General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsTeachers and students must "register" their political views?
Can the re-education camps be far behind? Yes, we must return America to the conservative christian values it was founded upon! I'm sure the Supreme Court will find this law constitutional. What could possibly go wrong here?
Public universities in Florida will be required to survey both faculty and students on their political beliefs and viewpoints, with the institutions at risk of losing their funding if the responses are not satisfactory to the state's Republican-led legislature.
The unprecedented project, which was tucked into a law signed Tuesday by Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis, is part of a long-running, nationwide right-wing push to promote "intellectual diversity" on campuses though worries over a lack of details on the survey's privacy protections, and questions over what the results may ultimately be used for, hover over the venture.
Based on the bill's language, survey responses will not necessarily be anonymous sparking worries among many professors and other university staff that they may be targeted, held back in their careers or even fired for their beliefs.
According to the bill's sponsor, state Sen. Ray Rodrigues, faculty will not be promoted or fired based on their responses, but, as The Tampa Bay Times reported Tuesday, the bill itself does not back up those claims.
Read the rest here: https://www.salon.com/2021/06/23/desantis-signs-bill-requiring-florida-students-professors-to-register-political-views-with-state/
RKP5637
(67,109 posts)CrispyQ
(36,470 posts)RKP5637
(67,109 posts)RKP5637
(67,109 posts)Maybe a Florida sink hole will open up underneath him.
The people of Florida must be cool with it; they havent risen up yet. I know, I know, protecting freedoms is so inconvenient.
How much oppression will it take to spark the people, or will they sit in the pot until it slowly boils?
pandr32
(11,586 posts)Perhaps stunned or deluded.
Native
(5,942 posts)wnylib
(21,468 posts)SergeStorms
(19,201 posts)with Liz Cheney. She's persona non grata in GQP circles now. She's from that old fashioned republican party.
wnylib
(21,468 posts)but his strength will fade as DeSantis pushes forward and as the J6 committee shreds Trump. There are many Republicans who don't want Trump but will not say it openly.
Cheney has a lot of the far right policies that Republicans like, but without the craziness of Trump. Same for DeSantis. Cheney could come out of the hearings as a national hero, depending on how successful the committee is in getting people to see the full picture of Trump's corruption. She is forceful and no nonsense. Combined with DeSantis, they would project an image of strength and leadership. People relate more to image than to policy.
Native
(5,942 posts)wnylib
(21,468 posts)in their party, pushing to take control of the party back from Trump and his acolytes.
Both have name recognition.
The J6 committee hearings and the investigations in NY and GA are causing conservative individuals, groups, and corporations to pull back from Trump. He was useful to them in 2016 against their nemesis, Hillary Clinton, and he got them a conservative court. But he is too unpredictable and self-serving for them to stay with. He has nothing more to offer them in maintaining corporate control of the government.
When Trump sinks in the public's eyes due to hearings, investigations, and trials of his inner circle, even if he himself is not tried and convicted, Cheney will become a national hero.
Cheney and DeSantis will project to their party an image of strong, stable leaders versus the Trump unpredictability and tendency to self-serving violence, which is bad for business and foreign relations. Cheney can gain the support of the corporate world. DeSantis can draw the people who support the domestic culture wars on religion, sexuality, and education.
Native
(5,942 posts)I don't think she'd join his ticket. And he doesn't listen to anyone except his wife (who is as bad as he is). Plus, he helped form the Freedom Caucus, and we all know how vociferously they've been calling on Cheney to resign. I can't see her wanting any part of that group.
wnylib
(21,468 posts)they might not fit well together because they are both strong willed people. So I think you could be right about that.
But I do expect to see both of them in the 2024 campaign. We know that DeSantis wants to run. I recently heard Cheney say, when asked if she would run in 2024, that she had not yet decided. So she is considering it.
They might face off against each other in the primaries. When primaries are over, unusual combinations sometimes develop, like the Kennedy-Johnson ticket in 1960.
Native
(5,942 posts)wnylib
(21,468 posts)As long as Dems win the general. Cheney's politics are much too far right for me to feel safe with her in the WH.
Native
(5,942 posts)Snackshack
(2,541 posts)How can this be constitutional?
Crunchy Frog
(26,587 posts)RKP5637
(67,109 posts)rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)what I think of their bullshit. Republican motherfuckers.
