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question everything

(47,487 posts)
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 10:52 PM Jul 2022

We can charge him (Trump) but I don't think it will ever get to trial

No legal background at all, but we know that defendants are not put to trial for mental reasons, when they cannot differentiate between right and wrong.

Legal eagles, correct me here.

Remember when Nixon said that when the president does it it is not against the law?

This is how Trump went throughout his whole life. (Except, perhaps when in the Military Academy when he was humiliated when a Sargent Major told him "give me 50.."

- This is my f**ing business and no one is going to tell me how to run it

(No offense to business owners on DU, but many start their own business because they don't want others to tell them what do do)

- This is my f**ing pageant and I can visit the women's dressing room.

And, of course, I am the president and no one is going to tell me what to do. I can meet with Putin and it is no one's business what we talked about.

Members of the Administration serve at my pleasure and I can fire them at will.

The AG is my personal attorney.

Comey would not do what I want so he is fired.

And, of course, on Jan 6, 2021: I am the f**ing president and no one is going to tell me what to do.

I really think he believed in this. Throughout his life

I really think that if he were subjected to a psychological evaluation, he would truly believe that this was his call: having armed supporters at the gathering and then tell them to go to the Capitol, intending to follow them.

He really thought that he won because, apparently, he had never lost any wish in his life.

OK, Ocelot II, set me straight.

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Pobeka

(4,999 posts)
1. Well, here's what I think.
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 10:59 PM
Jul 2022

Crowd in ellipse too small because armed supporters can't get through the mags.

1. "Turn the mags off".

2. "We are going to march to the capital".

3. "I'll be there with you".

1. -- Means he can't deny he had been told, and believed it was an armed crowd.

2,3 -- He set an armed mob upon the capital, and interrupted a legitimate govt function.

If Merrick Garland goes after him, and we have a legitimate jury, he's toast.

question everything

(47,487 posts)
4. I don't think that he will deny any of this
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 11:08 PM
Jul 2022

I am the President and I can order the mags off.

I am the President and I can send an armed mob to the Capitol.

And the question is whether this indicated a psychological malfunction brain that would exempt him from standing trial.

Mr.Bill

(24,303 posts)
2. Actually, he has failed at everything he has ever done in his life.
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 11:05 PM
Jul 2022

What I think will happen is maybe he will be convicted, but he will play the appeals process for so long he will die of natural causes before he ever sees a jail cell.

wyn borkins

(1,109 posts)
5. And...and...
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 11:09 PM
Jul 2022

If he was ever set in front of an actual jury

Can you imagine the Hillary(arity) that would ensue...

jgo

(915 posts)
6. There is a videotape from a few months ago
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 11:40 PM
Jul 2022

where he admitted to a reporter that he lost the 2020 election.

The more troublesome issue may be a rogue juror. That is why prosecutors should consider bringing multiple fewer charges to separate juries, instead of potentially building large unwieldy cases that go before a single jury. For example, obstruction of justice targeted at person A, obstruction of justice targeted at person B, etc., as separate trials instead of one big trial - but I'm not a lawyer.

Also, there is hope that civil cases, particularly the capitol police officers who are suing, could result in absolutely massive financial verdicts.

Ocelot II

(115,735 posts)
7. TFG is disordered, but he's not legally insane. An insanity defense would never work.
Wed Jul 6, 2022, 11:55 PM
Jul 2022

The Model Penal Code, which is the law in most states, says a defendant is not responsible for criminal conduct where he, as a result of mental disease or defect, did not possess a "substantial capacity either to appreciate the criminality of his conduct or to conform his conduct to the requirements of the law." In other words, they would have to be impaired in such a way that they did not understand that what they were doing was illegal, or were unable to obey the law. A successful insanity defense is extremely rare, and where there's evidence that the defendant has clearly planned and premeditated his crime, it will not work. The defendant generally has to be absolutely psychotic, in the sense of the sort of delusions where he thinks he's Jesus or Napoleon, or he kills someone because he thinks they're possessed by demons.

TFG is a malignant narcissist; he's obviously not normal. But he is not legally insane; he knows what's legal and what isn't and he's managed to use the legal system to his advantage. And even if he had a chance at an insanity defense he wouldn't allow his lawyers to plead it because his ego wouldn't be able to tolerate the suggestion that he's nuts.

One other thing: If a defendant's insanity defense is successful, he isn't turned loose; he'll be sent to a secure facility for people who are mentally ill and dangerous, and won't get out until he's diagnosed as either cured or no longer dangerous.

question everything

(47,487 posts)
8. Thanks for the Cliff Notes. Yes I can see that, at minimum, he would not go with
Thu Jul 7, 2022, 12:29 AM
Jul 2022

such a defense.

Let's just go with a charge of sedition.

rampartc

(5,412 posts)
10. trump is a stable genius, and smarter than the psychologists
Thu Jul 7, 2022, 02:15 AM
Jul 2022

if he can pull one over on the system he will sure try it.

&t=9s

question everything

(47,487 posts)
11. And this is how he arrived at naming his twitter-like account (or something)
Thu Jul 7, 2022, 02:54 PM
Jul 2022

I asked here last week what connects these two words: truth and social. It would be different if it were true social.

And it finally dawned on me that these were just two words that he had to memorize..

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