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babylonsister

(171,075 posts)
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 10:03 AM Jul 2022

David Corn: Don't Fall into the Collusion Trap on Trump and January 6

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2022/07/dont-fall-into-the-russia-collusion-trap-trump-january-6-capitol-insurrection/

July 15, 2022
Don’t Fall into the Collusion Trap on Trump and January 6
How to avoid the Russiagate pitfall for the Capitol insurrection.
David Corn
Washington, DC, Bureau ChiefBio | Follow



snip//

So much of Trump’s post-election misconduct is now out in the open. His Big Lie crusade and his incitement of the January 6 mob occurred in full public view. And his behind-the-scenes efforts to overturn the election have been revealed: leaning on state Republican legislators; pressuring election officials in Georgia (“I just want [you] to find 11,780 votes”); scheming to create fake elector slates; pressing the Justice Department to declare the election results corrupt; and muscling Vice President Mike Pence to block the certification of electoral votes. Moreover, the January 6 committee has been revealing evidence showing what was already known about that awful day: While the pro-Trump marauders attacked the Capitol and assaulted law enforcement officers, Trump took no steps to end the riot. The raid proceeded for hours before Trump called on his supporters to leave the Capitol. (The committee has teased that it will provide more testimony regarding what Trump did and did not do on the afternoon of January 6 in a hearing next week.)

Some of Trump’s actions may have been illegal—and there’s much discussion these days as to whether Attorney General Merrick Garland’s Justice Department is fully investigating them and whether Trump and his henchmen could be indicted. (The Fulton County district attorney is on the case.) But there is no question that Trump committed serious wrongdoing and that on January 6 he abandoned his duties as president, as he watched the riot and did nothing.

All this ought to be enough to brand Trump a villain and a danger to American democracy. Conspiring with the Oath Keepers and Proud Boys would be merely one more offense on a tall pile. It could expand his legal liability. But it’s a subplot in a tale already fully established: Trump attempted to subvert the constitutional order to retain power.