Harker
(14,018 posts)rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)Of course, DeSatan will fire all those professors.
Harker
(14,018 posts)I think he's a short step from hiring only ardent supporters at state institutions.
That, or liberals are to be set aside for "special ed" programs.
Magoo48
(4,712 posts)Or, we can just bitch until we become truly the subjects of tyranny.
Duppers
(28,121 posts)Plainly is an illegal violation of privacy, is it not?
spooky3
(34,456 posts)Lonestarblue
(9,996 posts)of church and state. The radical Catholic majority will see nothing wrong with jettisoning the rest of the First Amendment.
The Republican Party is truly evil.
csziggy
(34,136 posts)https://www.flsenate.gov/laws/constitution#A1S23
Duppers
(28,121 posts)IF passed, this will keep a lot of attorneys busy.
Dread Pirate Roberts
(1,896 posts)The effective date was July 1. DeSantis signed the bill on June 22.
Duppers
(28,121 posts)🤞
3auld6phart
(1,047 posts)the six assholes on the extreme court will allow that
shit to stand and make it nation wide.
Duppers
(28,121 posts)Traildogbob
(8,744 posts)The answer to that question. 6 judges (???) if you can call em that.
NNadir
(33,523 posts)milestogo
(16,829 posts)They ask for information about race, disability, and veteran status. Then there was a question about LGBTQ status. You are not required to fill these out but I usually do. But this kind of shocked me.
The more information they have the easier it is to target people for discrimination.
RKP5637
(67,109 posts)history. The rest of the world will walk right past the backward US if this happens on a large scale.
Hotler
(11,424 posts)RKP5637
(67,109 posts)reflex still don't get WTF is going on, the old GOP is gone. It's exasperating.
Sympthsical
(9,073 posts)It's meant as a way to 1. Signal the company is accepting and 2. For hiring to get a sense of diversity of the applicant pool.
It's meant to be well-intentioned.
You'd think when their gay HR manager says this can make people feel targeted and violate their privacy, they'd stop. But, it's a corporate thing. Above my pay grade. When I was still in the office directly dealing with applicants, I would just tell them they could leave it blank. I also advised others to inform applicants they do not have to answer.
It's like, I get it, but no.
milestogo
(16,829 posts)I did fill it out, but in the future I am going to start declining to answer these kind of questions.
Sympthsical
(9,073 posts)When we look at hiring, let's say for example we're getting tons of white applicants and few black applicants. So our first question will be to look at where we're advertising for hires. Are we missing some bias or lack of knowledge on our parts where we're unintentionally promoting our jobs to white communities? Is there an unconscious bias in how we're approaching the labor pool?
This actually was an internal problem for promotions at a location a few years ago. We like to promote from within. However, the head of a department was only advertising the promotions within their let's say circle. Well, this was noticed and we wondered how that was happening. After some quicky research into the matter, we discovered people outside the group were simply unaware of the promotional opportunities.
So that got changed right away.
Once we made sure everyone was equitably made aware of the opportunities, our applicant pool diversified.
This being in California, the LGBT community has been increasingly included in this process. I've had conversations about this for days and days with co-workers. Unless you're slapping ads in the Advocate, it's a lot harder and trickier to really treat the community the same way we do to achieve racial diversity. LGBT are everywhere in every race and every sex and gender.
I just don't feel like any benefit is coming from it. I honestly think it's just there for a "We're accepting" signal at this point. Which, fine. But people will still not want to answer it.
plimsoll
(1,670 posts)But they knew the Jews weren't going to say they were Jews. So they got to exclude all the people who reported and focus on just the ones who didn't. At this point reporting any kind of status like that is dangerous, and if you believe in the constitution you can't answer to protect those who are.
Got to hand it to DeSatan, he's right up there on the authoritarian's playbook.
Farmer-Rick
(10,175 posts)And you know how those non-Christian religions are always expressing different opinions. So next up, register if you are not a Christian. I wonder what they will do to atheists? I'm sure the Supremely Religious Court wants to get in on that registration requirement.
Harker
(14,018 posts)With people like him, it seems inevitable.
lostnfound
(16,179 posts)An old friend was further left of me, always saying there should be government programs to help solve all kinds of societal problems.
