your life you experienced an event that would have necessitated a gun. I can't think of once.
I'll bet a lot of those anti-vaxxers who said they don't live in fear of Covid are the same ones who live in fear of a burglar taking their precious material goods, as if those goods can't be replaced and covered by insurance.
BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)Irish_Dem
(47,131 posts)Ferrets are Cool
(21,107 posts)BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)If not, its more of a danger to you than protection.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)The average citizen is even less.
Ive never felt the need to have a gun. People overexaggerate the need for one.
hlthe2b
(102,292 posts)But, I decided a very long time ago only to carry non-lethal protection (a tiny keychain canister of pepper spray currently, though I have carried a small commercially- (i.e., civilian) available model of Taser when I had to travel/commute overnight several years ago. I had no doubt a gun could be turned on me and more importantly that I might not be able to live with the knowledge that I had killed someone--whether in the name of self-protection or worse, accidentally.
The very first thing I did when my father died years ago was to find a safe way to dispose of his hunting rifles and his handgun (police-run return/destruction program). When I was a teen alone and home sick from school, I had reason to grab that handgun when I heard a prowler approaching the backdoor. I am very grateful I didn't find out if I would have used it as a noise fortunately scared him off. But, it is likely that I might well have...
Everyone has to make their own decision on this. But, I remain decisively anti-gun and accept the risk.
leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)Novara
(5,843 posts)Only 1% of crimes are stopped by people using guns for self-protection. Statistically you are more likely to have your gun used against you.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/firearms-research/gun-threats-and-self-defense-gun-use-2/
maxsolomon
(33,345 posts)It's immune to statistics, as long as anecdotal instances of DGUs occurs - like the one this week at a party, where a woman used her handgun to kill a drive-by shooter.
More likely it kills or maims someone when it just wasn't necessary. I can think of many anecdotes: a father shooting his daughter to death as she sneaks in the house late is one that I remember reading on DU.
David Hemenway's research is, unfortunately, preaching to the choir. It can't overcome the seductive POSSIBILITY of a DGU, of a "Right" to self-defense.
Novara
(5,843 posts)I am a woman living alone. I think about my safety A LOT. But it is a myth that carrying a gun will keep you safe. Much smarter to be careful at all times. That doesn't ensure that you will always be safe, but I suspect a lot of people who carry guns aren't as fastidious about avoiding people and places that might be dangerous. I could be wrong, but guns can confer a false sense of security.
And yeah, danger can be found anywhere should some angry teenager get his hands on an AR15 but you are not likely to stop him with your pistol. In fact, you are 99% likely not to stop him rather than be the 1% who will.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,107 posts)You should, imo, own something you can carry on your person for protection at all times. Maybe some bear spray. I would certain investigate the possibilities.
WhiskeyGrinder
(22,357 posts)responsibility to kill someone and have made the decision that action is in you if you need it. If you have any hesitation around that, you shouldn't carry. If you keep carrying, keep training.
Hangingon
(3,071 posts)MarineCombatEngineer
(12,399 posts)should make you feel guilty about owning a firearm for protection, especially in your case where you truly might need it.
Joenobody
(90 posts)If not, then I think you are OK to keep owning and carrying your weapon.
Let's be real, you are a target for some people and you are more likely to be victimized than the average person.
If you keep them and nothing ever happens then they are 3 or 4 guns that never hurt anybody. If you get rid of them and are later victimized without any defense you didn't accomplish anything with your stance.
ripcord
(5,409 posts)You should take a gun safety class if you haven't done so.
vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)Locked up atm.
BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)Perhaps I misunderstood.
vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)Concealed when I'm out in public. Locked up when I'm home
867-5309.
(1,189 posts)Have you ever had to use it? Realistically, do you anticipate you will? If not, the risk of carrying it may outweigh the benfit.
Paladin
(28,264 posts)But then, I'm an adult, I'm sane, I'm law-abiding, I'm educated, I fully understand how guns function, I'm safety-conscious, and I've been in favor of stricter gun laws for many years. The reckless, lethal behavior of some persons with guns does not change any of the foregoing. If possible, I'd suggest that you concentrate on your own habits and practices, rather than those of others. I know that may be easier said than done these days, but it's still good advice.
LeftInTX
(25,381 posts)vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)I'll just carry my knife only
maxsolomon
(33,345 posts)Maybe get a taser or some bear spray; try going out with those instead of a handgun.
You may feel adequately protected.
Hopefully that was kind enough and I won't be alerted on.
vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)That's what I face
ga_girl
(183 posts)I do have a Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22. Based on the AR platform, looks like an AR, but shoots 22 long rifle bullets. Looks scary, but certainly doesn't sound that way.
I am actively considering buying a hand gun. I have taken classes with revolver, 9mm semi and 38 special. Unfortunately my fingers are short, so I can't grip a typical 9 mm very well. Walther has a new PDP-F product, supposedly for smaller female hands. Haven't been able to find one, but haven't looked very hard.
Being TG myself, having some sort of protection seems prudent. Currently I carry a loud rescue whistle in my purse, more as a means of startling a potential attacker. There's a bleed control kit in my car, along with a couple of doses of Narcan.
I don't want to carry a weapon, but with how society is going...
Fla_Democrat
(2,547 posts)Do you have a range that rents guns? Some do, and it would help you in your process. A 9x19 out of a P365 has a bit more recoil than a G17. The grip is more comfortable for smaller hands, but less mass to absorb the energy. Maybe something in a .380? It doesn't have the ballistics of the 9x19, but one can never discount the FIBS factor.
Kudos on carrying a bleed kit in your car. I keep one in my truck, with an IFAK on me, which I had to break out a month or so back when a dang fool carpenter cut his forearm down to the bone on a gangplate.