Trump has often escaped accountability by committing transgression upon transgression. Each dirty deed distracts from the other. Any one of his plots to steal the 2020 election would be a major scandal in itself. (Pushing the Justice Department to falsely declare the results were fraudulent!) Yet all of his dishonest conniving creates a gigantic blur that can be hard to absorb or follow. The January 6 committee has done a good job of breaking down Trump’s myriad skullduggery. This will certainly not convince the Trump cultists and denialists; they cannot be reached. But for the rest of the nation, there’s no need for a smoking gun—or to get hung up on a particular allegation or possible criminal violation. The question is no longer Trump’s guilt but how best to counter the threat he continues to pose to the republic.
43 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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David Corn: Don't Fall into the Collusion Trap on Trump and January 6 (Original Post) babylonsister Jul 2022 OP
Get thee to the greatest page malaise Jul 2022 #1
Trump's Guilt Was Never, Ever in Question. msfiddlestix Jul 2022 #2
Jusriceis coming malaise Jul 2022 #9
Daylight's burning Mr. Garland Evolve Dammit Jul 2022 #3
Anybody home, Mr. Garland? HELLLOOOOOOO??!!??! calimary Jul 2022 #14
We're in deep shit. Secret Service and DOJ corrupted? DeJoy still at USPS. How many others? Evolve Dammit Jul 2022 #25
And still... donald walks free... calimary Jul 2022 #37
Teflon Don and a joke of a justice system. Evolve Dammit Jul 2022 #43
Exactly. Vote, people. Vote. Trump is going to get his comeuppance. Joinfortmill Jul 2022 #4
... unless YOU don't vote. calimary Jul 2022 #16
+1 gulliver Jul 2022 #19
It's difficult imagining what additional threat Trump could pose to the republic, he's pretty much sop Jul 2022 #5
It's not so much him personally that is a threat, FoxNewsSucks Jul 2022 #8
I can imagine a lot of additional threats he poses if re-elected... Septua Jul 2022 #33
You are absolutely correct... Handler Jul 2022 #40
Trump has often escaped accountability Farmer-Rick Jul 2022 #6
Sure looks so malaise Jul 2022 #10
His MO is to move his chess pieces to block. Latest Laura PourMeADrink Jul 2022 #23
Speculation: Eyeball_Kid Jul 2022 #36
Bill Gates met with Trump weekly? mrsadm Jul 2022 #38
Holding Trump accountable is agingdem Jul 2022 #7
All very nice, I'm sure but there's only one sentence that checks all the boxes and that's........ jaxexpat Jul 2022 #13
I'm reading this as satire stopdiggin Jul 2022 #20
yes I crave it agingdem Jul 2022 #21
......shalom..... jaxexpat Jul 2022 #22
For real, did anyone know that Amazon already has pre-order going on now for J6 committee report Backseat Driver Jul 2022 #11
Yes! ShazzieB Jul 2022 #31
exactly right! stopdiggin Jul 2022 #12
While Trump's Speaking Career may NOT be over, Trump's political career is. 30% doesn't win ... Stuart G Jul 2022 #15
it's the 'cult members' only now stopdiggin Jul 2022 #18
David Corn is right on the money FakeNoose Jul 2022 #17
No association because he's known for scapegoating. live love laugh Jul 2022 #24
A dungeon would be nice. Hermit-The-Prog Jul 2022 #26
Declare tRUMP a national security risk, forbid him to ever run for a public office again. He is... SWBTATTReg Jul 2022 #27
Will he run in 2024? anotherOKIE Jul 2022 #28
He is already running. FuzzyRabbit Jul 2022 #29
The Republican Enablers need to be branded just as much as him and his followers Pyryck Jul 2022 #30
*All this ought to be enough to brand Trump a villain and a danger to American democracy. elleng Jul 2022 #32
Trump's guilt is still 50/50 in the minds of the public Septua Jul 2022 #34
Trump's legal guilt is not certain even to the author of the article quoted in the OP onenote Jul 2022 #41
Got to remember, "It's the economy, stupid." Septua Jul 2022 #35
As I've said before I'm actually shocked at the depth of the conspiracy captain queeg Jul 2022 #39
Feel like he's running interference for Garland 867-5309. Jul 2022 #42

malaise

(269,067 posts)
1. Get thee to the greatest page
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 10:07 AM
Jul 2022

RFN!

The question is no longer Trump’s guilt but how best to counter the threat he continues to pose to the republic.

msfiddlestix

(7,282 posts)
2. Trump's Guilt Was Never, Ever in Question.
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 10:44 AM
Jul 2022

the ONLY question is if he will ever be held accountable beyond finger wagging, harsh OpEd's, easy fines, or wrist slapping?

If so, will we live long enough to see it?



calimary

(81,335 posts)
14. Anybody home, Mr. Garland? HELLLOOOOOOO??!!??!
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:25 PM
Jul 2022

You up yet, Mr. Garland? Had a nice nap already? ANYTHING going on at the office???

I dunno. I don’t think he’s dead, though. I occasionally think I hear snoring…

Evolve Dammit

(16,743 posts)
25. We're in deep shit. Secret Service and DOJ corrupted? DeJoy still at USPS. How many others?
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 03:08 PM
Jul 2022

Congresspeople supporting the coup have had no formal rebukes. This is insane. Rolled over and playing dead?

calimary

(81,335 posts)
16. ... unless YOU don't vote.
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:31 PM
Jul 2022

A LOT of things we need to see happen, or be implemented, or to be fought, or to be secured, are ALL hanging by that thin little thread.

sop

(10,206 posts)
5. It's difficult imagining what additional threat Trump could pose to the republic, he's pretty much
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 10:52 AM
Jul 2022

destroyed everything he's touched so far. His lies and hate have infected too many. The die has been cast, there's no retreat from Trumpism now. The only way to counter the continuing threat of Trump is prosecution.

FoxNewsSucks

(10,434 posts)
8. It's not so much him personally that is a threat,
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 11:30 AM
Jul 2022

it's the MAGAts that follow his every whim and believe every lie. Even more, it's the Bannons, the Flynns, the Millers and who knows how many others doing the actual destruction. They are not stupid, unfortunately, and they use MF45 to distract the media and direct his worshippers.