It wasnt so much that I disagreed with the concepts but I told him that the GOP has a way of taking Democratic programs (like welfare or student loans) into tools of oppression (aid for single moms becomes drug tests and privacy invasion to search apartment for evidence that a recipient has a man living with them, or student loans intended to make college available turns it into indentured servitude at pawn shop rates).
Sympthsical
(9,073 posts)Because these policies oftentimes originate from people not a part of the communities they're targeting. They don't have those experiences.
I know I, as a gay man, have often been pretty circumspect in the past during job interviews. I never know what the person hiring me thinks of gay people. Could be good, could be bad. So I would simply give no indication either way.
If I were to have a box in front of me, I suddenly have a dilemma. I could mark it and hope the person hiring is cool. Or I could not mark it, give someone the assumption I'm straight, and then get to deal with that inevitable day of coming out all over again (I do not hide my orientation from my coworkers).
It's just such a weirdly awkward position people get put into sometimes.
reACTIONary
(5,770 posts).... the want to determine how diverse their hiring pool is, and be able to meet diversity goals amongst the hired staff.
milestogo
(16,829 posts)spooky3
(34,456 posts)RKP5637
(67,109 posts)To put it nicely, this governor is a real shithead!
spooky3
(34,456 posts)sop
(10,188 posts)friends and political contributors, at the same time DeSantis also appointed him to be Florida's Surgeon General and Secretary of the Florida Department of Health. DeSantis desperately needed someone in a position of authority to publicly support his anti-mask and anti-vaccine BS.
"Florida Surgeon General Ladapo was rushed into UF College of Medicine job, emails show."
"Top brass at the University of Florida College of Medicine fast-tracked the hiring of Dr. Joseph Ladapo, knowing that Gov. Ron DeSantis was eyeing him for the position of state surgeon general, according to emails obtained by the USA TODAY Network-Florida."
"They also knew they needed to get it done quickly to coincide with the governors desire to announce Ladapos appointment the day after his predecessor Dr. Scott Rivkees, also a UF College of Medicine professor stepped down."
"And they knew that Ladapo had the backing of UF President Kent Fuchs, Provost Joe Glover and UF Board of Trustees Chairman Mori Hosseini a major GOP fundraiser and DeSantis supporter."
https://www.tallahassee.com/story/news/local/state/2021/10/27/joseph-ladapo-fast-tracked-university-florida-college-medicine-ron-desantis-mask/6173664001/
wnylib
(21,468 posts)go to out of state schools or private ones.
What's left will be students who can't afford an alternative or who don't see anything wrong with such intrusive questions.
róisín_dubh
(11,795 posts)There are no jobs in some fields like mine (humanities), where we tend to be a bit more liberal.
But it's coming for all of us in conservative states. It's a shame. I'm happy I'm on my way out (changing careers and leaving the US permanently).
spooky3
(34,456 posts)RKP5637
(67,109 posts)Deuxcents
(16,222 posts)Dont know why this happened w/o a lawsuit
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)The devil, you say! Sen. Rodrigues is (a) badly misinformed; (b) lying his ass off. Of course, when the sackings start, Sen. Rodrigues will be at the head of the line to say that it's right there in the law, you should have known your job was at risk for wrongthink.
Bucky
(54,013 posts)as in nunya fuckin' business, Typhoid Ronnie
dameatball
(7,398 posts)opportunity available to intimidate because, so far, he can get away with it. This will only get worse.
Kid Berwyn
(14,907 posts)The goal of wholesale surveillance, as (Hannah) Arendt wrote in The Origins of Totalitarianism, is not, in the end, to discover crimes, but to be on hand when the government decides to arrest a certain category of the population. And because Americans emails, phone conversations, Web searches and geographical movements are recorded and stored in perpetuity in government databases, there will be more than enough evidence to seize us should the state deem it necessary. This information waits like a deadly virus inside government vaults to be turned against us. It does not matter how trivial or innocent that information is. In totalitarian states, justice, like truth, is irrelevant.
Chris Hedges, The Last Gasp of American Democracy
Celerity
(43,383 posts)burrowowl
(17,641 posts)to DUers.
JohnnyRingo
(18,633 posts)"...the Democratic Party?"
RKP5637
(67,109 posts)3auld6phart
(1,047 posts)All Im going to say because Im a furrier.
Is what the fuck is with that cro-magnon
freak ? It really looks the USA is going to
Hell in a hand basket. Unbelievable what
is happening there.Honestly feel sad/ bad
for you.