Kaleva
(36,312 posts)I have a revolver but i don't carry it with me off my property unless going to and from the shooting range. Living in the rural area I do, the odds of me, a white male senior, needing a gun to protect myself from death or severe harm is pretty much zero. So I don't carry.
MySideOfTown
(225 posts)A Colt .38 police special six shot revolver.
A 20 gage 3 shot pump shotgun.
A .22 single shot rifle over a .410 single shotgun
In that time I used the .22 rifle to kill an aggressive wood chuck and the .410 shotgun to kill a couple rabbits eating my garden. I've never used up any of rest of the ammo I bought at the time.
Don't know why I still have this arsenal. Just that I don't want to sell it to someone that could misuse it.
prodigitalson
(2,425 posts)I had one when I was a young and hunted rabbits.
MySideOfTown
(225 posts)Mine is a Savage. I just looked up the used selling price and it may be worth as much as $700. I think I paid $20 for it in 1980. My favorite gun.
prodigitalson
(2,425 posts)And it was a Christmas gift in 1983. Whish I had held on to it. The only gun I own now is a nice semi auto 12 gauge Benelli (only 3 round capacity with a plug) that hasn't been out of it's safe since my father passed away over a decade ago and I no longer quail hunt. Southern gun culture was way different in my childhood. I never even saw an AR 15 style weapon until the 1990s. Now people think it is their heritage. Really weird. I used to enjoy trap and skeet shooting a lot too. But it was a very special father son thing plus I don't like being around the modern gun nuts you find at ranges. They creep me out.
MySideOfTown
(225 posts)My 20 ga shotgun is a Remington, worth $500. My Colt revolver is worth $800. I'm going to pack them all up and sell them to a gun store this week before the price goes down. I mean, 3 shots in 40 years?
prodigitalson
(2,425 posts)Keeping the over/under?
Happy Hoosier
(7,314 posts)You store it properly, use it properly, and dont fetishize it.
ecstatic
(32,712 posts)I understand where you're coming from because lately I'm more and more aware of the places I go to that can potentially be targeted. I've been thinking that if my personality were a little different, I would probably conceal carry at this point... If I were less anxious and I had the military background and/or training to do so.
IngridsLittleAngel
(1,962 posts)...and I say that not liking the things at all. But as you said, you need to protect yourself. These are horrifying times for us, and I cannot fault anyone in the least for taking whatever steps they can to protect themselves.
Plus, there is a huge difference between carrying a handgun in the name of protection and to avoid becoming a victim/statistic, and carrying a military-grade mass-killing machine.
So I understand your guilt, but, you have no reason to feel guilty. You have every right to be safe. Right now, we're in times where people like us are at risk and we sure can't count on the cops to look out for us - for whatever reason.
vercetti2021
(10,156 posts)Thank you
IngridsLittleAngel
(1,962 posts)I'm so glad I can do so
Kaleva
(36,312 posts)In your area? That info ought to help you decide if you ought to carry it not?
IngridsLittleAngel
(1,962 posts)I'm not an expert on such matters, and never really have looked up the numbers.
Kaleva
(36,312 posts)IngridsLittleAngel
(1,962 posts)I'm not the one carrying.
Kaleva
(36,312 posts)But my point stands. One should do research before deciding to carry. Statistics show the great majority of people don't need to carry but there are some do need the protection. The only way to determine that is to do research.
Guns are dangerous so the actual threat level ought to be real, based on data, before deciding.
IngridsLittleAngel
(1,962 posts)I personally do not care for guns, and I'll say it: I don't trust me with a gun (out of fear that I'd be tempted to harm myself, honestly). The idea of getting one, owning one, etc... not something I've looked into and not something I plan to do.
My response was to Vercetti and her original post, along with her guilt and her feelings - both for and against carrying. She does carry, and my reply to her was me saying that I can understand why her reasoning and why she carries (namely, being a trans woman in Texas). I fully get that she feels the need to protect herself, and considering that she owns a handgun (and not an automatic mass-killing machine) and has no desire to do anything reckless with it, that she shouldn't feel guilty.
To carry or not to carry? That's up to each individual. That's up to someone to decide if they feel they need one, and feel comfortable with one. That's up to them to make sure they know how to handle one properly (which to my understanding, Vercetti does). I don't have all the answers when it comes to this issue. I know enough, though, to know I'm better off not owning a gun. And that no one needs an AR-15 or any mass-murder weapon like the ones used to shoot up Tops in Buffalo or the school in Uvalde.
Vinca
(50,278 posts)use it correctly and safely and aren't mentally off the rails, there's no reason to sell it. I owned a gun for many years because I was a police officer, but after I left the department it sat in its original box on a shelf for a good 10 years. I finally sold it (through a dealer who does background checks) because I didn't like the idea of someone breaking into the house and stealing it. That was probably 15 years ago and I've never given it a second thought. On the other hand, if for whatever reason I felt threatened, I wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.
obamanut2012
(26,080 posts)Raised very rural, love my .22 plinkster for target shooting, and I have a .20 shotgun for skeet and protection. They are locked in a gun case and I am responsible, but I feel like you right now.
Calculating
(2,955 posts)Not like the police will protect you
Pyryck
(99 posts)Last week I had a thought to take my rifle and pistol outside on the sidewalk and beat them with a sledge hammer until I was exhausted and to turn them into useless piles of metal suitable only for being melted down.
I can only imagine what you have to face daily. It scares the crap out of me because someone I dearly love is similarly living her life as best she can and I hope making damn sure to protect herself.
KentuckyWoman
(6,688 posts)You can't come out of Appalachian Kentucky without being raised around guns. I still have 3 historic rifles.