Septua

(2,256 posts)
33. I can imagine a lot of additional threats he poses if re-elected...
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 09:06 PM
Jul 2022

..and has a Senate majority. Mike Flynn Secretary of Defense, Giuliani Attorney General, Sydney Powell White House Counsel, Mark Meadows or maybe even Tucker Carlson, Secretary of State, Matt Gaetz Homeland Security...

He might create some sort of storm trooper militia filled with Proud Boys and sic them on all his enemies. If republicans controlled both houses, he'd have every Democratic and Rino lawmaker investigated. The House would impeach Joe, Kamala, Fauci and anyone else they wanted to attack.

He would pull the US out of NATO so Putin could take over Europe. He would revoke every regulation possible Democrats installed.

He would assume dictatorship early on.

Handler

(336 posts)
40. You are absolutely correct...
Sun Jul 17, 2022, 07:46 AM
Jul 2022

He can and will destroy this democracy and the republicans will stand by and watch it burn. Merrick Garlanded is like Joe Manchin in the DOJ.

Farmer-Rick

(10,192 posts)
6. Trump has often escaped accountability
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 11:02 AM
Jul 2022

Someone is protecting him.

I think you can look at the American Filthy Rich oligarchy, maybe Koch Bros, Walton's, Gates (he met with Trump weekly), Zuckerberg, the incest loving Musk and peto Putin. We got to consider Putin an American oligarch now cause he sure is good at getting his puppets into the US government and passing out campaign contributions. He's not dead yet.





Eyeball_Kid

(7,432 posts)
36. Speculation:
Sun Jul 17, 2022, 01:44 AM
Jul 2022

Trump may have been an informant when in New York real estate. If so, that's a possible reason for Trump being treated like a jaywalker.

agingdem

(7,850 posts)
7. Holding Trump accountable is
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 11:27 AM
Jul 2022

making the remainder of his life a living hell...it's seizing his wealth, confiscating his properties sans one, his Florida golf club and exiling him to his one remaining property..hotel and golf course closed down, isolating him..no visitors, no media...an ankle monitor..sentence him to irrelevance..

jaxexpat

(6,837 posts)
13. All very nice, I'm sure but there's only one sentence that checks all the boxes and that's........
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:20 PM
Jul 2022

public execution on 5th Avenue. It's the best practical and soon-to-be-most-popular solution. Martyrdom is really not a problem because he's so universally obnoxious that most will be see as the ultimate Kharma, their own sins washed away by a mile. There will be dancing in the streets. Crime will fall off for a while as well or at least the cops will be, perhaps, a bit more judicious in their derelictions. Taxes on the uber-wealthy will rise to appropriate levels and they'll welcome it, happily paying, humbly even. Can you say balanced budget? strong dollar? Universal single payer healthcare, childcare for all, total public education for ALL, the end of charter schools and all other taxpayer funded "private" enterprises. All this and more are yours if you'll only do the deed and kill that turkey.

That's probably not the most popular solution with liberal types and I'm pretty sure progressives will reject it out of hand and that's, maybe, a good thing. But don't you just crave it? It would maybe even suffice for justice, an aspect of American culture missing since the late eighteenth century.

agingdem

(7,850 posts)
21. yes I crave it
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:44 PM
Jul 2022

I'm Jewish, my god is not a forgiving god so wishing/praying Trump dead by 1,000,000 cut (one for each covid deaths) will not cause me divine retribution...allow me to add to your inspired public execution on 5th Avenue...prior to the great event might I suggest a caged Trump on display in the middle of 5th Avenue..again, payback for the terrified babies caged in detention centers..and because we are somewhat humane, a cheap mylar blanket for cover..