OMGWTF
(3,957 posts)I just love your country and your people.
fightforfreedom
(4,913 posts)That's what I would write on the survey.
cloudboy07
(351 posts)Another Jackalope
(112 posts)captain queeg
(10,198 posts)Dread Pirate Roberts
(1,896 posts)The Florida Senate President weighed in on law...and his opinion that colleges and universities were "socialist factories". Did Senator Simpson actually go to college? And if he did, how in the world did he ever escape without being turning into a socialist? Just wondering....
"We always hear about the liberal parts of the university system, and we don't hear so much of that from the college system," he said, according to The Tampa Bay Times.
In addition to the survey, the bill also prevents officials from limiting campus speech that "may be uncomfortable, disagreeable or offensive" a measure that, as Democrats in the state Legislature pointed out, will also make it easier for groups like the KKK or the Proud Boys to hold events on campus.
Initech
(100,078 posts)If you use the term "socialist factories", you might as well tell me you watch Tucker Carlson without telling me you watch Tucker Carlson.
pfitz59
(10,381 posts)Not a worldly fellow. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilton_Simpson
Laxman
(2,419 posts)only both sides. The cornerstone of any good education. Climate skeptics, flat earthers, Holocaust deniers, and the history of slavery as a benevolent institution will all certainly broaden the minds of students. No more of this indoctrination with the truth!
Dread Pirate Roberts
(1,896 posts)Q. How much is two plus two?
A. How much do you need it to be?
Initech
(100,078 posts)How is he getting away with this?
Samrob
(4,298 posts)CentralMass
(15,265 posts)Lonestarblue
(9,996 posts)I call them politicians instead of judges because they base their rulings on political beliefs rather than the law, as when Trump judges allowed a clearly unconstitutional Texas abortion law to go into effect before Roe was overturned.
Autumn
(45,093 posts)obamanut2012
(26,077 posts)They are all handpicked by DeSantis. They rubberstamp everything.
spanone
(135,838 posts)Novara
(5,842 posts)localroger
(3,626 posts)Back around 1980 my high school had to teach us a mandatory six week civics course. Our instructor warned us on the first day that when we finished there would be a test, and one of the questions on that test was going to be "Communism is evil: True / False," and that if we did not answer True we would fail both the civics course and social studies for the year. Hey it worked, I learned a lesson from that, but it wasn't about whether communism is evil.
Jerry2144
(2,102 posts)Give them fake data. If most respondents answer like they are brain-dead conservatives they might realize how stupid this is
DBoon
(22,366 posts)That providing false information on the survey is grounds for dismissal.. Envision a university clerk charged with verifying political affiliation by looks at voter registration, donor records on opensecrets and other widely available information.
background verification is done in the private sector, but more for situations where you fail to disclose s felony conviction.
Jerry2144
(2,102 posts)Give them fake data. If most respondents answer like they are brain-dead conservatives they might realize how stupid this is
malaise
(269,008 posts)DeathSentence is Mussolini on steroids
KS Toronado
(17,243 posts)He started rounding up those he didn't like, even killing some of them.
Native
(5,942 posts)Maybe people will start listening finally.
Fuck DeSantis, Abbot and Trump!
genxlib
(5,528 posts)It is a dangerous step but the real danger is step 2.
When they inevitably come to the conclusion that the students and faculty lean left (of course they do), that will give them the ammunition to try to un-skew.
Imagine University policies that would try to seek a 50-50 balance in left-right. Considering how skewed that age group is, there would need to be significant advantages given to RW BS to get there.
Mark my words, this is the goal. Favoring conservatism to get a balance that any first year sociology student would tell you shouldn't exist demographically.
As a Floridian, this guy infuriates me. It is costing me big money to send my daughter to college out of state but all things considered, it is worth it.
samsingh
(17,598 posts)Thtwudbeme
(7,737 posts)Robin was a Prof. of English in Florida--- she passed away many years ago. I miss her voice.
ratchiweenie
(7,754 posts)Rebl2
(13,514 posts)communism to me.
lees1975
(3,859 posts)as governor and his chances at being elected President are beaten into the ground.
Fascists did this. In Germany and Italy in the 20's and 30's.
gab13by13
(21,348 posts)I remember Fla. St., but it may have been a different university, that the Kock brothers threatened to take away its university funding unless it had a say in selecting the professors.