Backseat Driver

(4,393 posts)
11. For real, did anyone know that Amazon already has pre-order going on now for J6 committee report
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 11:58 AM
Jul 2022

books; at least two coming out September 13, 2022. Bet both end with "outcome to be continued..." Neither say anything about a blue-ray disc gavel-to-gavel.

stopdiggin

(11,320 posts)
12. exactly right!
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:15 PM
Jul 2022

This man tried - by several different means and methods - to subvert and overturn a free and fair election (and the will of the American people).

You don't need any more detail - or explanation - (or 'punishment' meted out) - than that.

We installed a man in the WH - that had complete contempt for democracy. Full stop.

Stuart G

(38,436 posts)
15. While Trump's Speaking Career may NOT be over, Trump's political career is. 30% doesn't win ...
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:27 PM
Jul 2022

anything. Trump may have 25 to 30 percent behind his bulls**t, but that doesn't mean he wins anything.

stopdiggin

(11,320 posts)
18. it's the 'cult members' only now
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:36 PM
Jul 2022

Unfortunately - that leaves out the fact of him dragging so much of the GOP (whether they believe in Trump or not) well over into anti-democratic territory. This is not your father's Oldsmobile ...

FakeNoose

(32,656 posts)
17. David Corn is right on the money
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 12:32 PM
Jul 2022

Go for the low-hanging fruit and convict Chump on the easy stuff that will put him away for the rest of his life. His collusion with Russia will be a smoke-and-mirrors thing because you can bet that no Russians will ever admit to anything. Why even go down that rabbit hole when there's so much else that Chump is already plainly guilty of?

Chump must be convicted and locked away quickly because he's still a threat as long as he's allowed to roam free.

Lock. Him. Up!

SWBTATTReg

(22,144 posts)
27. Declare tRUMP a national security risk, forbid him to ever run for a public office again. He is...
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 03:57 PM
Jul 2022

really, a national security threat. Just how many US secrets did he give to the Russians (remember, he was acting like a lap dog w/ Russian personnel when he won, so he's probably eager to please his task masters).

Traitor.

anotherOKIE

(90 posts)
28. Will he run in 2024?
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 04:12 PM
Jul 2022

How in God's name can he be allowed to run again? I don't understand the media completely ignoring the fact that he is not qualified to run for president again let alone be president. He is without question unfit for the office.

FuzzyRabbit

(1,967 posts)
29. He is already running.
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 04:25 PM
Jul 2022

He just had his plane, a 757, repaired and repainted. This is the airplane he used in his 2016 campaign. Why else would he fix up this old airplane if he wasn't planning on using it to fly around the country campaigning?

Pyryck

(99 posts)
30. The Republican Enablers need to be branded just as much as him and his followers
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 04:52 PM
Jul 2022

Without the enablers, he wouldn't have got away with near as much.

Hang the sign on the Republican Party and around every single enablers neck otherwise all of the crap WILL happen again.

Make it so Republicans HAVE to distance themselves from tfg and his followers. Let them turn on each other for a change.

elleng

(130,983 posts)
32. *All this ought to be enough to brand Trump a villain and a danger to American democracy.
Sat Jul 16, 2022, 07:44 PM
Jul 2022

Conspiring with the Oath Keepers and Proud Boys would be merely one more offense on a tall pile. It could expand his legal liability. But it’s a subplot in a tale already fully established: Trump attempted to subvert the constitutional order to retain power.'

onenote

(42,715 posts)
41. Trump's legal guilt is not certain even to the author of the article quoted in the OP
Sun Jul 17, 2022, 07:55 AM
Jul 2022

"Some of Trump’s actions may have been illegal..."

captain queeg

(10,209 posts)
39. As I've said before I'm actually shocked at the depth of the conspiracy
Sun Jul 17, 2022, 04:32 AM
Jul 2022

I’d figured TFG was just throwing spaghetti at the wall to see what might stick (well there is an element of that) but it was much more organized and coordinated than I thought. I think soon some big fish will come in and really blow the lid off. That might not happen till the DOJ starts sending out subpoenas though.

 

867-5309.

(1,189 posts)
42. Feel like he's running interference for Garland
Sun Jul 17, 2022, 09:30 AM
Jul 2022

Forget TFG being prosecuted, we know he's a bad guy and that's it.

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