Someone with a better memory can correct me. My memory is still good, it just doesn't last as long.
caraher
(6,278 posts)They aren't owed honest answers to a dishonest survey.
This serves the Republicans perfectly - drive out the liberals and anyone who believes in real academic freedom, leaving the state to the fascists and ignorant. Faculty who have a choice will leave.
LetMyPeopleVote
(145,278 posts)This is stupid even by DeathSantis standards
paulkienitz
(1,296 posts)keithbvadu2
(36,812 posts)fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)There will probably be a lot of "other" answers.
Ford_Prefect
(7,901 posts)Ugly Old news.
Very clearly violates 1st Amendment. No wiggle room for Death Santis.
Initech
(100,078 posts)TheFarseer
(9,323 posts)They would loudly and indignantly proclaim the left is doing but we all know they just preemptively say we are doing whatever they want to do.
vlyons
(10,252 posts)1 Write "member of the None of Your Business Political Party"
2 Chew up a big wad of chewing gum and stick it on the questionnaire
3 Go in the bathroom and wipe your ass with it
If survey is all online, see option # 1 above
obamanut2012
(26,077 posts)Sent to the employee and student's university or college email address. The answers WILL be tied to that survey.
Only FY Faculty are protected by a union. Adjuncts and all staff are not. So, you answer a certain way, you will be targeted. A friend knows soooo many staff and faculty who changed their registration to R or I, and who answered the survey like they were GOP.
Native
(5,942 posts)quaker bill
(8,224 posts)as randomly as possible
The Jungle 1
(4,552 posts)The right wing's head long run into fascism needs to be a political hammer for us. We need to use it.
The right is banning:
Abortion
Birth control
EPA
Voting rights
Gun control laws
Minorities
Books
Free speech and thought
Fascism is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism, characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and the economy. wiki
Call the right what they are.
flying_wahini
(6,600 posts)aggiesal
(8,915 posts)and to indoctrinate left leaning students.
And the current makeup of SCOTUS will agree that this is perfectly legal.
LiberalFighter
(50,937 posts)sarisataka
(18,655 posts)I am an active member of the Go Fuck Yourself party. Here is our logo"
greatauntoftriplets
(175,736 posts)jcgoldie
(11,631 posts)...is the opposite of what they are shooting for here.
BlueIdaho
(13,582 posts)Wait out Desatins reign of terror. Im reasonable sure hes at the end of his rope.
DBoon
(22,366 posts)send money here: https://charliecrist.com/
Mr. Sparkle
(2,933 posts)Maybe trump set the bar so low , it makes ordinary scumbags look good! Boggles the mind.
Native
(5,942 posts)Native
(5,942 posts)peggysue2
(10,829 posts)DeSantis will wave the banner on his march for a presidential bid in 2024.
Think Trump-level arrogance and thirst for power at any cost, only smarter
Achilleaze
(15,543 posts)Crunchy Frog
(26,587 posts)Emile
(22,770 posts)LetMyPeopleVote
(145,278 posts)Salon has had some bad crap lately including attacks on Biden and demands that its readers no longer donate to Democrats. I have seen multiple threads on DU stating that DeathSantis has signed a bill that requires all students to register their political views. Salon made this headline up and this claim is false
Link to tweet
https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/08/politics/fact-check-desantis-florida-students-professors-political-views/index.html?utm_medium=social&utm_term=link&utm_source=twCNNp&utm_content=2022-07-08T18%3A20%3A06
The 2021 law does require public colleges and universities in Florida to administer annual surveys on the subject of "intellectual freedom and viewpoint diversity." But contrary to the inaccurate initial Salon headline, the law does not require anybody to register their political views. Students and faculty members can decide whether to participate in the surveys, which are anonymous.
Salon published the headline in June 2021. Its revision on Wednesday, more than a year later, came after the article went viral among some Democrats on Twitter amid talk of a possible DeSantis run for president.
Before Salon's revision, its false claim was promoted this week by various Democratic commentators, by Florida agriculture commissioner and Democratic gubernatorial candidate Nikki Fried (who subsequently deleted the tweet that linked to the Salon article), and even by renowned novelist Stephen King, who has more than 6.7 million Twitter followers and has been a harsh critic of DeSantis.